verbal appraisal?

[san diego searcher]

I''m contemplating purchase of diamond earrings. I don''t plan to insure them so don''t feel a particular need for written appraisal. I contacted two local appriasers to ask about their fees. First one (which I''ve used before) does only written appraisals and charges $155. Second one will do written or will just give verbal opinion for $40. This seems like it would fit my needs more -- Just someone to tell me I got what I paid for in terms of my diamond purchase. Does this sound OK?

 

[san diego searcher]

If I buy stones that are not certified, I thought it might be a good idea to have someone take a look at them and just confirm that they are what they are supposed to be and the price is good. (esp if he only charges $40 to do this)
Most of the online sellers seem to offer certed stones but most of the local jewelers seem to suggest that for earrings, certed stones are not necessary.

 

[san diego searcher]

BTW, I talked to Jeff and I hope to get to see him tomorrow. Looking forward to it. Thanks for the advice.

 

[denverappraiser]

San Diego,

I think you are making a serious mistake. Especially for new purchase purposes, an appraisal that isn’t in writing isn’t worth the paper it’s not printed on.

You’re making what is, presumably, an important financial decision based on professional advice. A single grade variation on either color or clarity can boil down to hundreds or even thousands of dollars and the cut analysis is the difference between a fireball and a dud. Why would you make such a decision based on the opinion of the lowest cost provider who is willing to give you a quick and casual answer without consideration? If you trust your sellers grading and don’t need an appraisal don’t get one, but an off the cuff opinion is, in my opinion, a waste of money. Keep the $40.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Jewelry Appraisals in Denver

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 1/4/2008 6:27:16 PM
Author: denverappraiser
San Diego,


I think you are making a serious mistake. Especially for new purchase purposes, an appraisal that isn’t in writing isn’t worth the paper it’s not printed on.


You’re making what is, presumably, an important financial decision based on professional advice. A single grade variation on either color or clarity can boil down to hundreds or even thousands of dollars and the cut analysis is the difference between a fireball and a dud. Why would you make such a decision based on the opinion of the lowest cost provider who is willing to give you a quick and casual answer without consideration? If you trust your sellers grading and don’t need an appraisal don’t get one, but an off the cuff opinion is, in my opinion, a waste of money. Keep the $40.


Neil Beaty

GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA

Professional Jewelry Appraisals in Denver

Neil,

Not often that I disagree with you, but I am mildly doing so at this point.

I think our supplicant is buying a fairly inexpensive pair of earrings and wants to be sure that the vendor is telling at least close to the truth. She is wanting confirmation that not too much smoke or mirrors were used.

While the concept of what you are saying is certainly correct, I think it is more than is wanted for this particular job. I agree completely that she would be better off with a written appraisal, but if the earrings are inexpensive then she may not actually need a full appraisal. If the earrings are more than a few hundred dollars, then I swing right back into your court, as normal...

Wink

 

[san diego searcher]

Thank you for your responses. I''m probably going to spend over $2,000. The appraiser I called is one of two that were recommended on this site as reputable. He offered right up front that he did verbal appraisals. I didn''t even ask initially. Since I''m not intending to insure these earrings, I thought that would be a good way for me to just get an expert opinion.

The other question about this appraisal issue is regarding appraising them after they are set. He stated that he would have to determine size via measurements...wouldn''t be able to do by weight. I think for convenience whether I purchase locally or onlline, I''d rather have them set by the seller.

Seems like I have four options:
Buy certified stone and not get appraised
Buy non-certed stone from reputable dealer and trust that it is what he represents it to be
Buy non-certed stone and get appraised (either written or verbal)

This is a big enough purchase that I want to make sure I do it right...yet I am aware that what I''m shopping for is not the top range size or quality-wise. Any further advice would be appreciated.

 

[Lynn B]

I can see your position and understand your uncertainty. You''ve been given some good advice and valuable opinions.

Hmmmm... if it were me and I were going with one of our PS vendors, and I didn''t intend to insure the stones, I would probably be fine without any appraisal. One reason for going with uncerted stones (IMHO) is to keep costs low, right? So continue to keep them low by saving the $40 is my first thought. (Also remember that *most* uncerted stones don''t have an upgrade policy, if that concerns you!)

However, 2K is no small pocket change... and there is something to be said for peace of mind. I understand that a verbal appraisal of stones already set is somewhat limiting, but it could be just enough to give you confidence and peace of mind.

Buuuut, just one other random thought, though... there was a thread recently where a PSer took her stone to an appraiser and was somewhat disappointed in the appraiser''s opinions, even though they weren''t *bad* by any means, she was hoping for a more positive, affirming opinion. So if you have a vision of taking your new earrings in and getting a very warm and fuzzy, enthusiastic evaluation...well... consider that your appraiser may just not be that kind of a guy (or gal)!

