WF Legato vs. 2nd Hand Ritani? I/J vs. K???

[jauhara]

WARNING THIS IS LONG: Feel free to scroll past the background to get to the meat

Well my previously posted "the one" from jeweler whose name I cannot say turned out to be the most poorly cut round "brilliant" anyone ever tried to pawn off on the naive. He had balked and balked at sending me the measurements on the stone. But I persisted and when he realized there was no way I''d buy it until I saw those numbers he finally relented. His .9 ct round had a diameter of about 5.5

but still I tried to give it its best shot and entered the numbers into HCA. HCA''s response was I kid you not: "there is no way such a poorly cut stone actually exists." LOL
Sucks to be told off by a computer.

Then there was a $2200 craigslist 1ct GIA stone which was beautiful according to HCA and everyone else. Unfortunately, who knows if the stone existed in reality. Seller stopped answering emails. I guess someone else is much luckier than I am. I think that''s when I must have fallen out of love with rounds. They kept breaking my heart.

So I decided to join the mainstream, but being my mother''s child I thought I''d hunt around for a deal in the form of someone else''s broken heart. Onward! This time to IdonowIdont . And that''s when I first saw the ritani 1.8 mm pave band with 1ct princess cut. Love. at. first. sight. And the rest went something like this:
Budget: $4000 check!
Setting: ritani platinum size 6 check!
Carat: .97 check!
Certification: EGL...uh oh
USA or Int?: Int. Crap.
color: F or do you mean H? Well that''s ok I guess.
clarity: Si2 DANGER DANGER DANGER

But. The seller bought this stone at Bridges in the setting. And my husband is able to meet the seller at the store and check it out. So I haven''t discounted it entirely. But it is now my backup ring

The meat:
But then I went to whiteflash and met the legato 2mm pave band. only $995 which means I can spend $3000 on the rock.
I talked to Sheerah on the phone and she took my indiscriminating gaudy taste

into account and recommended an x-factor princess K color 1.10 cts and Vs1 for $2700.

I was looking at 1.00-1.05cts in I and J in my budget and she''s gonna get back to me about those.

I have never seen a K and frankly I am a little concerned with words like "cream" and "warm" being used to describe it. I''m also concerned that the pave in the setting being about a G would really make the "warmth" of the K very obvious.

What do you guys think?

PS: There is no way I''m gonna be happy with a .5ct ACA princess, so don''t even suggest it!

 

[mrssalvo]

If all checks out with the Ritani and the color is acceptable I'd probably go with that. I'd probably have the ring independently appraised though to be sure you're getting what you are paying for. There are plenty of folks with EGL stones that are happy and you have the benefit of being able to see this ring in person. I have an SI2 cushion and can't see anything so it just depends on where and what type of inclusions the stone has. your eyes should trump the paper. But, the appraiser will make sure your eyes aren't playing tricks on you and you are getting a fair deal.

I personally would not go as low as a J or K in a princess. So if you go the WF route, I'd wait and save up a bit more so you get get a higher color stone. Just my .02

ETA: if you do end up liking and deciding on the Ritani, I'd offer less then the 4K asking price.

 

[LovelyHearts]

I agree that I wouldn''t go that low in color for a princess either, or for fancy shapes. I think the lowest I''d go would be I color. Unless you can look at the stone in person and judge for yourself if you are color sensitive.

It sounds like you really loved the Ritani, so if that checks out and the stone is a sparkler, eye-clean to your liking, etc., you should go with that. I also agree that I''d offer less than their asking price.

If the stone in the Ritani setting doesn''t check out to your liking, and you really want something around the 1 carat mark, you should probably save a little longer and get what you really want.

Good luck with your search.

 

[HVVS]

https://www.pricescope.com/forum/rockytalky/j-color-princess-cut-t81905.html
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/my-facets-shared-prong-eternity-band.81337/
] color princess in those two

J sides here, radiants: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/is-a-j-color-that-much-more-yellow-than-an-h-color-stone.69277/

This thread is K color in general.
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/k-color-stones-in-platinum-wg.43782/

J cushion here: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/k-color-cushion-opinions-please.89592/

warm colors but L and lower - couple of L color Asschers in there:
https://www.pricescope.com/forum/show-me-the-ring/warm-diamonds-l-and-lower-t123090-120.html

I couldn''t locate a K princess pic. Maybe there''s one in SMTR eye candy thread.

 

[jauhara]

Hi everyone, thanks for your replies. The thing is that no matter what I cannot see the stone until after I buy. And my husband can go and verify the authenticity of the stone and have it appraised, but I can't really rely on him to really judge a stone's value. The EGL makes me nervous because it is Si2 so its at the end of the scale basically, meaning I could easily expect it to be visibly included? Isn't that right? Also as you all said, its over priced and it seems like the seller may not be very negotiable. I mean that setting new is $2500 and an EGL stone with her specs could easily be in the 2000-2500 range...so its definately not the price you'd expect for a 2nd hand ring.

