VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience :(((

[KatSkat]

I looked and looked for an asscher on various websites and decided to go with James Allen because of the great reviews it receives as well as the fact that one can look and choose using pictures of the actual diamond. I had a bad experience with my original engagement ring with Tiffany's (another long story), so I had hoped that with all the knowledge I learned from Pricescope and other reliable sources, picking my second engagement ring would work out fine this time. Prior to making my final choice for the center stone, I corresponded with a James Allen customer service rep about which of the 2 stones I reserved would be the best all around. Their gemologist was supposedly consulted and I received the following reply:

"The inspection concluded that diamond # 1 has nice light performance and appears beautifully white in color. As you would expect, it`s perfectly eye clean and faces up substantially larger. Appears the brightest and our gemologist favored its faceting pattern the most.
Diamond # 2 is also eye clean but appears smaller and has some "windowing" which negatively impacts the diamond`s light performance. This lackluster light performance didn`t impress the gemologist the way we would hope."

With this advice, I went ahead and purchased the first stone. While waiting for my ring to arrive, I read this thread [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/which-asschers-to-look-at-in-person.172768/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/which-asschers-to-look-at-in-person.172768/[/URL] and saw that another user had received this reply from James Allen:

"Asscher #1 (0.70crt K VS2) has nice light performance and faces the brightest of the group. As expected, it's perfectly eye clean, as are your other diamonds. It's square in shape and the gemologist favored its symmetry and overall cut. This diamond is our gemologist's favorite option and I recommend this diamond as your best and most beautiful diamond for purchase.
Asscher #3 (0.71crt K VVS2) is also a nice option, but while the difference is subtle, it isn't quite as bright as Asscher #1 (0.70crt K VS2). Its shoulders are wider and its shape is more octagonal. Asscher #2 (0.74crt K VVS2) has slightly weaker light performance due to some windowing."

I thought that was weird that James Allen's gemologists would have such similar replies about completely different sets of stones and wondered if perhaps they just say the same thing to all inquiries and that my stone wasn't even personally inspected or the best choice. I was really worried and anxious. My ring arrived about a week ago and I've been staring at it for the past week (like all new owners I suppose) and noticed that there is windowing in the stone that I purchased. I can clearly see my skin through the diamond from certain angles. This was not mentioned at all in the gemologist's report!!! Had I known that, I would have purchased a different stone. Now my other option isn't even available anymore. I just contacted customer service and no apologies, no nothing, just oh so you want a different stone? UGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!! I thought the stone was THE ONE, had great measurements, good color, cut, and price. Now I have to find a different stone and I can't find one that is comparable and the pickings are slim. Oh and the halo that surrounds the center stone isn't symmetrical and some corners are more rounded than others. Furthermore, even if I did find a replacement immediately, the creation of the new ring can't even be expedited so that I'll have my ring for my engagement party.

Sorry I've been verbose, but James Allen Schultz if you're out there, hope there's something that can be done to rectify the situation. I've been in touch with a rep who's looking for stones for me and nothing's really speaking to me. Can you acquire a comparable stone in terms of size, quality, and price to my original one? Or give me the closest quality/size stone for the price of my original stone? Or expedite the process! Something! I'm just so disappointed with the whole experience!

 

[Gypsy]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

I don't know if what you are seeing is bad. If I hold an unset asscher in my hand I'm sure through some of the facets I could see skin. It's a clear crystal, after all.

Maybe I'm not understanding what the issue is correctly? Can you explain it... in a short explanation?

 

[snoopkat]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

Have you tried looking at the diamond in a placeholder setting? It might close up that window you're seeing.

 

[justginger]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

I'm sorry you've had a disappointing experience. I personally don't think the set of gemologist responses to the two different comparisons is too similar - there are only so many things you can say about a diamond, you know? How it faces up, if it is eye clean, if the light performance is good. I don't think there is any chance that these are canned responses. I trust that there is a gemologist looking at the stones, but their impressions are limited to certain parameters and descriptions.

