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Vintage cutting of modern gems?

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A

Ara Ann

Brilliant_Rock
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Jan 5, 2009
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Hello gem lovers...

I have a newbie-ish question(s) for all of you. I''m very ''green'' in the gem world, LOL and hoping for some advice!

I have a dilemma with my current champagne diamond and I''ve been trying to come up with some alternatives. I had posted a few weeks ago that my champagne diamond cracked, just under the surface, probably as a result of being set in the new LOGR halo/split shank setting (I am wearing it as an e-ring). The diamond had a slight feather inclusion and I think it cracked more when it was set.

Anyway....

The dilemma is that for one, in addition to being cracked, it is set BADLY, it''s crooked and sits too high in the halo. Two, if I choose to have it reset, it may crack through and I can''t afford the kind of diamond I''d like to get, to replace it with (an OEC, WARM toned diamond, it has to be at least 5.7 mm and there''s nothing I''ve found close to my price range in that size)...there is no insurance money to work with either.

My plan right now is to try to have the diamond reset (with another jeweler!), I''m wearing it as is, but I just HATE how it looks, ugh. And if it cracks through during the re-set, I''d like to have a back up plan, with a gem stone of some kind, to use as a place holder while I save up for an OEC diamond.

This leads me to my question (or two!). Are there any gem stones that would resemble a warm colored diamond and be durable enough for everyday wear...the second question is, if so, would any of the gem cutters you know of do an old style cut? Like an OEC cut? It would have to be pretty reasonable cost wise too.



Any suggestions???
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Thanks in advance!
 
Sorry to hear about your champagne diamond. Unfortunately, the only stone I think that comes closest to the sparkle and color of a champagne diamond is a honey colored zircon, but it's too soft for everyday wear. However, IMHO, of all the brown stones that exist, nothing really can compete with the sparkle and scintillation of a brown diamond. To get a brown stone and have it recut it probably not worth it because most brownish stones aren't particularly expensive, and the cost of recutting would probably be more expensive than the stone itself. You might as well buy a new champagne diamond.

This ebay seller is very reputable, and he sometimes has OEC cuts in warmer or champagne colored diamonds for very good prices. Fortunatley champagne diamonds are very affordable, unlike their white counterparts, so perhaps you can replace the diamond.

http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/mlopros_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZ

Another option is looking at some peachy malaya garnets. Barry Birgestock of acstones sometimes has these and he cuts with amazing chunky facets. He might have something peachy/orange, similar to a champagne diamond, which might look nice and be a bit better for more frequent wear than a zircon.
 
Thanks for the reply TL!
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Actually, I'd even go for a pale yellow stone, even a very pale pink, just something in the warm tones, not just the brown family. My diamond is a peachy/cider color, with pink tones...it's not a dark brown diamond if that makes sense.

Any idea about sapphires? I know sometimes white sapphires had been used for e-rings, are there warm toned sapphires? Could those be done in a chunky cut?

As far as getting another champagne diamond, I really want an OEC, which I am finding out is hard to find in the right size and with a warmer tone...it doesn't have to be champagne, just a lower color, but I really want an OEC!

Thanks for the tip about Barry, do you have a website link for him? I'd love to check out the garnets you mentioned!


Thanks again!
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BTW, thanks for the other link, but that is where I got my 'cracked' champagne diamond from!
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Date: 5/5/2009 7:25:01 PM
Author: Ara Ann
Thanks for the reply TL!
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Actually, I'd even go for a pale yellow stone, even a very pale pink, just something in the warm tones, not just the brown family. My diamond is a peachy/cider color, with pink tones...it's not a dark brown diamond if that makes sense.

Any idea about sapphires? I know sometimes white sapphires had been used for e-rings, are there warm toned sapphires? Could those be done in a chunky cut?

As far as getting another champagne diamond, I really want an OEC, which I am finding out is hard to find in the right size and with a warmer tone...it doesn't have to be champagne, just a lower color, but I really want an OEC!


Thanks again!
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There are several sellers of warm colored OEC's on ebay.
kingkongcrowder
mlopros
antiquefacets

are some that come to mind.

Sapphires are a whole ball of wax and I don't even want to go there - talking about them and all the non-disclosed treatments is just too tiring. Most colors not in the blue, pink or purple family are not that attractive either. I much rather have a malaya garnet in orange/peachy tones. The way Barry cuts them reminds me of an OEC champagne diamond. I have a pink/peach malaya from him in a rose gold setting, and it's got pink in it, and the peach colors you like. It's really beautiful. I also have a round cut from him that is TDF.

Diamondsbylauren also sometimes carries brown or champagne diamonds with chunky facets. He recently sold an antique cushion cut brown diamond that was very attractive and reasonably priced. I mention the ebay sellers beccause they often sell used diamonds, and those can be a great value.
 