Why should I wait with whiteflashes upgrade policy, couldn't I trade the stone in at any time for an upgrade?

And not only that, my budget isn't based on means. My budget is based on how much money I am willing to wear on my hand. Originally, when I started all this I couldn't imagine wearing a ring over $3000. But then, the unfortunate effect of my "research" has been a slow expansion of that number. When I reached $4000, I really had to take myself in hand. Although, just today in the car I was thinking, oh why not $4500? Its only 500 more

But I live in a country where people are very poor. Its shameful for me to be thinking about spending any more. $4000 should be plenty. right?

 

[jauhara]

I tried to go see a K stone today at the local jewelry stores. Cartier almost laughed in my face

Azuelos had a J but in a YG setting so it was "biased." I thought the J was pretty though. It was a gorgeous stone. Can I really tell a K by a picture? I thought that was a no-no.

 

[tyty333]

Date: 3/3/2010 2:36:32 PM
Author: jauhara
Hi everyone, thanks for your replies. The thing is that no matter what I cannot see the stone until after I buy. And my husband can go and verify the authenticity of the stone and have it appraised, but I can''t really rely on him to really judge a stone''s value. The EGL makes me nervous because it is Si2 so its at the end of the scale basically, meaning I could easily expect it to be visibly included? Isn''t that right? Also as you all said, its over priced and it seems like the seller may not be very negotiable. I mean that setting new is $2500 and an EGL stone with her specs could easily be in the 2000-2500 range...so its definately not the price you''d expect for a 2nd hand ring.

Why should I wait with whiteflashes upgrade policy, couldn''t I trade the stone in at any time for an upgrade?

And not only that, my budget isn''t based on means. My budget is based on how much money I am willing to wear on my hand. Originally, when I started all this I couldn''t imagine wearing a ring over $3000. But then, the unfortunate effect of my ''research'' has been a slow expansion of that number. When I reached $4000, I really had to take myself in hand. Although, just today in the car I was thinking, oh why not $4500? Its only 500 more

But I live in a country where people are very poor. Its shameful for me to be thinking about spending any more. $4000 should be plenty. right?

Is the K an ACA or ES? Those are the ones that have the tradeup policy. Just make sure the K is an upgradable
stone before you buy it.

 

[mrssalvo]

jauhara- you are right that WF has an upgrade policy but do check and make sure the stone you want is eligible. If it is and f you are comfortable going with a lower color go for it.

since the second hand ritani isn't really that great a deal, why not call Pearlmans and see what they can do for you re: a princess diamond and the ritani new? they have the AGS0 princess stones which are amazing.

 

[jauhara]

The K whiteflash offered up is an "x factor" princess that she said would def be covered in their upgrade policy. Its an in house stone and they''ve given it 4 stars. Mebbe I should have mentioned that sooner?

Oh God, if I call pearlmans, I KNOW I am gonna spend 5k. I''ll be done for. I''ve already become so corrupt just lurking here at pricescope!

But really, I don''t think I like the ritani setting twice as much as the legato. I mean I do like it better, but not twice the price better you know what I mean? And actually, there are some aspects of the legato pave that I prefer, for instance the way seems more rounded. If you''re not familiar with the setting, you can see it here http://www.whiteflash.com/engagement-rings/metals/platinum/the-legato-diamond-engagement-ring-with-micro-pave_1071.htm

 

[mrssalvo]

Date: 3/3/2010 3:00:38 PM
Author: jauhara

Oh God, if I call pearlmans, I KNOW I am gonna spend 5k. I''ll be done for. I''ve already become so corrupt just lurking here at pricescope!


But really, I don''t think I like the ritani setting twice as much as the legato. I mean I do like it better, but not twice the price better you know what I mean? And actually, there are some aspects of the legato pave that I prefer, for instance the way seems more rounded. If you''re not familiar with the setting, you can see it here http://www.whiteflash.com/engagement-rings/metals/platinum/the-legato-diamond-engagement-ring-with-micro-pave_1071.htm

if you tell Bill your budget is 4K they will respect that and not push or trick you into spending 5K. also, the ritani is not double the price of the legato. the price on pearmans site is for platinum. call them for a quote on WG and tell them you are Pricescoper, they offer a discount and many times you can get an even better deal if you buy both stone and setting from the same place.

the legato is gorgeous, nothing wrong with going with that ring if you like it better and the X-factors are stunning diamonds.

