would you walk away from a friendship over this issue?

[asscherisme]

I woke up this morning really bothered by someone. I have posted many times about how 3 of my kids are on the autistic spectrum. 2 have aspergers and one more severe autism and she is severely developementally delayed.

I have a friend who has a son who is autstic. I can see it and its so obvious. He is 8 and even my older 2 kids can see it (one who has aspgers and one who is not affected by autism) This boy is so classicly autistic and he is actually scary to be around. My younger 2 kids are scared of him. He has destroyed and broken things in my home. The mom has no control over him. And when I suggested that she have him evaluated she is in denial and even told me that "the school psychologist has told her awful things about Daniel but I don't believe them".

I avoid having her over but she does sometimes invite us to her house. She and her husband have no control over this boy. I am afraid to let my younger 2 kids wonder out of my sight with him. And thats hard when they are not babies. he is viloent and has no understanding of his actions. Last time I was over, he was swinging around a bat inside the house an the mother did nothing and I got up and grabbed it away.

I did share with her in the past about my kids having autism trying to help her find answers for her son. She tells me she does not know what to do about his behavior but yet she is in deinal also. She has also told me that she does not believe my kids have autism because they seem fine to her (yet everyone else that comes in contact with my kids for long periods of time sees it as well as I got three opinions at diagnoses, school psychologists, private psychologists etc and just daily living with my kids. ) Its one thing to be in denial about her own child but when she starts telling me that she thinks my kids were misdiagnosed and don't really have it its like a slap in the face to me regarding the stuff I hve to deal with on a daily basis. And the only time I have used those words with her was when I was sharing in regard to her complaing she did not know how to control her son and that the diagnosis was actually a postive because it helped me find answers and more importantly help for my kids. Its not like its something I discuss or bring up all the time because I don't).

So, I had her over to dinner last night. And she brought her son and daughter. I did not invite her son and had hoped her son would stay home with her husband. Her son was so out on control and scared my and my kids. He broke my fish tank. When I went the bathroom I found him banging on my 40 gallon fish tank with a toy so hard that he broke the filter (its an acrylic tank) and left huge scratches on the tank. That thing cost me a lot of money to set up and I'm really upset about it. And his mom was sitting right next to him when he was doing it. I came into the room, saw him doing it and told him to stop and he would not stop so I went over and guided hi m away form the tank. I did not relaize it was broken until this morning.

Later in the evening, the mother started lecturing me over dessert (when the kids were watching TV so they were not next to us) about how she thinks that I should stop using the word aspergers and autism and that I am doing the kids a disservice and she thinks those words are used too much and how my kids are fine. That they were misdagnosed and they are fine. She has said this before, but last night it was like this huge lecture to me.

I was stunned and did not say anything and feel its a huge slap in the face. I'm tired of being lectured about this by her and that she does not "believe me" over an issue that if huge in my life and causes me so much stress and therapy money (for my kids, ) and meltdowns and learning issues and school issues etc. And that she does not believe me and thinks its all imaginary really bothers me.

I think she is in such deinal about her own son she is projecting it onto me.


I woke up this morning thinking if my child had bipolar disorder and was well controlled with medication, she would probably tell me that he is not really bipolar becuase he does not seem manic or depressed to her. Or if he depression, same thing, she would not believe me because he seems fine to her.


The tough thing is that our daughters are best friends.

I think I am going to just make my contact with her about arranging the girls to get together and make friendly small talk but no more dinner invitations or accepting invitations that involve being around her son. I don't want my daughter to lose her best friend but I am sad to say I think this friendship for me has run its course and I'm not sure I can be friends with someone who lecutres me like that and when I'm afraid to have her child at my house or have my younger kids be around him. I'm literally afraid for their safety.

As a side note, I just ordered a 100 gallon aquarium and excited about setting it up (and my kids are super excited). I thought it would be a nice calming thing for them when they get worked up or have meltdowns and I know that if this boy comes to my house he would probably destroy it. Of all my kids other friiends, they all love our 40 gallon tank and not one child has ever touched the tank. Not one. Never been an issue. And I take a lot of pride in maintaning it and keeping the water crystal clear and algae free and clean. And this boy was banging on it so hard he broke the filer and damaged the tank. The 100 gallon set up is costing me a furtune and I don't want him near it. Not just the cost but he effort. I plan on getting some rare fish and don't want anything to happen to them! And my older 3 kids are really concerned about this as well.

Another time this boy left a small hole in my wall from banging a gate agaist the wall. Slamming it actually. He throws things off my 2nd story balcony. He is a total terror.

I feel its time to downgrade my relationship with the mother from friend to mom of my daughter's best friend and hope she won't notice I'm not inviting her over. But she will eventually and will be awkard.

I would like to know others thoughts. What would you do in this situation? Am I being overly sensitive? For her to tell me that my kids don't have autism and that I believe they do is doing them a disservice is a huge slap in the face and I'm insulted by it.

