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Buyer''s Remorse... (wait, doubt) - Input Appreciated

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luv2ctheworld

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 5, 2009
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5
Hi Everyone,

Want to first say this is a great site, filled with so much information and helpful comments. I read as much as possible before making my decision the other day for a engagement ring. I went to several B&M dealers, compared prices via Blue Nile and here, then settled on a loose diamond that was from a dealer that is a friend of a friend. It seems like a great price compared to others available.

I''m pretty certain I got a good price, and I don''t believe this person would overcharge me, given his connection to a friend. However, I am one of those people who worries alot. After reading some more here about more intricate stuff, I am wondering if the rock I bought is a good value.

Here''s the stats:
Carat: 1.39
Color: G
Clarity: VS1
Cut: Ex
Polish: Ex
Sym: Ex
Fluor: None
Culet: None
Crown: 33''
Pav: 41''
Girdle: Th-Med
Table: 60%
Depth: 59.5%
HCA Rating: 1.3
Light Return: Ex
Fire: Ex
Scintillation: Very Good
Spread: Ex
Approx Cost: $9,900

I think what is making me wonder is that there is an inscription of "H&A" noted on the GIA report. At first I didn''t think of it much, and the dealer didn''t make a comment on it. I viewed it through a H&A viewer and there was some nice pattern but I don''t know much. I tried to figure out Rap Report but that''s as useful as me trying to use the the H&A viewer to make a call on the the H&A. But after reading more about how some people put that on as a marketing gimmick, I''m wondering how good the diamond is, if it is a ploy to dress up a not so good diamond, and whether it really is a deal?

I am also trying to understand if the 60:60 ratio can be bad in this case.

Also, I am unclear about taking the rock to an appraiser, will they be able to give me a sale value or replacement value on it?

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
Welcome!

The diamond looks nice, as to the inscription, it doesn't necessarily mean much as anything can be inscribed on a diamond and report. Did you want to purchase an actual h&a diamond? If so then maybe think about a branded h&a if you are open to buying online. You can get diamonds which show hearts and arrows yet not conform to the strict standards that conoisseurs of this cutting style insist on. Unfortunately we can't advise on any patterning without hearts and arrows images, you can read more below on h&a diamonds,

http://diamonds.pricescope.com/hna.asp

As to the 60/60 proportions much is dependant on the angle ranges, the diamond in question has angles which work harmoniously together so that is the main thing - read more on 60 60 here. Some love a nice 60 60 diamond which is well cut, others prefer diamonds with a smaller table ( 54- 58% thereabouts) so much of it is dependant on taste. If you aren't sure if this diamond is right for you - if there is a Jareds in your area ask them to show you their AGS0 cut grade diamonds, or Hearts on Fire if there is a dealer close by. That way you will be comparing your diamond to ones of pretty much known cut quality so you can see which type appeals to you the most.

http://diamonds.pricescope.com/60.asp

As to an independant appraiser, they can advise you in many ways with your diamond, some are skilled in judging cut quality so could give you an opinion on the cut of your diamond, and also whether the price you paid was fair. Here is a tool you can use to find an appraiser in your area.

https://www.pricescope.com/appr_list.aspx
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Messages
37,511
I take it it's a GIA stone with the H&A inscription. GIA does not do grading of H&A. If you are unsure, why not bring this stone for review by an independent appraiser? Pricing also looks reasonable for the size, colour, clarity and cut. If you bought this based on it being an H&A, then I'd certainly would want the H&A pattern checked out by a proffessional if you are unsure about how to check it.
 

luv2ctheworld

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 5, 2009
Messages
5
Thanks for the replies. I am not looking for a real H&A, I figured if it has some features of one, it would be nice.

Does a good HCA number automatically mean it is going to look great, excluding color and clarity factors?

The explanation on the 60:60 ratio helps. The angle explanation makes better sense. I couldn''t take away from the tutorial whether 60:60 was just completely a gimmick or if there is a true 60:60 "desirable" ratio.

In regards to an appraiser, is it something I can request from the dealer (i.e. I would like to have it appraised elsewhere)? I haven''t paid for it yet, is it standard practice to have him let me bring it to a third party? I feel comfortable enough as this person is a "friend of a friend", am I being too lax?

