Would you spend $30k on an F2 treated emerald?

[pudgethefish]

Hi everyone, I would appreciate if anyone could weigh in on this emerald I am tempted to buy from JR Colombian Emeralds. I went to their store in FL and handled it in person, and it was absolutely stunning to my naked eye, especially compared to the other emeralds they showed me in person. But, of course, I am a gem amateur and beyond “it’s so pretty” I don’t really have any expertise anyway, the original cert they had from Colombia said “minor oil” but I paid them to send to GIA and it came back “F2” which from my understanding poring through the posts on this forum, is not very desirable. I also have no idea what a window is, but I understand that to be undesirable as well, and I bet this emerald has one. Can anyone tell me?

My primary concern is I want to make a big beautiful ring that I can pass down to my kids and grandkids, so I don’t want the emerald to change in appearance significantly over time, which I understand can happen with F2 treated gems. I’m not concerned about reselling the gem, so I wouldn’t go for untreated - but is it worth waiting for a smaller gem with only F1 treatment? Also, if I were to buy this particular F2 emerald, would $30k be outrageous? I know JR is a reputable seller but I just want to know if this would be a $30k waste of money and I should hold out for a smaller but “better” emerald. That being said I love how this emerald looked in person, but maybe it’s because I am a peasant without good taste

Thank you all for your help!

Video here:

IMG_4698.mov

drive.google.com

GIA report here:

https://report-check-objects-us-west-2-092721654985.s3.amazonaws.com/pdfs/21/5231172821.pdf?AWSAccessKeyId=ASIARLFVEFTEZH36OKLH&Signature=nFs4IYH5gfMQujMjYdRjBr3rx%2Bs%3D&x-amz-security-token=IQoJb3JpZ2luX2VjEI7%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2FwEaCXVzLXdlc3QtMiJGMEQCIFwOgDm%2B%2FctEJh0R2jN5PhdhtU2le4Wk8edin1kp3xZDAiB93y%2FKM5EPAfP7K%2Foc0cebjBd03sMwgYpZe48DoLTDNiq%2FAwhnEAQaDDA5MjcyMTY1NDk4NSIMz0nY8G1lFVrw%2BHmxKpwDZ6NlHNwBSPNA72tK%2BpFshgUmrNYdpBr1GBv%2FEWOzF%2F7CmNXoK4OGhHFJ%2FzAu%2BiclRalH4eKXq9s4X2GtZ%2BIUwqckixc45sCdeFV0KgD3%2BLgiA86p72%2FDROdis5xUc0rdakcs%2FUnmv8pew5mPNjurt7EhdIWLD2cPfPjPwQXFonj0aSwBcdPYQzPwgdNVQn3F8n0otC%2FOFJSpt4RF5UN0Ul4d80khArp4Vdp5EdJpuJI1vATC%2BHKBH9ByESDzlFlDu0zloGa4RrObaJDx60XaxlioINQtMWXT6ELVVwkvCbC5AcaBcgkpgprQ%2FeqF13lxwI1SUIp8B%2Bt8tEwhuZmDjzwgOcGYzXGe8KY6jSYbWl703QPmXOdY%2BHDSGbfxSaiz3aaPqbU2FtDaA0nzHjwRbmENkvGWY2er7Pc3TjIzkVsoqZmILWJT%2FHH6gIBq2dV%2FOf08Uv16lsm38Tl3Hko3GFrc84YBReOwvzCmdsrgtNvt%2BS4FcNodofzfEl%2BT9sZJydZEeHvnTwHoTBNGV0fFfmLwvJXWIaiZLOjpRjClr6quBjqfAfMnuBwnJ6UcA6UgVFW9%2BgebLKHua%2FgmknyaqvWIEhET4WxpWVTSo4TX0Q%2BCxdtMxqN6QvFFGtN5Yx5lvc76g0JY8rDhzlQzkPMI68bH5rZFqkObIHkccaUjywYoiGPU1CdSRqfd2%2B17NzNH%2BSLi94n6qGq9q%2FbuOO8g9HTKr9PLhsdyNblIDYFj9uhRddeaghC278GyMEjXUWI1sN9jyw%3D%3D&Expires=1707781064

 

[Avondale]

A window is when you can see through the gem as if it were glass.