Worth dropping a friendship over? Any advice on how to not let it affect my daughter's freindship? I am not going to contront her, thats not my style and would freak her out as well. I think the best thing is to just not invite her over for dinner and not accept her dinner invitations and be perpetually busy in the evening but yet free enough to have her daughter over sometimes inthe after noon. she is usually at work during this time so that hopefully it won't be an issue.

We only do the dinner thing every few months and if I'm friendly about the girls getting together hopefully it will take her awhile to notice.

What do you all think? Am I over reacting? She has said these things before but last night it was in my face and kind of my last straw.

 

[decodelighted]

I think its fine to dial back the friendship ... not everyone is meant to be friends. She''s not letting you agree to disagree. Which isn''t cool at all.

About the fish tank ... this mother is in serious denial. I think you should tell her that he broke the tank and ask her to pay for the damage DESPITE the fact you''re getting a new one. (Put the money toward the new one -- or fix the old one & donate it to a school.) In little ways maybe these undeniable FACTS about his behavior and their affect on HER ($$$) might start adding up. For HIS sake I hope they do.

 

[asscherisme]

The new one is not to replace the old one, but in addition to it. I need to go out today and purchae a new filter so my fish don't die. But to replace a 40 gallon tank its going to be a pain. You can't just dump fish into a new tank. It takes weeks and weeks to "cycle" a tank and make it healthy for fish. The damage is really bad and I think that once I get the 100 gallon cycled I will put the fish from the 40 in there and replace the 40 gallon to put the fish back before I buy stock for the 100 gallon.

The money from the tank isn't even the biggest thing that bothers me. Its his out of control behavior, her denial, and her telling me MY kids have nothing wrong and that I'm wrong to believe they do or believe the 3 seperate diagnosis they got.

I'm also worried about my children's safety around him. This mother has a hockey stick and baseball bat INSIDE her house she lets him play with. And he swings them around and spins in circles with them hitting anything in his radious. Combine that with my 5 year autistic daughters lack of sense of danger and she wakls near him in his orbit with these things and she could get seriously injured.

 

[somethingshiny]

This is something that you know much more about than the average person. How would you feel if the tables were turned? I mean, obviously you would not let one of your children destroy property or scare people, but if you really try to put yourself in her shoes, how would you feel?

I can''t answer one way or the other. I don''t think there''s anything wrong with keeping certain friendships at a distance, but on the other hand, this woman seems to need some help and guidance that you would be able to give. It''s very hard to tell a mom that her child is not welcome in your home. But, if you just keep a friendship with the mom only (and don''t have anything to do with each other''s children) maybe you could offer her the support she needs while she works through her situation. Perhaps being away from her child for a bit and really digging deep to talk about it will give her some perspective. Then, hopefully, you could all be friends again.

 

[asscherisme]

I have been trying to offer her guidance for a few years. And each time she denies it. I have offered all I can offer because I''m worn out myself taking care of my kids.

And I have never nor would never say to her directly that her son is not welcome in my house. But I''m done issuing diner invitations because it means he will come along and it scares me and my kids.

Its a complicated situtation. She is a nice person for the most part but the denial and telling me how wrong I am for believeing in autism really bothers me.

 

[decodelighted]

Date: 8/16/2009 1:23:27 PM
Author: asscherisme
The money from the tank isn''t even the biggest thing that bothers me. Its his out of control behavior, her denial, and her telling me MY kids have nothing wrong and that I''m wrong to believe they do or believe the 3 seperate diagnosis they got.

I get that. I really do. But money is your friend here. It is TANGIBLE. He did damage. She should pay for the damage. Even she should understand the cause & effect there. NO ONE is making her be responsible for his actions (including her). You''d be doing them a big favor by expecting NORMAL BEHAVIOR out of them and not accepting anything less. YOUR SON damaged the tank right in front of you -- now pay up. Simple fact. Its one of the few things you can control in this situation besides just keeping all of your kids away from him ... including not letting your daughter go to their home. You can''t control what she believes ... you can''t control what he does ... but you CAN control asking them to pay for the damage to your property that occurred BECAUSE of his "non-existent" issues.

 

[somethingshiny]

Date: 8/16/2009 1:33:47 PM
Author: asscherisme
I have been trying to offer her guidance for a few years. And each time she denies it. I have offered all I can offer because I''m worn out myself taking care of my kids.


And I have never nor would never say to her directly that her son is not welcome in my house. But I''m done issuing diner invitations because it means he will come along and it scares me and my kids.


Its a complicated situtation. She is a nice person for the most part but the denial and telling me how wrong I am for believeing in autism really bothers me.

Your parenting is directly affected by this situation. Put your family first and know that you''re doing the best for them.