 

[denverappraiser]

Date: 1/5/2008 9:00:32 AM
Author: Wink

Date: 1/4/2008 6:27:16 PM

Author: denverappraiser

San Diego,



I think you are making a serious mistake. Especially for new purchase purposes, an appraisal that isn’t in writing isn’t worth the paper it’s not printed on.



You’re making what is, presumably, an important financial decision based on professional advice. A single grade variation on either color or clarity can boil down to hundreds or even thousands of dollars and the cut analysis is the difference between a fireball and a dud. Why would you make such a decision based on the opinion of the lowest cost provider who is willing to give you a quick and casual answer without consideration? If you trust your sellers grading and don’t need an appraisal don’t get one, but an off the cuff opinion is, in my opinion, a waste of money. Keep the $40.



Neil Beaty


GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA


Professional Jewelry Appraisals in Denver

Neil,


Not often that I disagree with you, but I am mildly doing so at this point.


I think our supplicant is buying a fairly inexpensive pair of earrings and wants to be sure that the vendor is telling at least close to the truth. She is wanting confirmation that not too much smoke or mirrors were used.


While the concept of what you are saying is certainly correct, I think it is more than is wanted for this particular job. I agree completely that she would be better off with a written appraisal, but if the earrings are inexpensive then she may not actually need a full appraisal. If the earrings are more than a few hundred dollars, then I swing right back into your court, as normal...


Wink

Wink,

My problem with verbal appraisals is that there are so many ‘appraisers’ out there who simply don’t know what they’re doing. Presumably the purpose here is to get confirmation that what the jeweler is telling them is accurate, that nothing important has been omitted and that the price paid is appropriate for the marketplace involved. These are all valid questions.

There are plenty of situations where an appraisal isn’t needed and this may indeed be one of them but it will depend on what the jeweler told them and what they consider suspect. My problem is with the ‘fast’ appraisal as a means of saving time and consequently money. That can come awfully close to ‘half assed’ and that can often do more harm than good.

I have no idea who the appraiser here is and I don’t want to know. That would preclude me from participating in this conversation at all since I’m a competitor. Typing is easy and paper is cheap. There’s no significant time savings by avoiding the report. Any appraiser who is USPAP compliant (which includes all members of NAJA, ASA, ISA, AAA and most other professional appraisal organizations) has to keep a written record of all of their appraisals anyway. What’s saved is the appraiser putting their own reputation on the line to make a grading and valuation call. This happens when they put it in writing and sign it. The dealer has already done this by making the sale. A 2nd opinion that holds less credibility than the first is of little or no value in my opinion.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver

 

[surfgirl]

I have to say that to me, 2K isn''t chump change so I''d want to know what I was really buying. May I recommend my appraiser in SD, Thom Underwood? You can look up his contacts under the "Resources/Appraisers/San Diego" thread at the top of this page. He is an independent appraiser that I''ve used with confidence for many years and I highly recommend him for his conservative, uninflated appraisals.

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 1/5/2008 5:51:09 PM
Author: denverappraiser

Date: 1/5/2008 9:00:32 AM

Author: Wink

Date: 1/4/2008 6:27:16 PM


Author: denverappraiser


San Diego,




I think you are making a serious mistake. Especially for new purchase purposes, an appraisal that isn’t in writing isn’t worth the paper it’s not printed on.




You’re making what is, presumably, an important financial decision based on professional advice. A single grade variation on either color or clarity can boil down to hundreds or even thousands of dollars and the cut analysis is the difference between a fireball and a dud. Why would you make such a decision based on the opinion of the lowest cost provider who is willing to give you a quick and casual answer without consideration? If you trust your sellers grading and don’t need an appraisal don’t get one, but an off the cuff opinion is, in my opinion, a waste of money. Keep the $40.




Neil Beaty



GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA



Professional Jewelry Appraisals in Denver

Neil,



Not often that I disagree with you, but I am mildly doing so at this point.



I think our supplicant is buying a fairly inexpensive pair of earrings and wants to be sure that the vendor is telling at least close to the truth. She is wanting confirmation that not too much smoke or mirrors were used.



While the concept of what you are saying is certainly correct, I think it is more than is wanted for this particular job. I agree completely that she would be better off with a written appraisal, but if the earrings are inexpensive then she may not actually need a full appraisal. If the earrings are more than a few hundred dollars, then I swing right back into your court, as normal...



Wink

Wink,


My problem with verbal appraisals is that there are so many ‘appraisers’ out there who simply don’t know what they’re doing. Presumably the purpose here is to get confirmation that what the jeweler is telling them is accurate, that nothing important has been omitted and that the price paid is appropriate for the marketplace involved. These are all valid questions.


There are plenty of situations where an appraisal isn’t needed and this may indeed be one of them but it will depend on what the jeweler told them and what they consider suspect. My problem is with the ‘fast’ appraisal as a means of saving time and consequently money. That can come awfully close to ‘half assed’ and that can often do more harm than good.


