Contemplating (colored!) MMD + colorless 3-stone e-ring

[forestbrook]

I have another post in RockyTalky where I was trying to decide between a classic pre-owned JA ring and a more unique colored MMD ring. After seeing other people's thoughts, I think even though the JA ring is a great deal money-wise, the MMD option seems to be more "us."

I think I'm currently interested in maybe creating a 3-stone ring with a red/pink/purple MMD in the center and two colorless (either MMD or mined) on the side, but I'd like to keep the total cost <$4k (I don't want my boyfriend to spend too much!)

Two stones that were nominated in the other thread:
http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/PE01
http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/PB04
http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/PR02

Am I going to need to order all 3 to be shipped out and returned to evaluate them? How well would a video represent the appearance of the real thing? (D.NEA said they could take videos) Is there any way I can sort of increase my chances of selecting a good performer by the stats ahead of time?

I'm not 100% fixed on the 3-stone option, I'm sorta open to a simple solitaire too! (sooo uh yeah I'm kinda indecisive)

 

[forestbrook]

The orange-red emerald cut looks really nice, but I think orange and green tones tend to not work very well with my skin color

 

[Niel]

Ill be honest i really really think a simple three stone with a colored mmd center is really the best idea! They are so pretty and based of the little youve said about yourself seems so much more "you", i think you didnt get that answer from most of the peopld over in RT because they tend to steer people away from mmds for whatever reason.
You only think the creation of the reds are neat? You wouldnt go for a yellow?

 

[maccers]

I'm happy to see that you're going with an MMD. I was keeping tabs on your other thread and it seemed clear to me that MMD is what really made you happy. I feel the same way about antique cuts, there's a story to them, whether it's a scientific one or not

I don't have any experience with MMDs other than reading the dnea website - it's quite mind boggling what they can do! Anyhow, I came across a blog of a couple who tell their MMD story - there may be some helpful advice for you in there. http://hecticlifehealthygirl.wordpress.com/2012/06/11/choosing-an-environmentally-friendly-and-conflict-free-engagement-ring-a-review-of-d-nea-lab-diamonds-and-derco-jewelers/

As for suggestions that you might get 'sick' of a coloured diamond - I'm not sure i agree with that. There's plenty of people who have coloured stones for their e-ring. Recently someone posted a three stone, all sapphire e-ring. I'm pretty sure she won't get sick it - it's wonderful and unique. I wish I knew more about coloured diamonds. You might want to put a shout out to Kenny in the coloured stone thread, he's a collector of coloured diamonds. His are natural but performance should be the same (other than those inclusions that are specific to MMDs. )

 

[forestbrook]

Ill be honest i really really think a simple three stone with a colored mmd center is really the best idea! They are so pretty and based of the little youve said about yourself seems so much more "you", i think you didnt get that answer from most of the peopld over in RT because they tend to steer people away from mmds for whatever reason.
You only think the creation of the reds are neat? You wouldnt go for a yellow?

Yellow tends to also create skin tone issues for me. I always try to buy yellow shirts and but they always make me look like I'm sick with some horrible disease!!

 

[Niel]

Ill be honest i really really think a simple three stone with a colored mmd center is really the best idea! They are so pretty and based of the little youve said about yourself seems so much more "you", i think you didnt get that answer from most of the peopld over in RT because they tend to steer people away from mmds for whatever reason.
You only think the creation of the reds are neat? You wouldnt go for a yellow?

Yellow tends to also create skin tone issues for me. I always try to buy yellow shirts and but they always make me look like I'm sick with some horrible disease!!

Hahaha i know it does the same for me! What about blue? I really liked the green step cuts

 

[forestbrook]

Blue could work, also dark green (but not light green) is ok, but I think a dark dark green stone isn't what I'm looking for.

 

[Niel]

Well dont get what you dont lile, just seems like the blues are a little bit less expensive and more plentiful. Plus a lot are in rounds so you could get those nice ideal cut sides

I led that Red i think it would look more stoplight red so might still look good on your skintone, otherwise maybe email them and see if they could locate you what you want

 

[pandabee]

Those 3 are all very different looks! Haha. Have you tried on any rings to at least see the shape you prefer? I also agree I think that if this is what you want, you won't get sick of having a colored center stone. Of the three stones you posted, I prefer the orange-red emerald or the straight red round.

