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Buying my girlfriends engagement ring in next few days

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arcticcatmatt

Shiny_Rock
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Hello all! Great forum you have here. I just spent some time researching the value of diamonds and what not so I now know a little bit.

I have been with my girlfriend for 4 years and I am now ready to bite the bullet, BUT I refuse to get a loan. I can afford 1,500. So, I hinted to her I was ready. She showed me a ring at JB Robinson that was 1300. I went back the next day and got specs. They were rude to me and the specs of the rock were horrible. Lowest grade.

So I then went to an actual jeweler and had her build a ring that she wanted. We built one to my budget. It is 14k white gold with diamonds up and down the sides of it (very thin) and platinum head $510.

The rock is .46 SI-1 F (have no idea why there is an F there) round cut - $865. The price on this website thing at the top basically says 550 for that rock. There was another one that was 1,100 dollars that was slightly bigger. I need to get its specs.

Warranty - 3% for 3 years (great warranty, covers accidental damage). Have to pay 3% every 3 years (41 bucks)

Subtotal - 1,416.. plus tax.. total.. $1,529

Can you guys offer any advice? I just want to make sure I get the best bang for my buck. I am already very happy with their service, no pressure, now just have to be happy with their price.

I realize that this is not a 7,000 dollar ring like some of my friends have purchased but I work in the auto industry and things are not the best. I do not get loans and don't want to start now. She understands and is very happy with this price tag of a ring. She doesn't consider me cheap, she considers me smart. It comes from the heart and she said she would take a twist tie to get my commitment. I love her :). With that said, I hope I don't get attacked like some people I know have relentlessly attacked me for being "cheap".
 
Date: 8/6/2009 2:57:05 PM
Author:arcticcatmatt
Hello all! Great forum you have here. I just spent some time researching the value of diamonds and what not so I now know a little bit.

I have been with my girlfriend for 4 years and I am now ready to bite the bullet, BUT I refuse to get a loan. I can afford 1,500. So, I hinted to her I was ready. She showed me a ring at JB Robinson that was 1300. I went back the next day and got specs. They were rude to me and the specs of the rock were horrible. Lowest grade.

So I then went to an actual jeweler and had her build a ring that she wanted. We built one to my budget. It is 14k white gold with diamonds up and down the sides of it (very thin) and platinum head $510.

The rock is .46 SI-1 F (have no idea why there is an F there) round cut - $865. The price on this website thing at the top basically says 550 for that rock. There was another one that was 1,100 dollars that was slightly bigger. I need to get its specs.

Warranty - 3% for 3 years (great warranty, covers accidental damage). Have to pay 3% every 3 years (41 bucks)

Subtotal - 1,416.. plus tax.. total.. $1,529

Can you guys offer any advice? I just want to make sure I get the best bang for my buck. I am already very happy with their service, no pressure, now just have to be happy with their price.

I realize that this is not a 7,000 dollar ring like some of my friends have purchased but I work in the auto industry and things are not the best. I do not get loans and don't want to start now. She understands and is very happy with this price tag of a ring. She doesn't consider me cheap, she considers me smart. It comes from the heart and she said she would take a twist tie to get my commitment. I love her :). With that said, I hope I don't get attacked like some people I know have relentlessly attacked me for being 'cheap'.
Click to expand...
You WILL NOT get attacked here, Pricescope is for everyone no matter how much they have to spend - welcome! Also that is a very wise decision I think not getting a loan and buying what you can afford!

The F is for the colour grade of the diamond, do you know if it has a lab report such as GIA? That is important to know. Also it is cut which will give you a pretty diamond, so if you could post the following if you can get the info from the diamond's report, that would be very useful.

The info needed is the -

depth%
table%
crown and pavilion angles or percentages
girdle thickness
polish and symmetry grades
diameter measurement
star and lower girdle facet percentages ( not essential but good to have)

If you could get that info then we can go from there and get an idea of how well this diamond is cut. If you have a well cut diamond your GF will have a beautiful stone which will outshine her friend's bigger rocks very likely if they aren't also well cut!

Just curious, have you thought about buying online at all or do you prefer to stick to this store?
 
^ Well that is great to hear!

