What is a good price for a ring like this?

[BenNYC]

I am looking for an engagement ring and wanted to get a ballpark figure. Assume I will be buying it in the diamond district in NYC. I am looking for a 1 carat ring with an ideal cut, SI1 or SI2, I or better color. I will also be having it set in a six prong platinum tiffany style setting. Also, is there anything I should look out of when I look at the settings? I have read all about the rocks, but usually settings are written about as an afterthought. Thanks.

Ben

 

[pqcollectibles]

It really depends on the quality of the make. Like the Cut of all diamonds is not created equal, the quality of all rings is not equal. You could spend anywhere from $100 or more in gold to $400 or in platinum. No accent diamonds. Just depends on the amount of metal and the quality of the workmanship.

 

[BenNYC]

Well I am looking for it in Platinum, just the simple tiffany six prong setting with nothing else. How much for the rock? Thanks for your answers.

 

[angela]

Whiteflash has a platinum 6 prong tiffany style for $350, and some great stones.
The PS Wire price would be a little less (around $100 less). Check these out: They are around $4k - $4400, and some are more, just depends exactly what you're looking for.

http://www.whiteflash.com/round_ideal_cut/Round-Ideal-Cut-cut-diamond-586241.htm

http://www.whiteflash.com/round_ideal_cut/Round-Ideal-Cut-cut-diamond-586230.htm

http://www.whiteflash.com/round_ideal_cut/Round-Ideal-Cut-cut-diamond-586219.htm

http://www.whiteflash.com/round_ideal_cut/Round-Ideal-Cut-cut-diamond-586231.htm

You can search under their expert selection to find stones that they recommend, and they give a lot of information! (Mine's in transit, will be picking up tomorrow - http://www.whiteflash.com/round_ideal_cut/Round-Ideal-Cut-cut-diamond-586226.htm). Hope this helps.

Good luck!

 

[BenNYC]

Thanks. From the sites mentioned I got some good ideas on price. I know it is all subjective and a matter of personal preference, but do you guys think that a one carat SI1-SI2 I(or slightly better) ideal cut is a good set of criteria for a ring since I am on a limited budget but want to get a great ring?

 

[angela]

I think so, and I'm mainly in the same boat. My BF set a budget, and I found the biggest, bestest stone I could that fit in that budget. It seems as if anywhere from .5 to 1.5 is very typical for an e-ring, so I would presume that around a carat is the average. (Correct me if I'm wrong). Of course, I wouldn't have minded getting a bigger stone, but I think that 1c is a very nice size, and the I color SI1 quality won't break the bank, but will still look great!

Obviously, this is just my opinion, but I think spending more on a ring if you just don't have it would be silly. Rings can always be upgraded at a later time if she feels that she wants to get something bigger. Also, staying within your budget means more $$ for the wedding, or a down payment for a house. It all depends what you've got and what you're comfortable spending. I know my BF could afford a bigger ring, but I'd rather we saved it for the wedding instead...

Or better yet, for the honeymoon!

 

[BenNYC]

Yea, thats pretty much how I am looking at it as well.

As far as getting the price down, is the price I am given (in the jewelery district) usually a set price or is it negotiable? I know each salesperson is different, but is it common for them to be able to come down on the price?

Thanks again.

 

[Nicrez]

Angela, you'd be surprised to know the "average" diamond size in the US is around .38 carats, and the average NYC diamond is 1.5cts. That of course is accounting for all the supermodels walking around with their 12ct stones!

1Ct is above the national average, and on PS, although no one has ever really quantified the sizes, I would say your average is good, probably because PS consumers are more descriminating with deals, and can make their money stretch into a bigger carat size, and perhaps the natures of the descriminating deal people here, also means they make more per capita than the national average?

 

[caratgirl]

----------------
On 2/25/2004 4:25:08 PM BenNYC wrote:

Yea, thats pretty much how I am looking at it as well.

As far as getting the price down, is the price I am given (in the jewelery district) usually a set price or is it negotiable? I know each salesperson is different, but is it common for them to be able to come down on the price?

