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ConfusedBuyer seeks help deciding between two diamonds...

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confusedBuyer

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 20, 2009
Messages
3
My brain hurts. The volume of measurements, certifications, and other facets in the diamond purchasing process are staggering. (pardon the pun, I just couldn''t resist) I''ve come to pricescope seeking guidance on a couple of points, namely ideal L/W ratios for round diamonds and girdle thickness. I''m trying to decide between the following two stones from Blue Nile''s Signature Collection and can''t for the life of me figure out which is "better" - I''m more interested in quality than size. What makes this decision most difficult for me is the different reports from AGSL, GCAL, and GIA - I have no frame of reference from which to compare, particularly in the optical brilliance/symmetry sections of the GCAL cert. Any help is greatly appreciated!

Thanks,
ConfusedBuyer


AGSL: Link to Report
GCAL: Link to Report
Carat: 1.11
Cut: Signature Ideal
Color: F
Clarity: VVS2
Depth %: 61.9%
Table %: 56%
Symmetry: Ideal
Polish: Ideal
Girdle: Slightly thick, faceted
Culet: Pointed
Fluorescence: None
Measurements: 6.61 x 6.64 x 4.10 mm


GIA: Link to Report
GCAL: Link to Report
Carat weight: 1.03
Cut: Signature Ideal
Color: F
Clarity: IF
Depth %: 61.3%
Table %: 56%
Symmetry: Excellent
Polish: Excellent
Girdle: Medium
Culet: None
Fluorescence: None
Measurements: 6.55 x 6.50 x 4.00 mm
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
Date: 2/20/2009 1:42:47 PM
Author:confusedBuyer
My brain hurts. The volume of measurements, certifications, and other facets in the diamond purchasing process are staggering. (pardon the pun, I just couldn't resist) I've come to pricescope seeking guidance on a couple of points, namely ideal L/W ratios for round diamonds and girdle thickness. I'm trying to decide between the following two stones from Blue Nile's Signature Collection and can't for the life of me figure out which is 'better' - I'm more interested in quality than size. What makes this decision most difficult for me is the different reports from AGSL, GCAL, and GIA - I have no frame of reference from which to compare, particularly in the optical brilliance/symmetry sections of the GCAL cert. Any help is greatly appreciated!

Thanks,
ConfusedBuyer


AGSL: Link to Report
GCAL: Link to Report
Carat: 1.11
Cut: Signature Ideal
Color: F
Clarity: VVS2
Depth %: 61.9%
Table %: 56%
Symmetry: Ideal
Polish: Ideal
Girdle: Slightly thick, faceted
Culet: Pointed
Fluorescence: None
Measurements: 6.61 x 6.64 x 4.10 mm


GIA: Link to Report
GCAL: Link to Report
Carat weight: 1.03
Cut: Signature Ideal
Color: F
Clarity: IF
Depth %: 61.3%
Table %: 56%
Symmetry: Excellent
Polish: Excellent
Girdle: Medium
Culet: None
Fluorescence: None
Measurements: 6.55 x 6.50 x 4.00 mm
Welcome!

I can't quite read the pavilion angle on the first diamond's AGS report, can you tell me what it is please, and the lower girdle facet measurement towards the bottom of the diamond diagram? Both diamonds look promising by the numbers, it depends on which quality combo you prefer and whether you would prefer the AGS0 cut grade and report or the GIA. Some would prefer the AGS cut grade and documentation and if you want very high colour and clarity the F VVS combo. They both look like very well cut diamonds, and you are probably aware it is cut quality which gives a diamond its beauty, moreso than colour and clarity. You are probably aware that you can drop both colour and clarity if you wished without visual sacrifice if the cut is good, but this is an entirely personal choice and if you prefer F VVS/ IF then that is absolutely fine!
 

confusedBuyer

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 20, 2009
Messages
3
Lorelei, thanks for the quick reply. The AGS report is rather grainy and also truncated on the right side, but it appears that the pavilion angle is 40.3 degrees and the girdle measurements show 2.1% to 4.??% (truncated after the decimal point).

It sounds like you prefer AGS paper over GIA for measuring cut, which seems consistent with most folks on pricescope and elsewhere; what''s your take on the optical measurements in the GCAL? Are the two stones equivalent in light return and symmetry? I can see a difference in the two GCAL papers, but I don''t know what it actually means.

Regarding your feedback on clarity and color - I''m concerned with VS1 diamonds from Blue Nile''s Signature Collection, because their description says the inclusions are "generally" not visible to the unaided eye. Is it generally not visible, or not ever visible?

