Cross jewellers settings..?

[arjunajane]

I''m just wondering, has anybody on the board actually purchased one of their settings? I see them discussed a bit, but wasn''t sure..

I''ve been browsing their site for sapphire photos - and I have to admit, I was quite alarmed that a large number of the designs appear to be direct copies of high end designer settings..

I don''t mean this thread to offend anyone who has bought from them, but basically I would like to know do they actually deliver the kind of quality/detail as in the pics on the site, has anyone seen these settings in person?

I am not considering buying from them - I just do find some of the settings they''re offering concerning.

For example, this design is almost exactly the same as a popular Van Craeynest model (sorry I don''t know the item #):

 

[arjunajane]

And this is a direct copy of the Michael Bondanza that facetfire has..

There are others, but I picked these as they are quite distinctive styles - not like a regular solitaire.

I''m keen to hear others'' opinions, do you think this is an issue?
Who cares?
Copyright?

Just quite curious is all..

 

[arjunajane]

For reference, here's the Bondanza one from Pearlmans' site - perhaps Cross came up with it first? But doesn't seem particularly likely to me...

I'm happy to stand corrected, if anyone has any info on this company and their advertised designs..?

 

[gemgirl]

Hiya AJ

. I believe Selkie got her ring from Cross Jewelers. Her''s is the Victory three-stone, and she has the matching band too. (I asked her about it after she got it because I loved it) Hopefully she''ll chime in so she can tell you of her experience with them in person.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/victory-my-sapphire-3-stone-ering.46111/

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 10/1/2009 8:42:07 AM
Author: gemgirl
Hiya AJ

. I believe Selkie got her ring from Cross Jewelers. Her''s is the Victory three-stone, and she has the matching band too. (I asked her about it after she got it because I loved it) Hopefully she''ll chime in so she can tell you of her experience with them in person.


https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/victory-my-sapphire-3-stone-ering.46111/

Hey gemgirl,
thanks for the link.
See, Selkie''s ring looks to me like a pretty and original design.

It was more the similarity to high end designers such as VC I was pointing out, like the examples above.

I hope my post is not mis-interpreted, I in no way have the intention to "call out" owners of Cross rings - Selkie''s ring is clearly beautiful, and not a copy of a designer style.

It was just those observations I was questioning, is all..
after all, the similarities are pretty glaring, correct?

 

[4ever]

I''d say that the original designer could have a pretty strong breach of copyright case if they wanted to pursue it because I''m sure 9 out of 10 people who knew the original design would think it very very similar to the cross jewellery setting but they''d have to show that cross is profiting at the expense of the orignial designer, that people we buying this instead of the original.

I don''t know much about copyright in regards to jewellery design but I assume it''s the same as for any other artist or creative industry.

On a side note, does anyone know who owns the copyright/interlectual property rights if the person designs a peice of jewllery and has it custom made? In theory if it is an original design the copyright should belong to the person who designs and has the jewllery made and the jewller should not be able to make more of the same design and sell them without the designers consent, but is this the case? Perhaps it''s only a breach of copyright if the designer intended to sell and profit of their design?

 

[Selkie]

Arjunajane, those actually are Van Craeynest settings. Like many other jewelry manufacturers, VC doesn't really have retail stores of its own, so they sell them through retailers like Cross, or Clay Pot in Boston. If you call Cross, they'll tell you who makes the settings, they aren't trying to hide anything. My setting is not a VC, but it is made by another old jewelry manufacturer called Jabel, who distributes their settings similarly. I'm not sure about the Michael Bondanza style one, but it may again be a distributorship. Some retailers tell you right out who the designers of their non-custom pieces are, but not necessarily.

ETA: I ran across this jeweler who also carries VC pieces, Antique Timepieces, but does not name them as such. I personally think it would benefit retail jewelers to use the names of higher end designers outright on their sites, but then again, VC is one of those designers that has name recognition in Pricescope circles, but not necessarily in the general public. Think of it like a higher-end Stuller-almost all jewelers carry their settings, but they advertised as such and thus aren't necessarily a household word.

 

[Selkie]

Diamondseeker tried on several VC settings at Cross at some point, and there''s a thread with photos. I''ll see if I can find it.

 

[cindygenit]

The detail on the band is slightly different to the VC style 484.

I know because I was in contact with VC about making that ring for myself.

