Concerns about my Ebay purchase!

[JHyde]

Thanks for your help...I couldn''t upload a pic of the appraisal because it is too large, but you can veiw the appraisal by cut and pasting this link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2607759375

I just won this auction on ebay and I am concerned about getting scammed here...$5,000 seems like a great deal for a 1.12 carat vs2 H tiffany''s ring... and it may just be a GREAT deal, and the seller has GREAT feedback, but I am suspicious about a few things...
1)The estimate
2) the seller hasn''t sold ANYthing in 6 months
3) if I use paypal, I may not be able to stop payment on my credit card (because I am using a third party) if the ring comes and it is not as the appraisal claims or worse yet glass or CZ...
I could also pay by personal check or postal money order...and send it so the person has to sign for it...that might be good if i get scammed..what do you all think?
Thanks so much for your help..this forum and everyone on it is wonderful and helpful! If this deal falls through I am definitely coming here next!
-Jonathon Hyde

 

[Daisyma02]

Ask the seller if they would be willing to use the escrow service. This will protect both of you but will cost you about $150 to use but will protect your investment and definately worth it. Also if you pay with payapal with a credit card you should be protected by your credit card company. If a item is not as described you should be able to desput it with your credit card expecially being such a large purchase. But if you pay using your checking account then your stuck. Most credit card are pretty good about protecting you with a large purchase.

 

[Nomarian]

I second the use of an escrow service, but make sure that the escrow service is legit. There are a lot of them out there now that just take your money. I wouldn't use an escrow service that the seller recommends either. Scam artists usually own the escrow service they are promoting. Good luck.

 

[Mara]

Interesting...I checked out the auction and here are my suggestions and comments.

-Use escrow to pay as the other posters suggested. Be sure it's reputable. Be sure that you can cover yourself after the purchase if you need to, find out the details.

-See if the seller will agree to send the ring and all accompanying items to an independent appraiser such as RockDoc or Dave Atlas (see appraisers link on this forum) BEFORE you pay for the item, this will ensure that an expert checks it out, and if all is as the original poster said, then you can pay for it, and the appraiser can send it directly to you, etc. You can offer to pay for the sellers shipping and then you will have to pay for the appraisal fees but a few hundred out the door to get peace of mind on a deal as great as this should not be too much to pay.

-Also, I didn't view all of the pics of the auction, but a poster here about a month ago wanted to sell his Tiffany ring and he had a letter of authenticity from Tiffany (e.g. the whole thanks for purchasing from us type thing) and a Tiffany appraisal. I know that this seller says he bought it from Euro Gem Labs or whatever that co's name was..maybe you can call them and check out his original transaction, he should be willing to give you the info for you to check up on his story. (Personally I think you should have tried to do this BEFORE winning the auction, but too late now!). Also it would be intriguing to find out where the original Tiffany appraisal and letter of purchase went? As a side note, the Tiffany box shown on the auction doesn't mean much to me as I purchased a bunch of Tiffany boxes in an eBay auction a few months ago for holding my jewelry in for around $20. So you can pretty much get those anywhere. I'd be interested to know why the Tiffany box is still part of the auction, but not the original appraisal or letter?

If all checks out, it sounds like the $5k for this ring would be a spectacular deal--esp for a branded Tiffany ring which carry steep markups via retail. I would try to pay via escrow, get the ring independently appraised before paying using one of the people listed on the link above, and try to do some background on this ring if you can.

Also this is just a random note and my thoughts, but if any of the experts on here read this....doesnt 3.94 depth sound pretty shallow for a 1.12ct stone? The note on the diameter and specs on the appraisal read this as the depth, which seems shallow as I thought most well-cut round 1ct stones have a depth of around 4.0mm. For a 1.12ct just wondering how shallow this stone is--too shallow? From the picture posted it looks pretty sparkly but you can't tell too much. If it is very shallow for the size, does Tiffany normally sell stones such as this? I thought their business was in selling only 'ideal' stones? If Tiffany normally DOES only sell 'ideal' stones (in this post I'm referring to 'ideal' as similar to an AGS0) and this is a shallower cut (the appraisal had no specs on depth or table etc), then that might raise a potential red flag to me that this could be an original Tiffany *setting* but the stone could have been switched out or replaced with an non original Tiffany stone. The setting is the only thing that is marked Tiffany per the appraisal and post.

Last but not least--I noted on the appraisal it says that the ring was graded as mounted, which could mean that that some things could be hidden as sometimes prongs and mountings may hide inclusions/chips/etc. This may not be a big deal if you don't plan to unmount the stone, but most appraisers who will want to do detailed analysis for you will want to unmount the stone and check things out completely for themselves.

Anyway, please us know what you find...good luck!

 

[photogold]

You may have snagged a great deal. Even if this is not a real Tiffany, it is not a bad price for the diamond. If you sell a diamond on ebay, you can't expect a great price, so if you are buying you should expect a bargain if you are careful. Try calling the seller with the ebay phone number. Scammers almost always have bogus phone numbers posted. You can ask if they will accept escrow, but the seller has every right to say: "you know I was hoping to get more than $5,000, I will send a refund if you are not happy, but if you insist on escrow, I would prefer to relist the item." I wouldn't read too much into the seller not having feedback in the last 6 months. I sell on ebay and there are periods when I don't do a transaction for several months. It is also possible that he did transactions, but the other party didn't bother to leave feedback. Good luck. Let us know how it goes.