Check this out, it should help you gain an idea:

It’s from the same vendor, very useful video.

If it were me, and I had that kind of money to blow on an emerald, I’d prioritise colour, clarity and cutting over size, and get a smaller stone that was truly spectacular. In the case of the emerald you’re considering, the compromise comes from the clarity and the cutting. In the end it’s a matter of personal preference and what is important to you. No right or wrong answers. Take your time, look at as many emeralds as you can. Allow your eye the time to develop a taste and a sense for what it can and what it won’t compromise with.

 

[pudgethefish]

A window is when you can see through the gem as if it were glass.

Check this out, it should help you gain an idea:

It’s from the same vendor, very useful video.

If it were me, and I had that kind of money to blow on an emerald, I’d prioritise colour, clarity and cutting over size, and get a smaller stone that was truly spectacular. In the case of the emerald you’re considering, the compromise comes from the clarity and the cutting. In the end it’s a matter of personal preference and what is important to you. No right or wrong answers. Take your time, look at as many emeralds as you can. Allow your eye the time to develop a taste and a sense for what it can and what it won’t compromise with.

Thank you so much for the advice! This is how amateur my eye is, I actually thought the moderate oil emeralds looked better after the oil was dissolved am I crazy??? I love inclusions, I think they are beautiful

 

[mellowyellowgirl]

Since you’re able to visit the store in person, I would ask them to show you a smaller, much higher quality emerald in the same budget and see how you feel about that! A higher quality stone may not necessarily sing to you! Or it might take your breath away!

If I were you I’d give myself time to look around and see what really calls out to me.

It took me a few years to come to my personal revelations that no matter how high quality stone is, I view all small stones as miserable so it’s just not something I would buy anymore these days. That’s my very own specific take though! Good luck finding yours!

 

[Mreader]

Was the price adjusted lower once the report came back as F2 as opposed to be minor oil?

 

[RRfromR]

Absolutely not. What about these?

Insignificant

Jacob & Co 2.11 Ct Colombian Emerald and Diamond Ring - Insignificant Treatment

A vibrant crystalline green Colombian emerald, weighing 2.11 carats, beams from the center of two bright white trillion-cut diamonds in this show stopping ring by Jacob & Co. The emerald is accompanied by an AGL certificate stating insignificant to minor treatment, Colombian origin. Currently a...

www.parkavenueantiques.com

Minor

https://www.therealreal.com/products/jewelry/rings/cocktail-ring/platinum-2-57ct-colombian-emerald-diamond-ballerina-ring-jwhxn

Minor

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[Mreader]

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[Crimson]

I agree with @Avondale and @mellowyellowgirl.
Since are looking for something that you can pass along in future, an f2 stone may not be the best choice. It’s not clear whether it will hold its value as much as a normal oil or minor oil stone. You might also be leaving problems for whoever takes over the stone because they may have to maintain it.
My preference is to put color and treatment before size. At 30k you would, it probably have lots of choices So do compare, and widen your search if you have the time. below is a link my emerald thread in case you’d like to have a look. It took four months of viewing hundreds of stores, and several conversations with suppliers and jewellers, trade shows, before I decided.
Thread 'My new Vivid Green Muzo Emerald Ring'
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/my-new-vivid-green-muzo-emerald-ring.277080/

 

[LilAlex]

I won't click on a link and you're a new user (welcome!) and those are complex-looking links. Maybe post some screenshots?

Generally, no, I would not get an F2 now and have said as much here. That stone looks huge and beautiful, though! And the only sizable emerald we have was purchased before we knew anything about treatment stuff so there's that.

For context: I said I would never get a heated sapphire but our local B&M shop had a (petite) killer royal blue that was heated. Then when they went out of business and it was like half-off, I made a beeline for it. Yes, I have my principles -- and if you don't like them, I have others.

