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AGS to introduce new DQD report format

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JohnQuixote

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AGSL will be dropping the ‘Triple 0’ format in the future on DQD reports.

The cut grade will be reported on the left side of the document along with grades for color and clarity. A new fold under flap will have the specifics of all 11 factors of the cut grade. The change is so a retailer can concentrate of the face of the document when selling to a client who is not so much interested in the why and wherefore of the cut grade. When someone wants expanded information the dealer can unfold the flap and discuss, in depth, those 11 factors.


AGS-DQD-WithCutFlap.jpg
 

Paul-Antwerp

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Very interesting.

So, now we can see individual deduction factors, even within the 0-grade? Like for instance a 0.15 deduction on Fire, which is not sufficient to get to a 1-grade?

However, the distinction between the grade for ''light performance'' and the other factors ''proportion factors, polish and symmetry'' is not that clear anymore. And for someone not used to the AGS-history, the weight of a 1 on polish or symmetry risks to get even higher.

However, with 11 clear scores now, we can now aim for an AGS-00000000000 in stead of an AGS-000.

Live long,
 

JohnQuixote

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Associated press release (courtesy of AGS)

AGS Laboratories announced today that they are adding user-friendly explanatory information to their Diamond QualityTM Document (DQD) that is aimed at benefiting retailers and consumers alike. The enhanced DQD explains all eleven factors of the AGS Performance-Based Cut Grade System.

AGS Labs' primary goal with this enhanced version of the DQD is to help retail sales associates in their presentations to consumers. During their sales presentation, associates can easily explain all of the factors of the cut grade with the information now readily at hand. The information has been purposefully included in a fold-out data flap located on the side of the document. Sales associates have the option of either displaying the information on the new flap if the consumer wants or needs more detailed information on the cut grade, or they may opt not to show or discuss it, depending on the needs and comfort level of the consumer.

The new data flap shows the Cumulative and Net Lowering Factors of the cut grade. The values given for the Cumulative Factors are totaled together, and include Brightness, Contrast, Dispersion, Leakage, Weight Ratio, and Durability. The values given for the Net Lowering factors affect the cut grade only if they are greater than the Cumulative Sum. Those factors include the Girdle, Culet, Polish, and Symmetry.

Additionally, AGS Laboratories' has educational material that sales associates can use if they need additional tools to further explain the cut grade to the consumer.

"The AGS Performance-Based Cut Grade System has been a giant leap forward from the Proportion-Based System," says Peter Yantzer, Executive Director of AGS Laboratories. "Because we went from analyzing three factors to eleven, there are additional challenges for the sales associate at the counter in trying to simply and concisely inform the consumer. Our goal with this new DQD enhancement is to make it easier to explain the cut grade. At the same time, we saw the importance of giving them a choice in how they present their material. The new data flap accomplishes that goal."

In 2005, AGS released the Performance-Based Cut Grading System for both the round brilliant and princess - the first-ever cut grading system for a fancy shaped diamond. AGS recently added emerald cuts to its cut grade mix, and plans are under way to release other shapes in the near future.

The science supporting the AGS Performance-Based Cut Grade System reflects AGS's transition from a proportion-based to a performance-based cut grade system, where all facets of a diamond are measured in three dimensions rather than two dimensions. The Lab uses state-of-the-art ray tracing software to trace light traveling through a diamond. The software demonstrates the quantity and quality of the light being returned to the viewer.

For more information on the AGS Performance-Based system, or any of AGS Laboratories' products and services, please visit
www.agslab.com.
 

JohnQuixote

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Date: 3/22/2007 3:40:18 PM
Author: Paul-Antwerp
Very interesting.

So, now we can see individual deduction factors, even within the 0-grade? Like for instance a 0.15 deduction on Fire, which is not sufficient to get to a 1-grade?

However, the distinction between the grade for 'light performance' and the other factors 'proportion factors, polish and symmetry' is not that clear anymore. And for someone not used to the AGS-history, the weight of a 1 on polish or symmetry risks to get even higher.

However, with 11 clear scores now, we can now aim for an AGS-00000000000 in stead of an AGS-000.

Live long,
That was my first thought too, Paul.