Or do my eyes need a check up? The one in the first pic AJ posted has flowers, while VC's original has scrollwork on it.

ETA: The shields are also different.

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 10/1/2009 4:02:19 PM
Author: Selkie
Arjunajane, those actually are Van Craeynest settings. Like many other jewelry manufacturers, VC doesn''t really have retail stores of its own, so they sell them through retailers like Cross, or Clay Pot in Boston. If you call Cross, they''ll tell you who makes the settings, they aren''t trying to hide anything. My setting is not a VC, but it is made by another old jewelry manufacturer called Jabel, who distributes their settings similarly. I''m not sure about the Michael Bondanza style one, but it may again be a distributorship. Some retailers tell you right out who the designers of their non-custom pieces are, but not necessarily.


ETA: I ran across this jeweler who also carries VC pieces, Antique Timepieces, but does not name them as such. I personally think it would benefit retail jewelers to use the names of higher end designers outright on their sites, but then again, VC is one of those designers that has name recognition in Pricescope circles, but not necessarily in the general public. Think of it like a higher-end Stuller-almost all jewelers carry their settings, but they advertised as such and thus aren''t necessarily a household word.

Hi selkie thanks for chiming in,

Thats interesting - I thought of that, but then I wondered how come they are using these weird style names for them like "Brandywine detail" ! It just seemed odd.

If you and DS have been there and say thats the case, than I guess thats problem solved..

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 10/1/2009 10:25:37 PM
Author: cindygenit
The detail on the bad is slightly different to the VC style 484.


I know because I was in contact with VC about making that ring for myself.


Or do my eyes need a check up? The one in the first pic AJ posted has flowers, while VC''s original has scrollwork on it.


ETA: The shields are also different.

I do agree with this Cindy - I was looking for the same VC to post as an example, and didn''t as it had the scrolls like you said.

The Bondanza one also looks different to the Pearlmans'' site, the diamonds aren''t as curved.


oh here just checked and they do have the scroll VC - they just look a bit "off" - I guess it''s their photoshopping?

 

[Selkie]

Date: 10/1/2009 10:37:01 PM
Author: arjunajane

Date: 10/1/2009 10:25:37 PM

Author: cindygenit

The detail on the bad is slightly different to the VC style 484.

I know because I was in contact with VC about making that ring for myself.


Or do my eyes need a check up? The one in the first pic AJ posted has flowers, while VC''s original has scrollwork on it.

ETA: The shields are also different.

I do agree with this Cindy - I was looking for the same VC to post as an example, and didn''t as it had the scrolls like you said.

The Bondanza one also looks different to the Pearlmans'' site, the diamonds aren''t as curved.


oh here just checked and they do have the scroll VC - they just look a bit ''off'' - I guess it''s their photoshopping?

Check out the "Show me some Van Craeynest thread." Larry makes variations on several of his designs. In regard to the naming, Cross has names for all their e-ring styles...it''s just marketing. Several other rings (Viola, Chantilly Lace, and Flora at least) are also VC but aren''t exact matches for what you might see in the VC catalog. Both companies have been around for at least 80 years, so I''m sure there are a lot of styles we don''t see on a daily basis. I was thrown too, the first time I realized what I was seeing, and asked the salesguy about it.

 

[cindygenit]

I hope you are right Selkie. I''d hate for anyone to copy Larry''s designs. They are TDF!

 

[Selkie]

LOL, I don't think anyone could do justice to Larry's designs! Remember, he runs a factory, not a jewelry store, and relies mostly on retailers to sell his stuff (except for those like you who have made direct contact about custom work). Here's a link to the thread where Diamondseeker posted some pics of VC rings that Cross sent her to take a look at. Paging Poptart and Love in Bloom!. DS's photos are on page 3.

 

[CrossJewelers]

Arjunajane and all other thread contributors,

You have a great eye for detail and subtleties. The rings you have highlighted in this thread are Van Cranyst and Michael Bondanza rings. We work with many of the world''s finest craftsmen. They are made for us, and by agreement, are marketed with our own names. In some instances, designers customize a piece, making it in a distinct way to be part of the Cross Jewelers collection.

Most of our engagement rings have names to facilitate conversation. When discussing rings it is much easier to remember and talk about Brandywine or Canterbury rather than style# 1234A. We attempt to convey the spirit of the piece through its name and description.

We hope this helps and clears up any confusion. We welcome any additional questions.

All the best,

Cross Jewelers