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Wedding VENT! Our Stress-Free Planning Has Come to a Halt!

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Haven

Haven

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Feb 15, 2007
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This is really just a vent, so thank you for listening.

We've had a pretty stress-free time planning the wedding thus far, partly because my family is incredibly supportive and just plain wonderful, and partly because I am intent on keeping stress out of all aspects of my life and I won't let the wedding change that.

Well, my FFIL seems to be absolutely determined to be angry and to cause us undue stress.

Background: FFIL told us he was going to pay for the band, photographer, and videographer at one point in the planning process. We made plans and put down deposits based on this information. Then FFIL decided he didn't like the vendors we chose (even though he originally had zero interest in any of this) and retracted his offer. Fine. We made some plans we wouldn't have made. We decided to not let it bother us and change our relationship with him, and we didn't. We just put on smiles and moved on.

We sent FFIL several copies of the guest list, asked him to add anyone he wanted, never gave him a limit (even though he's not hosting), and told him we needed the info by X date. No response. He really didn't seem interested in the wedding at all, and whenever FI brought up the guest list FFIL would just get angry and say it looked fine. X date came so FI called FFIL and asked him if the list was fine. FFIL said it was fine. SO, we ordered our invites based on the guest information we had.

Getting address information was a horrible ordeal, but we were able to get the info we needed from FFIL after many attempts.

We sent the invites out last Monday. My mother spent her entire spring break (she's a teacher) doing the calligraphy for the inner and outer envelopes. We called FFIL one last time to ensure that the list was okay. He said it was okay. Good.

THEN, FFIL called FI last Tuesday and asked to add a couple who is friends with FFIL's lady friend (FI's mother passed away five years ago). FI said it was okay, but that these people would be the only people at the wedding with whom we do not have a close personal relationship. FFIL said he really wants them there. Fine. We added them.

THEN, FFIL called FI again and asked to add four more cousins, none of whom have had any contact with FI in the last 15 years. FI said fine, but this has to be the end of it.

Fast forward to tonight: FFIL just called FI and told him that he wants us to know that he is extremely disappointed with the two of us. FI asked why he is disappointed, FFIL said he doesn't want to get into it, but we should just know that. THEN, FFIL told FI that he's had to tell several friends of his that they are no longer invited to the wedding after he told them they would be invited months ago.

FI was flabbergasted, of course. FI told FFIL he doesn't understand what he's talking about. FFIL said he couldn't invite many people he wanted to invite. FI said Why not? We never gave you a limit, we asked you for your list several times, you ok'd the final list. FFIL was angry and yelling and just being irrational in general.

They ended the conversation with FFIL angry saying he is disappointed in us, and FI saying he would love to fix it but he just doesn't understand the problem.

I'm so upset. I don't want my FI to have a strained relationship with his father. His mother died unexpectedly just five years ago, and FI was a mama's boy so I know this has been hard for him to think about getting married without his mom there, and now his father is acting like a big baby. The other thing is that FFIL had a heart attack and then surgery just last July, and we're really worried about his health, so we try very hard to calm him down whenever he acts like this, but I'm scared he's going to give himself another heart attack.

I'm just not used to this kind of crazy.
 
Oh Haven, I''m so sorry!

Is there any chance that this will just blow over and FFIL will realize he made a mistake?

(hugs)
 
Aww Haven I just want to give you a hug. I''m so sorry you two are going through this while planning one of the happiest days of your life. I too desperately want to avoid stress when planning my wedding. Hopefully your FFIL will calm down and come to his senses. Maybe he just doesn''t feel like he''s getting enough attention? Sure it''s childish, but perhaps he needs to feel like he has some input in some way.
 
What? Why would your FFIL tell his friends they are not invited to the wedding before calling your FI or you to see if they could be added to the guest list?? That seems very illogical and almost underhanded to me. Whatever the case may be, he is in the wrong here. The only way I see to fix it at this point is for your FI and you to just contact him, state that there was a misunderstanding, and try to find a way to get these people invited. Sorry this is happening, Haven, I hope it all works out ok.

ETA: and if I had to take a guess at why your FFIL is behaving like this, I would say he's upset about not having his wife around anymore to help with things like this and he's taking out his grief on you two. Sad, but doesn't excuse him saying he's disappointed in you guys when you clearly had no intention of trying to leave anyone out.
 
Thanks, ladies. I feel better just having typed it all out, if you can believe that.

I hope this will all just blow over. My concern is that FFIL holds grudges, and he''s angry in general, so if it does blow over it will likely be because FFIL has found something else to be angry about.