 

[jauhara]

Mrssalvo Oh I definately, all things being equal, would pick the ritani. Solomon brothers has the 18k ritani for 1900. I doubt that pearlsmans would go lower than that, but I suppose it doesn''t hurt to ask. I don''t think pearlmans would trick me, its the devil inside ME that I''m worried about

. If I let myself, I''ll have a platinum setting and an 1.5 ct F ACA princess before this is done...

 

[jauhara]

And I should add, a platinum setting and 1.5 ACA princess that I can''t even wear because I''ll be so worried about losing it and have to keep it in a safe forever ...definately not a good idea. I can just see me changing diapers in my $10k ring. lol

 

[mrssalvo]

Date: 3/3/2010 3:24:28 PM
Author: jauhara
Mrssalvo Oh I definately, all things being equal, would pick the ritani. that, but I suppose it doesn''t hurt to ask.

then def. call and at least get a quote! then you will at least have accurate info to base your decision off of.

 

[jauhara]

I talked to Bill. What a genuinely nice person. I can see why you guys are always recommending him. It looks like to stay within budget with pearlmans I''ll have to settle for a .75 (( Boo to that. Guess what happened next?

 

[tyty333]

Date: 3/3/2010 4:22:51 PM
Author: jauhara
I talked to Bill. What a genuinely nice person. I can see why you guys are always recommending him. It looks like to stay within budget with pearlmans I''ll have to settle for a .75 (( Boo to that. Guess what happened next?

What? What?

 

[jauhara]

What happened next is me trying to figure out how I can get to the bank tomorrow to wire over an extra $1000 on top of my so-called budget. But Bill, bless him is holding me to my word. He says he might be able to find some 1ctish (.8? .9?) and get me in at 4k. But he does have this AGS0000 :::cue violin music::: that would only be a tiny bit more...

I emailed the owner of the 2nd hand ritani and offered her $3500 for it. But I doubt I will hear from her again. She seems pretty determined to sell it for 4k. And I don''t think she''s had it on the market long enough to realize that she probably won''t get that. There''s no nice way to tell someone they paid way too much for their ring and they can''t expect you to do the same. She paid almost 8g''s for it at Bailey''s (I saw the receipt). She''ll either find someone who doesn''t know better (heck, I was thiiiis close to clicking "buy it now") or else she''ll probably lower the price in a month or so. I have no way to know that for sure, I''m just guessing there.

I think this whole thing is finally coming to a close. I can feel it. If Bill finds a decent diamond for me, I am just done and done.

 

[Maisie]

How much of your budget are you allowing for the setting?

 

[jauhara]

The ritani 18k I have seen for 1900-2200 platinum for 2400-2600

The whiteflash setting is $995

I liked the idea of the setting being 25% of the budget. But I am ok with it being 40-50%. I would not want the setting to exceed 50% of the budget.

So I guess $2000 is really my max budget for a setting. The thing about whiteflash is you can''t buy their setting (at least not the one I want) without buying the stone as well. And IMO their stones are overpriced (at least at the listed price) and I am not talking about their ACA stones. I am talking about the "regular" stones that show up on pricescope from many vendors. Typically with WF you see the same stone for 10-15% more. Actually one I was looking at was listed for almost 20% more on whiteflash than it was on solomon bros. Which kind of takes away the benefit of having the less expensive setting KWIM?

Also, personally, I''d rather get a EGL F/G than a GIA J. And so whiteflash is extremely limiting. I''ve seen EGL 1ct G si2 princesses for $1800 on pricescope. Actually, there are about 15-20 EGL princesses for less than $2500. meanwhile anything near 1ct with whiteflash you are looking at $3k minimum (and that''s for an Si2 J) Unless, of course, I wanted to get a K

 

[mrssalvo]

i''m so glad you called and got to talk to Bill. fingers crossed he can find something that will fit into your budget and you won''t have to settle in anyway. please keep us posted!!

 

[cara]

Have you tried on the ritani/seen it in person? I loved Ritani endless love setting in pictures, but when I tried it on in person I didn't like it so much. That was with pave stones in the band, not sure which ones you are considering exactly but I think I would prefer the Legato. And I would def. prefer a WF stone to whatever is in the second-hand Ritani. No trade-up policy/cut guarantee there.

Not sure I'd go with a K in a princess. I'd probably compromise differently if you are sticking with your budget, move up to I-ish in color with a smaller size. But probably I would also top off the budget to get something nicer if it was within reason.