 

[lyra]

I wouldn''t feel bad about losing this "friendship" at all. Maybe you can explain things to your daughter, as it is possible that this woman might be spiteful and not allow her daughter to see yours anymore. I think that isn''t so terrible in the whole scheme of things here. I would worry about my daughter even going to visit the other girl''s house at this point. Sheesh! You can''t help this woman. She is firmly in denial and might remain there for years to come. You did try, and that was kind of you, but she is responsible for her own actions or lack thereof. Too bad she''s not more open minded.

 

[asscherisme]

Its not my daughter that is best friends with her daughter I'm worried about. Its my 11 year old that does not have autism that is best friends with her 11 year old that does not have autism. And my older daughter knows to stay away from her brother. Its my 5 year old daugher and my 7 year old son that I worry about their safety around their son.

Rereading what I wrote it seems more clear to me know.

I think the best solution is to just be friendly and cordial with the mom but not issue invitations for her to come over because she brings her son. Her daughter though is perfectly nice and does not have any issues that concern me. And not accept family dinner invitations when she invites me and all my kids over but accept if she just invites my 11 year old daughter over.

In other words try and shift it so its just my daughter and her daughter getting together. She will figure it out over time and that wil lbe awkward but so be it.

I have for the past year or so been encouraging my older daughter to widen her circle of friends and she has made new friends so thats a very good thing. And this girl is in private school (we are at public school) so I don't have to worry if the friendship fizzles over time about school awkwardness for her.

edited to add my 11 year old daughter is VERY in tuned with this stuff. She does not understand how her friend's mom does not see whats wrong with her brother. And in fact I feel sorry for her daughter. She has confided in me how hard it is to have her brother wild and uncontrollable. She also said that he gets whatever he wants and they never say no to him. I don't want to shut the girl out so I will continue to invite her over alone but just not the mom for dinner. I have tried to help the mom with her son and its not helped. But I think that the girl really enjoys time at my house and I know she trusts me and talks to me and I don't want to shut her out. When I said earlier its complicated, thats part of what I meant. I'm a single mom and it does take all my energy with my own kids, but the woman's daughter is so sweet and her I welcome at my house.

 

[purrfectpear]

Frankly you''re upset over the wrong thing. You keep going on and on about how "insulted" you are because she lectures you about your kids diagnosis. Get over it. That''s not the issue here at all.

The issue is that kid is dangerous. You end the friendship because the kid is going to go "off" one of these days and you don''t want to be around it, or your kids to be there. I don''t get that you think it''s OK for your daughter to remain friends and visit that house? Either that kid IS dangerous or he is NOT? If he is then just because you think your daughter can stay away from him, I''d say you''re in denial. My kids wouldn''t be anywhere near that house, ever. If the mom was vigilant it would be another matter, but she''s not, and she thinks swinging baseball bats is OK. Sorry, but that''s just "batty".

 

[decodelighted]

I agree with Purrfectpear ... but IMHO you decide to let your kid go to someone''s house based on the PARENTING .. the parental SUPERVISION. Not whether the kid is a menace or not. Whether the ADULTS are competent and responsible caregivers. It seems CLEAR that they are NOT. Its probably not a good idea to let your daughter go over there at all, honestly. Even eleven year olds can be hit by a swinging bat when they are not looking. Or cut by the glass of a broken window etc etc. ACCIDENTS happen in the best homes, but they happen a heckofalot more often in homes with negligent, head-in-sand ADULTS.

Her lecturing you is almost besides the point. Are you yourself harboring doubts about the diagnoses of your kids? Why else would it bother you? Chalk it up to people not knowing what they are talking about and move on.

 

[Pandora II]

I''m sorry your friend is making you feel this way about your children''s diagnosis. In some ways I know exactly how you feel.

I have bipolar II and high-functioning Aspergers. Most people who meet me wouldn''t believe I have either. However it''s very obvious to my family, my husband and anyone else who spends a lot of time with me.

I''m on medication for the bipolar and have learnt a number of coping techniques for the Aspergers although I''m still not good at interpreting non-verbal signals a lot of the time.

A number of times people have expressed doubts that I have bipolar and suggested I should stop filling myself with meds. Hmmm, yes, the whole reason that you don''t think I have bipolar is because I am medicated enough to give me a normal life...

It is hard enough admitting that you or a family member have a disorder that is often misunderstood by most people without being doubted as well. As far as I can see you don''t need someone like this in your life - and her son sounds dangerous!

 

[Mara]

ITA with PP... there are several issues here but that child sounds dangerous and a Mom who is in denial about their child is just as dangerous.

I''d scale back the friendship for sure, but it might be awkward for a while. If your daughters are best friends, it may be hard because are you comfortable with allowing your daughter to go to their house? If not, that could add to the awkward scenario.

Tough call. I will never forget TG''s thread/posts about how you might have to deal with friends where your kids are related and things like safety or child-rearing... I think about it a fair amt and wonder how I would react in certain situations as well.

Good luck...but I believe life is too short to be around people who constantly make you feel badly. Friendship is a two-way street and while it doesn''t always need to be all roses and sunshine, it should always be wayyyyy on the positive side rather than negative.