I know there are some step cut aficionados around here who could correct me quickly - but seeing your skin through an asscher at some angles is normal, to the best of my knowledge. Those are tilt windows, not actual windows. Windowing is assessed from directly face on. When you start to move the diamond around, step cuts are essentially a series of windows and mirrors. At some angles, you're going to get tilt windows with a step cut. It's the nature of the stone. The gemologist would not have been assessing that for you, as it is unpreventable with asschers - they would have only been inspecting for the distracting, light performance impacting head-on windowing. (Please correct me if I am mistaken, asscher lovers!)

How to resolve the situation? Well, there appears to be a limited number of stones at your price point, size point, and color/clarity preferences. Unfortunately that seems to be the case with fancy cuts - unlike RBCs, they aren't lying around in proverbial piles of every combination possible. You will either have to be patient to find a suitable replacement, or perhaps take James Allen up on their very generous 60 days money back guarantee and start shopping elsewhere. Have you looked for comparable stones on other PS vendors' websites? You may have a difficult time finding something exactly the same for that price - JA is notoriously good with their pricing.

I'm afraid it might have to come down to either a) growing to love the stone, b) getting a refund and purchasing elsewhere, perhaps with either lower grading, smaller size, or a bit of extra money kicked in, or c) being patient while a JA rep tries to source something suitable for you. I understand it's disappointing when things don't work out as you hope and expect. However, I am unsure what it is about this stone you don't love. If it's just the fact that there is a tilt window, you have chosen the wrong cut and will have to start looking at other cuts that do not have this characteristic. Otherwise, it doesn't really sound like there is anything "wrong" with your current stone. Are you disappointed in anything else about it?

 

[Karl_K]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

most asschers(maybe all) from certain angles will show a reflection of the skin on the opposite side of the diamond at some tilt angles.
It is drawing the light from the bottom of the diamond not the top.
When it is an issue is if it don't go bright with less or sometimes more tilt.
I was looking at one in person a while back, it was really nice and I could see the reflection at some angles.
In fact I would make it got from showing it to a bright flash and back and forth at will.
It is impossible from you description to tell if it is a problem or normal.
Can you post a link to the diamonds page on the JA website?

edit: my opinion is that it is closer to all than most because I have never seen nor designed one that doesn't at some point.

 

[Natylad]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

I'm sorry you've had a disappointing experience. I personally don't think the set of gemologist responses to the two different comparisons is too similar - there are only so many things you can say about a diamond, you know? How it faces up, if it is eye clean, if the light performance is good. I don't think there is any chance that these are canned responses. I trust that there is a gemologist looking at the stones, but their impressions are limited to certain parameters and descriptions.

I know there are some step cut aficionados around here who could correct me quickly - but seeing your skin through an asscher at some angles is normal, to the best of my knowledge. Those are tilt windows, not actual windows. Windowing is assessed from directly face on. When you start to move the diamond around, step cuts are essentially a series of windows and mirrors. At some angles, you're going to get tilt windows with a step cut. It's the nature of the stone. The gemologist would not have been assessing that for you, as it is unpreventable with asschers - they would have only been inspecting for the distracting, light performance impacting head-on windowing. (Please correct me if I am mistaken, asscher lovers!)

How to resolve the situation? Well, there appears to be a limited number of stones at your price point, size point, and color/clarity preferences. Unfortunately that seems to be the case with fancy cuts - unlike RBCs, they aren't lying around in proverbial piles of every combination possible. You will either have to be patient to find a suitable replacement, or perhaps take James Allen up on their very generous 60 days money back guarantee and start shopping elsewhere. Have you looked for comparable stones on other PS vendors' websites? You may have a difficult time finding something exactly the same for that price - JA is notoriously good with their pricing.

I'm afraid it might have to come down to either a) growing to love the stone, b) getting a refund and purchasing elsewhere, perhaps with either lower grading, smaller size, or a bit of extra money kicked in, or c) being patient while a JA rep tries to source something suitable for you. I understand it's disappointing when things don't work out as you hope and expect. However, I am unsure what it is about this stone you don't love. If it's just the fact that there is a tilt window, you have chosen the wrong cut and will have to start looking at other cuts that do not have this characteristic. Otherwise, it doesn't really sound like there is anything "wrong" with your current stone. Are you disappointed in anything else about it?

My thoughts exactly.

 

[Karl_K]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

Here is one of the virtual asschers I use for teaching showing the effect.