 

[HelluvaEngineer]

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On 1/26/2003 2

1:34 PM Daisyma02 wrote:

Also if you pay with payapal with a credit card you should be protected by your credit card company. If a item is not as described you should be able to desput it with your credit card expecially being such a large purchase. But if you pay using your checking account then your stuck. Most credit card are pretty good about protecting you with a large purchase.

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Your credit card company will NOT back you up if you have a problem with PayPal, and PayPal will not offer to resolve the situation for you. Many people have already been burned (including me) and I would definitely consider an escrow option.

For the full run-down, see http://www.paypalsucks.com

 

[oldminer]

The stamp n the ring might be real or it might be counterfeit. I could not begin to tell the difference and few could. The appraiser was very cautious not to say more than "stamped Tiffany" which does not in any way authenticate the ring alone or the diamond and the ring.

The diamond may not be from Tiffany, maybe only the mounting, maybe nothing.

I wish you tons of good luck as you will need all you can find......

 

[Daisyma02]

Depends on your Credit card? Tha'ts why you have to look into what your Credit Card Covers. I personlly had a problem also witb a Ebay transaction and my Credit Card Backed me up 100% and I never lost a penny. So each Credit Card is Different. Call you Credit Card and Ask.

 

[fire&ice]

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On 1/27/2003 2

0:25 PM Daisyma02 wrote:

Depends on your Credit card? Tha'ts why you have to look into what your Credit Card Covers. I personlly had a problem also witb a Ebay transaction and my Credit Card Backed me up 100% and I never lost a penny. So each Credit Card is Different. Call you Credit Card and Ask.
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Did you pay via credit card or through paypal?

 

[Daisyma02]

I did pay with Paypal through my credit Card. It's a good credit card to have I guess. I realize Not all Cards have such great Disput dept but this particular Card did That's why you have to fing out.

 

[HelluvaEngineer]

Well, my experience was with Discover. If they are once removed from the actual transaction, they will not file a claim. They can't! - they never approved the merchant! At any rate, I would suggest you read the claims on paypalsucks.com and come to your own conclusions. Many people have the exact same stories. If your CC company won't bail you out, you're toast. I think the max claim is ~$200 from PayPal FWIW

 

[fire&ice]

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On 1/27/2003 2:11:41 PM Daisyma02 wrote:

I did pay with Paypal through my credit Card. It's a good credit card to have I guess. I realize Not all Cards have such great Disput dept but this particular Card did That's why you have to fing out.
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PayPal is a different animal all together. All the major credit cards will honor a dispute. If paypal is involved, the credit card may or may not honor a dispute.

 

[fire&ice]

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On 1/27/2003 2:11:41 PM Daisyma02 wrote:

I did pay with Paypal through my credit Card. It's a good credit card to have I guess. I realize Not all Cards have such great Disput dept but this particular Card did That's why you have to fing out.
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PayPal is a different animal all together. All the major credit cards will honor a dispute. If paypal is involved, the credit card may or may not honor a dispute.

 

[Leanne]

Hi. I did a little investigating for you & came up with this...hope it helps... go to the gemlab.com website & either get the number to call or e mail them. The lab report # on the downloaded certificate on Ebay is-GAL021502EA04. G.A.L. lists one of their services as laser inscription. Perhaps you can find out about this particular report just by asking. Maybe they will tell you if the girdle of the diamond has been inscribed. Also, the Ebayer said that he purchased the ring from Euro Antiquest & Gems. I found that they list on Ebay also. Check into that & maybe you can find a number or e mail address for them. Just do an online search & you will find them. The seller also stated that he has documentation from Euro Antiques about the ring so maybe they can confirm this. Remeber, the man selling the ring bought it from Euro Antiquest, check them out too! I hope the ring's right for you, it's a purdy one!!

 

[Leanne]

OOps, I mean Euro Antiques & Gems.

 

[Tanuk]

PayPal sucks! I got scammed online once and paypal refused to refund me a single cent. I had to submit multiple reports to PayPal and paypal policy then was that they would only refund me the amount if they could recover from the seller. DUH!

So... If people tell you that PayPal offers online protection, DO NOT BELIEVE THEM!!!!

Would strongly advice you to use a reliable escrow service.

 

[Tarams]

Discover card DOES offer protection on your PayPal purchases. I too had an incident where I purchased a pair of 2ct diamond studs on eBay. The seller sent me a pair of 1ct czs. PayPal backed the seller and would not credit my account. I had to provide an appraisal of the item, and a letter of explanation along with PROOF that I sent the item back to PAYPAL, and the charge was finally removed from my account. It's a lot of aggravation, but if you're scammed, you can dispute & win the charge back.

