Yellow in an Aset?

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Also isn't it highly unlikely that one could observe such a high amount of red from dispersion viewed through an ASET scope?
Red(dispersion) + Green = Yellow

Interesting CCL
See this next video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OECvvSx8dtI

 

[yssie]

Here is what I modelled and put on Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0xAfLHsWIs

ASET colour changes with only a small pavilion variation modelled in DiamCalc with a mid point of 40.74 pavilion. At this exact point the center of the stone recieves light from the ASET Red Green edge and the shallower angle draws from green and the deeper from the red zone. Mixing in the middle creates yellow.

After looking at a few stones and gently tilting, I can see how photo shop will 'adjuts' these colors to Yellowish.
PS - I doubt there would be much dispersion happening in that video

that is a very interesting video Garry

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Here is what I modelled and put on Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0xAfLHsWIs

ASET colour changes with only a small pavilion variation modelled in DiamCalc with a mid point of 40.74 pavilion. At this exact point the center of the stone recieves light from the ASET Red Green edge and the shallower angle draws from green and the deeper from the red zone. Mixing in the middle creates yellow.

After looking at a few stones and gently tilting, I can see how photo shop will 'adjuts' these colors to Yellowish.
PS - I doubt there would be much dispersion happening in that video

Sorry Garry I am not following you at all.
Its either red or green not a mix. This is a static image not in movement or in tilt.
Its only yellow due to dispersion I beleive that to be an artifact of Diamcalc and this would not be readily observable IRL.

When you change pavilion angle you change both dispersion and where those areas gather light from.
If not please post the .dmc file and tell me what you changed to get yellow with dispersion off.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

This series of 4 photo's have been enhanced without any color altering software - just mid tones, contrast and brightness.
Edit - the photo's were taken without the ASET lens in macro mode. Note the orange on the right side

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Garry I don't change or enhance anything I am using Snagit direct screen capture I do not use photoshop for this.
When I capture an image the colors match the original when I upload it to pricescope.

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

I still don't see amy mixing of colors at the Green/Red Border for a Tolk Round.
The Yellow comes from mixing Green with Red Dispersion and I have yet to see this replicated in actual viewing of diamonds with 40.8 pavilions.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Garry I don't change or enhance anything I am using Snagit direct screen capture I do not use photoshop for this.
When I capture an image the colors match the original when I upload it to pricescope.

Not suggesting you did CCL - but i will bet Rhino is

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

I still don't see amy mixing of colors at the Green/Red Border for a Tolk Round.
The Yellow comes from mixing Green with Red Dispersion and I have yet to see this replicated in actual viewing of diamonds with 40.8 pavilions.

I am seeing the real world WITH dispersion.
So is my camera!

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Its only yellow due to dispersion I beleive that to be an artifact of Diamcalc and this would not be readily observable IRL.

I think DC is modelling the real world surprisingly well - how else did I get orange in my photo?

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Garry,

Interesting example of the 4 images but not a great image.

What exactly is going on at 3 O'Clock ?
Why would their be dispersion only in that area? (Inclusions? Badly Assymetric cutting? Non Uniform lighting? )

To prove your theory that if the facets are on the border of the Red/Green or receiving light at right around 45 +/-0.1 degrees the light can mix we would need to see yellow in the table reflection area right above the culet. Do you have an example of a real photograph of that somewhere?

To the second possible explanation, can you explain why you would expect to only see strong red flashes from dispersion in some areas and not see the other colors when viewing through an ASET scope? ( I would not expect a diffuse backlit ASET to be a strong 'fire friendly' environment)

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Garry,

If you claim you are seeing it with your eyes and camera please explain further.

What exactly is going on at 3 O'Clock in those 4 images?
Why would their be dispersion only in that area? (Inclusions? Badly Assymetric cutting? Non Uniform lighting? Color Bleeding?)

To prove your theory that if the facets are on the border of the Red/Green border or receiving light at right around 45 degrees the light can mix we would need to see yellow in the table reflection area right above the culet. Do you have a picture of that somewhere?

To the second possible explanation, can you explain why you would expect to only see strong red flashes from dispersion in some areas and not see the other colors when viewing through an ASET scope? ( I would not expect a diffuse backlit ASET to be a strong 'fire friendly' environment)

A lot on CCL, but the photo was taken hand held ASET, lens removed, canon Ixus macro with strong back light.
The first in the top left is straight from camera.
This photo is ASET old CZ in Ideal-Lite with ASET lens in place.
Look in the very upper area as i have rotateted the scope a tiny bit

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

I still don't see amy mixing of colors at the Green/Red Border for a Tolk Round.
The Yellow comes from mixing Green with Red Dispersion and I have yet to see this replicated in actual viewing of diamonds with 40.8 pavilions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSeJWLKdLVk&feature=related Try this video CCL.
You can see that many areas have mixed colours. Some will be a combination of red from refraction (e.g. 2/3rds), white from partial leakage which could also have fire / dispersion changing the colour (e.g. 10-15%) emerging from the diamond, with green from reflection (17-18%).

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Garry,

The random color mixing of Dispersion with ASET colors I can accept but the impact of dispersion is minor and not observable in a regular pattern and much like fire not observable in a repeatable nor is it easy to develop a predictable pattern.

I refer Iota15 back to our earlier comments (saturation of colors and mixing yellow(from absorptio) with other colors.
This mixing of Green/Red in ASET is a red herring and not the source of the yellow in Rhino's ASET.