 

[asscherisme]

Date: 8/16/2009 2:51:54 PM
Author: purrfectpear
Frankly you''re upset over the wrong thing. You keep going on and on about how ''insulted'' you are because she lectures you about your kids diagnosis. Get over it. That''s not the issue here at all.

The issue is that kid is dangerous. You end the friendship because the kid is going to go ''off'' one of these days and you don''t want to be around it, or your kids to be there. I don''t get that you think it''s OK for your daughter to remain friends and visit that house? Either that kid IS dangerous or he is NOT? If he is then just because you think your daughter can stay away from him, I''d say you''re in denial. My kids wouldn''t be anywhere near that house, ever. If the mom was vigilant it would be another matter, but she''s not, and she thinks swinging baseball bats is OK. Sorry, but that''s just ''batty''.

You do make a very good point. The more I think about it, the more I agree that NONE of my kids should be at her house. And I''m glad they don''t go tthe same school as my kids.

I don''t think I''m wrong to be insulted over her denying my children''s diagnosis. And I don''t need to "get over it" I think thats very demeaning of you to suggest. What I was saying there is that if she were a freind, she would not pushing that at me.

The danger aspect however I definately agree with you is a much bigger issue. So I disagree with your first point about my feelings of her denial over my kids, but thats simply an agree to disagree sort of thing.

Her son''s behavior as a danger is the real issue here and you hit that one spot on. And the more I think about it, the more that issue bothers me.

Pandora, exactly my point. And in fact, even though we have never met in real life, I was thinking of you this morning and am grateful for what you have shared in the past regarding your mental health. And that was in my head of if my son had bipolar and was well controlled with medication, she would deny that. Bipolar is something that I watch for with him because he does have severe mood swings and I know that it often exists with apsergers. He also had OCD but someone with brief encounters can''t tell. But when you live with it and the meltdowns from it, its hard.

But yes, the danger issue is the big issue here. After rereading what I wrote definately and yes, Idon''t think its a good idea for my daugther to to there. However, I will continue to invite her daughter to my house and relaize that in time, she may either be happy to not have to host my daughter OR be insulted I never let her come over in which case the firendship might be over.

Time will tell.

 

[swimmer]

Asscher, you are doing a great job. Really, so many parents of autistic (or somewhere on the spectrum) kids just choose to ignore it. I have about 3 students a year whose parents refuse that "label" and so discard the services, outreach, and training that they and their children can really use in order to better function in society. I commend you and your family for being so proactive and working on making their lives more meaningful and filled with useful tools. It is not easy, but it is the right thing to do.

If you think your 11 year old daughter can really handle herself at that home, possibly around this young man, then that friendship should continue, but your younger children need your protection and he is a walking disaster. I have to agree that you are not doing that family a favor by ignoring that their child destroyed your property. I get it that the mom is in denial and that the son has no repercussions for his behavior, but now you are jumping onto that bandwagon. OK, if he is a "normal" kid, what would you do? You would ask for money or an apology if the neighborhood kids broke your window or something. Treat him normally. She said he is. Only his actions speak to the contrary. Perhaps helping her to see that he is not behaving in a normal pattern will help them out. It isn't about the money, it is about the taking responsibility. The son can't as of yet grasp that, the mom should. And will. What is she raising this poor boy to be or do?

It is hard to drop it, but do just ignore her rantings, you know you are doing the right thing by your children. The experts all agree with you and want her to take a different approach. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt and she has her own boat on it.
Best of luck to you and your family. This is hard.

 

[asscherisme]

Date: 8/16/2009 3:47:29 PM
Author: swimmer
Asscher, you are doing a great job. Really, so many parents of autistic (or somewhere on the spectrum) kids just choose to ignore it. I have about 3 students a year whose parents refuse that ''label'' and so discard the services, outreach, and training that they and their children can really use in order to better function in society. I commend you and your family for being so proactive and working on making their lives more meaningful and filled with useful tools. It is not easy, but it is the right thing to do.

If you think your 11 year old daughter can really handle herself at that home, possibly around this young man, then that friendship should continue, but your younger children need your protection and he is a walking disaster. I have to agree that you are not doing that family a favor by ignoring that their child destroyed your property. I get it that the mom is in denial and that the son has no repercussions for his behavior, but now you are jumping onto that bandwagon. OK, if he is a ''normal'' kid, what would you do? You would ask for money or an apology if the neighborhood kids broke your window or something. Treat him normally. She said he is. Only his actions speak to the contrary. Perhaps helping her to see that he is not behaving in a normal pattern will help them out. It isn''t about the money, it is about the taking responsibility. The son can''t as of yet grasp that, the mom should. And will. What is she raising this poor boy to be or do?

It is hard to drop it, but do just ignore her rantings, you know you are doing the right thing by your children. The experts all agree with you and want her to take a different approach. Denial ain''t just a river in Egypt and she has her own boat on it.
Best of luck to you and your family. This is hard.