Moonwater--I wonder if your insight is right, perhaps he feels like he needs to be involved more. He''s hard to get a read on, though, because when we do try to involve him in things he just gets mad about every single decision we make. It''s not just us, he''s like that with FI''s brother, too. It''s never good enough, ya know? Example: when we were looking at houses in Buffalo Grove he said "Oh boy, you have to pack a lunch to come all the way out here. Why don''t you look for a house in Highland Park?" Then we found a house in Highland Park (which we later bought) and FFIL said "You should really look at homes in Buffalo Grove, you could buy a lot more out there." And when I say "said" I mean spat, yelled, or huffed in anger. When we bought our Honda Civics he said "Why are you buying fancy sports cars?!" CIVICS! Fancy?! Sports cars?! He''s impossible.

So, when we try to involve him he just criticizes and second-guesses every single decision or choice, and he always says something about how we''re taking up his time with everything, which makes me think he doesn''t want to be involved at all.

This is the same FFIL who wanted us to have our rehearsal dinner the Wednesday before our wedding (rather than the night before, Thursday) because Wednesday is his day off so it would be more convenient for him. HE OWNS HIS OWN BUSINESS! HE IS THE BOSS! He can take off any day he wants, and excuse me, his youngest son is getting married--is that not enough reason to take a day off? (Not to mention, FI''s older brother works with FFIL in the store, so if FFIL has the day off that means FI''s brother does not, and FI''s brother is the best man, so he sorta needs to be at the rehearsal, too.)

Anyway, I''m having a hard time moving on, obviously. This is uncharted territory for me, I''m normally good at forgetting about things pretty quickly. This is just too much, FFIL has been picking fights and being mean and angry since we were engaged in September, but now he''s being more overt about it.

Okay, thanks again for listening. The typing it all out does feel therapeutic.
 
Date: 5/7/2008 11:21:29 PM
Author: monarch64

ETA: and if I had to take a guess at why your FFIL is behaving like this, I would say he''s upset about not having his wife around anymore to help with things like this and he''s taking out his grief on you two. Sad, but doesn''t excuse him saying he''s disappointed in you guys when you clearly had no intention of trying to leave anyone out.
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I think you''re right about that, Monnie, and I do feel bad for him. I know it must be terribly hard to see his youngest son going through such a big event without his wife there, but his grief shouldn''t cause an enormous rift between him and his son. I just don''t know if I can grin and bear it anymore. Now FFIL is saying he''s DISAPPOINTED in us? I feel like I''m being wrongfully accused of a crime and the judge is completely unwilling to hear my attorney''s statement. It''s so frustrating.

Thanks for your support, I''m so upset right now. Like I said, I''m just not used to this kind of crazy, I''m really not.
 
Oh Haven,
So sorry. I think FFIL is in the wrong here. Hopefully cooler heads will prevail and this can be worked out. HUGS to you. Have your FI conatact him in a day or so, and work this out. He had every opportunity to invite those he wanted, he dropped the ball....
 
Here''s a news flash: you''re disappointed in FFIL! You''re disappointed that he retracted his offer of support ... disappointed that he''s added extra guests unexpectedly ... and disappointed that he''s behaved childishly -- in accusing you both of letting him down WITHOUT the benefit of details & the ability to speak your OWN minds. Mature conversations are ones in which BOTH parties participate. Mature relationships are ones in which both have a voice. He is treating you both like little children and it is maddening!!! Totally feel for you but I don''t know what to advise. He sounds pretty unreasonable & with his recent health problems ... you might have to s*ck up some of his crazy and just NOT take it personally. KNOW that his expectations are unreasonable! And that you are taking the high road.

UGH!!! Hugs!
 
Haven, gosh that stinks! He sounds like he''s being really difficult. I think you''re handling everything like an absolute queen, kudos to you. I hope you don''t let him bother you much, but I know that''s easier said than done.

Side note, I''m in Chicago too! :) Okay, sorry couldn''t help it.
 
Aw Haven, this is really hard! I so wish I could say, "talk to him calmly and rationally, and i''m sure he''ll see how unreasonable he''s being," but it really doesn''t sound like he is anywhere near ready to want to be reasonable. The only thing I can think of, other than not letting it get to you or taking it personally as others have suggested, is to try to find a relative that he will listen to and explain to them what''s going on, and try to have them talk to him. If he can see that he is damaging his relationship with you and his son, maybe it will help, but I don''t think hearing it from you or your FI will be enough to show him.
 
Haven, I''m so sorry. . . why is it that weddings make everyone into drama queens (or kings, in this case?) EVERYONE has their own conflicting opinion on how things should be handled and, for some reason, feel free to push their feelings on you. I wish I had some sort of magic advice here, but I can just offer empathy and support. . .
 
Date: 5/7/2008 11:23:55 PM
Author: Haven
Thanks, ladies. I feel better just having typed it all out, if you can believe that.

I hope this will all just blow over. My concern is that FFIL holds grudges, and he''s angry in general, so if it does blow over it will likely be because FFIL has found something else to be angry about.

