Bad On line purchase Experience

[perry]

maxspinel:

You have me confused now: If you have serched Pricescope well enough to find the occasional case where an unhappy consumer was told that they were in fact treated fairly; you would have noticed the many many and many cases where a consumer brought a complaint - named names - and was supported on this site.

You claim that, apparently, you were sold a misrepresented diamond (and one without a cert).

You claim that it was from a vendor recommened by people on this site, and you maintaint that you don''t want to tell us who they are to "protect their reputation."

Well if they did what you claimed they did - then we all need to know who they are - so that we know their reputation.

All vendors make mistakes - the question is how the mistake is handled. It seems from your claim that the vendor kept an unfair amount of money - again something not very ethical.

If they did you wrong - I suspect that you will find things better shortly thereafter (as the vast majority of people who post a complaint about a vendor who is often discussed here on pricescope have found out). Pricescope as a community and Pricescope as a company can have an affect on a vendor - and the vendors are usually quick to respond.

On the other hand; if you researched pricescope well enough to find the stories I mentioned above - you would have found a few stories by people who claimed things that were later proven not to be true.


You further confuse the situation by claiming that "I''ve got nothing to gain by sharing my experience with people in this forum so consumers could be aware of appropriate steps to protect themselves.

Makes me wonder...

Two well respected people above have expressed skeptisim about your claims. At this point, add me to the list.

If you can substaintiate your claims you will in fact have earned something: Credibility.

You do not even have to do that directly if you don''t wish to publically post the information. I invite you to send the information to Leonid the forum moderator and he can insert a post saying you have submitted the information and he is investigation, and later the results of that investigation.

Please use the following link as needed:

www.pricescope.com/contact.asp


Perry

 

[maxspinel]

Cyber10,

The vendor is not Good Old Gold or White flash. This particular vendor specializes in colored diamonds so his/her name doesn’t come up as often. My only intent is to relate my own experience so others can benefit from it. This vendor can theoretically be anybody. Just because someone is highly recommended doesn’t mean we can let our guards down. Most people in the forum are just pseudo names with no faces attached. Some are genuinely interested in promoting consumer awareness while others are simply here to advance their businesses. Follow the golden rule and the comments posted by other members to protect your hard earned money. Don’t pay in full and in advance for something that somebody promise to ship no matter how good their reputation is or how favorable they have advertised their return policy. If you really have to do it, use at least credit card, not wire transfer. I believe Good Old Good and White Flash are among the vendors who are willing to ship the items to certain independent appraiser with only a fee just to cover their shipping cost.

To be fair, buying a round white diamond on line is probably less demanding than colored diamonds/gems since the cert should tell most of the story. Most of the data are there and now you can even plug the dimensions in a program to calculate scillination and fire. Still, you need someone like an independent appraiser to make sure the stone matches the cert and there are no obvious defects that could have incurred after the certification. White diamonds have 4 Cs, cut, carat, clarity, color. Colored stones have 4 Cs too and they are color, color, color and color. It is difficult to capture color on the monitor so it is IMHO, far more challenging to find the color that appeals to you in person. This gives more room for misrepresentation and misinterpretation. However, the world is a palette of colors and I love them all. Every shade of color showcases a different personality and they sing a different story. No two stones are alike; sky is the limit for all the available combinations and possibilities.

Good luck and take good care

 

[belle]

maxspinel,
i am sure it is not your intention but please realize you are doing more of a disservice to reputable online vendors than you are helping by not mentioning the name of who you dealt with. all anyone is left with is 'online dealers are bad.' no matter what you preface it with. we are left to guess and speculate and newbies who are hesitant to buy online in the first place are even more scared. the two top vendors here were even mentioned as being suspect and there couldn't be anyone more trustworthy!
i have no idea what your intentions are but again, you are not being as helpful with your veiled testimony as you think you are.

 

[Kaleigh]

Date: 8/10/2006 8:26:28 PM
Author: belle
maxspinel,
i am sure it is not your intention but please realize you are doing more of a disservice to reputable online vendors than you are helping by not mentioning the name of who you dealt with. all anyone is left with is ''online dealers are bad.'' no matter what you preface it with. we are left to guess and speculate and newbies who are hesitant to buy online in the first place are even more scared. the two top vendors here were even mentioned as being suspect and there couldn''t be anyone more trustworthy!
i have no idea what your intentions are but again, you are not being as helpful with your veiled testimony as you think you are.