 

[Niel]

Yeah i had never heard anyone hear make that arguement Before this thread. So many people get sapphires for engagement rings, i dont think this would be.any different

 

[periwinklegirl]

Hi Forestbrook,
Good for you for considering lab grown diamonds!

Can I just say, I love having a coloured diamond ring that is like no one else's! And I've had my FI blue for three years now and am not faintly tired of it.

I don't know if this helps, but I struggled in my decision, and finally went with the colour that I wanted to look at all day. And it wasn't yellow or orange (although those are lovely too). Pink would be a close second now that I've seen pink diamonds, but blue is my favorite colour.

A couple of thoughts - of the three stones you posted I like the red round one the best - the purplish red radiant is too dark in my opinion. (And you mentioned that you didn't think the orange would suit you as well).
However, they are all pretty dark. And the darker coloured diamonds, while lovely, simply do not show off their colour as well as the mid ranges (intense and vivid). They are not nearly as lively. I wouldn't recommend dark green for the same reason.

Here's another red one for comparison:
http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/pb11
This is mine and it really looks almost completely red in person, compared to the cert photo.

I don't know if you know, but they just got a new batch of pinks and reds. Here's a pic.
http://d.neadiamonds.com/newsletter/archive/quarterly/1011/

Eric mentioned that some of the pinks were up to 0.60 cts. Why don't you call/email him and give him an idea of what you want. He'll send you pics. He's great - and wouldn't pressure you in any way!

When I was selecting my blue, he offered to ship it to me to see if I liked it before I bought it. I didn't take him up on it at the time, but I did when I was choosing pinks for studs.

I'm happy to help you have any questions. I don't have Kenny's collection, but I do have a few fcds (red, intense blue, vivid blue, and many shades of pink!).

Good luck!

 

[periwinklegirl]

OK, just tracked down your original post.

forestbrook wrote:
"Option #1:
We've been contemplating picking something slightly more unusual: a colored lab-made diamond from D.NEA (the technology that goes into making the purples and pink is pretty awesome and we are scientists by profession). But, I'm not sure how to evaluate a deeply colored diamond -- is HCA still valid if it's a round? Will a diamond like this one (http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/PB04) look different than a ruby? More/less sparkly? "

A red diamond looks different from a ruby. More sparkly, definitely, but also, just different. What's really cool is that you can see it's a diamond because it still refracts light even though it red (same for my blue). My sapphire doesn't do this.
Eric is better explaining why this is than I am. But basically diamonds change light as it enters them. For example, fancy coloured diamonds look darker in sunlight and incandescent light. More noticeably so than say, rubies or sapphires. Oddly enough, sunlight makes the coloured diamonds slightly more opaque. Don't ask me why, I don't know, they just do (from hours of empirical evidence!). I've asked Eric and he can explain it fairly well. Sorry I can't.
Also, they do the same kind of colour change things that many coloured stones do. ie. blue sapphires look bluer in fluorescent light and more purple in incandescent. My blue diamond looks powder blue in daylight but almost steel grey in sunlight. The warm colours perform better in sunlight.

I am very far from being an expert on HCA, but my understanding of HCA is that it is limited to white diamonds. The paler coloured diamonds will probably perform better in HCA. I think the darker ones won't.

I think your three stone idea is great. The white side stones will set of the colour of the centre stone. I had a similar idea with my halo.

PS. The really freaking cool aspect of lab grown coloured diamonds hasn't paled on me in the least! Now I collect them, just to see what the different colours will do in different lights!

 

[Niel]

I hope a nice berry colored .5 ct is under 2k because i really like that color. Would look so pretfy in a yellow gold

 

[forestbrook]

A couple of thoughts - of the three stones you posted I like the red round one the best - the purplish red radiant is too dark in my opinion. (And you mentioned that you didn't think the orange would suit you as well).
However, they are all pretty dark. And the darker coloured diamonds, while lovely, simply do not show off their colour as well as the mid ranges (intense and vivid). They are not nearly as lively. I wouldn't recommend dark green for the same reason.

Here's another red one for comparison:
http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/pb11
This is mine and it really looks almost completely red in person, compared to the cert photo.

I don't know if you know, but they just got a new batch of pinks and reds. Here's a pic.
http://d.neadiamonds.com/newsletter/archive/quarterly/1011/

periwinklegirl, I *LOVE* yours!!! I could go either a little more red or more red-purple (or similar "berry"-colored like nielseel mentions). Do you have pics of it in different lighting?