On the one hand, you can clearly afford to get more of the real deal -- an F1 or better. OTOH, none of these are really "investments" and you should buy and wear and enjoy what you love!

 

[Avondale]

I actually thought the moderate oil emeralds looked better after the oil was dissolved am I crazy??? I love inclusions, I think they are beautiful

No, you're not crazy. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and sometimes what the beholder finds beautiful is quite good for the budget. I imagine most people would prefer their emeralds to be oiled, but perhaps you're one of the rare cases where you'd rather instead have the oil removed altogether?

One important thing you have to keep in mind though - inclusions don't just affect the beauty of an emerald, they also affect the structural integrity. A more included emerald will be more susceptible to chipping, cracking and breaking, and where the inclusions and fissures are located can be key. It's one of the main reasons why F2 stones take a significant price hit. JR create a lot of jewellery so I imagine they'd be well equipped to advise you on that, you just need to ask.

 

[RRfromR]

@Avondale that link was wild! So you can just drop your stone in acetone?
For OP, these are 2 of mine - the art deco one is insignificant oil, probably oiled once in the 20s and the retro one F1. I'm posting close images to see the structure too. The treatments for F1 and insignificant are invisible to me. I think F2 would be similar (I think)

 

[pudgethefish]

Since you’re able to visit the store in person, I would ask them to show you a smaller, much higher quality emerald in the same budget and see how you feel about that! A higher quality stone may not necessarily sing to you! Or it might take your breath away!

If I were you I’d give myself time to look around and see what really calls out to me.

It took me a few years to come to my personal revelations that no matter how high quality stone is, I view all small stones as miserable so it’s just not something I would buy anymore these days. That’s my very own specific take though! Good luck finding yours!

Thank you so much for your insight! I think I share your view on small stones

 

[pudgethefish]

Was the price adjusted lower once the report came back as F2 as opposed to be minor oil?

No, I asked them to discount it further but they refused, saying I already got a discount before the Gia report came back (which is true)

 

[pudgethefish]

Absolutely not. What about these?

Insignificant

Jacob & Co 2.11 Ct Colombian Emerald and Diamond Ring - Insignificant Treatment

A vibrant crystalline green Colombian emerald, weighing 2.11 carats, beams from the center of two bright white trillion-cut diamonds in this show stopping ring by Jacob & Co. The emerald is accompanied by an AGL certificate stating insignificant to minor treatment, Colombian origin. Currently a...

www.parkavenueantiques.com

Minor

https://www.therealreal.com/products/jewelry/rings/cocktail-ring/platinum-2-57ct-colombian-emerald-diamond-ballerina-ring-jwhxn

Minor

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Thank you for the suggestion. I’m looking for something big and honking - my husband sacrificed size to get a flawless diamond for my engagement ring and this whole time I’ve thought wow I really don’t care if it’s flawless, so I’m leaning toward a bigger emerald even if it’s flawed

 

[pudgethefish]

I agree with @Avondale and @mellowyellowgirl.
Since are looking for something that you can pass along in future, an f2 stone may not be the best choice. It’s not clear whether it will hold its value as much as a normal oil or minor oil stone. You might also be leaving problems for whoever takes over the stone because they may have to maintain it.
My preference is to put color and treatment before size. At 30k you would, it probably have lots of choices So do compare, and widen your search if you have the time. below is a link my emerald thread in case you’d like to have a look. It took four months of viewing hundreds of stores, and several conversations with suppliers and jewellers, trade shows, before I decided.
Thread 'My new Vivid Green Muzo Emerald Ring'
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/my-new-vivid-green-muzo-emerald-ring.277080/

Thank you for the advice, beautiful ring you have there! I could def look at more emeralds as you suggest!

 

[pudgethefish]

I won't click on a link and you're a new user (welcome!) and those are complex-looking links. Maybe post some screenshots?