I agree 100% belle. I think at this point you need to say who the vendor is. From there people can make up their own minds. But the whole thing is veiled as belle said.

 

[aussiegirl23]

Maxspinel,

I am a bit confused as to what your objective is here.

You don''t want to reveal the vendor''s name in hopes to prevent trashing their good name. But that provides no help to us other consumers whatsoever.

You don''t want to provide any specifics as to the stones you purchased, or what they were really appraised as.

So my point is - what''s the point of you coming on here and posting this thread? You''re angry enough to be considering legal action, and seem to be seeking the support of the PriceScope community, but aren''t allowing us the oppurtunity to evaluate your situation fairly.

All of these things together make the situation stink - there''s got to be something else going on here that has got all of us slightly skeptical people get their hackles up. So what''s the deal? Why did you really post this?

Aussiegirl : p

 

[Aurelia]

Date: 8/8/2006 9:15:36 PM
Author:maxspinel

It is the last straw when I had to shelf out greater than $50,000 to order a pink diamond from a supposed to be big company.

I found a brick and mortar retailer who is able to locate a similar pink diamond for me. It is a little more expensive but looks ten times, no a hundred times better. I learnt my lesson and I should have listened to my hubby, never buy anything on line........

Okay, I know I''m new here, but I figured I would throw in my .02

One thing I''ve learned from reading here is that if you have a good B&M store locally, it is a good thing to explore their options too, and take advantage of the ability to go LOOK at the stone you''re considering before shelling out money, especially to the order of 50K!

"The company was actually recommended by this web site. I didn''t want to make a scene and since they promptly refunded my money, I chose not to disclose the name. Because of their good reputation, I trusted this store and shelfed out the money. And believe me, $50,000 was no bargain. During this process, I lost $750 but gained a valuable lesson."

If the company promptly refunded your money when there was a discrepancy, doesn''t this kind of customer service deserve some recognition? This is a good thing - so listing the company''s name would be advantageous to them. Every business has problems and makes mistakes, but they rectified it. Losing 1.5% of a purchase doesn''t seem that bad. It''s not like Zappos where it''s common practice to order a pair of shoes, find it''s the wrong size, send them back and get a full refund!

"The whole point of this post, just like you have stated, iis to raise consumer awareness so they can take appropriate steps not to fall into the same traps again. I am just lucky to get my money back; many others might not be so lucky."

We, the other consumers on PriceScope, are not going to learn anything unless you give us 100% of the background information here. There are plenty of terrible online companies out there who are dispicible, and tons of very reputable companies that will go to the end of the earth for you. Just trashing the entire idea of online shopping is ridiculous. Specific criticism and examples of issues would be helpful. Right now, you''re simply insulting the internet... how useful is that?

"I could have confronted them when I returned the item and demanded them waiving the fee but since they got a big chunk of my money, being abrupt and confrontational is not a good tactic if you want your money back. Later after the refund, I did not even bother to question them why they have deducted more than what they stated in the invoice. It has become such a hassle and I am so tired of it. Like I said, I am counting my blessing that I got most of my money back and I am treating the lost change as tuition fees to educate myself how not to be ripped off in the future. "

Here''s one statement you made that bugged me - in life, one must be pro-active. You have to remind the coffee shop not to add sugar if you don''t want it, you have to remind the baby-sitter not to let the kids watch TV after 8, you have to double-check with the insurance company about changes to your policy, etc. You can''t just sit back and NOT ASK about why they deducted more than what they stated on the invoice. You are acting passive, and simply accepting the situation for what it is. What if they made a mistake? Or what if a simple conversation would have resolved the discrepancy? You''re just laying down and taking this. And yet now you''re considering taking legal action? Seems a bit inconsistent on your part. If you consider this all to be an educational experience, why are you considering legal action?

"In my case, I was trying to be more tactful here by leaving out the details to give some benefit of the doubt to the vendor. Somehow, it seems that I am being accused now for not doing the opposite. Damned you do and damned you don''t. I am wondering if the new lessons learnt here is that the consumer is always wrong."

We''re not "damning you" since you haven''t listed the company''s name. We''re simply unable to help you, or really understand what is going on if you''re going to continue to be so vague. Again, back to my point above, when I asked why you posted this whole thread. We''re not saying the consumer is always wrong - but that right now we have only a small piece of the story - and from only one party involved. You''re not giving enough info or detail to understand or resolve anything.