To me it's like a clarity plot for cut: The pertinent minutiae will be listed, even if it's beyond our ability to perceive. For example, in a VVS stone it's interesting to know where the pinpoints are, even if you can't see them.
 

Regular Guy

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Date: 3/22/2007 3:29:07 PM
Author:JohnQuixote
AGSL will be dropping the ‘Triple 0’ format in the future on DQD reports.

The cut grade will be reported on the left side of the document along with grades for color and clarity. A new fold under flap will have the specifics of all 11 factors of the cut grade. The change is so a retailer can concentrate of the face of the document when selling to a client who is not so much interested in the why and wherefore of the cut grade. When someone wants expanded information the dealer can unfold the flap and discuss, in depth, those 11 factors.
Sorry, this seems like a bad coincidence. I read here that are 11 grades. But these are different...a different axis of info. Right?

Now...if someone could just come up with a simpler system...maybe based on say..(arbitrarily) 5 grades...based on people''s ability to sort these into 5 piles, from best to worst...maybe this could get some traction. Ya think?
 

Rhino

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Date: 3/22/2007 3:40:18 PM
Author: Paul-Antwerp
Very interesting.

So, now we can see individual deduction factors, even within the 0-grade? Like for instance a 0.15 deduction on Fire, which is not sufficient to get to a 1-grade?

However, the distinction between the grade for ''light performance'' and the other factors ''proportion factors, polish and symmetry'' is not that clear anymore. And for someone not used to the AGS-history, the weight of a 1 on polish or symmetry risks to get even higher.

However, with 11 clear scores now, we can now aim for an AGS-00000000000 in stead of an AGS-000.

Live long,
Too funny Paul. And that''s not even taking optical symmetry into account.
 

risingsun

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Will this change the grading of diamonds that have been graded under the most recent, performance- based system?
 

JohnQuixote

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Date: 3/22/2007 7:12:18 PM
Author: risingsun

Will this change the grading of diamonds that have been graded under the most recent, performance- based system?
No. The system has been in-place since 2005. They are just printing more information about how the cut grade was calculated on the report.
 

Kelkel

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Is it possible to get the extra info for a previously graded diamond under the triple 0 format?
 

stebbo

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Date: 3/22/2007 4:55:13 PM
Author: Regular Guy


Now...if someone could just come up with a simpler system...maybe based on say..(arbitrarily) 5 grades...based on people''s ability to sort these into 5 piles, from best to worst...maybe this could get some traction. Ya think?
The problem is different people will sort differently. What is really best? A rigid H&A pattern or a less symmetrical look? Broad or pinflash? Brilliance or dispersion? Size or beauty? And that''s not even mentioning the crowd who rate workmanship, flawlessness and other non-visible or paper specs as ''best''.

This new report format will be great for the savvy consumer, allowing them to target their preferences easier.

AGS has only two cut grades anyway, 0 and 1. All other stones get a DQR or end up at another lab.
 

stebbo

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John, thanks so much for the followup - like always, you really know how to over-deliver.
 

stebbo

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Date: 3/22/2007 9:26:26 PM
Author: DiamondExpert
The new AGS isodecal 0 ideal deal...accept no substitutes
!!


Nah, 11 zero''s would be a ''hendecuple 0''

And why not add in clarity and color for a ''triskaidecuple 0''
 

hikerchick

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Date: 3/22/2007 7:27:31 PM
Author: Kelkel
Is it possible to get the extra info for a previously graded diamond under the triple 0 format?
I am curious to know if this is possible also? Anyone know?
 

Lynn B

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OHMYWORD.
I dunno... I''m not sure I like it. (Likely because I DON''T UNDERSTAND it!!!) It seems to me that the current 000 system wasn''t "broke" -- so why "FIX" it???!!!
Oh well, AGSL didn''t ask me!
 

:)

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Date: 3/22/2007 3:42:19 PM
Author: JohnQuixote

Associated press release (courtesy of AGS)

AGS Laboratories announced today that they are adding user-friendly explanatory information to their Diamond QualityTM Document (DQD) that is aimed at benefiting retailers and consumers alike. The enhanced DQD explains all eleven factors of the AGS Performance-Based Cut Grade System.