Thanks for the kind words swimmer. And you do have some good points. I am going to call the mom later and tell her about the damage and ask she pay for it. If it were reversed and my child broke something I would want to pay.

And its not the first time I have had to ask her this. I have asked her to pay for broken things before. So even that does not sink it with her.

Its not me and my family, its pretty much just me. My ex is very not supportive of anything so its pretty much me and my kids. And I do the best I can with them. My children''s teachers have told me I''m doing great, as well as the principal at the school, the school social worker, and the private therapsit we use. So I figure I must be doing something right

 

[VRBeauty]

Date: 8/16/2009 4:00:36 PM
Author: asscherisme

Its not me and my family, its pretty much just me. My ex is very not supportive of anything so its pretty much me and my kids. And I do the best I can with them. My children''s teachers have told me I''m doing great, as well as the principal at the school, the school social worker, and the private therapsit we use. So I figure I must be doing something right

I''m glad you''ve decided to cool this friendship. It sounds as if you have a hard enough row to hoe without having to fight her denial and negativity.

 

[decodelighted]

Ahhhh I get it now ... your ex was resisting the spectrum labels & dropping the ball JUST LIKE THIS LADY IS. That''s why you''re so peeved at HER. It taps into unsettled biz. Okay.

Have you heard the term Gaslighting. Where people try to manipulate you by making you think YOU''RE the crazy one. Well I''d guess that''s what your ex was doing & what THIS lady is doing also. If she admits your kids have a legit diagnosis she has to look at herself and her own child differently. To avoid doing that she''ll decide YOU''re wrong & YOU need convincing. Obviously that would be uncomfortable for you whether done by the EX or the "friend". See it for what it is & it will be easier to a) ignore/dismiss etc and b) decide you don''t want to be around it in the future.

 

[Maisie]

I really feel that life is too short to put up with things that make us miserable. This woman is not in control of her unruly and sometimes dangerous son. That isn''t good for you or your family. My advice would be to scale right back, ignore any silliness or tantrums she might throw in your direction, and move on. It would be good for your daughter to widen her social circle now. Just in case the mother stops her friend from coming over.

You have tried to offer her advice and its fallen on deaf ears. She isn''t going to accept her son has these issues. You can''t make her listen and its such a shame. I feel sad for her family. These issues won''t go away.

Always put yourself and your children first. Especially when it comes to matters of safety. It would be truly awful if one of your children was hit round the head with a bat or another heavy object.

I am sending you lots of hugs!!

 

[Sharon101]

83%; HEIGHT: 110px" class="ibbquote">Date: 8/16/2009 2:51:54 PM
Author: purrfectpear


The issue is that kid is dangerous. You end the friendship because the kid is going to go 'off' one of these days and you don't want to be around it, or your kids to be there. I don't get that you think it's OK for your daughter to remain friends and visit that house? Either that kid IS dangerous or he is NOT? If he is then just because you think your daughter can stay away from him, I'd say you're in denial. My kids wouldn't be anywhere near that house, ever. If the mom was vigilant it would be another matter, but she's not, and she thinks swinging baseball bats is OK. Sorry, but that's just 'batty'.

This advice is spot on. Especially as the scary boy gets bigger and more violent you dont want any of your family near him. It is within your rights to set limmits on your kids friends eg. the friend can only come to your house not other way around. Plus as a Mum, you can work towards encouraging new friendships for your daughter. Stear her towards other friends. I find that parents have a lot of influence in these areas even if it is not obvious to the children. Make suggestions to your daughter to invite xyz and try to talk up the benefit of having many friends not just one best one.


And fwiw, I would not be friends with someone who made a point of telling me (many times) that my kids are fine if I knew that was not the truth. Life is too short, busy and hard to have friends who want to pull you down and be unsupportive. It is also considered rude and disrespectful to push your views on someone about their kids. She has no credibility either so is barking up the wrong tree. We are all responsible for both recognising and eliminating toxic people from our lives. Trust me, there is no shortage of those types and you have to be on your toes!

 

[VRBeauty]

Asscherisme -- what I know about autism you could fit on the head of a pin. I have co-workers who have autistic children or grandchildren though, and I know that it generally means that the parents must be more involved in their children''s lives. I''m sure you don''t (always) see it as a burden, but raising three children as a single parent would be difficult under any circumstances, and it must be doubly so when two of the children present special challenges such as autism. I really hope you have a support group that maybe wasn''t germane to your question here -- parents, siblings, in-laws, other extended family. If not, is there any way you can carve out some time to so you can meet other parents who are facing the same challenges you are?

Please ignore (and forgive) me if my unsolicited advice is way off base.