The best part is all the guys that go after me.. are still paying for their rings. One of them even got married and has a joint account with his wife. Now she bitches that she is paying for her own ring ha
 
Date: 8/6/2009 3:03:46 PM
Author: arcticcatmatt
^ Well that is great to hear!

The best part is all the guys that go after me.. are still paying for their rings. One of them even got married and has a joint account with his wife. Now she bitches that she is paying for her own ring ha
Click to expand...
I assure you we are here for EVERYONE and help the same way regardless of what you have to spend, it makes no difference to us! I started out with the tiniest diamond imaginable, but even though I have upgraded many times, this diamond to me is irreplacable because it is the diamond we were engaged with. Also you don't have to have a huge rock to have a beautiful one, as long as the cut is great then thats the main thing. I have a half carater myself, its a great size and its a gorgeous stone!
 
I doubt that peple would attack you.
But I''ll offer a comment......
2.gif


As Lorelei says; the SI1 is the clarity grade and F is the colour.
You could drop the colour to G or perhaps H if the stone is well-cut and you might then be able to get a stone that''s just above the magic half-carat level.
If the diamond will be set in yellow gold, you could drop down to I colour.
 
Date: 8/6/2009 3:02:09 PM
Author: Lorelei
Date: 8/6/2009 2:57:05 PM

Author:arcticcatmatt
Click to expand...

You WILL NOT get attacked here, Pricescope is for everyone no matter how much they have to spend - welcome! Also that is a very wise decision I think not getting a loan and buying what you can afford!


The F is for the colour grade of the diamond, do you know if it has a lab report such as GIA? That is important to know. Also it is cut which will give you a pretty diamond, so if you could post the following if you can get the info from the diamond''s report, that would be very useful.


The info needed is the -


depth%

table%

crown and pavilion angles or percentages

girdle thickness

polish and symmetry grades

diameter measurement

star and lower girdle facet percentages ( not essential but good to have)


If you could get that info then we can go from there and get an idea of how well this diamond is cut. If you have a well cut diamond your GF will have a beautiful stone which will outshine her friend''s bigger rocks very likely if they aren''t also well cut!


Just curious, have you thought about buying online at all or do you prefer to stick to this store?
Click to expand...
Calling them now (and emailing) and getting that exact information! Thanks! If they give me any crap, I will be done with them as I have no toleraration for that.

I have no issues with buying online but for something like this I think I should stay local as I would need them to "keep it in check". It seems like their diamond price might be 200 bucks to high.
 
Date: 8/6/2009 3:20:47 PM
Author: arcticcatmatt

Date: 8/6/2009 3:02:09 PM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 8/6/2009 2:57:05 PM

Author:arcticcatmatt
Click to expand...

You WILL NOT get attacked here, Pricescope is for everyone no matter how much they have to spend - welcome! Also that is a very wise decision I think not getting a loan and buying what you can afford!


The F is for the colour grade of the diamond, do you know if it has a lab report such as GIA? That is important to know. Also it is cut which will give you a pretty diamond, so if you could post the following if you can get the info from the diamond''s report, that would be very useful.


The info needed is the -


depth%

table%

crown and pavilion angles or percentages

girdle thickness

polish and symmetry grades

diameter measurement

star and lower girdle facet percentages ( not essential but good to have)


If you could get that info then we can go from there and get an idea of how well this diamond is cut. If you have a well cut diamond your GF will have a beautiful stone which will outshine her friend''s bigger rocks very likely if they aren''t also well cut!


Just curious, have you thought about buying online at all or do you prefer to stick to this store?
Click to expand...
Calling them now (and emailing) and getting that exact information! Thanks! If they give me any crap, I will be done with them as I have no toleraration for that.

I have no issues with buying online but for something like this I think I should stay local as I would need them to ''keep it in check''. It seems like their diamond price might be 200 bucks to high.
Click to expand...
Thats good. Also as FB says you could lower the colour and even the clarity if you wished and if the diamond is well cut, still have a white and sparkly diamond, but this is a personal preference.

If you wanted to buy online we could find some diamonds might suit you?
 
Hey arcticatmatt - skidoojeff here.