Thanks for the ebay vendor names! I do search ebay often, both for vintage cuts and champagne diamonds, but haven''t found any OEC''s large enough...they all are just a TAD too small!
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Or not ''warm'' enough...there is one I''ve had my eye on for a while, but it''s out of my price range and too small...if it were bigger, I''d take a stab at it and make an offer...oh well.

I''ll check into the garnet idea and thanks for the heads up on sapphires too, like I said, I have no idea about gemstones, other than my birthstone and those of my DH and kids!!
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What size are you looking for?
 
The setting (same as your LOGR split shank) calls for a 6 mm, but I think I can get away with maybe 5.7 mm? The OEC''s I''ve seen are all 5.4 and smaller...
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You''re right, they are all small!! Wonder why that is. I scored a champagne diamond on ebay of 6mm for $250 (it was a modern cut), but I suspect that the vintage cuts are more in demand, and higher priced per carat. Because of that, you might not be able to find an OEC champagne diamond in your price range, but there are several modern cut diamonds on ebay for good prices in larger sizes. Check with some of those ebay sellers to see if they have stock that they didn''t list.
 
What about golden beryl? Is that a durable enough gem? This one is sold, but the color is pretty. Does beryl have any firey colors?

http://www.acstones.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=141&idproduct=2767


And I also liked this: Demantoid Garnet, any thoughts on that gem stone?

http://www.acstones.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=5&idproduct=2611

And I like this too!

Chrysoberyl

http://www.acstones.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=5&idproduct=1271
 
Beryl doesn't have a high RI, so no fire or dispersion like in a diamond. I don't recommend yellow or pale yellow stones based on what I think you want.

Demantoid is kind of soft.

If you want a nice yellow stone, I think mali garnets are a great value for their dispersive qualities. That might be a good one for you, and some have brown in them (which lowers their price).
 
Do you have any pics of your Malaya garnet ring? I'd love to see that!


And yep, I'll keep checking for diamonds, both champagne and warm colored OEC's...I'm just anxious to have this one reset, I hate how it looks as is and even more nervous that it will crack through. Just not a fun thing at all...
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And I LOVE the tone of this diamond, which is going to make it hard to find a replacement diamond...I don't like the darker brownish ones, or lifeless ones...this diamond is so pretty and has so much fire...it's going to be hard to find one similar, in a any price range I'm afraid...you know too, not all champagne diamonds are pretty.

Thanks for all of your help TL!
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Date: 5/5/2009 8:09:43 PM
Author: Ara Ann
Do you have any pics of your Malaya garnet ring? I'd love to see that!


And yep, I'll keep checking for diamonds, both champagne and warm colored OEC's...I'm just anxious to have this one reset, I hate how it looks as is and even more nervous that it will crack through. Just not a fun thing at all...
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And I LOVE the tone of this diamond, which is going to make it hard to find a replacement diamond...I don't like the darker brownish ones, or lifeless ones...this diamond is so pretty and has so much fire...it's going to be hard to find one similar, in a any price range I'm afraid...you know too, not all champagne diamonds are pretty.

Thanks for all of your help TL!
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You're welcome.

My malaya is on this page in my finger full of halo pictures (towards the top) and more pictures towards the bottom and the next page. It's from Barry Bridgestock and it's in an 18K rose gold LOGR halo with upgraded mellee. I also have my pink champagne diamond pictured on this page as well since you asked. If I were you, I would try to find a nice pink champagne diamond. They're really beautiful Good luck on your search, and I'm really sorry about your stone. That's just horrible.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/colored-stone-e-rings-eyecandy.29435/page-33
 
Thanks again TL, for your pics and the link to the other thread! That will give me a lot to look at!

in the meantime, I''ll keep the faith and post when I find something...still hopeful my diamond will make it through a reset intact, but it will need to be replaced at some point whenever it does fail.
 
Don''t go back to your same jeweler to do it. In fact there are some PS vendors I hear that are very good at resets. You might want to start a new thread to ask the question of who they would recommend for an online benchman.
 
Well, I am probably going to have it done locally, there is a (different) very reputable shop/B&M store close by...they specialize in ''difficult'' repairs, so I trust them to do it, if it can be done at all.
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We took it to them to ask about doing a reset and had them verify the hairline crack after the first botched job....they said they can do the reset, but the head jeweler said once there is a crack in it, it could go at any time....which is why I''m hesitant to take it in.


BTW, what about morganite? Is that very durable?
 
Morganite is a beryl, so it''s not suitable for everyday wear, and most morganites are pale and washed out, and have no dispersive quality. You can tell I''m not a big fan of most beryls (except deep green emeralds, but you''re not looking for those - LOL!).
 
I do appreciate your patience and input! I''m only going by colors I like, lol, so that won''t help me much!
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Thanks again TL!
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Date: 5/5/2009 9:16:08 PM
Author: tourmaline_lover
Morganite is a beryl, so it''s not suitable for everyday wear, and most morganites are pale and washed out, and have no dispersive quality. You can tell I''m not a big fan of most beryls (except deep green emeralds, but you''re not looking for those - LOL!).
Click to expand...
I''m with TL on this. Morganites are indeed very pale and just don''t sparkle much.
 
