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AVC and color.....should I regret?

mzzdna

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
Messages
43
I recently got engaged with a beautiful AVC. I love how it looks so different all the time depending on the lighting conditions. I know I should be happy with it BUT one of the things that bothers me is the color. It's H. Sometimes it's really white but other times it looks so yellow! Does this happen with all AVC's? Or is it that I'm color sensitive?

Do high colored AVC owners notice that it can still look yellow depending on the lighting?

My fiance bought this stone last year and now the prices have gone up so much that I don't think we would be able to trade up. Would it be worth it to get a smaller stone at a higher color? Does anyone know about GOG policies with the dramatic increase in diamond prices???

TIA!
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
What color are you wearing, and what color are the walls around you when it looks yellow?
 

yssie

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Messages
21,105
Ditto Gypsy's question! Diamonds are like little mirrors and prisms and windows at different times, in different lights, from different angles - if the walls were yellow, or the ceiling, or you were wearing a yellow shirt your stone might have been reflecting that.

Can you go to your local jeweller and check out some (reputably graded - AGS, GIA in the US) higher colour stones, compare to yours and see what your eyes think in-person? That's the best way to find out anything for sure.
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
And not only yellow makes diamond look tinted, but beige or brown or taupe walls or environment too.

And H is not likely to show enough body color to make you scream "YELLOW!!" But it might react more to the environmental colors than a true colorless stone, say DEF. Is it worth it to go down in color? *shrug* only you know. Can you buy a smaller AVC to see to help decide, and return it, or your present for upgrade, if that is the way you go?
 

mzzdna

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
Messages
43
I'm a upset with myself as I could have gotten an F at the time but the videos did not show that much color difference. :( I didn't have a chance to see them side by side in person. But I look at it now and just see a color to it. I almost wonder if it was the correct color grade? Has GOG ever made mistakes on that? I can understand the color tinting from the environment so I don't factor that in. Perhaps it's my skin tone (it's yellow based....) because I don't think it's the clothes that I wear.....
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Dec 16, 2007
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GOG does not determine the color grade, AGS does. Sometimes they make "mistakes", and if your stone is regraded it is theoretically possible that it would come back an I color grade. But you won't know and that is irrelevant.

I think you have a couple options here. Pony up for a higher color or learn to love the variation in your stone! As I said, I think it could be worth having a smaller higher color stone sent to you (you would have to purchase it of course) and comparing it. You may just not like the optical performance of a AVC, which is likely to show much more variation in color appearance simply because of its cut than an RB. But since GOG carries other cuts you can always switch. GOG has a very good upgrade policy -- they even allow even trades I believe -- so it is as good as you will get in diamonds.
 

MissStepcut

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
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Jun 29, 2011
Messages
1,720
An H looking yellow? The most I've ever seen is sorta like aged paper. Ditto the viewing environment concerns.
 

jstarfireb

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 24, 2007
Messages
6,232
In an H, you are probably seeing reflections from the environment rather than true body color. Check out this video...about halfway though, you'll see a D color stone that looks yellowish due to the lighting environment:

http://www.vimeo.com/917255
 

ame

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2004
Messages
10,763
It sounds like you're either extra color sensitive, or you're seeing ambient color. If you aren't happy with this stone though, get the F.
 

CharmyPoo

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 10, 2004
Messages
7,007
You may be very color sensitive. I have an E (appraisals indicate more like a D) - I never see signs of yellow unless I am under yellow light in a yellow room.
 

kenny

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Apr 30, 2005
Messages
28,963
The larger the facets the less they conceal body color, especially if you are not looking straight down into the top of the diamond.
If it bugs you perhaps trade it in for an F or G.

Our Octavia is a GIA H and I wish it was an F but the H was the only one in our size at the time.
The yellow is certainly not pronounced but it is detectable in some lighting at certain viewing angles especially since I'm used to F.
 

John P

Ideal_Rock
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kenny|1314037566|2996700 said:
The larger the facets the less they conceal body color...
This is probably at work, although I am sure that the cut-quality of that diamond helps it face-up with less color.

