AGS 0 that doesn''t score well on HCA

[Skip]

I have found a AGS 0 stone that doesn''t score well on the HCA cut adviser. I am lookimg for some input, here are the specs

1.1280 cts
G color
VS 2
6.95x6.99x4.34 mm
Total depth 62.3
Table 55%
Crown Angle 35.6
Crown Height 15.9
Pavillion Angle 41.1
Pavillion Height 43.3
pointed cutlet

How bad of a performer do you think this stone is? Should I pass on it? Any advice, please!

 

[Diermint]

Interesting - the HCA shows that this doesn''t perform all that well because it falls into the upper right corner of the AGS0 specifications. I think this is a good example of AGS needing to upgrade and stop using boxes...

If you can get another AGS0 at the same price that does better on the HCA then it is worth a look - but personally I wouldn''t go for that particular stone just because it is an AGS0.

 

[Skip]

The only reason I am looking at AGS 0''s is because they have the vitals on the cert. Finding a local jeweler that wants to give up a stone''s vitals isn''t even close to easy. They slap down a GIA cert and say, here it is. You ask for a crown or pavillion angle and it is like you are asking for keys to the store.

 

[Diermint]

Good point.

It''s good you managed to get that info.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Imagine doing an mail or Internet order bride?
They would all add a bit at the top and take some off the middle and the bottom dimensions

Use HCA to select the better AGS 0 stones.
Next year they will change the system

 

[diamondlil]

Just curious, Gary, with the parameters for AGS0 being broadened with the new cut grade system, would this stone fall outside the AGS0 designation come 2005?

DiamondLil

 

[niceice]

You found a diamond which might technically be an AGS-0 but the proportions are on the outer realms of the range for the current AGS-0 ideal cut proportions rating which is why it is not performing well on the HCA and not likely to perform well in real life either. Consider for a moment that a range such as the AGS-0 ideal cut rating must contain a high and low end to appease the cutters who want to retain weight and thus would not use the AGS Laboratory if the range of proportions were too tight and that with that in mind, it is plausable that a tighter range of proportions was actually the initial desired set of parameters for the AGS-0 Ideal Cut Rating... You might consider finding a diamond with tighter proportions, such as something with a combination of measurements which would be more in the center of the range...

There are lots of combinations of proportions which will yield beautiful diamonds, but in our experience the combination of a steep crown angle and a deep pavilion angle has never been good.

 

[bar01]

I looked at some AGS0 Stones as well that did not perform well on HCA (not below 2.0) also that did not get a good AGA DYI cut grade see link below

http://gemappraisers.com/


AGS 0 is a good starting point - but use HCA and AGA to weed out the less then stellar performers


I know what you mean about working with local jewelers and getting data on their diamonds. When I tried - I was lucky to even find a diamond with any type of cert - let alone an AGS 0 cert. It was like pulling teeth.Thats why I gave up and went to one of the great PS vendors for my diamonds - could look and compare many AGS0 diamonds in the comfort of my own home. But good local B&M jewelers are out there - just may take you a while to find one who will give you some choices (show you several different AGS0 Certs - then bring in the one you selected based on the data).

 

[oldminer]

I wonder if the HCA will work over the entire range of the future AGS 0 grade. I wonder if the highest HCA scores will all fit into the new AGS 0 parameters? I would think the HCA will still proved high performance predictions for stones somewhat outside of the new AGS 0 cut because shape and light return don't quite go hand-in-hand.

Maybe Garry will tell us a litte more.

 

[roadpupp]

My experience?

I looked at several AGS triple 0 diamonds in my price range. I ran them through the HCA. Some were considerably higher on the scale then others.

My jeweler who is GIA certified, said "everyone has their idea of what perfect numbers are, I gave up a long time ago and simply sell AGS OOO as what it is." He charged me the same price for a stone that made a 2.3 on the HCA as the one I bought with a 0.7. (That falls within Talkowski ideal!!) He really didn''t seem to care. I guess the Brick and mortor shops don''t have time to analyze each stone and rate it past what the AGS has done.

Fortunately, I am in NYC and they had Sarins on all the stones I was looking at.

If I had it to do over, and knew for sure what stone my Fiancee wanted, I would buy it online.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Hope this chart uploads.
No that stone would be maybe an 2 or an AGS 3.
They have made their standard look much more like HCA.

 

[niceice]

Date: 10/29/2004 2:11:27 PM
Author: roadpupp
My experience?

I looked at several AGS triple 0 diamonds in my price range. I ran them through the HCA. Some were considerably higher on the scale then others.

My jeweler who is GIA certified, said ''everyone has their idea of what perfect numbers are, I gave up a long time ago and simply sell AGS OOO as what it is.'' He charged me the same price for a stone that made a 2.3 on the HCA as the one I bought with a 0.7. (That falls within Talkowski ideal!!) He really didn''t seem to care. I guess the Brick and mortor shops don''t have time to analyze each stone and rate it past what the AGS has done.

Fortunately, I am in NYC and they had Sarins on all the stones I was looking at.

If I had it to do over, and knew for sure what stone my Fiancee wanted, I would buy it online.

Hmmm... All we wanted to quote was "I guess the Brick & Mortar shops don''t have the time to analyze each stone and rate it past what the AGS has done" but we got all of this... Must be part of the new improvements...

Anyway, we suppose that it depends on the caliber of which Brick and Mortar jewelry store that you happen to walk into... We operate a 2700 square foot brick and mortar shop and we have all the bells and whistles and an in-store client gets to see all of the same reports as an on-line client does... And Jonathan at Good Old Gold runs both a Brick & Mortar and a Click & Order like us and he offers the same services to his clients... We''re not alone, there are others just like us... It''s a personal decision as to how much time and money you want to invest into each customer and into the growth of your store, we invest a lot in our store and as a result we sell a lot more diamonds than the average single unit Brick & Mortar jewelry store as do most jewelry stores who operate with this type of equipment. We routinely give customers a tour of the inner workings of our store, they''re always curious about what all the computers are for, in fact, not more than five minutes ago an in-store customer asked us that very same question... We were sitting at a carved lion table in the front of the store looking at a lovely pendant and earring set of inlaid opals from Lightning Ridge Australia and Dale said "I have to ask... What are all the computers for?" and we said "C''mon we''ll show you..." We showed him a diamond being inscribed on the inscription machine... We showed him a diamond being measured on the OGI Nova Scope... We showed him a comparison of two diamonds being measured on the Gem Ex Brilliance Scope, we showed him how we design rings and how they are custom made to order, we cleaned his rings in the back of the store while he stood a few feet away so that he wouldn''t get hit by a loose wheel or something (you haven''t lived until one of those flies off and whacks you one!) and our little tour had the desired effect "I''ve never seen a jewelry store like this!" Dale said and we are pretty sure that he hasn''t... But there are a few of us who operate traditional brick and mortar stores and who do look past the information on the AGS lab report, we''re the ones who can look our customers in the eyes when we run into them in the grocery store because we''re not worried that they might discover something which wasn''t disclosed during the sale, after the sale... Our customers know as much about their diamond as we do - if they care to know, there are a lot of customers who say "that''s great, I''m glad you did all that, but I just want a diamond pendant" and we''re good with that because they won''t have it any other way

 

[roadpupp]

Robin and Todd.

No offense meant. I should have said "most BandM stores!!