 

[asscherisme]

Date: 8/17/2009 2:16:31 AM
Author: VRBeauty
Asscherisme -- what I know about autism you could fit on the head of a pin. I have co-workers who have autistic children or grandchildren though, and I know that it generally means that the parents must be more involved in their children's lives. I'm sure you don't (always) see it as a burden, but raising three children as a single parent would be difficult under any circumstances, and it must be doubly so when two of the children present special challenges such as autism. I really hope you have a support group that maybe wasn't germane to your question here -- parents, siblings, in-laws, other extended family. If not, is there any way you can carve out some time to so you can meet other parents who are facing the same challenges you are?

Please ignore (and forgive) me if my unsolicited advice is way off base.

I actually have 4 kids, 3 of whom have autism and one who does not. And nope, just me and my kids. Pretty much it. No family. And ex inlaws are dysfunctional at best and never had any interest in the kids. Pretty much ignored the from the day they were born.

Back on topic, I have decided to allow the girl over to play with my 11 year old, but not allow her to go to their house or expose my other kids to their son. I expalned to my 11 year old daughter why and she confided to me that the brother scares her too and she understood. I also told her that over time, once the mom figures out we are avoiding her house she might contront me and iwill tell her the truth that her son scares me and my kids and that it might end the freindship but that I feel she needs to know the truth. My daughter agreed and I was SO proud of her because she told me that as much as she likes her friends, her little brother and sister come first. I was SO proud of her. She is so amazing. she just made me so proud tonight.

She did say that her friend would not put up with her mom not letting her come over, but time will tell. She also told me her firend is afraid of her brother, and I already knew that. I feel so sorry for her. I know my daughter feels a lot of stress having 3 autistic siblings but she tells me she is glad she has me to talk to about it but that her freind can't talk to her mom about it. Just sad

 

[asscherisme]

Date: 8/16/2009 6:19:10 PM
Author: decodelighted
Ahhhh I get it now ... your ex was resisting the spectrum labels & dropping the ball JUST LIKE THIS LADY IS. That''s why you''re so peeved at HER. It taps into unsettled biz. Okay.

Have you heard the term Gaslighting. Where people try to manipulate you by making you think YOU''RE the crazy one. Well I''d guess that''s what your ex was doing & what THIS lady is doing also. If she admits your kids have a legit diagnosis she has to look at herself and her own child differently. To avoid doing that she''ll decide YOU''re wrong & YOU need convincing. Obviously that would be uncomfortable for you whether done by the EX or the ''friend''. See it for what it is & it will be easier to a) ignore/dismiss etc and b) decide you don''t want to be around it in the future.

Oh my gosh, you so totally got something I did not even realize that I was doing and you are so spot on its scary. What you described is EXACTLY how I felt and why I was so bothered by her attitude.

And no, I have never heard the term gaslighting but thats EXACTLY how my ex made me feel. Like I was the crazy one. In fact he would call me crazy, among other things. I had to leave, I had no choice because I felt that the kids and I were not safe. I have zero regrets for getting out and I honestly have such a sense of relief over it.

You are good!

 

[asscherisme]

Date: 8/16/2009 8:21:53 PM
Author: Sharon101

style="WIDTH: 95.83%; HEIGHT: 110px">Date: 8/16/2009 2:51:54 PM
Author: purrfectpear


The issue is that kid is dangerous. You end the friendship because the kid is going to go ''off'' one of these days and you don''t want to be around it, or your kids to be there. I don''t get that you think it''s OK for your daughter to remain friends and visit that house? Either that kid IS dangerous or he is NOT? If he is then just because you think your daughter can stay away from him, I''d say you''re in denial. My kids wouldn''t be anywhere near that house, ever. If the mom was vigilant it would be another matter, but she''s not, and she thinks swinging baseball bats is OK. Sorry, but that''s just ''batty''.

This advice is spot on. Especially as the scary boy gets bigger and more violent you dont want any of your family near him. It is within your rights to set limmits on your kids friends eg. the friend can only come to your house not other way around. Plus as a Mum, you can work towards encouraging new friendships for your daughter. Stear her towards other friends. I find that parents have a lot of influence in these areas even if it is not obvious to the children. Make suggestions to your daughter to invite xyz and try to talk up the benefit of having many friends not just one best one.


And fwiw, I would not be friends with someone who made a point of telling me (many times) that my kids are fine if I knew that was not the truth. Life is too short, busy and hard to have friends who want to pull you down and be unsupportive. It is also considered rude and disrespectful to push your views on someone about their kids. She has no credibility either so is barking up the wrong tree. We are all responsible for both recognising and eliminating toxic people from our lives. Trust me, there is no shortage of those types and you have to be on your toes!

Great advice and I have spent that past year stearing my daughter towards expanding her circle of firends and had some success there.

Funny aside, she also likes to lecture me about how I am doing a bad job mothering in the religion department because I dont'' take my kids to a house of worship and that kids need religion. I''m not a religious person and am not going to push something on my kids that I don''t feel strongly about. Ironically her husband is an athiest and it bugs the heck out of her. He never ever goes to church with her and she tells me it causes big fights between them. But thing is, he was an atheist when they married, its not like he was one way and changed, she got what she got and critisizes him for it.