See the diagram below I have chosen the border of ASET Red/ ASET Green and these are the areas you might see yellow in if your theory held any weight.

These areas do not correspond with the yellow areas in the ASET.

 

[Serg]

Light response for light ring illumination from 42 degree to 48 degree( ASET RED/GREEN boundary has direction 45 degree . I added +_3 degree)

so zone near culet could have yellow color for RBC 40.75/34.5, if ASET light has ideally alignment with diamond position

 

[Serg]

.

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Serg,

My images above are the exact same thing as yours except I used white for the background and only went +/- 1 degree.
What I cannot understand is under what lighting conditions would I see a diamond with a 40.75 pavilion have that much red dispersion that the centre over the culet would look that yellow.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

With fire enabled there is a yellow center

 

[Serg]

re:What I cannot understand is under what lighting conditions would I see a diamond with a 40.75 pavilion have that much red dispersion that the centre over the culet would look that yellow.


CCl,

for perpendicularly( to table) entering beam new culet zone and P40.75 , exiting ray640nm has angle 44.8 degree from vertical , exiting ray 520nm has angle 45.2 degree.

if structure light as ASET has boundary between red and green light in direction 45 degree( red should have less angles from vertical ), your eye will collect lights from both color zones ( green and red lights) for same VF new culet .

 

[Cehrabehra]

Perhaps Rhino will send me the 3D Gem file and I can settle this (since he knows i can model his exact proportions anyway )
But here is a quick and dirty with a color that would not quite be 'O' modeled in DiamCalc.

I don't know what this is Garry, but I want one. I love the faceting. It looks like an omc and oec hopped into bed and produced a beautiful lovechild.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Perhaps Rhino will send me the 3D Gem file and I can settle this (since he knows i can model his exact proportions anyway )
But here is a quick and dirty with a color that would not quite be 'O' modeled in DiamCalc.

I don't know what this is Garry, but I want one. I love the faceting. It looks like an omc and oec hopped into bed and produced a beautiful lovechild.

Its a chopped up RBC Sara. Did not save the proportions, but there are thousands of possabilities like it

 

[Serg]

re:But this is what I normally see for photographed Green/Red Boundary.

CCL,

results depends from ASET size. In DC we use ASET size what is 3 times bigger than smallest ASET is.
if ASET has small size, spatial dispersion is not big enough to receive yellow( you can see yellow in Big ETAS and you can not see Yellow in small ETAS, for such RBC)

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

re:But this is what I normally see for photographed Green/Red Boundary.

CCL,

results depends from ASET size. In DC we use ASET size what is 3 times bigger than smallest ASET is.
if ASET has small size, spatial dispersion is not big enough to receive yellow( you can see yellow in Big ETAS and you can not see Yellow in small ETAS, for such RBC)

Interesting Sergey, does this explain why the crown facets here have more orangy colour in this ASET which is huge?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSeJWLKdLVk&list=ULjRm-A6KRbPo&playnext=1&feature=bfnav

 

[Serg]

Photo from AGS article http://agslab.com/spie/spie_lo_res.pdf

 

[kenny]

That is hilarious.
Mods just removed the most amazing post ever.

This is a thread about yellow appearing in an ASET image, where only Red Blue and Green are expected.
The post just removed was spam from a vendor (with 13 posts) who sells yellow diamonds.

They must have done a search for the word yellow and found this 2-year old thread about yellow showing up in ASET pics.
Then they posted all this pro-yellow diamond promotion, and a link to their website, without even realizing that the colors in an ASET pic has nothing to do with the color of a diamond itself.
What an Einstein!

I expect we'll soon hear from a vendor who sells Red diamonds, then one selling Green diamonds, and one selling Blue diamonds.

 

[Karl_K]

lol Kenny...
The post was down right weird.

 

[diamonds-are-friends]

that's really funny. the surprising thing is that the diamond listed in the first post is still available 2 years later. For a moment, it seems to appear that this thread is current.

 

[yssie]

Now I'm disappointed to have missed it

 

[Serg]

Are the areas I circled on the Aset leakage or not?

Iota it is exactly the same as anASEt image center of a diamond with a 40.75 degree pavilion - there is mixing of red and green = yellow.

Gary by definition in ASET one should not get mixing of Red and Green in the same area. That certainly is not the case for any AVC I have ever seen. Green/White or Green/Yellow in this case okay but Red/Green ????.

Iota's point is supported by the following, for this AVC (I've added a light yellow natural diamond absorption to it) the correlation between the IS and ASET is much better.

CCL,

What ASET definition do you mean?
One single point in diamond cut can easy reflect light from different directions simultaneously .

Most simple example is external ( table , crown ) reflections ( VF's) and internal reflections( VF's).

Diamond cut splits 'Viewer beam' by area and intensity ( during particular internal reflections) . VF's have many layers and in one single point you can see many VF's in same time which reflect light sources from different directions( for example green and red in ASET)
Yellow zones in ASET image are more effective diamond cut zones( increase Light Performance ) than just Green or Red zones

 

[kenny]

Serg, FYI this thread is 2 years old.
I believe CCL is long gone and, in fact, banned.

 

[Serg]

Serg, FYI this thread is 2 years old.
I believe CCL is long gone and, in fact, banned.

Kenny,
2years ago we did not discuss this issue well. We discussed only about reason ( dispersion) yellow facets in ASET light.
There is other much more important reason of this phenomena .
It is pity if CCL had been banned.