Best way to tell if a colored diamond is coated?

[kenny]

Apparently IM service means inscription service. I didn't request the service and while I don't have the report back I have to assume the stone is treated because it seems GIA automatically inscribes treated stones.

FWIW, according to GIA comparison chart of their two FCD reports (yours being the one on the right) a laser inscription is optional on both.

https://www.gia.edu/gem-lab-colored-diamond-grading-report-compare

 

[jnl123]

Do you mean optional as in they have the option of doing it at their discretion or optional that you as a consumer may select it as a service?

 

[kenny]

Do you mean optional as in they have the option of doing it at their discretion or optional that you as a consumer may select it as a service?

Call and ask, but I suspect it's your choice and there is an additional fee.

I don't know but perhaps when GIA determines a diamond is not 100% natural (both material and color) they document it is synthetic or was color-treated with a laser inscription, besides what they write on the report.

I'm just guessing.
Call them.

 

[jnl123]

Call and ask, but I suspect it's your choice and there is an additional fee.

I don't know but perhaps when GIA determines a diamond is not 100% natural (both material and color) they document it is synthetic or was treated with a laser inscription, in addition to what the report will state.

I'm just guessing.
Call them.

This is what their client agreement states:"GIA may, in its discretion, add an Inscription on any Article that GIA reasonably believes to be synthetic, treated, or processed specifying the results of such GIA testing, even if Client did not request such Inscription as a part of the Services. Client hereby agrees to pay for any such Inscription, even though not requested by Client when the Article was initially delivered to GIA."

 

[kenny]

This is what their client agreement states:"GIA may, in its discretion, add an Inscription on any Article that GIA reasonably believes to be synthetic, treated, or processed specifying the results of such GIA testing, even if Client did not request such Inscription as a part of the Services. Client hereby agrees to pay for any such Inscription, even though not requested by Client when the Article was initially delivered to GIA."

Hey, good guess on my part.
I'm not surprised that this was in the fine print.

As an FCD collector I appreciate this as a way of GIA protecting us.
Some sellers (even a huge national chain) may just describe a treated diamond as a 'genuine natural' diamond when it WAS mined from the earth, but treated for color.
They can argue in court they told the truth ... (they just failed to mention another tiny thing that for certain colors may change the value by a factor of ... oh ... uhm ... say ... maybe around 100.)
Some poorly-informed buyers won't even bother to read the GIA report (for a treated or synthetic) carefully.
Vendor can even say it's 'certified' by GIA.

We just had a 4-page thread about this that has vanished ... I'd guess Rogers threatened to sue Pricescope if they didn't delete the thread.
Too bad; Rogers missed an opportunity to turn lemons into lemonade.

I'm sorry your stone was not 100% natural.
At least now you know.

 

[gm89uk]

https://webcache.googleusercontent....n-got-duped.231328/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

still available here if you want. Not sure why it got deleted.

 

[kenny]

https://webcache.googleusercontent....n-got-duped.231328/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

still available here if you want. Not sure why it got deleted.

Cool, thanks.

But that only lets you see pg 1 of a 4 pg thread.
If you try to click on the next page it doesn't come up.
Are the other 3 pages somewhere?

 

[ChristineRose]

Cool, thanks.

But that only lets you see pg 1 of a 4 pg thread.
If you try to click on the next page it doesn't come up.
Are the other 3 pages somewhere?

If you can think of distinctive words that only appear on pages 2, 3, and 4, and do a verbatim search, you might be able to find it.

The cached links point to the "real" pages, not the cached pages.

 

[Sunstorm]

Wow I have never seen anything like this, I would be suspicious but I am also very curious about what GIA will say. If I were you though, I would definitely send in all the stones because while these weird looking ones may be treated, perhaps the lighter, normal looking ones are not and they could still be very valuable. The cost is minimal compared to potential value here and I would test all stones of considerable sizes. With pinks that means even stones in the 20-30 point range. Keep us posted as soon as you can. This is a very exciting thread.
Although I know that in most cases people are disappointed, a friend of mine bought a pink off of ebay for nothing, albeit she is in the trade, her stones has proven to be a natural fancy vivid and she bought it for next to nothing. You just never know. I am always more skeptical than positive but you actually can get lucky.

 

[jnl123]

I am still waiting, GIA estimated release date was the 1st and I haven't head a peep out of them. I am curious too to see what treatment they determined.

 

[jnl123]

GIA finally finished with the stones. They came back as natural color treated diamonds. Although the specific treatment wasn't listed. Is there a good resource to get an idea of what a color treated diamond is worth wholesale/retail?

