Calling Chrono - Help with PT

[mimi72]

Chrono - Thanks for responding to my post in the pre-loved forum.

I decided it was more appropriate to move it over here since I have another question, and maybe others would chime in.

For reference, this was my Pre-Loved post:

"I have looked for ages and have almost given up trying to buy a "paraiba" tourmaline online (ebay etc). I don't trust that I know what I should be looking for - stones that honestly don't look that different to me range from $500 to $3000+. I don't want to make the mistake of assuming that just because someone is asking big money that it must be better.

I am looking for a stone either with a reputable report OR being sold by a PS'er/vendor whose judgement of the stone I can trust. Origin can be Brazil, Mozambique or Nigeria...color is paramount. Greenish blue, Carribean blue (think Art Nouveau's and Widget's LM rings), neon glow (think kryptonite), optimal saturation and tone. Prefer cushion, EC, round, oval shapes but would consider pears and others. Prefer at least 1 ct, ideally 2 ct+.

I know these are not easy to find - just putting out feelers in case any PS'er has one sitting around that could be getting worn and loved!"

Chrono responded about a promising one on Swala.

There are several "PT" rings just listed on ebay by the same seller. I don't know if they're a store liquidation or someone selling a personal collection (likely the former). They have GIT memos. Chrono would you take a look and see if any look decent? Now that I compare them to the Swala specimen I think they are probably not the right color.

This is one - if you go to seller's other items you will find 10 or so pieces, rings/pendants. I don't care for any of the settings.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/140856441582?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

 

[ChrisA222]

Only things I can add is that they are all in almost the exact same style...big time bling, lots of Diamonds. They are all from the same place in my opinion, whether thats one store or one persons stash.

All the stones are listed as untreated. As far as I know, Paraiba Tourmalines are generally heated to get that electric color. None of these blew me away but could be the photos. Ill defer to Chrono/LD on quality of the stones.

 

[Lady_Disdain]

If you are looking for top colour, neon glow and optimal saturation then you are looking for stones that are in the ballpark of $6-10,000/ct or much, much more. A stone in the range of $500 to $3,000 may be lovely but it won't be the ideal stone you are describing.

If your budget is up to it (mine, unfortunately, is not...), I think that contacting a good dealer specialized in fine stones (Richard Wise, Pallas, etc) is probably the safest and easiest way to go. This sort of stone doesn't show up on eBay very often.

 

[mimi72]

If you are looking for top colour, neon glow and optimal saturation then you are looking for stones that are in the ballpark of $6-10,000/ct or much, much more. A stone in the range of $500 to $3,000 may be lovely but it won't be the ideal stone you are describing.

If your budget is up to it (mine, unfortunately, is not...), I think that contacting a good dealer specialized in fine stones (Richard Wise, Pallas, etc) is probably the safest and easiest way to go. This sort of stone doesn't show up on eBay very often.

I hear you. I know $3k won't nearly do it for the size and quality I am looking for, just throwing out ranges I see on ebay. Contacting Richard is a good idea; I haven't heard of Pallas but I will look them up.

Guess I was hoping to find something on the secondhand market...looks like those opportunities are rare!

 

[ChrisA222]

There are some other nice colored options, too. I saw some really lovely Nigerian Tourmalines that were very bright...it looks like the nicest one sold, but this one is available for under $500/ct. Its not Paraiba, but it sure is nice!!

http://www.litnon.com/index.php?page=viewgem&id=9207

 

[Lady_Disdain]

If you are looking for top colour, neon glow and optimal saturation then you are looking for stones that are in the ballpark of $6-10,000/ct or much, much more. A stone in the range of $500 to $3,000 may be lovely but it won't be the ideal stone you are describing.

If your budget is up to it (mine, unfortunately, is not...), I think that contacting a good dealer specialized in fine stones (Richard Wise, Pallas, etc) is probably the safest and easiest way to go. This sort of stone doesn't show up on eBay very often.

I hear you. I know $3k won't nearly do it for the size and quality I am looking for, just throwing out ranges I see on ebay. Contacting Richard is a good idea; I haven't heard of Pallas but I will look them up.

Guess I was hoping to find something on the secondhand market...looks like those opportunities are rare!

Hey, looking is free! I also stalk the secondhand market for a lucky find - none so far, but who knows?

I am glad you are aware of prices. I was feeling like a dream crushing meany.

 

[mimi72]

There are some other nice colored options, too. I saw some really lovely Nigerian Tourmalines that were very bright...it looks like the nicest one sold, but this one is available for under $500/ct. Its not Paraiba, but it sure is nice!!

http://www.litnon.com/index.php?page=viewgem&id=9207

The Litnon one does have a nice open axis but just not quite the right color.

What do you guys think of this? I don't see the saturated "glow". Hard to tell with only one photo. Showing up lighter here than on the Swala website for some reason, it seems, but the same photo. Wierd. Goes to show the vagaries of photography and one's monitor.