As a FYI, and assuming the setting is white metal - gold is a whole different ballgame - a good way to determine its most neutral/natural face-up color is to view it under fluorescent lighting (like an office or classroom) with white walls and ceiling and yourself wearing black, gray or white.

Of course in the real world any diamond takes on different appearances. One of my colleagues wears a phenomenally cut "L" colored princess as her daily diamond; precisely because it has so many different looks in different places. She says "If you have a D you always see a D... I get to see a D, or a G, or a J (etc)" Logically there will be far less of this kind of body-color variation the closer you get to D, and that may be your preference.

As others have said, color-perception is personal. Ultimately you're the one who will be wearing it, so do what makes you happy.
 

mzzdna

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
Messages
43
It is true about personal preference and color perception. I am color sensitive but I wanted to help stay within a budget by going with a lower color. I do like that it is a chameleon in many ways and looks different in many environments. I think I wasn't expecting that, so perhaps that is part of my problem. I hope that I'll get used to it and learn to love it because I doubt the fiance wants to spend any more!

Too bad the AVC's are only available in New York, buying something sight unseen was tough....
 

pregcurious

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
6,724
If the color of your stone still bothers you after putting it in white environments, as suggested above, I agree that you should go for an F.
 

Amys Bling

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
11,025
My only suggestions are to trade in the stone and: A. Pony up more cash to color upgrade B. Downsize in carat weight to get a higher color C. Learn to accept the warm and embrace it-
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
It doesn't sound like it's mindclean for you.
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
Gypsy|1314072905|2997138 said:
It doesn't sound like it's mindclean for you.
Unfortunately not. You can clean your mind though if that is what you want to do :)) I find if I focus on the thing that bothers me -- duh -- it bothers me more :twirl: If I accept my diamond for what it is and accept that its good qualities outweigh little things that bother me, I am totally happy! Diamonds are a lot like husbands that way.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
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40,198
Dreamer_D|1314073875|2997146 said:
Gypsy|1314072905|2997138 said:
It doesn't sound like it's mindclean for you.
Unfortunately not. You can clean your mind though if that is what you want to do :)) I find if I focus on the thing that bothers me -- duh -- it bothers me more :twirl: If I accept my diamond for what it is and accept that its good qualities outweigh little things that bother me, I am totally happy! Diamonds are a lot like husbands that way.
At one point (years ago) I thought that someone might have switched my diamond (before PS) and I had myself convinced that it was so because I saw yellow in my diamond and I have an F. No one had done anything... my mind was just finding evidence of a theory I was afraid was true.

If you were unsure of the H when you bought it... that uncertainty could literally be 'coloring' your perception.
 

LGK

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 27, 2007
Messages
2,975
OK, an H is quite white. For real. Yes, it's possible you're seeing some body color, if you're color sensitive- cushions in general do tend to show color a smidge more than, say, a round brilliant for example. It *might* be a low H, possibly, too- colors do have a bit of a range to them, and a lab does have to make judgement calls in those situations sometimes. However, other people, viewing it on your hand, are not seeing anything but an incredibly sparkly white stone, and I can say that with complete confidence having talked to quite a few members of the general public whilst they're looking at jewelry 8) (So, if that's part of your worry- that other people are seeing whatever it is that you are- you can stop worrying about that at least!)

Anyway- yes. Dreamer's post is pretty accurate. Either you can try to enjoy your lovely, sparkly diamond regardless of the fact that maybe you can detect some body color in some lighting situations, or you can trade it for a smaller, whiter stone. With diamond prices rising like they have been, I'd try to live with it if I were you :)) Unfortunately, most of us do have to make some sort of compromise between The Most Perfectly Awesome Diamond and our real, actual budget- it's just a matter of deciding what it is that we can live with in that compromise. (Too bad, huh. Otherwise I'd be sporting that pink-brown 7 ct OEC Uppy posted some years ago!) H is typically a color most of us can live with, especially if it means a larger stone, but that's not universally true, and it might indeed be that you'd be happier with a smaller but whiter diamond. Heck, I decided I could happily live with an M colored diamond to get a nice size- and I haven't regretted that one bit.