"My only intent is to relate my own experience so others can benefit from it."

This is as bad as saying "Watch out people, a viscious dog just bit me..." But you''re not warning people which dog it was... NOT HELPFUL!

"Most people in the forum are just pseudo names with no faces attached. Some are genuinely interested in promoting consumer awareness while others are simply here to advance their businesses."

This simply isn''t true - the vendors, appraisers, and other experts clearly identify themselves with full names, company names, etc... There aren''t a million employees running around creating fake identities just to chime in and promote their business. This site isn''t some veiled conspiracy theory to promote certain jewelery companies. It''s to inform people about diamonds - plain and simple.

Okay, I''ve said enough - but really, you''re not helping anyone with this post, unless you''re honest with yourself and others as to what happened.

Aurelia

 

[maxspinel]

I posted the information to Leonid using the link. He know the vendor now.

 

[perry]

Most people in the forum are just pseudo names with no faces attached. Some are genuinely interested in promoting consumer awareness while others are simply here to advance their businesses."

For the record here:

My name really is Perry. Before Pricescope removed the contact information from the forums due to privacy issues that came up - mine was there. I admit that I have not adopted a symbol - but I can''t think of one that is appropriate. But my picture does exist on Pricescope for those who want to dig it up.

I''ve got nothing to hide.

There are about a half dozen vendors here on Pricescope who know exactly who I am and know how to get ahold of me - and I''ve sat in the offices of several of them within the last month.

If needed the Forum Administrators (Leonid & Irena) can contact me as well.

As Aurelia correctly stated: many of the people and experts on this forum are from companies - and exactly who they are and how to contact them is redily available. I personally think that some of these people put in a lot more time helping consumers than they ever earn in business from the site. As for the what business they get.... Helping people to learn what is appropriate and right is the best way to get business. Many of these people value an educated consumer.

It is amazing that other business does as well. Short version of a long story: I will be installing a new heating boiler. The companies I''m dealing with also appreaciate an educated consumer because they are not selling the cheapest boilers out there - they are selling high quality boilers (and I could buy my planned engagement ring for a certain young lady that didn''t pan out with what I will be paying for that boiler and related work.

When you shop quality (service, better specs, etc) - the vendors who sell those things always want an educated consumer - and are willing to educate even if they don''t get the business.

No difference here; and I greatly appreciate the ones who do so. It is afterall how I learned.

Perry

 

[Rod]

Hello.......My name is Rod and there is nothing veiled in the fact that my name is what I profess it to be. And to be honest, I too take offense at your comment that many here are veiled names to promote their business. Hogwash. The vendors clearly identify themselves and we consumers are a community of people at varying levels of diamond knowledge.

Members such as Belle and Storm are quite knowledgeable and they go to great lengths to help people, for no monetary compensation or reward other than the fact that they know enough and care enough to help people get the best they can for their money. Other people, like myself have been learning (slowly) over the last several months and like myself know enough to comment when appropriate (and sometimes, we make comments that aren''t absolutely correct), but we also spend a lot of time here looking for ways to learn more and offer our help if we can.

You, my friend, have gone about this all wrong. You have made accusations, but you won''t substantiate them. It''s difficult to know what your true motive is, but if you believe you are offering help to people less knowledgeable, I think you''ve missed the mark.

Sincerely...........ROD......Legally and Truthfully

 

[coda72]

I think I know who this vendor is, and if it''s who I think it is, I''m not a bit surprised.

 

[Lorelei]

Max, if you stick around Pricescope long enough, you will get to realize that we truly are a community who spend time here to try to help new consumers, learn more ourselves and simply to have fun while doing it. The professionals and experts are easily recognizable from the 'prosumers.' I don't use my real name or any identifying feature as I choose not to, those here whom I am more friendly with than just interacting here on the forums know what my real names are and more about me - I have nothing to hide, but choose not to use my real name here. Hopefully us regular posters DO help in some way and help Leonid and Irina to keep PS the great place it is by trying to use the forums respectfully and properly so that the real mission of PS can be fulfilled - helping folk buy a great diamond. Leonid and Irina work very hard to run a 'clean' forum, free from false identities, spammers. shills etc and their efforts are to be applauded.

I am sorry about what happened to you - truly - I am fairly sure I know who the vendor is, but maybe as the others say, it might be better to post this information so that other purchasers can make their own decisions

 

[pricescope]

Date: 8/10/2006 9:48:18 PM
Author: maxspinel
I posted the information to Leonid using the link. He know the vendor now.