AGS Labs'' primary goal with this enhanced version of the DQD is to help retail sales associates in their presentations to consumers. During their sales presentation, associates can easily explain all of the factors of the cut grade with the information now readily at hand. ...
The new data flap shows the Cumulative and Net Lowering Factors of the cut grade. The values given for the Cumulative Factors are totaled together, and include Brightness, Contrast, Dispersion, Leakage, Weight Ratio, and Durability. The values given for the Net Lowering factors affect the cut grade only if they are greater than the Cumulative Sum. Those factors include the Girdle, Culet, Polish, and Symmetry.
Hmm, this is interesting. I cannot help but think that it may actually make it harder to sell some diamonds. I would think with that many variables being presented, consumers would be more likely to feel that something was ''wrong'' with a diamond, whether they understand the graded factors or not. I would think there would be a strong chance a consumer would feel afraid of any values that they did not understand that were outside of the range of perceived ''normal'' or ''perfection'', just as a current grade of less than 000 can cause a diamond to take longer to sell.
 

JohnQuixote

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Update:

The AGS has introduced the new DQD with the cut grade flap.There have been revisions, based on feedback received at the AGS Conclave from members of the industry.

1. It a diamond achieves AGS 0 no deductions are listed.I anticipate this is to indicate ‘equal status’ for diamonds reaching the top of their ladder.

2. Any other cut grade (1-10) comes with a deductions breakdown.I anticipate this is to show what area, or areas, did not meet the required measure for 0 in the AGS metric.
 

gg21

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Sorry to re-hash a old subject, but I was on AGS''s website and they do not have the fold out flap for the non-triple 0 diamonds the same way that they were supposed to and I was wondering if anyone knew why?
 

JohnQuixote

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Date: 5/28/2007 6:15:37 PM
Author: gg21
Sorry to re-hash a old subject, but I was on AGS's website and they do not have the fold out flap for the non-triple 0 diamonds the same way that they were supposed to and I was wondering if anyone knew why?
I checked the AGS Lab website and found examples of the old (proportions) and new (performance) DQDs. Both examples feature a diamond with a 0 cut grade however. Examples: http://www.agslab.com/report_dqd_info.html

AGSL reps will be at JCK this week and one of us will get an answer for you GG.

I believe Neil Beaty posted about AGSL now providing online verification of AGSL grading reports. GIA does this with their GIA Report Check service. Though a side-dish to this topic I thought I'd give it a mention here.
 

risingsun

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Thanks, John. BTW, I just tried the Report Verification and it did, indeed, find my diamond and it's specs. Nice to know that this feature is available
 
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Date: 5/4/2007 1:25:22 PM
Author: JohnQuixote
Examples:
Hey guys, especially John, I was just wondering why my new AGS report is different than my old one and I came on to check it out. I wasn't worried because my new one is all zeros anyway. My old one was after this latest post in may and thus on the right hand flap it had the "Triple 0" indicator with ideal ideal listed.

However, this new diamond was grade on April 20th and thus has all 11 factors listed out and all of the numbers are zero.

My question is, were there in fact some DQD's released during that 2 month period that had 0.15 or 0.003 on them that were still AGS 0 cut grades. That would mean that mine being all 0.00000's makes it the true absolute best light performance possible, even amongst ideals? or during that 2 month period did they simply print 0.00000 for all AGS ideals and then two months later go back to the triple zero method for Ideals?

basically I am asking, did they in fact show deductions on "0" cut grade diamonds during that 2 month period, and my diamond is simply perfect

it is always good to know when you have a perfect diamond (aside from the E color, VS2 clarity and terribly small size of course)
 

Wink

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Date: 3/22/2007 5:24:10 PM
Author: Rhino
Date: 3/22/2007 3:40:18 PM

Author: Paul-Antwerp

Very interesting.


So, now we can see individual deduction factors, even within the 0-grade? Like for instance a 0.15 deduction on Fire, which is not sufficient to get to a 1-grade?


However, the distinction between the grade for ''light performance'' and the other factors ''proportion factors, polish and symmetry'' is not that clear anymore. And for someone not used to the AGS-history, the weight of a 1 on polish or symmetry risks to get even higher.