Generally, no, I would not get an F2 now and have said as much here. That stone looks huge and beautiful, though! And the only sizable emerald we have was purchased before we knew anything about treatment stuff so there's that.

For context: I said I would never get a heated sapphire but our local B&M shop had a (petite) killer royal blue that was heated. Then when they went out of business and it was like half-off, I made a beeline for it. Yes, I have my principles -- and if you don't like them, I have others.

On the one hand, you can clearly afford to get more of the real deal -- an F1 or better. OTOH, none of these are really "investments" and you should buy and wear and enjoy what you love!

Yes thank you for the reminder that it’s really just about buying and wearing what you enjoy! It’s so easy to get caught up in the grading even knowing I won’t sell it!

 

[pudgethefish]

No, you're not crazy. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and sometimes what the beholder finds beautiful is quite good for the budget. I imagine most people would prefer their emeralds to be oiled, but perhaps you're one of the rare cases where you'd rather instead have the oil removed altogether?

One important thing you have to keep in mind though - inclusions don't just affect the beauty of an emerald, they also affect the structural integrity. A more included emerald will be more susceptible to chipping, cracking and breaking, and where the inclusions and fissures are located can be key. It's one of the main reasons why F2 stones take a significant price hit. JR create a lot of jewellery so I imagine they'd be well equipped to advise you on that, you just need to ask.

I asked JR and they said F2 wouldn’t change significantly over time

 

[pudgethefish]

@Avondale that link was wild! So you can just drop your stone in acetone?
For OP, these are 2 of mine - the art deco one is insignificant oil, probably oiled once in the 20s and the retro one F1. I'm posting close images to see the structure too. The treatments for F1 and insignificant are invisible to me. I think F2 would be similar (I think)

Wow gorgeous rings, thank you for sharing! It’s super helpful to see the comparison

 

[Mreader]

No, I asked them to discount it further but they refused, saying I already got a discount before the Gia report came back (which is true)

I call BS on that. Minor oil is not the same as F2, so why wouldn’t it be cheaper when the report came back? Also, I can’t link the GIA report. How big is the stone?

 

[pudgethefish]

Yes, I felt a little miffed by that too. It’s 12.09 carats so very large, which is the primary reason I like it

I call BS on that. Minor oil is not the same as F2, so why wouldn’t it be cheaper when the report came back? Also, I can’t link the GIA report. How big is the stone?

 

[Mrsz1ppy]

Thank you for the suggestion. I’m looking for something big and honking - my husband sacrificed size to get a flawless diamond for my engagement ring and this whole time I’ve thought wow I really don’t care if it’s flawless, so I’m leaning toward a bigger emerald even if it’s flawed

Go big or go home! I’m gravitating towards bigger these days, as well.

 

[RRfromR]

12 ct is absolutely enormous for an emerald, this is how it looks on a size 8.5 finger, which is on the larger side. I'd be worried about the fragility of that ring too, because emeralds are delicate. Just my 2 cents, but I'd look for something smaller and better quality, but that's just me, someone (practical lol) who inherited a ton of cocktail jewelry for my family.

Vintage 12 Carat Colombian Emerald and Diamond Ring in Palladium

Top-quality natural Colombian Emerald set in vintage palladium ring. Center stone is mounted in an elaborate baguette and round cut diamond halo. This vintage ring is estimated to originate circa 1950. A true one-of-a-kind, handmade ring. This ring is for those with a refined and sophisticated...

www.assayjewelers.com

 

[RRfromR]

12 ct is absolutely enormous for an emerald, this is how it looks on a size 8.5 finger, which is on the larger side. I'd be worried about the fragility of that ring too, because emeralds are delicate. Just my 2 cents, but I'd look for something smaller and better quality, but that's just me, someone (practical lol) who inherited a ton of cocktail jewelry for my family.