Thanks again.----------------

Yes, it is very possible to get a lower price, even if it is only $100. Vendors in the Jewelry districts are used to the bargaining, so their first price is never really their last price.

 

[BenNYC]

Good to keep in mind. Thanks caratgirl.

 

[BenNYC]

OK, today I went and looked at some stones. Can I get some opinions on this one?

Dimensions: 6.33-6.40*3.96
1.00 carat
Depth 62.2%
Table 59.0%
Girdle Med-Thick F (what does the F mean?)
Polish Excellent
Symetry Good
Clarity SI2
Color I
Culet None
Flourescense None


What do you guys think? Is it a good stone? Is the girdle a potential problem? What do you think it should go for? (I was quoted a price but want to know what others think it should be.)

 

[BenNYC]

Oh and it is GIA certified

 

[valeria101]

You have mentioned "ideal cut" in your previous posts... there is no way to know from the available info wether this diamond comes anywhere close... Does this matter?

 

[BenNYC]

Right. I only jotted down the GIA stats and not crown and pavilion angles. Is there no way to figure them from the other info? What do you think otherwise?

 

[Mara]

Actually Val...this stone is quite obviously nowhere near ideal from this information...




The diameter of the stone gives it away if nothing else does. The diameter of a well-cut 1c stone should be 6.5mm. This stone has a diameter average of 6.37. This means that this stone actually FACE UP looks like more like a .95c stone. So you are paying for a 1c stone but getting one that will look smaller.




Definitely not ideal if that is what you are focusing on. Also 4mm is the targeted depth (or close to) for 1c as well.




Secondly, the girdle as 'thick' is acceptable but I would target more like 'thin-slightly thick' or similar. Thin-med. The depth over 62% is not what I would consider ideal, though you can still have a nice looking stone if that was all that was wrong...




The last thing I really do not like on this stone is that Symmetry is only GOOD. I would not buy a stone like that. I would be sure that both Polish and Symmetry were at least VG VG if not EX EX or ID ID.




So the combo of the depth, the symmetry, the okay girdle, and huge diameter problem, this stone would be a big fat NO from me. Keep looking!

 

[valeria101]

----------------
On 2/26/2004 5:38:54 PM BenNYC wrote:

Right. I only jotted down the GIA stats and not crown and pavilion angles. Is there no way to figure them from the other info? What do you think otherwise?----------------

No, those extra numbers cannot be deduced from the cert. I see no serious reason not to obtain full details on a round diamond. After all, this shape is supposed to deliver best light return. Not sure why one would buy rubies that are not red and white, round diamonds that do not sparkle.

Aside from this clearly personal judgement, nothing blatantly wrong with the respective data points: except that they are inconclusive.

BTW: the "F" could be from "faceted" - a normal attribute.

 

[phoenixgirl]

Similar stones are going for about $3100, give or take a couple hundred, on Price Scope right now.

Examples:

Diamond #1

Diamond #2

No, this stone is carrying too much weight in the girdle to be ideal. It will look smaller than a well cut one carat, which should have a diameter around 6.5mm.

If you were quoted more than about $3500, I would say someone is trying to take you to the cleaners.

For that $, you can get a nice stone like this:
1.01 J SI1 0.3 on the HCA

 

[BenNYC]

Thank you very much for the critique Mara. I am very dissapointed in the jeweler who I was personally refered to and who I told that I wanted an ideal cut. He did nothing to point out this was not. There is another jeweler who was reccomended to me who I am dealing with who seems much more trustworthy. He is showing me some stones early next week and I cant wait to see what he has.

As far as getting the other angles, how do I get those? They arent on the GIA certificate, are they?

 

[Mara]

An 'ideal' cut is a broad term...one person's ideal may not be another. That is why it pays to have some rules in your mind (e.g. if you want the 1c...make sure its around 6.5mm) while you are shopping. Check out the Pscope tutorial...but here are a few things that you may want to keep close while you look at stones.




Table: 54-59 is generally an acceptable range though some may give tighter range like 55-58.


Depth: 60-62 ..I would not go over 62 though there have been some nice stones slightly over


Girdle: Try to focus on thin-med or thin-slightly thick or med-slightly thick. Anything like 'extremely thin' or 'thick' are too extreme.