The price he gave me was around $2K less than a comparable one found on Blue Nile, and $4K less than a H&A version. I know from looking around the B&M stores that it is less as well, just want to put that nagging voice of "too good to be true" to rest.

Thanks again.
 

John P

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
May 1, 2008
Messages
3,563
Lorelei was very thorough.

The price is competitive for what you bought. 60/60s can be beautiful. By the numbers your diamond has a crown height of about 13% - though we can't be exact because GIA rounds some of the averages on their reports. It won't have as much fire as some of the near-Tolk configurations that are popularly listed here but it should be very bright if well-cut.

There is no way we can give decisive feedback on cut consistency without seeing actual images. Performance images include ASET or Ideal-Scope. These would permit us to see how all 57 facets work together. The report has single numbers which stand for multiple measurements (for instance, crown angle is actually the avg of eight separate measurements). In the same way, the HCA gives a very general prediction based on a 'chalk outline' it draws from the table, crown and pavilion averages. It's a tool for rejection, not selection, and in this case the diamond's critical numbers passed muster.

Chrono is right about the inscription. It is interesting that someone would have "H&A" inscribed on a 60/60. "H&A" diamonds are not usually associated with 60/60 because tables of that size don't optically result in the traditional long arrows pattern that smaller near-Tolk tables do. The hearts can be quite nice though also somewhat different. Of course cut precision (in any shape or make) can be acquired to enhance contrast patterns...it doesn't need to specifically look like hearts, arrows, ducks, bunnies...whatever.

If you would like an independent appraiser he/she must be selected independently. It should not be someone who sells gemstones or jewelry and he/she should have no affiliation with the seller.
 

luv2ctheworld

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 5, 2009
Messages
5
Thanks for the info. Do dealers have the ability to take such photos or is it normally more for geared for appraisers?

On a side note, he offered to do a simple Pave platinum engagement ring and wedding band, under .2 total carat weight, F/G color, VVS1, for around $700. I''m amazed at the price because Blue Nile has something like that but wants around $1,200 for the e-ring alone. Is the premium that much or am I getting that great of a deal?

Thanks again.
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
Date: 2/6/2009 1:12:58 PM
Author: luv2ctheworld
Thanks for the info. Do dealers have the ability to take such photos or is it normally more for geared for appraisers?

On a side note, he offered to do a simple Pave platinum engagement ring and wedding band, under .2 total carat weight, F/G color, VVS1, for around $700. I''m amazed at the price because Blue Nile has something like that but wants around $1,200 for the e-ring alone. Is the premium that much or am I getting that great of a deal?

Thanks again.
If you mean ASET/ Idealscope images then yes, some vendors can provide them for the customer - some have them routinely available for inventory diamonds, others can take them on request.

As to the setting, qualities vary so it is hard to price what this dealer is offering, but we would need more details of the BN setting to make a better comparison.
 

John P

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
May 1, 2008
Messages
3,563
Date: 2/6/2009 1:12:58 PM
Author: luv2ctheworld
Thanks for the info. Do dealers have the ability to take such photos or is it normally more for geared for appraisers?
Anyone has the ability to; it''s this simple.


On a side note, he offered to do a simple Pave platinum engagement ring and wedding band, under .2 total carat weight, F/G color, VVS1, for around $700. I''m amazed at the price because Blue Nile has something like that but wants around $1,200 for the e-ring alone. Is the premium that much or am I getting that great of a deal?
It could be a great deal if he has movement there (there is typically more profit in settings than diamonds). Just like diamonds, though, setting quality varies. There is a good post by Todd Gray in this thread describing economy vs heavy settings.
 

Todd Gray

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jan 20, 2009
Messages
1,297
Date: 2/6/2009 1:12:58 PM
Author: luv2ctheworld
Do dealers have the ability to take such photos or is it normally more for geared for appraisers?
Most of the dealers here on Price Scope certainly do, some provide detailed photographs for every diamond that they represent and others provide them upon request.
 

luv2ctheworld

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 5, 2009
Messages
5
Want to thank everyone again for their input. I''m going to pick up the ring tomorrow and have an appraiser take a look at it. I understand it costs about $100 for the process.

Very excited!
 
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