Which stone one should I chose? 1.45 vs 1.42 AGS GIA I want to buy today!

[Milo]

Please help, I am about to pull the trigger on this big purchase and I have to decide between 2 stones. I am looking for the better value and the nicer stone obviously. Can you please tell me which one you would chose and why. I appreciate your opinions or if you can suggest another that you have come across that would be better in the same price range. Would one be more beautiful over the other? Looking for Fire and Brilliance all over the place

Shape: Round
Carat Weight: 1.42ct
Color: H
Clarity: VS1
GIA Cut Grade: Excellent
AGS Light Performance: Ideal
Optical Symmetry: Superior
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Excellent
Fluorescence: None
Culet: None
Lab Report: GIA
Lab Report #: 1116121971
In House: Yes
Width: 7.19mm
Length: 7.22mm
Depth: 4.47mm
Table Percentage: 55.57%
Depth Percentage: 62.05%
Crown Ú: 34.58‹
Pavilion Ú: 40.78‹
$11, 678

Shape: Round
Carat Weight: 1.45
Color: G
Clarity: VS2
AGS Cut Grade: Ideal
AGS Light Performance: Ideal
Optical Symmetry: Superior
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Excellent
Fluorescence: Negligible
Culet: None
Lab Report: AGS
Lab Report #01040379510018
Width: 7.29
Length: 7.30mm
Depth: 4.45mm
Table Percentage: 55.1%
Depth Percentage: 60.9%
Crown Ú: 34.6‹
Pavilion Ú: 40.5‹
$11,045

 

[Lorelei]

From the info we have I prefer the first but they could both be excellent, do you have images for each please?

 

[stone-cold11]

Numbers look promising.

IS and hearts images?

 

[Dreamer_D]

The info the previous requested will help.

I suspect though that both diamonds will look equally smashing in person. I would prefer the G for the color and the lower price, if the cut checks out to your satisfaction.

 

[Milo]

Hi again,

I am desperate for help.

It looks like I need more info before buying but I am really wondering if I should believe what certain vendors tell me and I hope that someone can comment to make me feel better about this process. Here is my issue as well as the sarin and idealscopes of the 1st diamond that we are considering up for comments as I cannot get my hands on the 2nd diamond''s reports nomatter how hard I try.

We are leaning towards the second diamond but it is in a virtual diamond inventory- there are 5 pricescope vendors that are offering me this stone with pricing for the exact same stone varying over $1000 from cheapest to most expensive. The most expensive vendor which is $1000 over the others promises an upgrade policy, and inspection, idealscope and sarin before they send it but only once I commit to buy from them and have the stone sent to them. I feel that they are responsive and have all kinds of services but is this worth $1000 to anyone on the forum? I didn''t think diamonds depreciated that much anyway so are vendors really out anything by offering upgrades etc (I am a rookie so really I have no idea)....Also, I can''t seem to get even an idealscope image of the first diamond before I commit to this vendor. Is this the norm for an AGS ideal stone? Based on what I have read, these images are pretty readily available right? My issue is that if I commit, get it sent and the images for some reason don''t work out, I am responsible to have the diamond shipped back to the company that has it and have to start over. If it wasn''t for their great customer service and so on I would stop looking at the most expensive vendor and move on to one of the others who are offering it for much less... It boils down to the fact that I would be more than comfortable bringing it in with an idealscope image or something- my main concern is that the pavillion may be off at 40.5 and that even though it is a 0.4 on the HCA, it may be off a bit but on the other hand it may be absolutely stunning and perfect. I don''t like to gamble and would like reassurance from the vendor. I even asked the vendor to call the people that have the diamond in hand to discuss my concerns and apparently this cannot be done.... I am struggling with this because it is an AGS0 stone and it would seem logical to me that people can access such reports and information before shipping diamonds here and there around the world and returning them- the reports would seem like a time saver to me but I am no diamond expert by any means. Anyway, here is the link to the 1st diamond which has every bit of info that I can dream of available to me - like I said, we are leaning towards the 2nd with no info available to me but any comments would be appreciated. I am equally concerned since the one below is being branded as H & A and I feel that the other should measure up to this as it is in the same price range... yet no comments on whether there are hearts arrows etc. Also, should the services that a company provides cost the buyer an extra $1000? Sorry, I am so ready to buy already but I am so bloody confused....

Link to diamond #1

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond.php?d=8832&shape=1&ctMin=1.42&ctMax=1.42&clarity=24&color=16&resultsColumns=268435471&singleResult=1

 

[stone-cold11]

The price difference includes in addition to the spces difference, the branded H&A cut of GOG and policies difference that you noted.

Sure diamonds do not depreciate that much to the vendor, but try selling a stone to any store and most would only give you 30-50% because of the opportunity cost to the vendor in terms of cash flow.

The virtual stone might not have the H&A patterning of the GOG stone as it is not advertise as one.