 

[txgreeneyes]

Yeah.. I want one too. *sigh*

Won't be for awhile. I've already promised my spouse that I'd stop begging for more gems.

 

[chrono]

There are several "PT" rings just listed on ebay by the same seller. I don't know if they're a store liquidation or someone selling a personal collection (likely the former). They have GIT memos. Chrono would you take a look and see if any look decent? Now that I compare them to the Swala specimen I think they are probably not the right color.

This is one - if you go to seller's other items you will find 10 or so pieces, rings/pendants. I don't care for any of the settings.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/140856441582?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

They look like ordinary greenish blue tourmalines. Zero glow. Lacking in saturation. Actually, a few of them are grayish greenish blue.

The initial find of PTs were unheated but later ones had to be heated to get that desired colour. I find that the Nigerian cuprians have a little bit of glow, not enough to be considered paraiba. The Mozambique ones are a mixed bag - most have some glow but a handful have amazing glow, enough to rival some top Brazilian paraibas. The Brazilian ones are actually a mixed bag today - the initial find was unreal but the ones from the second mines and later being unable to compare to the first strike.

 

[chrono]

These tourmalines remain very popular in Asia, particularly Japan so the shows there tend to have them. These are a sampling of what I looked at several years ago. The pictures were taken in a rush under poor lighting. As mentioned in the other section of the forum, an included (not eye clean) 1 carat stone is about $6000/ct. For a clean stone of about 1 carat, expect to pay over $10,000/ct today at the minimum.

 

[LD]

There are some other nice colored options, too. I saw some really lovely Nigerian Tourmalines that were very bright...it looks like the nicest one sold, but this one is available for under $500/ct. Its not Paraiba, but it sure is nice!!

http://www.litnon.com/index.php?page=viewgem&id=9207

That is an excellent example of an Indicolite Tourmaline.

 

[LD]

Chrono - Thanks for responding to my post in the pre-loved forum.

I decided it was more appropriate to move it over here since I have another question, and maybe others would chime in.

For reference, this was my Pre-Loved post:

"I have looked for ages and have almost given up trying to buy a "paraiba" tourmaline online (ebay etc). I don't trust that I know what I should be looking for - stones that honestly don't look that different to me range from $500 to $3000+. I don't want to make the mistake of assuming that just because someone is asking big money that it must be better.

I am looking for a stone either with a reputable report OR being sold by a PS'er/vendor whose judgement of the stone I can trust. Origin can be Brazil, Mozambique or Nigeria...color is paramount. Greenish blue, Carribean blue (think Art Nouveau's and Widget's LM rings), neon glow (think kryptonite), optimal saturation and tone. Prefer cushion, EC, round, oval shapes but would consider pears and others. Prefer at least 1 ct, ideally 2 ct+.

I know these are not easy to find - just putting out feelers in case any PS'er has one sitting around that could be getting worn and loved!"

Chrono responded about a promising one on Swala.

There are several "PT" rings just listed on ebay by the same seller. I don't know if they're a store liquidation or someone selling a personal collection (likely the former). They have GIT memos. Chrono would you take a look and see if any look decent? Now that I compare them to the Swala specimen I think they are probably not the right color.

This is one - if you go to seller's other items you will find 10 or so pieces, rings/pendants. I don't care for any of the settings.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/140856441582?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

You will not find a PT on Ebay of the type you've described. If you do, it won't (or shouldn't be) in the price range you've stated. There is NO good material around at the moment that is even remotely affordable.

The Swala gemstone (to me) does not look like a PT. It is too pale, lacking in saturation and, as you say, doesn't have the glow. If you look at my avatar, that's one of my PTs and you can see the glow in that! The only thing you can do is continually scour all vendors or ask them to specifically find one for you (a re-sale is going to be your best bet) BUT nobody is letting go of their stones at the moment.

 

[mimi72]

Thanks LD. I didn't mean to imply ebay was where I am primarily looking. It's just one potential, albeit risky, source for pre-owned pieces. One would think that a nice one would come up every so often on consignment to a reputable re-seller. Not the kind of seller I posted links to though.
Anyhow, I have spoken with vendors considered reputable on this forum...someday I'll find the right one....

 

[LD]

Thanks LD. I didn't mean to imply ebay was where I am primarily looking. It's just one potential, albeit risky, source for pre-owned pieces. One would think that a nice one would come up every so often on consignment to a reputable re-seller. Not the kind of seller I posted links to though.
Anyhow, I have spoken with vendors considered reputable on this forum...someday I'll find the right one....

Unfortunately they don't come up often - even on consignment - because they get snapped up before they even go for sale. Having said that, if you keep feelers out everywhere one may turn up but be prepared to dig in and wait. Paraiba International have some but you can see the price of the good ones. From photos it's difficult to tell the difference but to justify $71k (and yes, I have typed that correctly), for a 3ct stone, you can see how much it's a seller's market. If you're prepared to not have top quality and have a significantly smaller stone then they have a few in your price range.

http://www.paraibainternational.com/products.php?category=3