 

[KatSkat]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

I know that diamonds aren't supposed to be opaque, but looking at my ring from a 45 degree angle, I can see skin through the diamond from a large facet. That didn't seem normal to me and I asked my friend and that didn't seem normal to her either. Then I looked at the following thread http://betterthandiamond.com/discussion/ubbthreads.php/topics/569180/1 and the examples of windowing pictured were similar to what I was experiencing with my own stone. Did I just work myself into a tizzy? If so, I am embarassed. Carry on with your Friday night. I'm going to eat some ice cream.

 

[Karl_K]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

The above but at a 45 degree angle.

 

[justginger]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

Ice cream is ALWAYS a good idea.

Honestly - you don't know until you ask. Karl will be able to explain and illustrate far better than the rest of us, and the photos he has posted shows the tilt window very well. If you haven't seen many asschers in person, it is not unreasonable to not know.

Now you know. Does it bother you? If so, ship that baby back and start looking for another cut. If it bothers you now, it will bother you forever. If the face up appearance is lovely enough that you don't mind the tilt window, enjoy.

 

[KatSkat]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

My apologies to James Allen for being cray cray there. I'm tempted to just delete this thread so others browsing the topics won't think that JA has poor customer service and poor quality diamonds, but I'll serve as a cautionary tale for all those newbies who are confused like me.

Thanks for schooling me though, fellow users.

I do love my stone (and ring in general) from above and now that I know it's not defective, I will keep it.

Again everybody, oopsie

 

[Karl_K]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

Your welcome.
Glad we could help.
You could click the report concern button on your first post and ask the Mods to soften the title of the thread if you want.

 

[Christina...]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

I know that diamonds aren't supposed to be opaque, but looking at my ring from a 45 degree angle, I can see skin through the diamond from a large facet. That didn't seem normal to me and I asked my friend and that didn't seem normal to her either. Then I looked at the following thread http://betterthandiamond.com/discussion/ubbthreads.php/topics/569180/1 and the examples of windowing pictured were similar to what I was experiencing with my own stone. Did I just work myself into a tizzy? If so, I am embarassed. Carry on with your Friday night. I'm going to eat some ice cream.

I cant tell if your being sarcastic about your last statement or not. I can tell you as an asscher owner that my stone has tilt windows as well although I almost never notice because my hands and suspect yours as well are constantly in motion. I know that when you get your diamond its normal to obsessed over every facet and its a fanatstic way to get to know the personality of your new diamond but its also easy to become stuck on the little nuances of the cut. Asschers just don't perform the same as brilliant cuts, are you perhaps disappointed because you thought that it would?

I have purchased two diamonds from James Allen and though the prose is very similar sounding the substance of the evaluation reports were very different. They can only report about the color clarity light performance in so many words, the fact that they are similar sounding doesn't make the information they contain the same.

But the bigger issue here is whether or not you are happy with your diamond and setting and will be for a very long time. If the answer is no then you really need to take advantage of the return policy and start over. It will be very disappointing to not have your ring for your engagement party but even more so to be disappointed every time you look at your ring. If you decide to return your ring come back and let some of the fantastic people here help you make some choices. As you know asschers can NOT be purchased on depth and table ratios alone. Wish you the best.

 

[Christina...]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

Happy to hear it skatcat. Enjoy your ring and congratulation on your engagement.

 

[distracts]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

Well ditto what everyone else said, but also I'd like to say that though I know nothing of the training practices of James Allen, in past customer service positions I have been in, both in retail and in politics, we were always trained very carefully on what to say and how to say it, including usually booklets of the sorts of things the company/campaign/whatever would like us to say. So I suspect the similarity between James Allen replies to questions could be a result of training on company-approved ways to express things about the stones. But that doesn't mean they're not being honest. It may mean that they're picking from a list of acceptable ways to say what they think about the stone, though.

 

[Gypsy]

Re: VERY disappointing James Allen Asscher and experience

Glad it was resolved.


I would message the admins and ask them to change the title to "Is a tilt window normal in an asscher?" that way it's easily searchable and it takes away the hit on JA's name. Okay?

Now, the only thing that needs to be said is... maybe asscher's just aren't for you? Maybe you'd be better off with a brilliant cut diamond instead of a step cut?