To me there is a huge advantage going with WF and their tradeup policy in case the color is not to your liking or later on you decide you are comfortable wearing $6k on your hand

and want that(!), and as well the cut quality on their in-house stones. But you don't seem sold on prioritizing cut-quality if you are considering all these EGL stones without ASETs, etc. And there is less advantage using WF with a called-in stone that do not qualify for tradeup, etc. But not *no advantage* as presumably WF would call it in and do their standard tests on it and give you their opinion. Also I don't have a preference for the Ritani setting, so these are factors for you to consider and weigh.

 

[jauhara]

Thanks Mrssalvo! PS: Your siggy is just the mantra I need to adopt. I am the perfect victim of the bad "good" deal. I blame my mom. We used to joke that she would buy a cow (as in one that says "moo") if she found one on sale. And then we''d have to have it in our living room and hear about what a good deal it was.

 

[AprilBaby]

I have never seen anyone say a bad word about Bill Pearlman. Hopefully he will come up with something to your liking!

 

[jauhara]

Cara I haven''t seen a ritani in person. But my best friend has a 1.8 mm pave cushion w/halo that she bought from a jeweler in the UK. Originally, I was all into getting a halo, so she told me to come over and took it out of her safe so I could try it on. I learned two things 1) a halo is not for me and 2) I loved the 1.8 mm band. On top of that I also tried on a princess which I had never considered before and realized that the was just the look I wanted. And then the very next day I saw the ritani princess for the first time. It seemed like providence. Also I have long tapered fingers so it seemed to suit me.

The thing is the only thing WF had in my budget of 3k (+1k for setting) anywhere near 1ct was the K for the upgrade policy. And I just can''t bring myself to do a K. So it seems like the WF upgrade wouldn''t apply to me. And if I can''t get 1ct from WF well then I am back to the drawing board. Because that is the one point I will not compromise. Esp not with a princess. I was willing to do a .8 in the RB...but I draw the line at 5.5 mm.

 

[jauhara]

No I''m definately not sold on cuts above all. In Morocco, jewelers don''t even mention cuts. I saw a loose J .62 IGI RB today at a jeweler here for $5000. Yes, $5000. I asked her if it was ideal cut and she had no idea what I was talking about. My friends all think there is no way I''m getting a 1ct in a setting for 4k. But they''ll believe it when they see it . Most of my friends don''t even know what color or clarity rating their diamonds have. All they know is they look pretty and what ct weight they have. And I''ve never seen a diamond in person that I didn''t like. Maybe if I saw two cuts side by side then I would "get it." But I really don''t have that ability. So I''m just going with what I think will make me happiest.

 

[Swirl]

Hey, I saw a real life K just the other day!

I''ve been shopping for a new ring for some months now and stopped by the Jewelry Store/Gun Shop to get my earrings cleaned and pick up a new holster.

While my earrings were cleaning I tried on solitaires. One I liked was a 1.03 VVS2 round AGS set in YG. I looked at the tag and said, "Is this right? The color is K? Good grief! I''ve never ever seen a K in real life for sale ANYWHERE?" But it was NICE! I was totally shocked! I carried it around in different lighting trying to get the full "effect" of "K". I wanted to not like it, but everywhere I went it still looked good! I still can''t get over it. I almost don''t trust myself shopping for diamonds now.

You know what they wanted for that 1.03 AGS VVS2 K- $6000. Yep- $6000. I about choked. I got a good price on a .38 though.

 

[jauhara]

LOL Swirl, I''ve never been gun shopping, but somehow I just KNOW that it must be a lot more straight forward than diamond shopping! $6000 for a K? Holy smokes! but you know I almost envy the person that buys that ring...oh to be so innocent.

Thanks for the info about the K. I have a hunch I willl end up with a J (probably something to do with a certain 1.04 AGS000 that may have been mentioned on the phone with Bill) but its nice to know that K could still be in the running.

 

[Dreamer_D]

I owned a J and then a K. I now own a G. The K was much to warm for me, and it did not *pop* the way that the higher colors do. If you are not a lover of warm diamonds, then the K will not be for you.

 

[jauhara]

Well, the seller of the 2nd hand Ritani accepted my offer of $3500. I''ll have trouble beating that with a stick. I''m gonna see what Bill comes up with for me today and then decide. WF seems to not be interested in selling me a $3000 diamond and unless I was a K. So it looks like I''m getting a ritani!!!

 

[HVVS]

http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=view-id-diamond-infinity&id=472 has a video of a K princess. Wrong video for the stone listed, but it''s a K princess.

 

[mrssalvo]

the one plus to buying the ring from Bill if you can get it to fall within budget is that you will get the Ritani Warranty and just having Bill in your corner if there are any future problems. Plus, you''d have the option to trade the stone if you ever wanted to whereas the 2nd hand deal you''ll have to recourse or trade-up etc. I''d still want it appraised to make sure you are getting exactly what you are paying for.