That's really giving me ideas.

 

[Niel]

A couple of thoughts - of the three stones you posted I like the red round one the best - the purplish red radiant is too dark in my opinion. (And you mentioned that you didn't think the orange would suit you as well).
However, they are all pretty dark. And the darker coloured diamonds, while lovely, simply do not show off their colour as well as the mid ranges (intense and vivid). They are not nearly as lively. I wouldn't recommend dark green for the same reason.

Here's another red one for comparison:
http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/pb11
This is mine and it really looks almost completely red in person, compared to the cert photo.

I don't know if you know, but they just got a new batch of pinks and reds. Here's a pic.
http://d.neadiamonds.com/newsletter/archive/quarterly/1011/

periwinklegirl, I *LOVE* yours!!! I could go either a little more red or more red-purple (or similar "berry"-colored like nielseel mentions). Do you have pics of it in different lighting?

That's really giving me ideas.

Do you still think a halo is too blingy for your lifestyle? A plain shank one would also be lovely, budget friendly, and be a bit more casual than one with diamonds down the band.

 

[forestbrook]

A couple of thoughts - of the three stones you posted I like the red round one the best - the purplish red radiant is too dark in my opinion. (And you mentioned that you didn't think the orange would suit you as well).
However, they are all pretty dark. And the darker coloured diamonds, while lovely, simply do not show off their colour as well as the mid ranges (intense and vivid). They are not nearly as lively. I wouldn't recommend dark green for the same reason.

Here's another red one for comparison:
http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/pb11
This is mine and it really looks almost completely red in person, compared to the cert photo.

I don't know if you know, but they just got a new batch of pinks and reds. Here's a pic.
http://d.neadiamonds.com/newsletter/archive/quarterly/1011/

periwinklegirl, I *LOVE* yours!!! I could go either a little more red or more red-purple (or similar "berry"-colored like nielseel mentions). Do you have pics of it in different lighting?

That's really giving me ideas.

Do you still think a halo is too blingy for your lifestyle? A plain shank one would also be lovely, budget friendly, and be a bit more casual than one with diamonds down the band.

Yeah, I think it's too blingy for me (and not really my style). I'm more likely to go regular solitaire if the three stone option doesn't make sense/work out.

I found a pair of small D and E GIA rounds with great HCA scores http://www.b2cjewels.com/pdd-3508671-3508964-0.36-totalCarat-Round-pairdiamond.aspx but they are mined. Upon further thought, I'm not sure how I feel about going with newly-mined diamonds vs all MMD vs trying to find a second-hand pair (might be impossible).

 

[periwinklegirl]

periwinklegirl, I *LOVE* yours!!! I could go either a little more red or more red-purple (or similar "berry"-colored like nielseel mentions). Do you have pics of it in different lighting?

That's really giving me ideas.

Hi forestbrook,
Here's one pic. It's at the jewelers right now, since we're discussing settings (it's still loose). But when I get it back, I'll take some pics for you.

The second pic isn't mine at all - it's LD's, but mine looks a lot like this in sunlight.

I'm sorry if I seem to keep suggesting the same thing, but if you're interested in that 0.55 red round, email Eric and ask him if he has another pic of it (besides the cert pic). That's how I got this pic of my red. Or he has something more berry-coloured.

Also, something to bear in mind. D.NEA's reds don't come along all that often. I snapped mine up because it was the only one I saw on their website in a over a year. You can always reserve it while you are deliberating. It would be a shame if someone else saw it (and a lot of people reading our PS forums!) and grabbed it. That happened to me when I was trying to decide to buy a blue pear from them (luckily Eric had another one).

 

[periwinklegirl]

Hi forestbrook,
I think it's entirely possible to get a nice pair of side stones second hand. Are you thinking .25's? .15's?

It might take a little while. But there are tons of stud earrings available in the second hand market (since people get bigger ones all the time). Shouldn't be too hard to find.
If you want them to be ACA's or ideal cuts, you're more likely to find them in the Pricescope CAfe, Pre-loved jewels section, or on Loupe Troop or Diamonds Bistro.

Did you look at D.NEA's whites? They are going to be well cut too.
http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/White-Diamonds#c=W&w=0-210&l=s

They don't necessarily have all their stones posted on the website. But if you contact Eric and explain what you're looking for, he can let you know if they have anything.