We did get an email from Maxspinel and know who the vendor is. A few thoughts from our viewpoint.

1. First of all, we feel sorry that Maxspinel had bad experience and lost money and time. Unfortunately, this could happen with both online and traditional vendor. Other members understand and sympathase you. However, neither experts nor consumers can help you in any way, unless you share more information. Let''s do not turn against each other out of frustration

2. In this particular case, the company in question is not our advertiser or listed anywhere on our site. Moreover, we haven''t found any testimonial on our forum that shares positive or negative experience dealing with this company. Therefore, this vendor was not really "recommended" by anybody here.

3. If there would be facts of wrongdoing or ethical problems with any company that advertise or listed here, we should get rid of such advertiser.

4. However, Pricescope is not FTC or BBB. We provide the message board to share your experience to inform other people. Consumers can ask questions and get response from fellow consumers and experts. It doesn''t mean consumers should skip due diligence and then blaim "this site".

5. A few regular members of this forum did posted links to some pages/pictures of this vendor pointing to some products. Although it was more like illustrations during conversations rather than recommendations to do business with this vendor especially no-one said that they know that vendor or bought anything from them.

6. When working with any vendor online, auction, catalog, TV, or in B&M store, please evaluate your risk and exercise common sense to protect yourself: check the company background, get written warranties, employ independent appraiser, use credit card, etc.

7. Share your factual information with community to help your fellow consumers to avoid similar problems. Unfortunately, we know that some community members prefer not to share negative experience with their vendors for different reasons: legal, financial interests, or simply afraid to look silly. For example, a member gets a great deal from a company and writes rave testimonials for that company on the forum, recommends it all the time. Later this member discovers poor quality of the work but not posting about it on the forum because doesn''t want to loose his/her face.... There are many other reasons.

8. Consumers who recommend other vendors or simply dropping links (or pictures) for illustrations, keep in mind that you are influencing someone''s buying decision. Make it clear what your knowledge of this vendor/products is.

What else can we say

 

[Rod]

Date: 8/11/2006 11:19:56 AM
Author: Pricescope

Date: 8/10/2006 9:48:18 PM
Author: maxspinel
I posted the information to Leonid using the link. He know the vendor now.

We did get an email from Maxspinel and know who the vendor is. A few thoughts from our viewpoint.

1. First of all, we feel sorry that Maxspinel had bad experience and lost money and time. Unfortunately, this could happen with both online and traditional vendor. Other members understand and sympathase you. However, neither experts nor consumers can help you in any way, unless you share more information. Let''s do not turn against each other out of frustration

2. In this particular case, the company in question is not our advertiser or listed anywhere on our site. Moreover, we haven''t found any testimonial on our forum that shares positive or negative experience dealing with this company. Therefore, this vendor was not really ''recommended'' by anybody here.

3. If there would be facts of wrongdoing or ethical problems with any company that advertise or listed here, we should get rid of such advertiser.

4. However, Pricescope is not FTC or BBB. We provide the message board to share your experience to inform other people. Consumers can ask questions and get response from fellow consumers and experts. It doesn''t mean consumers should skip due diligence and then blaim ''this site''.

5. A few regular members of this forum did posted links to some pages/pictures of this vendor pointing to some products. Although it was more like illustrations during conversations rather than recommendations to do business with this vendor especially no-one said that they know that vendor or bought anything from them.

6. When working with any vendor online, auction, catalog, TV, or in B&M store, please evaluate your risk and exercise common sense to protect yourself: check the company background, get written warranties, employ independent appraiser, use credit card, etc.

7. Share your factual information with community to help your fellow consumers to avoid similar problems. Unfortunately, we know that some community members prefer not to share negative experience with their vendors for different reasons: legal, financial interests, or simply afraid to look silly. For example, a member gets a great deal from a company and writes rave testimonials for that company on the forum, recommends it all the time. Later this member discovers poor quality of the work but not posting about it on the forum because doesn''t want to loose his/her face.... There are many other reasons.

8. Consumers who recommend other vendors or simply dropping links (or pictures) for illustrations, keep in mind that you are influencing someone''s buying decision. Make it clear what your knowledge of this vendor/products is.

What else can we say

Nothing........But thanks as usual. Nicely said!

 

[Cyberj10]

Thank you Mr./Ms. admin, nicely stated.