Sounds like a good plan - nothing at all wrong with it. As Lorelei suggested, you can try calling the store and asking what lab graded the diamond (probably GIA, could be AGS or EGL). Ask if they can give you the lab report number. With that number, you can then go to...

http://agslab.com/verify_diamond_grading_report.php (for AGS)
or
http://www2.gia.edu/reportcheck/index.cfm (for GIA)

...and enter the report number to see the exact details on the diamond. You will find the numbers Lorelei is looking for there. We''ll be able to give you a general opinion of that diamond from those numbers... or suggest alternatives within your budget.

Treefrog
 
^ I am wondering if the store will accept a diamond I buy online. Is that where I will get my best deal aka bang for my buck?

You guys will like this. A month ago someone joked about me buying a ring and about 5,000 dollars. My girlfriend said "buy granite countertops and a ring for that money, I would rather have both!". So granite countertops went in last week in cash. Hence the 1500 budget. I might be able to swing 2,000 if it makes a huge difference. She loves the countertops and has not put 2 and 2 together yet to realize I am doing what she said.

I am the chepeast guy you will meet, this is a huge step for me haha.

I wonder what me bringing in a diamond from online would change. I am also worried about spending 1,000 dollars on something I cannot see.
 
Date: 8/6/2009 3:29:56 PM
Author: arcticcatmatt
I wonder what me bringing in a diamond from online would change. I am also worried about spending 1,000 dollars on something I cannot see.
Click to expand...

Usually better than what you can see as you get more to choose from, if you know what and how to look for it.
 
I sincerely appreciate this from all of you.

I have been the moderator one of the biggest snowmobile sites on the net and been a member since it began in 2001. I have the most posts also (14,000 I think). A HUGE ton of them is helping people that are not "into it" as much as me.

So please realize your help is much appreciated!

I am awaiting the information from the place.

Hey SkidooJeff!
9.gif
 
Date: 8/6/2009 3:45:07 PM
Author: arcticcatmatt
I sincerely appreciate this from all of you.

I have been the moderator one of the biggest snowmobile sites on the net and been a member since it began in 2001. I have the most posts also (14,000 I think). A HUGE ton of them is helping people that are not ''into it'' as much as me.

So please realize your help is much appreciated!

I am awaiting the information from the place.

Hey SkidooJeff!
9.gif
Click to expand...
Thank you! If you do decide to buy online then we would be glad to help but whatever way you decide to buy we can be of assistance.
 
Awesome - I don't visit that site much. I think my buddy did. He's a cat guy... well, he was until he sold his sled. Won't be too much longer before it's time to start the pre-season checklist!

Anyway, let us know what you find out. I took the diamond I got online to a local jeweler and they didn't have any issues with doing it that way. I was very pleased with the help I got here and like stone-cold11 said, you have tons more to choose from when shopping online so prices are pretty competitive. Lots of other benefits too like discounts and upgrade policies.
 
Hey arcticcatmatt,

Congrats on your decision to propose
36.gif


Have you given any thought to the actual proposal?

Since your lady loves her new countertops so much, maybe you could incorporate that into the proposal?

Do you have any small pieces of granite leftover from the project?

You could present her new diamond ring on a little slab of it??? Just a thought
9.gif


~Allyson
 
^ Funny you mention that! I thought about that! Actually, one of my first dates with her (when getting to know her) I took her to a not well known waterfall.
-ugh forum will not let me link in a picture-
I want to do it at the base of this and pretend we are looking for crabs or a geocache
-forum won't let me link in a picture, I get an error-
I feel that it is where I started to fall for her. I really loved our first time there. I was going to do it on a dinner sunset train ride in the mountains of PA but it sounds like it is impossible to get our own table. So the waterfall is my backup. Just me and her alone in a spot that I think the was a turning point for us both.

I got word back from the Jewelry shop. Please give me your feedback on this please!! Advice as to how to proceed would be SO MUCH appreciated! If I am getting my bang for my buck I will buy there. I am thinking the .71. If I am not getting the bang for my buck, I will buy online with what you guy/gals recommend. I plan on going to speak with her at noon E.S.T. tommorrow to talk about me buying a diamond elsewhere for a "better selection".
She sent me everything below here

Hi Matt,
I wanted to let you know that the .46 Si2 F found a home last evening.

I do have the .41 F Si1 here for $865 as well.