Thanks,
ConfusedBuyer (Peter)
 

blastdoor

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
159
Date: 2/20/2009 5:17:08 PM
Author: confusedBuyer

Regarding your feedback on clarity and color - I'm concerned with VS1 diamonds from Blue Nile's Signature Collection, because their description says the inclusions are 'generally' not visible to the unaided eye. Is it generally not visible, or not ever visible?

ConfusedBuyer (Peter)
Anything above VS2 (from a reputable lab such as GIA or AGS) is usually quite safe in terms of eye cleanliness, meaning most people won't be able to see the inclusion with their naked eyes..

But fact remains that there will be inclusion/s as long as it is not an IF stone, and just in case someone with superbly good vision comes along, hence the term "generally"..

If you would like an idea of how the inclusions in a VS1 stone looks like, or any other clarity level for that matter, you might like to take a look at some vendors that provide magnified pics of their diamonds on their website... I know GOG has lots of microscopic pics of their diamonds, and JA and a few other vendors has loupe functions where you can see magnified pics of their in-house diamonds too...

hope this helps..
 

ejv207

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 9, 2009
Messages
33
Hey Peter,

You can call Blue Nile up and have them send you a blown-up hi-res scan of the report. Especially since this is a Signature Ideal, they should have it quickly. I had a grainy AGS report, and they sent it to me within 24 hours. Along the same line as blastdoor''s great advice, I think you should check out some stones in person at a B&M and look at the difference between a IF, VVS,VS with the naked eye and with a 10x loupe. During my search, I viewed RB GIA ex/ex/ex stones from VVS1 to SI2. To me, the differences between the VVS1 and VS2 were undetectable. IMO, those differences did not justify the difference in pricing.


Good luck!
 

Stone-cold11

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 9, 2008
Messages
14,069
Date: 2/20/2009 6:06:02 PM
Author: blastdoor

But fact remains that there will be inclusion/s as long as it is not an IF stone, and just in case someone with superbly good vision comes along, hence the term ''generally''..
Just something to note, there is no such thing as a stone without inclusion.

Inclusion grading is done at 10X face up. So even if it is graded IF, there is no guarantee that at higher resolution there will not be inclusion.
 

blastdoor

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
159
Date: 2/20/2009 6:38:22 PM
Author: Stone-cold11
Date: 2/20/2009 6:06:02 PM

Author: blastdoor


But fact remains that there will be inclusion/s as long as it is not an IF stone, and just in case someone with superbly good vision comes along, hence the term ''generally''..

Just something to note, there is no such thing as a stone without inclusion.


Inclusion grading is done at 10X face up. So even if it is graded IF, there is no guarantee that at higher resolution there will not be inclusion.

oops... thanks for pointing that out Stone-cold...
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
Date: 2/20/2009 5:17:08 PM
Author: confusedBuyer
Lorelei, thanks for the quick reply. The AGS report is rather grainy and also truncated on the right side, but it appears that the pavilion angle is 40.3 degrees and the girdle measurements show 2.1% to 4.??% (truncated after the decimal point).

It sounds like you prefer AGS paper over GIA for measuring cut, which seems consistent with most folks on pricescope and elsewhere; what's your take on the optical measurements in the GCAL? Are the two stones equivalent in light return and symmetry? I can see a difference in the two GCAL papers, but I don't know what it actually means.

Regarding your feedback on clarity and color - I'm concerned with VS1 diamonds from Blue Nile's Signature Collection, because their description says the inclusions are 'generally' not visible to the unaided eye. Is it generally not visible, or not ever visible?

Thanks,
ConfusedBuyer (Peter)
Thanks! If the pav angle is 40.3 then I would ask if you can get an Idealscope or ASET image for that AGS diamond. AGS numbers aren't rounded like GIA so they are considered to be more accurate.

VS1 in the size you are considering should be pretty much completely eyeclean, however if you are concerned and want to make absolutely sure, then get someone from BN to check for you, there can sometimes be an exception to this ' rule'!
 

confusedBuyer

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 20, 2009
Messages
3
After looking at a few diamonds at a B&M I''m now leaning towards a VS1. I greatly appreciate the feedback from everyone at pricescope!
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
Date: 2/21/2009 10:04:50 PM
Author: confusedBuyer
After looking at a few diamonds at a B&M I''m now leaning towards a VS1. I greatly appreciate the feedback from everyone at pricescope!
Most welcome! If you wish you could post the numbers for that diamond so we can take a look for you.
 
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