Vintage 12 Carat Colombian Emerald and Diamond Ring in Palladium

Top-quality natural Colombian Emerald set in vintage palladium ring. Center stone is mounted in an elaborate baguette and round cut diamond halo. This vintage ring is estimated to originate circa 1950. A true one-of-a-kind, handmade ring. This ring is for those with a refined and sophisticated...

www.assayjewelers.com

Oops, this is the picture I wanted to post. This is an aprox. 12 ct on a size 8.5 finger. The proportions are off imo

 

[pudgethefish]

Oops, this is the picture I wanted to post. This is an aprox. 12 ct on a size 8.5 finger. The proportions are off imo

Yes I agree, that looks like a superbowl ring I would get a very classic setting just two small side diamonds if I got it … I tried it on my hand in person and it didn’t look huge like this one and my ring size is 5. Maybe just a difference in the shape of the emerald? The one I would buy is more rectangular!

 

[Mreader]

Can you tell us the mm n/s and e/w of the one you looked at? Again I can’t see the report. The link didn’t work. In case anyone wants to search for more comps

 

[pudgethefish]

12 ct is absolutely enormous for an emerald, this is how it looks on a size 8.5 finger, which is on the larger side. I'd be worried about the fragility of that ring too, because emeralds are delicate. Just my 2 cents, but I'd look for something smaller and better quality, but that's just me, someone (practical lol) who inherited a ton of cocktail jewelry for my family.

Vintage 12 Carat Colombian Emerald and Diamond Ring in Palladium

Top-quality natural Colombian Emerald set in vintage palladium ring. Center stone is mounted in an elaborate baguette and round cut diamond halo. This vintage ring is estimated to originate circa 1950. A true one-of-a-kind, handmade ring. This ring is for those with a refined and sophisticated...

www.assayjewelers.com

Can you tell us the mm n/s and e/w of the one you looked at? Again I can’t see the report. The link didn’t work. In case anyone wants to search for more comps

I just attached the pdf to this post, dunno if that worked …

 

[pudgethefish]

Can you tell us the mm n/s and e/w of the one you looked at? Again I can’t see the report. The link didn’t work. In case anyone wants to search for more comps

Trying to upload a pic too

 

[mellowyellowgirl]

Yes I agree, that looks like a superbowl ring I would get a very classic setting just two small side diamonds if I got it … I tried it on my hand in person and it didn’t look huge like this one and my ring size is 5. Maybe just a difference in the shape of the emerald? The one I would buy is more rectangular!

It will probably just be around this size according to the measurements.

 

[pudgethefish]

It will probably just be around this size according to the measurements.

Thank you, that is a helpful visualization! Is that your ring? Looks gorgeous

 

[SpinelsAndTourlamine]

I am going to agree with the above posters. With emeralds they have low specific gravity (2.6 vs 3.6 diamonds and 4.06 for sapphires) so a 2.9ct emerald is the size of a 4ct diamond. Based on your 30k budget you can buy a very rare 2ct or a stunning 4ct. While the large one you posted is nice for its size you could get an amazing eye clean vivid/intense/old mine colored Columbian stone maybe with some butterfly effect. Your talking a 1/100k emeralds at what is still considered a large size commercially. Also for emeralds the color is what makes an emerald an emerald. If you look at green sapphires, spinels, tsavorite, dementoids, diospides(sp?) they never come close to the perfect green of a Columbian emeralds.

Where as red spinels are a pretty good ruby copy cat. If anything they are less cloudy and more vibrant. But a perfect emerald has no comparable.

For oil, the Chinese seem to prefer minor oil or better. I also like this because I bet if you remove the oil they would still be amazing. I mentioned China because they are the biggest colored stone market and for the best price appreciation I buy what is considered popular in the USA and China. Generally Americans are more tolerant of heated sapphires and maybe Columbian Emeralds beyond F1. But none, insignificant and minor seem to be the unheated of emeralds. Especially cause you can remove the oil.

Also checkout @gemfactor_emeralds (IG). I am sure JR could match them on price cause seeing them in person is nice. Gemfactor, JR and George Smith alpinegreen.co @emeralds (IG) seems to be the biggest selection of high quality Columbian emeralds.