I will say that over time, for many of us, those small flaws we perceive and/or possibly obsess over do bother us much less over time. For example, the OEC I do own has a small chip on the girdle- it isn't eye visible, but it's loupe visible and I can feel it if I fiddle with it enough. For about a month I fretted over that dang chip- should I get it recut despite the risk? should I leave it even though I can feel it and see it through a loupe? Etc. Finally I decided to let it go for now, and decide later, when and if I found a setting. Later rolled around and frankly I'd forgotten about the chip! So I left it. And trust me, I spent wayyyyy too much mental energy fussing over it when I first got the stone :rolleyes:. But now, especially after I bezeled it, it's not even something I think about when I look at my ring. YMMV, obviously! Good luck.
 

iota15

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 19, 2010
Messages
1,278
Probably just not mind clean for you. I have an E and to be honest, once in a while, I see "yellow" in it too. lol. I cringe slightly but then I remember, I have an E. It's just the environment.

H is also very clear. H is above my cut off point and I've always been okay with it - but on the other hand, if you're not comfortable with it.... it's more likely than not, just the environment you're in.
 

Amys Bling

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
11,025
Dreamer_D|1314073875|2997146 said:
Gypsy|1314072905|2997138 said:
It doesn't sound like it's mindclean for you.
Unfortunately not. You can clean your mind though if that is what you want to do :)) I find if I focus on the thing that bothers me -- duh -- it bothers me more :twirl: If I accept my diamond for what it is and accept that its good qualities outweigh little things that bother me, I am totally happy! Diamonds are a lot like husbands that way.

Haha very true! If you focus on something that bothers you- it bothers you more! If you accept it for what it is and move on it won't stick out and bother you so much any more.
 

Hospatogi

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Nov 18, 2010
Messages
668
Dreamer_D|1314073875|2997146 said:
Gypsy|1314072905|2997138 said:
It doesn't sound like it's mindclean for you.
Unfortunately not. You can clean your mind though if that is what you want to do :)) I find if I focus on the thing that bothers me -- duh -- it bothers me more :twirl: If I accept my diamond for what it is and accept that its good qualities outweigh little things that bother me, I am totally happy! Diamonds are a lot like husbands that way.
I love this comment Dreamer ! :) So true hehe I have an H AVC so I am probably biased but I think the very slight body color of my stone gives it a lovely vintage feel. Maybe in time you will be able to look past the slight hint of color you see and just be able to enjoy its beautiful sparkle?
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
I certainly don't want the Op to think we are all trying to convince her to keep a stone she is not happy with.

I think there is a fine line between obsessing with mnind clean bugaboos and being bothered by something that is a real flaw in your diamond.

I previously owned a K color stone and an SI2 and neither was mind clean. But there was also an objective aspect to my annoyance -- K color is tinted, and my SI2 has a naked-eye visible black inclusion. Objectively, most people could perceive those flaws. So for me, I knew that no amount of mental acrobatics could solve those flaws.

But in the case of an H color stone showing tint... well that is on the border in my opinion between reality and OCD ;)) Yes, its true, an H is not an F. But it is a very colorless rock. You will need to decide if you can embrace its appearance to save money and gain carat, or whether you want to pony up to, perhaps, siply satisfy your inner compulsive hand-washer. As other have noted, even an E or F can look tinted given the right environment and frame of mind!
 