Does it have a GIA lab report? No, however we grade by GIA standards. We could obtain a GIA certification, however that would add an additional $350 onto the cost of the diamond

depth% 63.5
table% 59.5
crown angle 37.6
pavilion angle 42.3
pavilion Depth % 44.4
girdle thickness slight
polish good
symmetry very good
diameter 4.76 x 4.72 x 3.0
laser inscription
Cost $865.00

The other one that you mentioned in your email is as follows:
.71 Vs2 H $1,185.00
depth% 62.1
table% 57
crown angle 35.5
pavilion angle 41.2
pavilion Depth % 43
girdle thick
symmetry very good
diameter 5.72 x 5.68 x 3.5
laser inscription

Matt, as an engineer, I know that you know statistics are very important. As your jeweler, the best advice I can give you is to trust your eye. The statistics don’t always tell the entire story. At the end of the day, the actual physical beauty, the fire and the aura that it portrays is what she will see.

I hope this helps in making your choice.
 
well I got one to work

carp1.jpg
 
And number 2

carp2.jpg
 
Unfortunately for you I''m a newbie and can''t help you with your diamond purchase. But as far as the proposal goes, the waterfall idea just made me go "awww!" Heck, there might even be a tear or two in my eyes. But I''m sure your girlfriend will love anything you decide to do.
 
No to both of these stones. Much too deep, the stone will look small for the weight and there will be leakage resulting in the stone looking dull in most situations outside of jewelry store lightings.

Definitely not worth it.
 
Yikes, Matt definitely pass on both of these, horrible proportions!

You can use this chart as a guide to help you find well cut round diamonds.

depth - 60 - 62% - although my personal preference is to allow up to 62.4%
table - 54- 57%
crown angle - 34- 35 degrees
pavilion angle - 40.6- 41 degrees
girdle - avoid extremes, look for thin to slightly thick, thin to medium etc
polish and symmetry - very good and above

note - with crown and pavilion angles at the shallower ends ( CA 34- PA 40.6) and steeper ( CA 35- PA 41) check to make sure these angles complement in that particular diamond - eyeballs, Idealscope, trusted vendor input - check as appropriate!


As the above implies, configurations depend on each other. A little give here can still work with a little take there.

From expert John Pollard.

With that said, here's a "Cliff's Notes" for staying near Tolkowsky/ideal angles with GIA reports (their numbers are rounded): A crown angle of 34.0, 34.5 or 35.0 is usually safe with a 40.8 pavilion angle. If pavilion angle = 40.6 lean toward a 34.5-35.0 crown. If pavilion angle = 41 lean toward a 34.0-34.5 crown.


GIA "EX" in cut is great at its heart, but it ranges a bit wider than some people prefer, particularly in deep combinations (pavilion > 41 with crown > 35).


 
Glad you liked the waterfall bit :) I very much appreciate the advice. Does the GIA rating add 350 to the stone like she said?

I am a little weary of buying a stone from a place that rates them themselves. They could rate it whatever they wanted!

If you guys have a recommendation of some stones online for me I would love to see them!! 1,000 dollars is the limit on the stone as the ring in the store is $510

I see what you mean by too deep and bad proportions.

I am going to talk to them today about buying a stone elsewhere and bringing it to them to mount. If I get a ration of crap, I am walking. I would still be spending $510 dollars there and buying a warranty and if that isn''t good enough, I will find someone that it is good enough with.
 
Hi,

I''m also looking to buy soon, so best of luck.

From what I understand, lab gradings/certificates (such as GIA''s) are usually available for diamonds of a certain quality. As they do require work (on the part of the lab) and they do add some value to the product, it''s understandable that grading would add cost (not sure on the $350 figure though).

Shop around for dimensions like Lorilei posted & I doubt you''ll be disappointed.

Was there a reason you needed the ring so soon? If not, you could take more time to shop & also find a ring that might be a better value.

Cheers!
 
Thanks!!!!!!

Why does my jeweler have a .71 for 1,185 and these online places have a .50 for 950? But their ratings are very close to the same?
 
Hey Matt,

Great pictures. Looks like it would make a great proposal spot!

Yes, definitely pass on those diamonds. In addition to the poor cut, you simply can't rely on their grading. You really don't know what you're getting since they use their own standards. Why is their .71 priced at $1185? Well, it doesn't have the grading report behind it so you are trusting that their numbers compare to the grading of the labs. Also, it is poorly cut. Finally, there is just no assurance that it is even a VS2 or an H. Another $185 - nice upsell attempt on their part!