I would like to thank you to Max for at least sharing the vendor identity with the administrators so that they could conduct an unbiased investigation and provide us consumers with more factual information. I know it probably hasn''t been easy for you deciding what to do but please realize that the only way we ALL learn is for everyone to share their personal experiences with one another. I hope you''ll stick around and continue to take part in the wonderful community that the Pricescope forums promote. Cheers!

 

[kasmom]

Hi maxspinel,

I think I know who this vendor is. I also bought a diamond from them and ended up returning it. It was an SI2 and suppose to be eye-clean but upon receiving it I can spot the inclusions from far away. The return was easy but there was a 3% restocking fee as listed on their website. I think they did you a favor for charging only 1.5%. I don''t think they are dishonest and should be aware. What I learned after the incident is find a vendor that don''t charge a restocking fee and that they have a strict standar when descriping their diamonds.

 

[maxspinel]

Hi Kasmom,

This vendor does not advertise a restocking fee. I concur I am lucky that I only lose a tiny sum conpared to the whole amount; however, I couldn''t quite quantify it as a favor.

IMHO, I also don''t think it is a good practice to represent an item with obvious visible flaws from far away as SI2, then charge a 3% restocking fee. Instead of relying on the strict standard of description posted by the vendor, we think we''d better trust the cert or independent appraiser.

 

[kasmom]

I bought a very inexpensive diamond for occasional wear. But in case of a 50K pink diamond, I think you should definitely send it to an appraiser or buy a ticket to go see the diamond in person before making any purchase.

 

[Modified Brilliant]

As an independent appraiser, I am working for "you''" the consumer. If you are buying a house you certainly would want to hire your own appraiser and not just
accept the seller''s appraisal. There really is no difference when you''re spending thousands of dollars of your hard earned money.

An independent appraiser tries to keep everyone honest but believe me...it''s an uphill battle sometimes. Thankfully, the good sellers

far outweigh the bad.

I repeat, it''s your hard earned money. Do your homework and research before making a major purchase of any kind AND read the fine print

www.metrojewelryappraisers.com

Date: 8/11/2006 4:08:42 PM
Author: maxspinel

Hi Kasmom,

This vendor does not advertise a restocking fee. I concur I am lucky that I only lose a tiny sum conpared to the whole amount; however, I couldn''t quite quantify it as a favor.

IMHO, I also don''t think it is a good practice to represent an item with obvious visible flaws from far away as SI2, then charge a 3% restocking fee. Instead of relying on the strict standard of description posted by the vendor, we think we''d better trust the cert or independent appraiser.

 

[codex57]

So far, the only valid point or lesson I see out of this entire thread is that you really need to educate yourself before purchasing something pricy.

I dunno, maybe it's cause I've been hardened and experienced through more than a handful of purchases on eBay, but you've got to learn what constitutes a valid recommendation or review before accepting it as fact. You gotta take everything you see online with a grain of salt. That's why people are so anxious to see more details to find flaws or to otherwise verify the OP's story.

That's also why I wasn't very surprised to see Leonid state that he couldn't find any recommendations for the vendor in question. If someone merely mentions a name or posts a link, it doesn't mean it's a recommendation. If someone says, "I had a great experience with X", it doesn't mean it's a VALID recommendation. It doesn't have enough detail. If there is enough detail, are there other people with similar good experiences with the vendor and have the details to elaborate? You wanna see more than a couple recommendations b/c anyone can anonymously log on and post a vague recommendation (including the vendor and his/her buddies). You want details to see if either it has inconsistencies meaning it's an elaborate hoax, or if the person is just easily pleased (or unrealistic/unreasonable if it's a bad review).

I've seen plenty enough posts (and have enough experience with eBay personally) to know that any jewelry offered for sale on eBay is almost certainly crap, overpriced, or a scam (often all 3 at once).

I really tried to find an important lesson in the OP's story since she seems like a nice, respectful lady trying not to make attacks on character unnecessarily. Unfortunately, for lurkers and others trying to learn something and come across this thread (to the OP as well come to think of it), the only valid lesson here is not that buying online is bad, but that you need to really educate yourself and find out red flags and warnings before you spend a significant amount of money. That goes for online AND at a Brick & Mortar store.

 

[elmo]

Date: 8/11/2006 5:40:14 PM
Author: codex57
So far, the only valid point or lesson I see out of this entire thread is that you really need to educate yourself before purchasing something pricy.