Diameter...note the 6.5mm rule. Something like 6.48 would be fine..but the 6.37 on this one is blatant.


Polish & Symm...stick with VG VG or try to find EX EX or ID ID if you can. If you have to settle for VG / G..I'd rather have G polish than G symm IMO.




Tell your jeweler that you want a Sarin report on the stones you choose...that will give you the crown and pavilion angles, they will not be on a GIA report. Good luck! Let us know what you find.

 

[BenNYC]

I was quoted 3,150 and this BS artist claimed he was giving me that discount because he was treating me "like family," and hardly making any profit. I didnt buy that crap for a second and it sent up immediate warning flags. So much for his getting my business.

 

[pqcollectibles]

Now you can shop from among some really well cut diamonds, with all the info up front, make an informed buying decision, and get a diamond that is reasonably priced!!

 

[caratgirl]

----------------
On 2/26/2004 6:16:51 PM BenNYC wrote:

I was quoted 3,150 and this BS artist claimed he was giving me that discount because he was treating me 'like family,' and hardly making any profit. I didnt buy that crap for a second and it sent up immediate warning flags. So much for his getting my business.

----------------

Well...that may be a bit harsh. The stone is priced fairly for what it is, and he may be giving you a very good price, depending on what he paid for the stone. It is a bit deeper than a really great cut, but the pricing reflects that, in my opinion. If you want a really nice cut, you will just have to look a bit more, but also be prepared to pay a bit more.

 

[BenNYC]

----------------
On 2/26/2004 9:27:31 PM caratgirl wrote:

----------------
On 2/26/2004 6:16:51 PM BenNYC wrote:

I was quoted 3,150 and this BS artist claimed he was giving me that discount because he was treating me 'like family,' and hardly making any profit. I didnt buy that crap for a second and it sent up immediate warning flags. So much for his getting my business.

----------------

Well...that may be a bit harsh. The stone is priced fairly for what it is, and he may be giving you a very good price, depending on what he paid for the stone. It is a bit deeper than a really great cut, but the pricing reflects that, in my opinion. If you want a really nice cut, you will just have to look a bit more, but also be prepared to pay a bit more.

----------------

Ok, maybe it is harsh but he gave me the "what can I do to convince you to buy it today" line which was what really put me off. In all fairness I dont think he was trying to rip me off, just to make a quick sale. Since this is something I am trying to do once in my life and be happy with the purchase, I take it a bit more seriously than that and will spend my money with someone who respects my situation.

 

[caratgirl]

----------------
On 2/26/2004 10:27:32 PM BenNYC wrote:

----------------
On 2/26/2004 9:27:31 PM caratgirl wrote:

----------------
On 2/26/2004 6:16:51 PM BenNYC wrote:

I was quoted 3,150 and this BS artist claimed he was giving me that discount because he was treating me 'like family,' and hardly making any profit. I didnt buy that crap for a second and it sent up immediate warning flags. So much for his getting my business.

----------------

Well...that may be a bit harsh. The stone is priced fairly for what it is, and he may be giving you a very good price, depending on what he paid for the stone. It is a bit deeper than a really great cut, but the pricing reflects that, in my opinion. If you want a really nice cut, you will just have to look a bit more, but also be prepared to pay a bit more.

----------------

Ok, maybe it is harsh but he gave me the 'what can I do to convince you to buy it today' line which was what really put me off. In all fairness I dont think he was trying to rip me off, just to make a quick sale. Since this is something I am trying to do once in my life and be happy with the purchase, I take it a bit more seriously than that and will spend my money with someone who respects my situation.----------------

Well, with that new information, I do agree that he was doing the 'hard sell' routine. That would not make me too comfortable either in your position. Good luck with the other vendor.

 

[BenNYC]

----------------
On 2/26/2004 6:16:04 PM Mara wrote:


An 'ideal' cut is a broad term...one person's ideal may not be another. That is why it pays to have some rules in your mind (e.g. if you want the 1c...make sure its around 6.5mm) while you are shopping. Check out the Pscope tutorial...but here are a few things that you may want to keep close while you look at stones.