Rhino

Ideal_Rock
Trade
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Dreamer_D|1314073875|2997146 said:
Gypsy|1314072905|2997138 said:
It doesn't sound like it's mindclean for you.
Unfortunately not. You can clean your mind though if that is what you want to do :)) I find if I focus on the thing that bothers me -- duh -- it bothers me more :twirl: If I accept my diamond for what it is and accept that its good qualities outweigh little things that bother me, I am totally happy! Diamonds are a lot like husbands that way.
You're so funny. :naughty: Good analogy.
 

katushka

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2010
Messages
74
I relate to your predicament. When my husband and I went to GOG to buy my engagement ring back in January 2010, I was sure I wanted an AVC and was sure I would be comfortable with an H, not having seen or "tried on" many stones but basing my opinions on online photos. We put this 2.04 H SI1 stone on hold and went to see it. http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/6905/

I loved everything about it—proportion, fire, size—but in person, the color bugged me so much we let it go. I ended up with this 1.57 F SI1 (significantly less expensive) stone solely because of color and because we were in a big rush to get engaged and inventory was limited. http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/6285 Sometimes I wonder if I made the right decision, since I gave up a lot of size and my preferred proportions (and some optical performance) and my stone doesn't have that ideal maltese AVC look...but I LOVE the color and know the H would have bothered me.

We're saving up for an upgrade but worry it won't happen soon because of price increases. (I would need to add about $17K to what I spent to go from a 1.57ct F SI1 to a 2.17ct G SI1 and that's only *if* the G doesn't bother me in the larger size.) I'm kicking myself for not spending the $22k for a 2 carat F SI1 GOG had at the time!

BTW, you'll notice both stones are SI1. I never see the inclusions and it's not a concern for me, at least at these sizes. Goes to show that you CAN find areas you're willing to compromise on, even if you're picky about other things!

Good luck making your decision. Some people say you can't see body color in an H, but I definitely could with a chunky faceted AVC. This is exacerbated for me with halo settings when the pave is higher color than the center stone. I saw an H color AVC in a tacori setting and saw a clear difference between stone and setting - the stone's fire and design of the ring was amazing but I would prefer the overt "deliberate" warmth of a J-L stone to the mid-level H.

Sorry for going on and on but wanted you to know you're not the only one who's color-sensitive AND loves the AVC!

-Katie
 

karpouzi

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 31, 2009
Messages
307
Dreamer_D|1314132582|2997688 said:
I previously owned a K color stone and an SI2 and neither was mind clean. But there was also an objective aspect to my annoyance -- K color is tinted, and my SI2 has a naked-eye visible black inclusion. Objectively, most people could perceive those flaws. So for me, I knew that no amount of mental acrobatics could solve those flaws.
Mind clean for you personally is one thing but I hardly think a lower color is objectively a "flaw." Many people prefer lower colors and some even prefer lower clarities.
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
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karpouzi|1314193976|2998172 said:
Dreamer_D|1314132582|2997688 said:
I previously owned a K color stone and an SI2 and neither was mind clean. But there was also an objective aspect to my annoyance -- K color is tinted, and my SI2 has a naked-eye visible black inclusion. Objectively, most people could perceive those flaws. So for me, I knew that no amount of mental acrobatics could solve those flaws.
Mind clean for you personally is one thing but I hardly think a lower color is objectively a "flaw." Many people prefer lower colors and some even prefer lower clarities.
True. I should have said "most people can objectively perceive those characteristics" and should have clarified that they were flaws in my mind.
 

Amys Bling

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I know what what you mean Dreamer- other people could see the tint in your K and the inclusion in your SI2.
 

dreamer_dachsie

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Amys Bling|1314205244|2998311 said:
I know what what you mean Dreamer- other people could see the tint in your K and the inclusion in your SI2.
Yes, so they are objective features that it *sort of* makes sense that someone is bother by them. Maybe 8) . An H color diamond though is less clearly a "tinted" stone.

And I am hardly prejudiced against tinted stones, I do own a large J ::)
 

Amys Bling

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Dreamer_D|1314210483|2998361 said:
Amys Bling|1314205244|2998311 said:
I know what what you mean Dreamer- other people could see the tint in your K and the inclusion in your SI2.
Yes, so they are objective features that it *sort of* makes sense that someone is bother by them. Maybe 8) . An H color diamond though is less clearly a "tinted" stone.

And I am hardly prejudiced against tinted stones, I do own a large J ::)

A large J that you are keeping :)
 
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