Hmmm as I write that she does sound awful dosn''t she.

 

[Sharon101]

Date: 8/17/2009 3:07:38 AM
Author: asscherisme

Date: 8/16/2009 8:21:53 PM
Author: Sharon101




Date: 8/16/2009 2:51:54 PM
Author: purrfectpear


The issue is that kid is dangerous. You end the friendship because the kid is going to go 'off' one of these days and you don't want to be around it, or your kids to be there. I don't get that you think it's OK for your daughter to remain friends and visit that house? Either that kid IS dangerous or he is NOT? If he is then just because you think your daughter can stay away from him, I'd say you're in denial. My kids wouldn't be anywhere near that house, ever. If the mom was vigilant it would be another matter, but she's not, and she thinks swinging baseball bats is OK. Sorry, but that's just 'batty'.

This advice is spot on. Especially as the scary boy gets bigger and more violent you dont want any of your family near him. It is within your rights to set limmits on your kids friends eg. the friend can only come to your house not other way around. Plus as a Mum, you can work towards encouraging new friendships for your daughter. Stear her towards other friends. I find that parents have a lot of influence in these areas even if it is not obvious to the children. Make suggestions to your daughter to invite xyz and try to talk up the benefit of having many friends not just one best one.


And fwiw, I would not be friends with someone who made a point of telling me (many times) that my kids are fine if I knew that was not the truth. Life is too short, busy and hard to have friends who want to pull you down and be unsupportive. It is also considered rude and disrespectful to push your views on someone about their kids. She has no credibility either so is barking up the wrong tree. We are all responsible for both recognising and eliminating toxic people from our lives. Trust me, there is no shortage of those types and you have to be on your toes!

Great advice and I have spent that past year stearing my daughter towards expanding her circle of firends and had some success there.

Funny aside, she also likes to lecture me about how I am doing a bad job mothering in the religion department because I dont' take my kids to a house of worship and that kids need religion. I'm not a religious person and am not going to push something on my kids that I don't feel strongly about. Ironically her husband is an athiest and it bugs the heck out of her. He never ever goes to church with her and she tells me it causes big fights between them. But thing is, he was an atheist when they married, its not like he was one way and changed, she got what she got and critisizes him for it.

Hmmm as I write that she does sound awful dosn't she.

Thats the limmit.....nobody lectures about religion. Its so personal and private and it relies on faith....its not something you can debate the facts. I`m an athiest and live quite well without visiting any house of religion, my kids included. So maybe someone should tell her we dont have to follow her way of living and that she can take her `bad mothering` attitude and apply it to her own life and kids before worrying about yours.

Really kick her to the curb...she sounds boring on top of everything else. You need some fun friends who can share a good drop of red, or enjoy a good coffee over some deep and meaningful (or not) girls talk. Your friend is way too controling and serious about life, she`s a total big mouth who would just bore me to death! We need our friends to lighten the load not weigh it down with lead!

 

[Sharon101]

Date: 8/16/2009 6:19:10 PM
Author: decodelighted
Ahhhh I get it now ... your ex was resisting the spectrum labels & dropping the ball JUST LIKE THIS LADY IS. That''s why you''re so peeved at HER. It taps into unsettled biz. Okay.

Have you heard the term Gaslighting. Where people try to manipulate you by making you think YOU''RE the crazy one. Well I''d guess that''s what your ex was doing & what THIS lady is doing also. If she admits your kids have a legit diagnosis she has to look at herself and her own child differently. To avoid doing that she''ll decide YOU''re wrong & YOU need convincing. Obviously that would be uncomfortable for you whether done by the EX or the ''friend''. See it for what it is & it will be easier to a) ignore/dismiss etc and b) decide you don''t want to be around it in the future.

This is really interesting and well writen. Much of this could apply to my life too! Im going to remember that new word `gaslighting`. It is such a good word and we can all relate to the meaning.

 

[asscherisme]

Date: 8/17/2009 8:05:34 AM
Author: Sharon101

Date: 8/17/2009 3:07:38 AM
Author: asscherisme

Date: 8/16/2009 8:21:53 PM
Author: Sharon101

style="WIDTH: 95.83%; HEIGHT: 110px">Date: 8/16/2009 2:51:54 PM
Author: purrfectpear


The issue is that kid is dangerous. You end the friendship because the kid is going to go ''off'' one of these days and you don''t want to be around it, or your kids to be there. I don''t get that you think it''s OK for your daughter to remain friends and visit that house? Either that kid IS dangerous or he is NOT? If he is then just because you think your daughter can stay away from him, I''d say you''re in denial. My kids wouldn''t be anywhere near that house, ever. If the mom was vigilant it would be another matter, but she''s not, and she thinks swinging baseball bats is OK. Sorry, but that''s just ''batty''.