I am also going through this right now with another eBay purchase that was suppose to be a 1.51ct G VS2 where I was sent a 4ct cz (LOL!). Again, I used PayPal, they found the seller at fault, but there weren't any funds in the sellers account to recover (duh!) and now my credit card (A Visa this time) will handle the charge back.

The point is that you have more protection using a credit card than sending certified funds (you would have to sue in the state that the seller lives in in order to try to recover anything in that case). I agree, PayPal is HORRIBLE, but they kinda have a monopoly!

(PS- I have made many great diamond purchases on eBay, & there are legitimate sellers & deals to be had, so no ill feelings towards eBay here!)

Good luck!

 

[JHyde]

I just wanted to Thank everyone for their great advice... I appreciate everyone putting their two cents in because I am learning a lot! lets just hope I don't get screwed...I will let you all know what happens!
-Jhyde

 

[stewie]

I would be wary of anything that came from Euro Antiques and Gems. Do a search on the forums at diamondtalk.com, they have spoken extensively on ebay scams.

IMO, more likely than not, it is a fake. This person probably bought it and then realized after the fact that he was taken, now he's trying to unload it. Don't pay for anything without protecting yourself first!

I had a similar experience - won an auction for a Tiffany piece (not a diamond). When the seller could not verify authenticity before shipping it out, we cancelled the sale. Saved us both the aggrivation of me having to send it back.

2 things worry me about the link you provided: first of all the Tiffany stamp on the inside of the bank looks shoddy - definitely nothing like the real thing. Second, the certificate provided is not a Tiffany certificate. This is very important because, as I understand it, these are the only grading reports available for the "Tiffany diamond."

Be careful out there... as I have learned over time, 90% of the crap you find on ebay is just that... crap.

 

[Leanne]

One other thing....look at the tiffany stamp on the ebay auction. Doesn't the shank of the ring look like yellow gold while the other pictures look like platinum or white gold?

 

[Daisyma02]

Would love to hear what you decided to so about this Ring.

 

[JHyde]

The ring is shipping out friday so I am holding my breath! The seller has been in contact with me every step of the way and seems like a stand up individual so far... I will definitely let everyone know what happens after it arrives and I get it independantly appraised!
Thanks!
-Jonathon

 

[Leanne]

Just thinking of you. Hoping for the best.

 

[findre]

Get this, i think this is the same item you were talking about.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2676389508&category=42947&rd=1

what happened with your purchase?

 

[DEVO]

ok... this is about a 10 month old link.

funny that the item you list looks the same as the above described rock.

 

[valeria101]

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On 1/27/2003 7:37:29 PM Tarams wrote:

I too had an incident where I purchased a pair of 2ct diamond studs on eBay. The seller sent me a pair of 1ct czs. I am also going through this right now with another eBay purchase that was suppose to be a 1.51ct G VS2 where I was sent a 4ct cz (LOL!). PS- I have made many great diamond purchases on eBay [...] so no ill feelings towards eBay here!)
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Talk about perseverence!

How on Earth?...

Ok, I shop Ebay as much as I can, but I would definitely need to learn a bit more about this! Do you check the sellers in some way? I am starting to get scared here!

 

[valeria101]

[These refer to the item listed at the second link, the original one is no longer active...]

Oups, one thing to look for: the stamp on the ring does not match the caligraphy of the current Tiffany mark. I have just been told that, as expected, Tiffany uses a standard marking for their engagement rings. So, either this is an older mark style or a different story altogether. It is also possible that I have been told something wrong deliberately, but you can also call Tiffany and ask (just do not mention E-bay, they seem to be allergic to this word altogether).
I agree that it is very hard to distinguish a well-made fake stamp, but in this case the difference is easy enough to spot from a mile...

And those prongs look like a Tiffany ring after a car crash (admitedly, a brand new ring was used for reference).

After all, that price is not completely out of line for a 1.1-1.2ct, H, VS2 with some average cut in some average mounting: just not a bargain. If other specs other than the brand get downgraded, THAN the deal sucks.

Sorry for being nosy and late with the comment... but I go on Ebay so often that I get worried every time someone mentiones a worrisome deal.

 

[findre]

It is the same item only 10 months later. The Buyer (jHyde)returned it after checking it out. The Seller relisted it, trying to defraud someone else. The ring is BS as far as a Tiffany.

The only thing I can say is that if the stone is a 1.12 VS2 H color its still worth the hi bid of $1125 even if it isnt a tiffany ring.

BTW he pulled the ebay listing when he saw the bidding wasnt what he expected.

 

[fire&ice]

Tiffany fakes on ebay run rampant. As does Coach purses, etc.

 

[valeria101]

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On 12/5/2003 9:24:25 AM findre wrote:

It is the same item only 10 months later. The Buyer (jHyde)returned it after checking it out. The Seller relisted it, trying to defraud someone else. The ring is BS as far as a Tiffany.

The only thing I can say is that if the stone is a 1.12 VS2 H color its still worth the hi bid of $1125 even if it isnt a tiffany ring.

BTW he pulled the ebay listing when he saw the bidding wasnt what he expected.----------------

Oh... Why was I thinking that item went for 5K? Well, a fifth of that is a whole other story... but not a better one.