Moonwater--I wonder if your insight is right, perhaps he feels like he needs to be involved more. He''s hard to get a read on, though, because when we do try to involve him in things he just gets mad about every single decision we make. It''s not just us, he''s like that with FI''s brother, too. It''s never good enough, ya know? Example: when we were looking at houses in Buffalo Grove he said ''Oh boy, you have to pack a lunch to come all the way out here. Why don''t you look for a house in Highland Park?'' Then we found a house in Highland Park (which we later bought) and FFIL said ''You should really look at homes in Buffalo Grove, you could buy a lot more out there.'' And when I say ''said'' I mean spat, yelled, or huffed in anger. When we bought our Honda Civics he said ''Why are you buying fancy sports cars?!'' CIVICS! Fancy?! Sports cars?! He''s impossible.

So, when we try to involve him he just criticizes and second-guesses every single decision or choice, and he always says something about how we''re taking up his time with everything, which makes me think he doesn''t want to be involved at all.

This is the same FFIL who wanted us to have our rehearsal dinner the Wednesday before our wedding (rather than the night before, Thursday) because Wednesday is his day off so it would be more convenient for him. HE OWNS HIS OWN BUSINESS! HE IS THE BOSS! He can take off any day he wants, and excuse me, his youngest son is getting married--is that not enough reason to take a day off? (Not to mention, FI''s older brother works with FFIL in the store, so if FFIL has the day off that means FI''s brother does not, and FI''s brother is the best man, so he sorta needs to be at the rehearsal, too.)

Anyway, I''m having a hard time moving on, obviously. This is uncharted territory for me, I''m normally good at forgetting about things pretty quickly. This is just too much, FFIL has been picking fights and being mean and angry since we were engaged in September, but now he''s being more overt about it.

Okay, thanks again for listening. The typing it all out does feel therapeutic.
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Better get prepared for the long haul, because it sounds like this is the way this man IS. Owns his own business (read: possible control freak), no wife anymore, (no one to easily control anymore, see comment about control freakiness), and expecting everyone to read his mind (my mom''s family is like this in spades. A family trait.
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) Has nothing to do with you or your FI per se. If that is the case, as I suspect it is, move on!!! Just let him be mad. There isn''t anything you can do to make this person happy, even if you stood and your head and burped square nickels. And your FI is going to have to be the one to tell him to lay off/butt out if he gets too irrational/abusive. No one else can do it.

I have a friend who has been fretting over her truly horrible MIL for nearly 30 YEARS. It drives her nuts to this day. Her husband never said to his mom to lay off his wife, and so she never did. I''d have told the woman to take a hike 29 years earlier, but that''s just me....

Good luck and take deep breaths!
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Possibly his irritability is linked to his health issues: link It is not an excuse, and the research is "murky" but depression has roots in health issues not just because of the fear of another incident.

So sorry that he is being so irritable and irrational, just thought that the concept that it could be related to his health might make it easier to deal with for your FI. Perhaps you are not encountering your FFIL''s true feelings, but rather the effects of his health issues.
Hugs to you and your FI
 
Aw, Haven. That''s so tough.
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Does he usually behave this way or is this new behaviour? If it''s new, then I''d try to figure out what it''s ''really about'' or rather get FI to, and let them have a heart to heart. I think Monarch and Moonwater have made good suggestions, and although my screen name doesn''t begin with ''M'' too, I''d like to throw another one out there: maybe he''s worried that, since his wife is gone, his son marrying means your FI won''t be there for him as much anymore?
 
Haven, I hope things get better, but I agree with ksinger, it doesn''t look like there''s much you can do to make him happy, so just go along your merry way. And yes, have your FI talk to Mr. Grumpy when he gets out of line. And definitely be there for your guy when he needs to deal with it. As much as it eats you up, it probably eats him up more that his DAD is behaving this way. Good luck.
 
Oh my gosh, Haven. I have to say, you are handling this with a heck of a lot more grace and compassion than I would. Seriously, I would really be upset and would be second-guessing everything if this had happened to me. I guess there is just no making him happy, and all you can do is move forward. I''m sorry that this is casting a gray cloud over your stress-free planning, though.
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Thank you thank you thank you.
I don''t have enough time to respond to everyone individually, but I''ll come back later to do so.
I''m still really upset about the whole thing, and I think you''re right, he is irrational and generally angry so I''m thinking this has less to do with us and more to do with him.

The worst part of it is that FI and I got into a little argument last night because FI was so irritated he took it out on me. (We were on the phone and he used a tone that I didn''t like, so I told him I knew that he''s upset about his father, but that doesn''t make it okay to speak to me like that. He never does that, so in hindsight I should have had a bit more compassion, but I don''t stand for anyone speaking to me with a tone, least of all the man I''m about to marry. Mutual respect and all that jazz. But now I feel bad because I should have been more supportive, right?) ANYWAY, we hung up the phone unhappy with each other, and then he apologized later but I shouldn''t have let it get that far. THIS is what I wanted to avoid--to allow other people to dictate the way my FI and I treat each other.