This advice is spot on. Especially as the scary boy gets bigger and more violent you dont want any of your family near him. It is within your rights to set limmits on your kids friends eg. the friend can only come to your house not other way around. Plus as a Mum, you can work towards encouraging new friendships for your daughter. Stear her towards other friends. I find that parents have a lot of influence in these areas even if it is not obvious to the children. Make suggestions to your daughter to invite xyz and try to talk up the benefit of having many friends not just one best one.


And fwiw, I would not be friends with someone who made a point of telling me (many times) that my kids are fine if I knew that was not the truth. Life is too short, busy and hard to have friends who want to pull you down and be unsupportive. It is also considered rude and disrespectful to push your views on someone about their kids. She has no credibility either so is barking up the wrong tree. We are all responsible for both recognising and eliminating toxic people from our lives. Trust me, there is no shortage of those types and you have to be on your toes!

Great advice and I have spent that past year stearing my daughter towards expanding her circle of firends and had some success there.

Funny aside, she also likes to lecture me about how I am doing a bad job mothering in the religion department because I dont'' take my kids to a house of worship and that kids need religion. I''m not a religious person and am not going to push something on my kids that I don''t feel strongly about. Ironically her husband is an athiest and it bugs the heck out of her. He never ever goes to church with her and she tells me it causes big fights between them. But thing is, he was an atheist when they married, its not like he was one way and changed, she got what she got and critisizes him for it.

Hmmm as I write that she does sound awful dosn''t she.

Thats the limmit.....nobody lectures about religion. Its so personal and private and it relies on faith....its not something you can debate the facts. I`m an athiest and live quite well without visiting any house of religion, my kids included. So maybe someone should tell her we dont have to follow her way of living and that she can take her `bad mothering` attitude and apply it to her own life and kids before worrying about yours.

Really kick her to the curb...she sounds boring on top of everything else. You need some fun friends who can share a good drop of red, or enjoy a good coffee over some deep and meaningful (or not) girls talk. Your friend is way too controling and serious about life, she`s a total big mouth who would just bore me to death! We need our friends to lighten the load not weigh it down with lead!

Sharon, do you want to come over to my house for some coffee and/or a good drop of red I am agnostic but have utmost respect for atheist''s view as well. And I agree, I would never nor have I ever pushed my view any anyone else.

And its amazing what writing about something can make you see it so clearly. Yeah, sounds like a downgrade from "friend" to mother of my daughter''s friend is in order.

In addition to my daughter, I think its time to widen my circle of friends. Hard to do but time to definately make an effort in that department.

 

[Sharon101]

LOL, well Im in Australia so I will have a virtual drink with you!

I get that sometimes we hold on to unhealthy friendships because we are too exhausted or tired to try to start new ones. Ive been there, and its really hard to socialise and act all happy and chirpy when you have problems and you`re working 24/7, and you have no free time etc. I really get that. When my kids were younger and I had issues with them and work, I can tell you that friends were the last thing I had energy for.

But, where you can, and if you can, go for it. Try to have some you time with some women even if they are a group or committee for a charity, or your school, or anything. Just having an excuse to get out and have a break can be very rewarding. It is hard when you feel stretched to your max. Sometimes all we can do is facebook from the comfort of the home!!!!!

I think you will get there, you sound like a great person to know.

 

[cara]

At the end of the day, this is about respect. A woman that lectures you on your religious choices has no respect for your own ability to make such important decisions as to a belief system for yourself. A woman that does not respect your parenting choices by calling you out on your children''s diagnoses, well she is clearly expressing the idea that her judgment on the matter is better than yours without the appropriate amount of respect for your ability to make your own decisions for your family (even if she would make different ones.) To some extent, all parents make judgements about what method is best for their own family, and many make silent judgments about what would be best for someone else''s family. But to openly and repeatedly question your judgment and parenting decisions shows a lack of respect for you.

As you''ve already figured out, this friendship has run its course. But I would suggest that it is she who has severed the friendship, but has left to you the messy task of minimizing your contact with her and protecting yourself and your family members from her dangerous child. She is also deserving of some pity from afar, as to protect her worldview that her autistic son is normal, it has become necessary to attack her former friend''s parenting choices. Sad.

Also, I''d encourage your daughter to keep up the friendship as much as possible within the constraints of safety. There''s nothing wrong or dangerous with her friend, and it sounds like the friend could use a safe outlet from her home. If the friend''s mother cuts off her visits in retailation then that is a shame but out of your hands to control.

 

[asscherisme]

Sharon, OK virtual drink it will be I would also go for virtual ice cream instead

And yes, I do admit I know the friendship has had severe limits for awhile but her being my daughters best friends mom had a convience factor and sometimes its easier to go with the known than put yourself out there.

I do want to widen my circle of friends, but its pretty low down on my list right now. Even so, I would be better off having a nice evening with my kids than having them over.

Cara, I agree with what you wrote. And I do plan on welcoming her daughter to my home, just not the other way around. The friendship between her mother and me has run its course and your points are spot on.