Educating yourself is good, but as Jeff says, also hire a pro to assist. For something like this, not just a qualified appraiser but a specialist, an enthusiast, someone who evaluates several pink diamonds each year; someone who will help you evaluate quality and not just run the numbers, GIA style. Even though I disagree with the blanket criticism of internet sellers, I think in general that for high-end colored stones, the chances of finding something really fine on the internet is fairly low.

 

[pinkflamingo]

Date: 8/11/2006 4:08:42 PM
Author: maxspinel





IMHO, I also don't think it is a good practice to represent an item with obvious visible flaws from far away as SI2, then charge a 3% restocking fee.

AFAIK SI2 does NOT mean eyeclean 90% of the time. I have seen many many SI2s that are not eyeclean, even graded by GIA. Zales and other maul stores seem to specialize in these...

My friend has a large stone that is a GIA SI2 and I can see a carbon speck from about a foot viewing distance. Of course, she paid about half the going rate here for her diamond.


why would you assume this?


Also, I am not sure why you would be spending that kind of cash without a GIA certificate. it sounds to me like you didn't do your research. I hope I don't across as rude. Hopefully next time, you will send to an accredited independent appraiser BEFORE purchase.

 

[maxspinel]

I stated again and again that yes, as a consumer, I did not take the appropriate steps to protect myself.

As for the certificate, you''ll be surprised how many fancy color diamonds out there which only have a GIA color cert, not full cert. Since the beginning of this year, I''ve looking for a pink diamond. I really couldn''t find anthing that matches my criterion and fits the budget from local jewelers. My budget might seems generous but not so for pink diamonds for ~ 1.25 ct, with good clarity and color. I took a chance on online purchase in haste w/o really going through the thought process.

It is my 25th anniversary at the end of this month and I was so hoping that I can finish the pink diamond ring in time for this special day. It looks less and less likely that it is going to happen. I went back to local jewelers (LA downtown jewelry district & some maul retailers) and look at what they have. They do look way better than the one that I returned but it really doesn''t say much since the other one is SO SO bad. The only pink diamonds that I can find are:

LA downtown Jewelry district:
1) 1.38 fancy light pink, VVS2, full GIA certificate, cushion cut: $42k
2) 1.5 fancy light purplish pink, I1, GIA color cert, Marquise: $25k
3) 1.08 fancy purplish pink, I1, GIA color cert, modified rectangular brilliant: $35k.
4) 1.5 fancy orangy pink, SI2 clarity, GIA color cert, oval: $68k
5) 1.08 fancy intense pink purple, SI2 clarity, GIA color cert, oval: $86k

Mauls:
1) Fashion Island Maul in Newport Beach: 1.5 fancy brownish pink, SI1, ful GIA certificate, radiant: $70k
2) Tiffancy, South Coast Maul in Newport Beach: 2.01 fancy intense purplish pink, VS, full GIA certificate, radiant: $ 660,000 + Tax

. Gorgeous, gorgeous stone. I love this one the most

but need to sell a house or win a big lotto.

Please note that except the first one in LA downtown or the high end mauls, none of them has a full certificate. All the clarify descriptions are from the various vendors.

 

[elmo]

A few additional thoughts here. You say you're in LA. It's not a recommendation

but I thought that Ariel at IceStore has his office in or near the LA jewelry district. He specializes in colored diamonds, and I expect he could find something nice for you. Also, and you probably already know this, most pink diamonds come from the Argyle mine in Australia, and it is my understanding that Argyle stones often have clarity issues. I expect you will see many SI2/I clarity pinks as a result. (Edited to add: also consider that because the material is so valuable, in addition to the poor clarity, I expect you'll see a lot of very poorly-cut stones. I haven't looked at pinks but was shocked once at an asking price I saw for a half-carat very-well-cut intense pink EC, far more than unheated fine quality ruby. Have you thought about a killer ruby instead?

) (And as you have seen, color doesn't make an ugly diamond pretty.) Also, if you email or call Garry Holloway here and start a conversation (who is in Australia and familiar with Argyle stones) there's a possibility you can pick up some good info. Finally, it might be worth getting in touch with Stephen Hofer (who literally wrote the book on colored diamonds and consults). Again not a recommendation, but something I would try if I was shopping for this.

 

[jaz464]

AFAIK SI2 does NOT mean eyeclean 90% of the time. I have seen many many SI2s that are not eyeclean, even graded by GIA. Zales and other maul stores seem to specialize in these...