Table: 54-59 is generally an acceptable range though some may give tighter range like 55-58.

Depth: 60-62 ..I would not go over 62 though there have been some nice stones slightly over

Girdle: Try to focus on thin-med or thin-slightly thick or med-slightly thick. Anything like 'extremely thin' or 'thick' are too extreme.

Diameter...note the 6.5mm rule. Something like 6.48 would be fine..but the 6.37 on this one is blatant.

Polish & Symm...stick with VG VG or try to find EX EX or ID ID if you can. If you have to settle for VG / G..I'd rather have G polish than G symm IMO.


Tell your jeweler that you want a Sarin report on the stones you choose...that will give you the crown and pavilion angles, they will not be on a GIA report. Good luck! Let us know what you find.
----------------

Thank you very much for those guidelines. I will print it out and take it with me.

So will I be expected to pay for the Sarin report or would he already have it?

 

[Mara]

Some jewelers will already have Sarins on some stones. If you are having a jeweler call in stones for you, tell him you want a Sarin now...while he is calling them in. I did this with our jeweler and he got me Sarins on the stones he had called in. I think his wholesaler had the machine. Anyway, you should not have to pay for the Sarin...but if someone dared to charge you, it should be like $5 or $10 maybe. However, honestly if someone tried to charge you for the Sarin and you are spending $4k with them..run!

 

[BenNYC]

Again, thanks for the great advice. Since I am meeting with them either Monday or Tuesday I will call tommorow and ask for the Sarin reports. At the moment I have become a bit obsessed with getting the right rock and cant get it out of my head. I suppose that is better than just going and buying the first glittery one I see!

 

[chris-uk04]

----------------
On 2/25/2004 4:01:20 PM angela wrote:

I It seems as if anywhere from .5 to 1.5 is very typical for an e-ring, so I would presume that around a carat is the average. (Correct me if I'm wrong). !----------------

Actually the average e-ring size is about 0.7 carats. The average diamond sold (including earings etc) is 0.38 carats. 1 carat is not the average, but the mark for which girlfriends to expect and boyfriends to shell out for (set by DeBeers). So if you do have a 1 carat, you are probably within the top 1/3 of sizes and you should be very happy.

 

[angela]

----------------
Actually the average e-ring size is about 0.7 carats. The average diamond sold (including earings etc) is 0.38 carats. 1 carat is not the average, but the mark for which girlfriends to expect and boyfriends to shell out for (set by DeBeers). So if you do have a 1 carat, you are probably within the top 1/3 of sizes and you should be very happy. ----------------

I think it has to do with social circles as well - most of the people I know have anywhere from .5 to 3 carats, most of them around 1-1.5. I think around 1c/6.5mm is a great size. Not too big, but just big enough (depending on hand size as well). I know lots of people who would prefer larger though...

Thanks to this site, and all of the research done, we were lucky enough to get 1ct for the price we could have paid for a smaller stone in many stores. Hurrah for PS!

Mara has a lot of great advice! Get as much info as you can before purchasing, and if someone is going to try to charge you for a Sarin report on that large of a purchase, then you can take your business elsewhere...

 

[Nicrez]

Angela, absolutely agree with you on social circles. That's what finally determines your average. But as Chris said, the national average on diamonds IS .38 or .7 for e-rings. National New York average is 1.5.




Here a link to a bridal article on the average ring:


http://www.2theadvocate.com/weddings/stories/roundring.shtml




two relevant quotes:

[FONT=Arial,]"An average engagement ring might cost around $2,000 to $3,000, he said. A wedding band might cost $50 to $750 and higher..."[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,][/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,]"...As far as the size of the diamond, “Most people try to get between half a carat and one carat,” said Elgin. “We sell a lot of 3/4 carat (diamonds).”[/FONT]

So one carat, although NICE, is NOT average. Most people spend 2-3K, and most people don't shop on PS for a good deal, so I am totally inclined to agree that citizen generall get .7ct e-rings, on the average.

By the way, lady at doctor's office came in with a 5 carat RB and 2ct rhomboidal sides. She was 110lb soaking wet and about 5' 1".../idealbb/images/smilies/eek.gif