 

[mickeyva]

I just did a report verification on the AGS website using the report number you posted for diamond number 2. The report lists the polish and symmetry as being ideal not excellent so a step up.

AGS Report Verification

 

[Milo]

Thank you- sorry about that. Just to clarify, for the good old gold ring- the info is all there... they are fabulous with making you understand what you are getting by providing reports, images, I haven''t had to ask them questions because everything is there and available etc. Just to clarify that the $1000 price difference that I mentioned is for the non-good old gold stone in of itself, stone #2. Basically stone #2 in original post is a "virtual diamond" and I can get for as low as $10,100 and as high as $11,100 depending on who I buy it from- the highest priced vendor includes the bells and whistles of upgrades etc that I am considering but I am trying to assign a value to those things.... not sure that they are worth $1000 difference in price for stone #2. I am always a sucker for a good deal and this is an apples to apples comparison because it is the same exact stone that various vendors are selling- the only difference is the service- the one vendor with the extra costly services includes a pre-inspection where the stone is shipped to them where they run various reports on it before I have it shipped to me. If I don''t like the reports, I am responsible for shipping it back $300 basically. I would feel better knowing that it is good ahead of time by means of reports being made available to me so that I know what I am getting- the last thing that I want to do is have to send it back and start from scratch and be out the $300 for nothing. If I could get my hands on an idealscope of that diamond, my decision would be made and I was hoping that someone would know if I can do this somehow for an AGS stone.

Are others keen on these pre-inspection, reporting and upgrading services being worth an additional expense of $1000 for the same stone. I get a return policy with all vendors but like I said, the hassle of returning is not something that I want to deal with. I''m sorry that I am all over the place, but I really have no idea how the diamond business works and thought that stones that are AGS certified might have idealscope images or additional reports on file somewhere ??

 

[Milo]

Just to clarify specs for stone #2 in response to previous posts and the AGS report

Shape: Round
Carat Weight: 1.45
Color: G
Clarity: VS2
AGS Cut Grade: Ideal
AGS Light Performance: Ideal
Polish: Ideal
Symmetry: Ideal
Fluorescence: Negligible
Culet: None
Lab Report: AGS
Lab Report #01040379510018
Width: 7.29
Length: 7.30mm
Depth: 4.45mm
Table Percentage: 55.1%
Depth Percentage: 60.9%
Crown Ú: 34.6‹
Pavilion Ú: 40.5‹
$11,045

 

[hmr_mama]

I would buy the first one....because I thought about buying it myself before I decided I wanted Whiteflash to make my setting (so I purchased a WF stone--to save some hassle). I think it is especially nice to be able to see the actual photo of the diamond when you are buying on-line. I bet if you asked--the vendor would make you up a video of the stone--maybe even put it next to a G colored diamond with the same cut quality. Is that why you''re leaning toward the 2nd--color?

 

[Milo]

Yes, I am leaning towards #2 because:


1 the better G vs H color
2 It is slightly wider in diameter- slightly larger carat (7.19 vs 7.29)
3 rating 0.4 on HCA
4 it is slightly less expensive (if I purchase it from one of the companies that doesn''t include the upgrade service it is also quite a bit less expensive $10,100 vs. $11,67 savings of $1,578
5 it is also an AGS rated 000 which based on what I read is sometimes better than GIA stones

Unkowns that are potential negatives
1-Does #2 it have a H & A pattern like #1 clearly does (I am not hung up on having a perfect pattern but want spectacular fire and brilliance)
2- Does #2 have light return issues with 40.5 pavillion angle (but AGS ideal light performance rating giving me confidence with this aspect although I''m not sure that it should...?)

It seems like a better value I guess for these reasons... One cheaper vendor who does not offer upgrades has offered to list it on consignment in the virtual diamond inventory in the future if I ever want to trade it in which they told me I would get what I paid for it towards a new stone- but of course I have no idea what that means and if it is true or just a sales pitch.

I have only been reading for days on pricescope so other than Pricescope 101, I have no idea about diamonds which is why your help is so valuable to me! Thanks for any comments (good or bad) on my rationalization.

 

[RaiKai]

Respecting your questions about upgrades and whether vendors are "out anything" by offering them. The upgrade option is good, if you are the kind of person open to upgrades.

You will never sell your diamond second-hand for as much as you paid for it (well never say never...but it is incredibly unlikely). Even on consignment, I would be surprised if you recovered what you paid for. If people got what they paid for their diamonds back, people would not be selling them to pawn shops...that is for sure!

Diamonds should not be considered an "investment" unless you have a very rare stone. Diamonds themselves are really not that rare (though of course good quality diamonds are less common at larger sizes), there are many of them on the market, and the prices ARE marked up considerably (this is why you will see diamonds priced considerably higher in a maul jeweler than online (and online usually have a much better stone!) - it is not like there is a "standard" by which everyone follows as they have their own overheads, or marketing, etc) so that a 1-ct stone is always going to cost X-dollars.