 

[periwinklegirl]

Also, if you're interested in seeing pics of a blue diamond in different light, you can check out my thread:
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/which-is-the-right-blue-for-me.135953/
The pics are at the bottom of the page.

 

[EEFranklin]

Periwinklegirl adds some very valid points backed up with real world experience using her own diamond collection.

A picture is literally one snapshot of how the diamond looks. We try to represent a nice average representative color, but different light (sun, clouds, candle, fluorescent, incandescent, halogen, led, etc.) and environments will make the diamond look lighter or darker. For the record, all of our photos and videos are done with fluorescent light, but could still look different from another jeweler that also uses fluorescent light in their photos.

Video will add all the sparkle and scintillation that isn't otherwise there in a photo, but still shows the diamond under one "average" environment. Seeing the diamond in-person at a jeweler is one more environment, but they usually have non-standard lighting (halogen, led, etc.), so it may look different than it will at your home (incandescent, CFL) and workplace (fluorescent). Seeing multiple diamonds in one photo is a better way to directly compare them than multiple separate photos or videos.

Generally, people can narrow down shape and size ($) first. There is a pretty big visual difference between step cut (emerald, asscher, etc.) and brilliant cut (round, princess, radiant, cushion, etc.). Size and budget are usually closely correlated too. A visit to a local jeweler should give you a good idea where your preferences may be for shape and size, even if they are showing you white diamonds.

With treated colors (red, pink, green, etc.), there is a lot more variation and secondary hues than with the as-grown colors (blue, yellow, white). When comparing different color grades, color should take higher priority than cut stats. An ideal cut orangy red isn't "better" than a good cut purple, if you like purple better. All else being equal, vivid or lighter will appear a bit more sparkly than deep and dark colors. Dark colors still technically sparkle just as much, but a larger proportion of the light being returned is saturated, rather than white.

 

[periwinklegirl]

Eric as usual does an excellent job of explaining things, like why the deeper colours don't show as much visible sparkle.

In my experience, D.NEA's cert photos do do a good job of representing what colour the diamond shows under a certain kind of light. They really are trying to be as accurate as possible.

I wish you all best in your quest for a red diamond! (Mine was "the quest for the blue diamond"). It is an exciting time!

 

[Niel]

I thought of you when i was looking though the preloved forum... Its gone now, but someone was selling a old mine cut stone for unde 1k and it wad about. 68 ct. Now i bring it up because i think a great idea would be to get a vintage stone for the center, that would leave nearly 2k for some really lovely vived pick or blue side stones. Send those to a jeweler to be set and boom, stunning. And eco friendly in lots of ways by being reused and created diamonds. I know if you posted over in rocky talky and said something like "old stone lovers help, find me a 1k round"...And im sure they woyld find you something nicd

 

[Niel]

I thought of you when i was looking though the preloved forum... Its gone now, but someone was selling a old mine cut stone for unde 1k and it wad about. 68 ct. Now i bring it up because i think a great idea would be to get a vintage stone for the center, that would leave nearly 2k for some really lovely vived pick or blue side stones. Send those to a jeweler to be set and boom, stunning. And eco friendly in lots of ways by being reused and created diamonds. I know if you posted over in rocky talky and said something like "old stone lovers help, find me a 1k round"...And im sure they woyld find you something nicd

Haha im going to revise and say tbis would only really work with pears probably....xombining new and old round cuts might look strange.


Either way cant wait to see how your ring turns out!

 

[periwinklegirl]

"by Circe » 18 Feb 2013 03:23
Generally, colored diamonds aren't cut into rounds. The biggest and most important factor in their creation is to maximize their color. I think I'd try to treat them like colored stones when buying - shop with your eyes, but better yet, find a trusted vendor, and pre-shop with theirs."

by 04diamond<3 » 18 Feb 2013 02:34

Responding to nieseel, who said "As for a sapphires, i think that is a bad idea. It doesnt have the same color or light performance, nor does it have any of the aspects of a MMD that was the driving reason for the OP to pick one"

04diamond<3:
Well...why not? I mean, a "red" MMD I can't imagine would perform anywhere close to what a colorless diamond does so if she wants a dull performing stone she can pay less to get the same size in a sapphire. Even sapphires can be better performers... and I totally agree with DS, the color on that stone looks terrible!"

