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Where would you compromise?

PuppyLove

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 5, 2011
Messages
16
Me again. :roll: I don't think I'll be able to find an eye-clean, G colored, ideal cut, 1.5 ct round diamond for $15,000. In order to stay in my budget, where do you suggest I compromise? Drop to a VG cut? Drop to H color? Or go smaller? My budget would allow a 1.3 ideal cut stone in F/VS2. Is the upgrade in color/clarity going to make a difference in beauty? I had an E/VS2 diamond so I'm use to a very white diamond so I've really shied away from going below G.
 

cookies

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 5, 2010
Messages
706
If it were me, I would get a super fine sapphire or ruby instead. That doesn't help, does it? :tongue:

You said you want a really white diamond.. I heard that a well cut OEC/OMC diamond usually faces up pretty white even if it is in the I/J/K color range. Maybe you could consider that.
 

nfowife

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 15, 2011
Messages
544
Personally, I would go down to H in color. It really depends on how color sensitive you are. I had a 2 carat F color stone for my e-ring, and I lost it 3 years ago. I recently got my replacement e-ring and went down to an I color and I will tell you I cannot see any hint of tint face up. It is in a setting with G sidestones (they are .16 each) and a wedding band with .16 E-F stones and I cannot see any difference between them, honestly. And going down to an I allowed me to go up to 2.27 in size. If I look really closely, in certain lower light situations, from underneath, I can occasionally notice a slight tint- but it's not even yellow....it's more like a bit less "icy". It's hard to explain. And the appraiser said my I was more like a low I to him. I'm so surprised because before finding PS I would have thought an I color stone would be just plain yucky yellow and it isn't at all.
I would go down to H to get up to 1.5 in size, no question. Here are a few:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2270384.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2632197.htm
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1379629.asp?b=16&a=12&c=77&cid=131 will need to check if eye-clean but the inclusions look like they could be covered by prongs.

I would not compromise on cut as that is where you are getting the most sparkle, fire, brilliance...all the things that to me make a diamond a diamond.
 

maplefemme

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 12, 2011
Messages
874
Cookie|1311260912|2973759 said:
If it were me, I would get a super fine sapphire or ruby instead. That doesn't help, does it? :tongue:

You said you want a really white diamond.. I heard that a well cut OEC/OMC diamond usually faces up pretty white even if it is in the I/J/K color range. Maybe you could consider that.
OEC/OMCs can face up "whiter" than their given grade, but realistically an I/J/K is not going to face up like modern cut G, and definitely not to an E/F.
 

kenny

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
28,953
There is no wrong compromise.
It's all personal preference.

Myself, I'd get the smaller diamond.
 

crbl999

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 21, 2010
Messages
447
I wouldn't compromise on cut. I would go lower in color to H/I and keep clarity around VS2/SI1. That should get you to the 1.5 mark.
 

TristanC

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 6, 2011
Messages
995
PuppyLove|1311260498|2973754 said:
Me again. :roll: I don't think I'll be able to find an eye-clean, G colored, ideal cut, 1.5 ct round diamond for $15,000. In order to stay in my budget, where do you suggest I compromise? Drop to a VG cut? Drop to H color? Or go smaller? My budget would allow a 1.3 ideal cut stone in F/VS2. Is the upgrade in color/clarity going to make a difference in beauty? I had an E/VS2 diamond so I'm use to a very white diamond so I've really shied away from going below G.
Keep the cut at ideal - with your kind of budget its very sensible. Then look in person at a selection of G-I stones all in round brilliant cuts from a local jeweller who has GIA certs. see if you can tell the difference.

Eye clean is possible in SI1 and very doable in VS2 so long as the vendor is trustworthy.

Then with the ideal cut and a tolerable colour in hand just get as big a size as you can find from a good vendor with the caveat that you only want eyeclean stones.
 

OCgirl

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Apr 28, 2011
Messages
509
I would drop to an H. I like the one that MissSparkle listed.

If you are okay/into blue fluor, you can ask Brian about this one too.

1.51 I VS1 $14k http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/diamond-detail/?product_id=BLAGS-104052029012

Since it has strong blue fluor you can ask Brian if the H above faces up whiter or the I.