So, I am not sure I would say they "depreciate" as it is not like the value in itself is more new versus used (unless there have been damages to it), but the mark up price of a new diamond is considerably more than a used diamond. If you are going to sell it for what (or close) to what you paid for it, people are going to just buy new. There is not a lot of benefit in buying used, except if it is a vintage stone that appeals to a certain market, or if someone wants to save money over buying a stone with similar specs new.

So, without an upgrade policy....you really aren't going to ever get the value of your diamond back, or even much close to it, unless you are very lucky. The jeweler who offered to list it in the future can't guarantee you someone will buy or pay what it is listed for your stone. An upgrade policy at least accepts the price of your stone towards a new stone (and depending on the vendor, you may not have to upgrade THAT significantly for the policy to kick in). And sure the vendor is "out" what you might have paid to buy a brand new stone without crediting your previous stone, but what they get is a returning customer, and the option to sell your previous stone again.

So in short...if you see yourself upgrading in the future, or wanting a larger diamond, or etc....get the upgrade policy. To me, the $1,000 now (if it is in your budget) saves $1,000's down the road.

 

[NJDeac]

Date: 4/1/2010 10:44:22 AM
Author: Milo
Thank you- sorry about that. Just to clarify, for the good old gold ring- the info is all there... they are fabulous with making you understand what you are getting by providing reports, images, I haven''t had to ask them questions because everything is there and available etc. Just to clarify that the $1000 price difference that I mentioned is for the non-good old gold stone in of itself, stone #2. Basically stone #2 in original post is a ''virtual diamond'' and I can get for as low as $10,100 and as high as $11,100 depending on who I buy it from- the highest priced vendor includes the bells and whistles of upgrades etc that I am considering but I am trying to assign a value to those things.... not sure that they are worth $1000 difference in price for stone #2. I am always a sucker for a good deal and this is an apples to apples comparison because it is the same exact stone that various vendors are selling- the only difference is the service- the one vendor with the extra costly services includes a pre-inspection where the stone is shipped to them where they run various reports on it before I have it shipped to me. If I don''t like the reports, I am responsible for shipping it back $300 basically. I would feel better knowing that it is good ahead of time by means of reports being made available to me so that I know what I am getting- the last thing that I want to do is have to send it back and start from scratch and be out the $300 for nothing. If I could get my hands on an idealscope of that diamond, my decision would be made and I was hoping that someone would know if I can do this somehow for an AGS stone.


Are others keen on these pre-inspection, reporting and upgrading services being worth an additional expense of $1000 for the same stone. I get a return policy with all vendors but like I said, the hassle of returning is not something that I want to deal with. I''m sorry that I am all over the place, but I really have no idea how the diamond business works and thought that stones that are AGS certified might have idealscope images or additional reports on file somewhere ??

I''m pretty sure there''s no way to get an idealscope/H&A image of a diamond without getting a vendor to bring it in-house, with the associated fee if you toss it back into the pond. Alternately, you could purchase a scope and the diamond and then return the diamond if it''s not to your liking, but like you said, that''s also a hassle. It''s a simple question of risk vs. reward - do you like stone #2 better than stone #1 enough that you''re willing to risk $300 if the idealscope image comes back a dud? No one can make that determination but you.

The same personal preference applies to selecting a vendor for their upgrade policies - do you think you''re likely to take advantage of such a policy? My girlfriend and I discussed it and neither of us were too keen on ever trading up for sentimental reasons, so such a policy isn''t worth as much to me as it might be to someone who is planning to upgrade for a birthday or anniversary down the line. It''s just a question of whether you think you''re likely to use it. I just flat out asked my girlfriend if that was important to her and got a straight answer - if you''re trying to keep the purchase a secret this might be more difficult.

You should also consider that some vendors (such as goodoldgold, for example) offer buy-back policies for 70-75% of the purchase price of the stone. While no one hopes to ever have to use such a service, some people appreciate the peace of mind offered by knowing they can always liquidate their expensive luxury item if they come on hard times and get 2-3x what the pawn value would be. Worth paying a price premium? Maybe for some, not for others.

 

[Dreamer_D]

I am very cautious when I spend a lot of money, and I would not buy a diamond unless a trusted vendor had viewed it and I had seen photos and other images like IS. If I were spending 10k, then I would *definitely* want these things. If stone number two appeals to you, then I would go through a vendor who at least will call the stone in and assess it properly prior to sale. You perhaps can do without the upgrade policy etc. Yes, to me those services are worth $1000.

BUT you can also have the diamond sent to a PS independent appraiser who can give you the same information for more like $100. So if you wanted to go with the less expensive vendor then that is another option.

Who are the vendors? You do not need to be cloak and dagger

Knowing who we are talking about would affect my advice.

Finally, I have not heard of a vendor requiring you to commit to buying the diamond before they will call it in. Usually they will require you to pay the shipping both ways if you choose not to buy it, and perhaps an additional fee for their time, but requiring you to buy it before they call it is?? That is not appropriate.