I have no idea who the appraiser here is and I don’t want to know. That would preclude me from participating in this conversation at all since I’m a competitor. Typing is easy and paper is cheap. There’s no significant time savings by avoiding the report. Any appraiser who is USPAP compliant (which includes all members of NAJA, ASA, ISA, AAA and most other professional appraisal organizations) has to keep a written record of all of their appraisals anyway. What’s saved is the appraiser putting their own reputation on the line to make a grading and valuation call. This happens when they put it in writing and sign it. The dealer has already done this by making the sale. A 2nd opinion that holds less credibility than the first is of little or no value in my opinion.


Neil Beaty

GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA

Professional Appraisals in Denver

Well said my friend.

Back when I though our supplicant was talking about a few hundred dollars I was prepared to mildly disagree with you, but at 2k I am right back in your court, especially after your oh so eloquently put comments above.

Wink

 

[san diego searcher]

Date: 1/5/2008 9:32:23 PM
Author: SanDiegoLady
SDS, how did your meeting with Jeff go today?

Hi Michelle
Meeting went well. He was very nice just as you said. Spent quite a bit of time with me even though it was Saturday and several other people came in. IMHO his pricing was very fair in comparison to other local sellers though maybe a bit higher than Internet sellers. He''s going to see if he can find any other options for me to look at. I''m having trouble making a decision. He did suggest insurance and I''m going to look into it. If I decide to insure my jewelry, the written appraisal will obviously be the way to go.
He guessed right away that it was you that recommended him on Pricescope.
Thank you!

 

[san diego searcher]

Thank you all for your advice. I will give it serious consideration along with thinking about insurance for my jewelry.

 

[Kay]

Date: 1/5/2008 6:20:11 PM
Author: surfgirl
I have to say that to me, 2K isn''t chump change so I''d want to know what I was really buying. May I recommend my appraiser in SD, Thom Underwood? You can look up his contacts under the ''Resources/Appraisers/San Diego'' thread at the top of this page. He is an independent appraiser that I''ve used with confidence for many years and I highly recommend him for his conservative, uninflated appraisals.

I second that recommendation. I have used Thom Underwood 3 times and felt like he was thorough and honest. He gave 2 of my purchases very positive reviews, but let me know nicely that the third item was not the best quality. I haven''t been in a few years, but I think he used to charge somewhere between $75 and $85 for a written appraisal.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

If I were spending $2000, I honestly wouldn''t want the earring stones carried in most jewelers cases! Have you looked at the ready-set-go earrings from WhiteFlash? You save money because they don''t come with certs (I THINK), but they are ideal cut stones equivalent to their expert selection stones. At least it would put you in the category of well cut stone rather than overpaying for poorly cut ones. (And I would see no need to have another appraisal on these either.)

http://www.whiteflash.com/Fine-jewelry/Diamond_Studs/Three-Prong--Martini---READY-SET-TO-GO_950.htm

 

[san diego searcher]

Date: 1/6/2008 12:03:35 AM
Author: Kay

Date: 1/5/2008 6:20:11 PM
Author: surfgirl
I have to say that to me, 2K isn''t chump change so I''d want to know what I was really buying. May I recommend my appraiser in SD, Thom Underwood? You can look up his contacts under the ''Resources/Appraisers/San Diego'' thread at the top of this page. He is an independent appraiser that I''ve used with confidence for many years and I highly recommend him for his conservative, uninflated appraisals.

I second that recommendation. I have used Thom Underwood 3 times and felt like he was thorough and honest. He gave 2 of my purchases very positive reviews, but let me know nicely that the third item was not the best quality. I haven''t been in a few years, but I think he used to charge somewhere between $75 and $85 for a written appraisal.

I have also had an appraisal done by Mr Underwood. That was several years ago. He charges $150 now. He is very nice and I know has an excellent reputation. If I decide to insure my jewelry, I''ll probably give him a call and see what he would charge to update my other appraisal and take my new diamonds in (when I get them). The other gentleman I talked to who was willing to do verbal is also independent appraiser in jewelry building downtown...not someone in a store who sells jewelry. Thanks for the input. I appreciate all of your expertise.

 

[strmrdr]

If you have insurance on another piece of jewelery you can likely add the earrings to the policy for something like $20-$30 a year. Its worth it.

 

[nolimits]

This sounds a little odd to me. You are willing to spend $2k on a set of earrings, which most people consider a substantial amount, but you are balking at the idea of spending $150 on a written appraisal? This is less than 10% of the amount you are spending on the earrings and a good piece of mind for you that can be used for insurance purposes (should you change your mind later) or that can possibly be used should you need/want to sell the earrings. Also if the appraisal should come back showing less quality, the jeweler has zero ability to argue a refund as he sold you something that was not the quality he stated. Obviously you don''t think that would happen or you wouldn''t be shopping there, but better safe than sorry and for less than 10% of your initial purchase price, it''s cheap insurance.

While new to diamonds, I have worked in the construction management business for years. I can tell you this, if it''s not in writing and can force liability on a person than it''s worthless. Protect yourself with a written appraisal.