Have you seen the Holloway Cut Advisor? (https://www.pricescope.com/cutadviser.asp) It's just a tool for generally evaulating the performance of a diamond and is basically used to eliminate bad diamond proportions. Your .71 comes in at a 4.5... WAY out in right field. We look for anything below 2 and a 1.1 isn't necessarily better than 1.8. Under Total Visual Performance for your .71, the HCA says Only if price is your main concern.
Light return: Good
Fire: Good
Scintillation: Good
Spread: Very good

Now, I plug in the numbers for Lorelei's .51 ...
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/I-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1236872.asp?b=16&a=12&c=77&cid=131
... and I get a 1.2 and right in the center with
Light Return: Excellent
Fire: Excellent
Scintillation: Very good
Spread: Excellent
Total Visual Performance - excellent within TIC range


Treefrog
 
Matt,

Congratulations on finding the girl of your dreams and making the commitment to marry her! That waterfall is gorgeous and what a sweet picture of the two of you!

I think you should read the tutorial section of this site. You will find it very helpful.

Here are a few things you'll learn:

-The cut is what makes a diamond sparkle. If a diamond is cut badly, it will look dark and dull and un-diamondlike. It may also look much smaller than its weight. Jewelry-store lights may make it sparkle, but once you're out in daylight you'll see the difference.

-The clarity and color of a diamond make a huge difference in the price, but they may make only a tiny difference in the way the diamond looks.

-Clarity: In general, inclusions ("flaws") in VVS and VS diamonds are so small you will never see them with your naked eye. Inclusions in SI1 and SI2 diamonds are usually too small to see with your naked eye, but it's a good idea to check and make sure. I1 flaws are usually visible with the naked eye. I2 and I3 flaws are VERY visible.

-As for color, D (the whitest color) through H look the same to most people looking down at the top of the diamond. I and J may look the tiniest bit tinted, like winter white paint instead of snow. By K, many people can see a hint of creamy color. The whiter the diamond, the more expensive.

-Because the differences in color and clarity are very subtle, you can't tell by yourself what color and clarity a diamond is. That's why people get lab reports. Some labs are better than others. GIA and AGS are the most trusted here. The reason your jeweler is charging so much for a lab report is probably NOT because it's expensive to grade diamonds. It's probably because her diamonds are actually lower in color and clarity than her own grading says. So her SI1 F may really be, for example, an SI2 H. (I'm not saying your jeweler definitely does this, but it's very common.) A real, lab-graded SI1 F will cost more than a loosely graded stone that's really lower in clarity or color.

Good luck!
 
Date: 8/7/2009 10:33:19 AM
Author: arcticcatmatt
Thanks!!!!!!
Why does my jeweler have a .71 for 1,185 and these online places have a .50 for 950? But their ratings are very close to the same?
Click to expand...
Because the cut is crap and a diamond is also priced according to cut.
 
Excellent feedback! This can get very confusing to a guy that knows jack about diamonds.. but I am a designer/engineer so I appreciate numbers and science.

My jeweler wrote me back. Give me feedback on this

Hi Matt,
I am curious where you found a hearts and arrows diamond? Those are brands carried by Kay/JBR/Jared (large Kay Jewelers)/Sterling Companies. It is very important to know that when you purchase a diamond on line, it is generally from a clearing house. The vendor does not have the diamonds in inventory. They literally are a clearing house for jewelers who are “clearing house”.

In addition, we cannot warranty something purchased elsewhere. It is also important to think about the long term. If you purchase the diamond elsewhere and then the stone becomes damaged or lost, it will unfortunately be an out of pocket loss. Additionally, it is important to think about the service after the sale. My advice to you, as your jeweler, is to choose one place or the other, Perrywinkle’s is a privately owned company. Our owner has been in business for over 30 years.

I hope this helps with your questions and decision making process.
 
I didn''t even make it to the second paragraph! Incredible. I''ll comment on it when I stop laughing.

Stay with us here Matt. We have nothing to gain in the direction we steer you so you''re getting totally unbiased opinions here.

The stuff glitterata wrote - absolutely accurate, rock solid advice.

I''ve got to check out the second paragraph now. I can''t wait...

Treefrog
 
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