My friend has a large stone that is a GIA SI2 and I can see a carbon speck from about a foot viewing distance. Of course, she paid about half the going rate here for her diamond.


why would you assume this?

Most SI2s are not going to be eyeclean. People that find eyeclean SI2s are lucky and often spend a lot of time looking for them. I would not expect anything lower than a VS2 (accurately graded) to be eyeclean almost all of the time, to an average set of eyes.

 

[kenny]

Buying diamonds is all about risk, online OR at a brick and mortar store.
Risk is not black and white.
Risk comes in shades of gray, from darker to lighter.

For me buying an F VVS2 (so I can verify some inclusions on the plot to the stone) round ACA with AGS paper from Whiteflash in person at their store in Texas using my Visa card, with angles that put in the center of the charts for BOTH AGS 0 and GIA's Excellent cut has low risk, lets call it 2 out of 100.
The same purchase online, wiring the funds, raises the risk - to me today since I have had good experience with WF I'd say the risk only goes up to 5 out of 100. (My very first time I would have put the risk up at 20)
Now change that to an Expert Selection and the risk goes up a little that I won't be as happy, say 10 out of 100.
Change it to GIA paper and the risk goes up a little since they have fewer steps in their cut grading system making more angle combinations possible in the grade, now lets say the risk of being unhappy is 15 out of 100.
Change it from VVS2 to SI2 the risk goes up, say, 30 out of 100 - now we must deal with "opinions" of eye-clean and acceptability of the feathers' nature and location.
Change it to a less-known vendor I have never dealt with or read about and the risk goes up, say 40 out of 100.
Change it to EGL-USA paper and the risk goes up, say 55 out of 100.
Chanage it to EGS-Israel and now we are at 65 out of 100.
Change it to anything other than a round, where there is no HCA or grade cuts, and the risk goes up, say 75 out of 100.
Change it to a fancy color and the risk goes up again, say 85 out of 100.

Any eBay purchase is 200 out of 100.

All my numbers are arbitrary, and your numbers will be different, and you can argue with my criteria, but you get the idea.

This buyer made what I would call a very risky purchase.
Personally, I will only make very low-risk purchases.
(I will not buy and Asscher till AGS cut-grades them.)

If I wanted a $50,000 pink diamond I'd spend a ton of time learning, researching and checking references and probably use appraisers and/or fly around the country to shop.

 

[Mexi]

Kenny - I totally agree with you. IMO It has nothing to do with the internet.

 

[maxspinel]

I did call up icestore and the gentleman (I forgot his name) told me that he did not have too much stock. At the time, those stones listed on his web site were almost sold. He found me a radiant cut fancy light 1.27 ct, SI2 with full GIA cert for 27K. I was hoping to get something in the fancy category, not light.

Besides the pink, I would consider other fancy colors. I realized that he is in LA and I asked him if I could come by and look at some of his other listed diamonds. He said no.

I know I did it in haste w/o due diligent steps to protect myself but I was running out of time.

 

[RockDoc]

For those interested in learning about fancy pinks from Argyle etc, and how they are sold, rent the PBS film "Diamonds" from Blockbuster or from Netflix. This is a really great film for those interested in diamonds in general as well as the fancy color ones. Cost: a few $$.

If you really have a burning desire to learn about fancy colors, invest $ 300.00 in Hoefer''s book on Colored Diamonds.

Occasionally, there are some fancy colored diamonds that go on sale at Christies and Sotheby''s. Check their websites, as they are informative too.

Rockdoc

 

[Anthony K]

Unfortunately we cannot self promote, if I am not mistaken, because I know "A Guy" who has these available, but I am new here and am not 100% certain of the rules because I see ppl with their web-sites linked on their messages and is that not considered self promotion? What is one to do when we could help rectify the unhappy situation for a consumer who had a disappointing experience with a company?

Max I do hope you get everything worked out with your search for your diamond.
Anthony K

 

[belle]

Date: 8/13/2006 5:47:42 PM
Author: Anthony K

Unfortunately we cannot self promote, if I am not mistaken, because I know ''A Guy'' who has these available, but I am new here and am not 100% certain of the rules because I see ppl with their web-sites linked on their messages and is that not considered self promotion?

your question is answered in the ''forum rules'' section that you agreed to when you registered.
https://www.pricescope.com/idealbb/faq.asp?mode=policy