DiamondSeeker and 04diamond<3 are both commenting on this stone:
http://d.neadiamonds.com/lab-created-diamonds/PB04

Then other posters suggested that emerald cuts or radiants are better.

Eric - could you speak to this? About coloured diamonds not being cut into rounds? Is this true?

None of my fcds are "dull performing stones", but you know so much more about this than I do.

I know you already mentioned that a coloured diamond outperforms a ruby or a sapphire, which is certainly my experience. So many people, even here on Pricescope don't have much experience with fcds and I think it would be really helpful to have this clarified by an expert.

Thanks!

Caroline

 

[EEFranklin]

Mined fancy colored diamonds are very rare and very expensive. The higher the saturation, the higher the price, exponentially. As light travels through a diamond, it picks up color along the way. The longer the light travels through the diamond, the more color it shows, all else being equal. Round brilliants generally have shorter light paths than fancy shapes, where the light bounces around more before it leaves the diamond. If a particular fancy colored rough diamond was cut into a radiant, it would look more saturated than if the same diamond were cut into a round instead. Similarly, ideal cut rounds have shorter light paths than less-ideal cut rounds, giving them the appearance of less color (part of the reason why "ideal cut" isn't that important in colored diamonds).

The other factor is the shape of the rough diamond. When cutting a very expensive diamond, you want to remove as little weight as possible, since each point is very valuable. The shape of mined FCDs is usually pre-determined by the shape of the rough, not based on what the market wants.

Skilled cutters can use "tricks" to lengthen the path that light travels through the diamond, making it more saturated than if they cut that same diamond "ideal". They also leave weight on that adds nothing to the stone's beauty, but adds greatly to the price.

In lab-grown diamonds, saturation can be somewhat controlled during synthesis and the rough weight is less valuable than a comparable mined colored diamond. For these reasons, we don't use any of the cutting tricks that can be used with mined colors. We cut shapes that are in demand and try to focus colors where people want them (lighter or darker). Treated colors, like red and pink, have less control and usually end up on the more saturated side though.

Fancy colored diamonds will perform just as well as an equally cut white diamond. A portion of the light returned is colored, but still sparkles just like you would expect a diamond to, at least down past "vivid". In the "deep" and "dark" grades, the same amount of light is returned, but a smaller proportion of it is white. Those saturations will not appear quite as brilliant as lesser saturated colors, but will have more overall color to compensate.

For this PB04, I would call it either "vivid red" or "deep red", so it is around that border of showing less white brilliance, but has a nice strong red color.

A fancy colored diamond will outperform a comparable ruby or sapphire. That has more to do with the technical attributes of the gemstones than anything else. I think rubies and sapphires are pretty and an excellent choice in jewelry (I gave my wife a ruby this Christmas), but if one was placed next to a comparably colored diamond, I suspect people would choose the diamond the overwhelming majority of the time.

 

[periwinklegirl]

Thank you so much Eric! You are so much better at explaining it than I am.

Good luck forestbrook!

PS. Here's a blurry iphone pic of my red diamond. I didn't realize it was out of focus until I got home. I'll be picking it up in a few weeks and will take some better ones. But at least you can see the colour!

 

[Niel]

Thank you so much Eric! You are so much better at explaining it than I am.

Good luck forestbrook!

PS. Here's a blurry iphone pic of my red diamond. I didn't realize it was out of focus until I got home. I'll be picking it up in a few weeks and will take some better ones. But at least you can see the colour!

Oh my gosh im in love with that color!

 

[forestbrook]

Thank you so much Eric! You are so much better at explaining it than I am.

Good luck forestbrook!

PS. Here's a blurry iphone pic of my red diamond. I didn't realize it was out of focus until I got home. I'll be picking it up in a few weeks and will take some better ones. But at least you can see the colour!

Wow that's so vibrant!! I'm trying to find time in my schedule to try on some ring styles at a local jewelry store. Will update when we've made progress!!

 

[periwinklegirl]

Hi forestbrook,
I went to Spence diamonds to do that. They let you try everything on with no pressure. That's how I decided on the halo. I don't know if you have those in the US (if that's where you are).
Of course, my ring is a size 9, so it doesn't look like a lot of bling on my hand.

Thanks for the compliment on my stone. I actually would prefer a deeper red one, but there weren't any on offer when I bought this one. Maybe at some point in the future I will trade it in.

Good luck!

 

[Niel]

cant wait to see what shape you decide to go with!