However, with 11 clear scores now, we can now aim for an AGS-00000000000 in stead of an AGS-000.


Live long,
Too funny Paul. And that''s not even taking optical symmetry into account.
Ahh, Now Rhino and I can have something new to "discuss" vehemently. LOL! Looking forward to it.

Wink
 

JohnQuixote

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Date: 6/29/2007 12:03:48 AM
Author: WorkingHardforSmallRewards

Hey guys, especially John, I was just wondering why my new AGS report is different than my old one and I came on to check it out. I wasn't worried because my new one is all zeros anyway. My old one was after this latest post in may and thus on the right hand flap it had the 'Triple 0' indicator with ideal ideal listed.

However, this new diamond was grade on April 20th and thus has all 11 factors listed out and all of the numbers are zero.

My question is, were there in fact some DQD's released during that 2 month period that had 0.15 or 0.003 on them that were still AGS 0 cut grades. That would mean that mine being all 0.00000's makes it the true absolute best light performance possible, even amongst ideals? or during that 2 month period did they simply print 0.00000 for all AGS ideals and then two months later go back to the triple zero method for Ideals?

basically I am asking, did they in fact show deductions on '0' cut grade diamonds during that 2 month period, and my diamond is simply perfect

it is always good to know when you have a perfect diamond (aside from the E color, VS2 clarity and terribly small size of course)
Too cool WHFSR. At the very least you have an extremely rare format on your report!

My understanding is that those reports did show deductions. Just remember that each AGS grade represents a range of equal performance: Like the HCA, taste factors exist even within the top grade, which is why you'll read PS posts where people compare the merits of one AGS 0 vs another AGS 0. This means 0.00 in all factors may suit Susie's taste whereas greater relative dispersion to brightness (for example) may suit Billy's taste - if they can perceive the differences. This is one reason the decision was made to omit the deductions; diamonds that achieve AGS Ideal are considered commensurate.

As a side note, the FTC prohibits use of the word 'perfect,' but there's nothing wrong with whispering it to your lady... About the diamond too!
 
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Well this has really cleared one issue up for me. One of my first interactions with AGS went like this:

I called up and asked about a diamond that had not yet been put into the online database. They looked it up for me and we confirmed everything orally. Then I asked him about the lightperformance test and how I personally have a greater love for dispersion than the other qualities--you just can't beat the beautiful flashes of color. He took a moment and said that there were some deductions. I got panicked and said "The little flap on the right, it is all zeros right!"

Suddenly his attitude seemed to change and he was less friendly and said "This diamond is an ideal cut diamond." Then I said, "They are all zero's right?" (this was early on in my studies of AGS zero cut grade and how it was determined) He said "This is an ideal cut, all of the factors are ideal."

But I wanted to know about the light performance so I asked him "within the Ideal cut range there must be some diamonds with greater fire "scores" and some with greater brightness "scores" so I was hoping you might be able to give me the data on the tests that were run too determine those characteristics." He just responded "This is an ideal cut with ideal light performance." and was never willing too talk about deductions again. Now I understand though! However, I have yet to find a DQD with the same format as mine that is an ideal cut. I want to find one with that same 11 qualities listed for an ideal cut and see the deductions so that I know that they actually did list those small decimal point values just so I can tell her that it is "perfect" when I show her the report


But you are right, and it isn't something I would say to anyone when having a serious discussion of light performance, that perfect is not quite the right term. If the diamond were just for me I would have to do alot more research on FIC and perhaps the opposite route looking for a few bit broad flashes of fire--something that would really emphasis the color. But I think for an E ring getting the H&A TIC with AGS ideal (totally ideal, again, hooray!
) is probably the smartest choice.

So if you see any DQD's in this same format with ideal cut and a few small deductions listed let me know. And on the same note, they were def. smart to switch back for ideal cuts. Just imagining seeing those "deductions" for cut quality listed on my AGS report makes me angry, so I can imagine it would have made things very difficult for retailers trying to sell beautiful ideal cuts with SMALL deductions. Either way, I am really happy with my report now, at the very least
 
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