I have an E color stone. I also have a G and an H color stones. My mom has a J. Honestly they are all beautiful, just different. I personally prefer the G/H color stones because they are still "white" but not too icy cold. I don't think you'll be disappointed with a well cut G/H. It'll be so sparkly you won't be paying attention to the color :lol:
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
I dropped color to J to get the size I wanted.

Whether you want to comprimise on carat or color is up to you. The only thing I would say is do not compromise on cut. BUT perhaps look for a GIA Ex or AGS0 that is not an H&A to save money. WIll still be a gorgeous stone.
 

centralsquare

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
2,201
I agree with those that say try an H. You may want to look for an eye clean SI as well. Definitely don't reduce on cut!
 

Frenchcut

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 1, 2010
Messages
280
I would compromise on color (down to H) and clarity (but no lower than VS2). You'd better avoid compromising on cut, have smaller rock if needed.

Frenchcut

PS: some of you must know that I did compromise on the cut when I chose my e-ring, and I ended up with a diamond that gives me 100% satisfaction, but I consider myself very lucky and would not advise someone else to do it. Hope you understand ;-)
 

Stone-cold11

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 9, 2008
Messages
14,069
Cut, case by case. Which lab's VG grade? Some can still be good, depends on why it got the VG grade, but those will need time to search for.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Where would I compromise?

If you aren't planning to upgrade... I'd get a stone with Ideal light return, but one that is "near" hearts and arrows, and skip paying the premium for perfect hearts and arrows. I'd also consider H SI stones. And I would call Mark at Engagement Rings Direct or Perry Chen at Leon Mege or Yekutiel at ID Jewelry and ask them to help me with my request. Since these vendors don't have the same level of technical investment of each of their stones, their prices are sometimes less than the other vendors. It's worth a call.
 

mogster

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Messages
364
I'd keep the ideal cut but go down in size as the difference between a 1.50 carat and 1.30 carat round is ~0.25 mm.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Oh, I would totally go for florescence as well.
 

Liam-Spillane

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 17, 2011
Messages
21
I disagree with dropping the color down. I wouldn't go lower than a G in that size. Color is hard to see the subtle differences, but when you do it's easy and you'll always notice. I personally would drop the cut slightly out of ideal and the carat to 1.35-1.45.

Don't get a very good cut either, just get a slightly out of ideal. You will save about 5-7% on cut, and even more on going just below the 1.5 carat. The spread due to the angles below will make up for the slight drop in weight. You won't be able to tell the difference in bueauty unless you spend a lot of time comparing side by side with an ideal stone at just the right angle and lighting. A bonus is I think these types of stones look slightly better in diffused lighting than the true ideal ones.

table- 58-60
crown angle 32.5- 33.5
pavilion angle 40.9-41.1 (to compensate for the slightly lower crown angles)
depth- 59.3-61
crown hgt- 12.5-14
pavilon hgt- 43.5 (around)
no culet
med-med or thin-med (if possible)

I know this suggestion might be unpopular on this site, but go to a very big jewlery store that specializes in diamonds and compare for yourself.
 

LGK

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 27, 2007
Messages
2,975
Tristan had some great advice- we can all say what *we'd* do, but everyone's eye for color tolerance is different, and honestly, you just have no idea until you look in person*. Don't assume that just because you're used to an E that you can't wear an H or I just fine. A properly graded I is not remotely yellow- it's just not icy icy white. It's still absolutely a white stone though. If I were you, I would go to someplace like Jared that carries ideal cuts, and look at all the various color grades in several lighting situations. Then make your decision. Because, some people really *can* see the difference between, say, an E or an F even set- rarely, but some PSers swear they can!- and others are fine with much lower colors. Heck, I showed my mom a U/V top brown and she was like... "that's not white?" The average layperson typically spots a hint of color face up in a set diamond somewhere around J or K.

And if you want to pick a setting that hides the side view, so much the better, because that's where you'll spot the most tint- from the side, not face up.

Personally, I'd drop the color to J or K and SI clarity, and find the biggest stone possible :naughty: but that's not much help, huh? Heh. Seriously though, if I were you I'd go into top of the near colorless range (H/I) and try to find a stone with at least medium fluorescence.

*I would have always assumed I had a good eye for color, but in higher color diamonds (above H) I have a tough time spotting the differences. The color grades (above J) are very narrow and the difference between, like, G and H, is incredibly minor to my eye.
 

jstarfireb

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 24, 2007
Messages
6,232
I would absolutely drop the color...and that's exactly what I did, because my diamond is an I. I often advise people to consider SI1 clarity as well, but I personally prefer VS2 and above.