 

[kenny]

Thanks for returning with results.
Sorry, I don't know how to determine value on treated diamonds; it's hard enough to determine a fair value on fully natural ones.

Perhaps research sites that sell them and look for comps.

 

[ChristineRose]

One of the problems with color-treated stones is that they aren't marketed in the same way naturally white stones are. Most color-treated stones start out as low quality stones because the treatment can ruin the stones and no one wants to risk a stone that already has substantial value. You'll see hundreds of hideous treated stones on e-bay, which are probably someone's reject pile.

The stones that make it through the treatments intact tend to end up in the sort of low-end pieces you'll see in the malls. Malls will charge three times what Blue Nile will for all but identical diamonds. But Blue Nile won't sell you a color-treated diamonds. If you want a stone then it's worth what you're willing to pay for it, even if you have to buy it at Rocks backwrds-R Us. If you're selling your stone may be worth 10% of what it was worth you bought it.

Colored stones are sold mostly to the trade. There's no Pricescope database for you to pick out your dream stone.

My next step would be to figure out what the treatment was--coating vs. irradiation vs. HPHT. Africa Gems is a supplier of treated stones (mostly to the trade) with a good reputation.

 

[tkyasx78]

Thanks for following up ! i dont have anything to add, but I thought the stones were beautiful! I'm glad you finally have an answer though!

 

[jnl123]

Given the length of time GIA took and that they didn't state irradiated or HPHT which I have seen on other certs I think they aren't sure themselves and I believe I read somewhere GIA will not grade a coated stone. It just says color treatment by one or more methods. The stones are largish. One came back fancy deep pinkish-orange and one fancy intense reddish-pink. They are both over 1CT and have good clarity. Not sure what to do with them.

 

[ChristineRose]

Poking around a little, it appears coatings and irradiation should be detectable with a microscope or loupe.

If it's not coated or irradiated, it's HPHT.

As frustrating as it must be, you could look for a specially trained appraiser. But a cheaper option would be to look for a gem and rock collector's club. Many of them would have the training and tools to help you.

Fun stuff:

A History of Diamond Treatments

There are many other technical papers out there if you want to dive into it.

 

[jnl123]

The thing is I was under the impression GIA would list the treatment. Looking around some certs specifically say HPHT or irradiated, mine just says color treatment by one or more methods. I did confirm with a jeweler though that they send back a stone ungraded if it is coated so that's not what it is.

 

[ChristineRose]

Can you call them and ask them? They might have a different report; they might just tell you.

 

[kenny]

Given the length of time GIA took and that they didn't state irradiated or HPHT which I have seen on other certs I think they aren't sure themselves and I believe I read somewhere GIA will not grade a coated stone. It just says color treatment by one or more methods. The stones are largish. One came back fancy deep pinkish-orange and one fancy intense reddish-pink. They are both over 1CT and have good clarity. Not sure what to do with them.

Are you sure the GIA report actually says "Fancy Intense Reddish-Pink"?
Also what is the exact name of report, listed at the top?

I was under the impression that Fancy Red was the only possibility .... no Fancy Deep Red, or Fancy Intense Red, and no Reddish anything, there can never be a modifier to Red, and Red cannot be a modifier.
IOW, the only time Red will be on an FCD GIA report is if the color is called simply Fancy Red.
Kinda makes sense because a light red is a pink.

I could be wrong or GIA may have changed on this.

 

[jnl123]

Whoops! Kenny you're right. I have too much paperwork in front of me. I was looking at an insurance report I had a local jeweler draw up for USPS insurance just in case they got lost so I had something to prove some sort of value for and what was in the package. Goes to show what some jewelers know about colored stones. The GIA report for that stone says Fancy Purplish-Red. The report was a GIA colored diamond report identification and origin. The other was as fancy deep pinkish-orange. They were both inscribed "TREATED COLOR" and the color has an asterix which leads to a note which says: "This diamond has been treated by one or more processes to change its color".

 

[kenny]

Thanks.

Hmm, so they do list red with another hue modifier.
I stand corrected.

... old rotten brain.

 

[jnl123]

Yup, here's a natural one from Leibish that is purplish-red http://www.leibish.com/red-diamonds/fancy-purplish-red-radiant-18856

 

[Texas Leaguer]

I think if you call GIA for more info on the reports you purchased, they will connect you to someone who can shed more light on the possible treatments.
Can you post the report numbers?