If you''d only be looking for a stone in the colors mentioned, that''s durable enough, topaz would be an option. It''s more durable than garnets and shows up in all shades of brown, as well as light yellow, but if you cut it in an OEC you won''t get much sparkle (especially compared to a diamond). Untreated yellow sapphires are mostly (in about 90% of the cases) pastel yellow, so you might look there, but be sure to deal with a reputable vendor who can guarantee that there''s been no berilium treatment or similar processes done, which you might not like. They''re not too expensive in small sizes, and are some of the sparkliest yellow stones out there (and among the most durable). A lighter shade of pink spinel could also be an option (it''s durable and sparkly). Pink sapphires are often highly treated, and if they''re not, they cost quite a bit.
 
I just wanted to chime in as I''ve noticed GOG has at the moment got a number of very attractive
oec''s and other old cuts, at what I think seem like very good prices.
Infact, I regularly trawl ebay for old cuts, and these prices at GOG are better than most of what I''ve been
seeing on ebay for awhile now..


for example, 0.55ct $500 - very pretty stone!


OEC

almost 0.6ct transitional for $600

trans

almost 0.7ct for $850..

trans2

anyways, you get the point - there are plenty more too.
If I were in the market atm, it would be a no-brainer for me..
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here''s the 0.56ct -
I realize they are not champagne diamonds, but I thought I''d put the option out there as
they are mighty nice looking old cuts (plus if you choose a K-L-M colour they are quite warm looking)
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whoops sorry here''s that photo..

trasn 0.56 GOG.jpg
 
AJ,
Those OECs are gorgeous and the prices are awesome too. Kudos to GOG and your good eye.
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Thanks for the additional gem advice and links too!

About topaz, that is actually my birthstone (gold toapz/citrine) and I have an EC citrine that I had been wearing as a temporary e-ring...so I''m looking for something a little different now...but I agree, it is a pretty color!


AJ, I have also been checking ''GOG'' regularly - these diamonds are pretty and reasonably priced, but again, only one is large enough for my setting, which takes a 6 mm, so the smallest I could go would be at least 5.7 mm...I will keep looking though!
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I am hoping to hit the jackpot one of these days! I know "my diamond" is out there somewhere, LOL, it may take a long time to find it.
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I don''t mind waiting a while to find the right one, which is why getting a temporary gem appeals to me...so I have something to wear while I''m waiting and saving for my diamond to show up!
 
I just wanted to say I''m so sorry about the crack in your stone. If you go thru with the reset I hope it goes well. And I hope you find a stone you love soon.
 
Thanks Stone Hunter! I''m sure I''ll be posting updates and asking for more advice along the way!
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I cracked my e-ring diamond too, it''s not a fun thing to deal with!

I had mine reset in a half bezel pendant so as not to break it in half.

I don''t know if I can say this here, but I think you can find CZ''s in old cut styles. If you just want something for now until you find the right diamond, that might be an option. I''d hate for you to have your diamond crack all the way!
 
Sad news about your diamond, I''m so sorry. Hopefully, soon you''ll be able to replace it with the stone of your dreams and the setting work will be top-notch. Meanwhile, you''ve had some great suggestions for substitute stones. I''d echo the advice to look at garnet, topaz, sapphire, and, I don''t think anyone has mentioned spinel. Also, don''t give-up, keep looking for diamond – you may just find one that fits the ring and your pocketbook! With just a bit more time (and saving?) a 5.7mmm stone with a little color is well within your reach...
 
Date: 5/6/2009 8:58:41 AM
Author: Chrono
AJ,

Those OECs are gorgeous and the prices are awesome too. Kudos to GOG and your good eye.
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Click to expand...

That''s what I thought C, I was very impressed!
 
Date: 5/6/2009 9:08:46 AM
Author: Ara Ann
Thanks for the additional gem advice and links too!

AJ, I have also been checking 'GOG' regularly - these diamonds are pretty and reasonably priced, but again, only one is large enough for my setting, which takes a 6 mm, so the smallest I could go would be at least 5.7 mm...I will keep looking though!
21.gif
I am hoping to hit the jackpot one of these days! I know 'my diamond' is out there somewhere, LOL, it may take a long time to find it.
20.gif
I don't mind waiting a while to find the right one, which is why getting a temporary gem appeals to me...so I have something to wear while I'm waiting and saving for my diamond to show up!
Click to expand...

You're welcome Ara, just thought I'd put the idea out there, also for anyone else researching that
comes across your thread
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btw, GOG hardly ever has *all* of their inventory posted online, so a quick email may be worth it -
Jon could potentially have something suitable in the store, or be able to source it
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They also appear to have a project in the works where they will be having new stones cut
with OEC - like patterns, but top light performance - kinda like an "ultimate oec"
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If it were me and I didn't care about whether the diamond was true antique, I would go that route for sure.
 
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