If you're set on G, I'd look at the 1.2-1.3ct range, but the one thing I would never compromise on is cut quality.
 

Liam-Spillane

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 17, 2011
Messages
21
I have nothing against I color diamonds. I would get them absolutely, but you said you had an E previously. You definately would be able to tell a difference between an I and an E. Not at first glance, but you will spend so much time looking at a stone like your considering. My car was only 17K! I can tell the the difference between and G and and E set in jewlery form the right angle in diffused lighting.

I have a G colored excellent cut .75 diamond and from the side there is a slight ting to it, more of a very very faint graphite color than yellow. D and E look like pure perfect ice.
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
Liam-Spillane|1311289396|2974133 said:
I disagree with dropping the color down. I wouldn't go lower than a G in that size. Color is hard to see the subtle differences, but when you do it's easy and you'll always notice. I personally would drop the cut slightly out of ideal and the carat to 1.35-1.45.

Don't get a very good cut either, just get a slightly out of ideal. You will save about 5-7% on cut, and even more on going just below the 1.5 carat. The spread due to the angles below will make up for the slight drop in weight. You won't be able to tell the difference in bueauty unless you spend a lot of time comparing side by side with an ideal stone at just the right angle and lighting. A bonus is I think these types of stones look slightly better in diffused lighting than the true ideal ones.

table- 58-60
crown angle 32.5- 33.5
pavilion angle 40.9-41.1 (to compensate for the slightly lower crown angles)
depth- 59.3-61
crown hgt- 12.5-14
pavilon hgt- 43.5 (around)
no culet
med-med or thin-med (if possible)

I know this suggestion might be unpopular on this site, but go to a very big jewlery store that specializes in diamonds and compare for yourself.
SL you have learned a lot since you first thread here on PS! Are you in the trade?
 

pregcurious

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
6,724
I would keep the ideal cut, and either compromise on color or size. You should do what you are most comfortable with.
 

dreamingoftacori

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 9, 2011
Messages
87
I would go with a smaller F, carat size isn't as important for me as color is when shopping. Also a 1.3 vs 1.5 is a nominal difference in size. Just like previous posters said, you will be looking at this engagement ring A LOT and from all angles so I wouldn't risk it especially since you are so used to a colorless stone.
 

Liam-Spillane

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 17, 2011
Messages
21
No not at all, but my uncle is. After getting into diamonds from picking one out, I went into his work and just looked at all different kind of RB diamonds for hours and hours. I compaired my stone to stones with all different aspects, from perfect ideal to fair, D to L, IF - I1.

What prompted this deep reseach and calling on my uncle:

Honestly, I really got scared because the stone I picked out was slightly outside of ideal cut. The more I researched the more scared I got about the stone I picked since eveything is all about perfect signature ideal now. After real life comparisons I've found slightly outside of ideal ranges can still be just as pretty. Infact my perfect stone would be an E color VS2 with the proportions I got (see my first post) with just a slightly larger crown angle and height. say around 33-33.5 degrees and 13-14%.

I know some people will only want perfection I understand that and don't think they are wrong for it. I just think everyone should see first hand a great looking stone outside of ideal proportions, before making up their minds a signature ideal type stone is the only option for true bueaty.

I don't expect everyone to agree with me, but I found going outside of the ideal range just slightly can be a great option. If you choose right you can increase the spread without hurting the visual performance and save $$$. I couldn't be happer with what I got for my budget. When I picked out the stone I just got lucky since I though all gia excellents were equal at that time. I didn't know the first thing about proportions. Only once I got it did I research properly.
 

marcy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 27, 2007
Messages
24,114
I would get an ideal cut diamond and either drop color or size.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
56,129
I think you may be unhappy with a color below G if you are used to E color. I have a GIA H color diamond and find it very white even though my original diamond was F color. But really, there isn't a lot of difference between G and H in GIA graded stones (but I have had AGS H stones that looked more tinted than my GIA ones). And I do think the cut makes a HUGE difference, so don't go below excellent cut!

I think the 1.5 G SI1 stone from Good Old Gold looks like a good buy (there is actually a 1.51 and a 1.53), or you can go to an H VS2. But I think you'd need to go below 1.5 cts. to get a G VS2 stone or better.
 
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