Anyway, your support made me feel a lot better, which is why I signed on to PS just now, so thank you.
 
Haven, I just wanted to say that I''m so sorry for you and your fiance that you have to deal with this. ((HUGE HUGS)).
 
So I spent some time on the phone with my FSIL who confirmed that my FFIL is insanely irrational.

I learned that:
- FFIL is extremely angry with us because he feels slighted about the guest list.
BUT,
- FFIL knows he dropped the ball with the guest list because he never responded to our numerous requests for a list.
YET,
- He is extremely angry with us because he feels slighted about the guest list.

I also learned that he does not want to pay for the rehearsal dinner because he is so mad at us. I already booked it and paid the deposit anyway because we're getting in less than two months and he hadn't said a peep about it, anyway. Yeah. FSIL convinced him to host the RD because she doesn't want to regret it later, but I'm not so sure I want him to host it if he's only doing it because FSIL is forcing him to.

So at this point, do we give in and tell him to just give us a list of guests he would like added, or tell him to stuff it? Well, we'd find a euphemism for "stuff it" but you get the point.

Here are the cons for both situations:
Asking for more guests: These would be people FI does not know at all; our venue is going to be a bit crowded as it is, this would make it worse; higher cost--we're talking about $150 per person; WE DON'T KNOW THESE PEOPLE; we really wanted our wedding to be only close friends and family, these people wouldn't qualify as either and they'd be the ONLY ones there who aren't close to us.
Stuff it: Potentially harmful to the father-son relationship, such as it is. Angrier-than-normal curmudgeon at my wedding.

Thanks for your support, gals!
 
Honestly, I say tell him to "stuff it"...If he is trying to bully you now, only imagine what will happen in your marriage...EVERY decision you make will be criticized because he knows he can...if/when you have kids, where and how they will be raised, etc

I totally understand how hard that is because you don't want to damage the relationship your FI has with him, but a some point boundaires need to be set and NOW is the time to do it. Over the past year I have learned how to do this the hard way...my FMIL is IMPOSSIBLE and I have finally perfected the art of saying "NO" and i think only now (2 weeks before our wedding) has she finally learned that her behavior will not be tolerated so she has finally stopped...If we would have given in to her demands we would be in a worse position now..yes, my FI's relationship is different with his mother but not necessarily for the worst, i feel like a respect and boundary line has finally been drawn and maybe this is what you both need to do..just my $.02

anyway, HUGS to you...i FEEL your pain!
 
I"m a bit of a pleaser but COME ON, the man KNOWS he dropped the ball and he''s STILL MAD AT YOU GUYS, and now is fussing about paying for the RD!?!?!?! That would make me mad enough to tell him to stuff it. But I''d probably just go with what FI feels is best (after having given him ''thoughts'' on the subject) as it''s ultimately his relationship with his dad. I''m REALLY sorry you are dealing with this Haven.
 
Man...wow...I really think ksinger hit the nail on the head with this situation. That''s just how he is.
 
Oh lordy....Haven, I really empathize. Your FFIL sounds a lot like my dad...whenever his kids make a decision without him, it is the absolute wrong thing to do no matter what the situation or circumstance. As long as it wasn''t his idea to begin with or he wasn''t consulted from the get-go, the end result is wrong. My mom has spent 30 some years being the "buffer" between my dad and every decision my brother and I and our respective spouses, have made. Your FFIL no longer has his wife as the buffer, (and I am of course just speculating) so you guys are getting the brunt of his frustrations at this point.

I wonder if it would help at all for you to host a small dinner party at your new house, with just the parents as guests? Maybe everyone involved could just have a nice meal and use the time to discuss the wedding plans and air out any grievances? I may be totally off the mark in suggesting this, but I know when my father gets out of line (privately) he is much more willing to listen to reason when outsiders are involved, and he puts on a very generous and endearing persona around other people. Perhaps that is not the greatest way to go about getting him to be nicer about things, but it just may work.

Lots of luck to you, Haven.
 
I''m with Karen. Haven, tell him to stuff it. Otherwise this will become a never ending roller coaster of hell for you and FI. In my opinion, if you give in now, you give in for life with this sort of person. Do you want this every time you have an event or an issue in your life? Probably not. I say, you write him a heartfelt letter (so you dont have to deal with his abusive calls) and leave it at that. Explain about only wanting people the two of you have a personal relationship with and that he had X months to let you know who he wanted to invite. Dont let him bully you with his anger because that''s what he''s doing.

Re: the RD, you need to talk to him about it or make arrangements for you to pay for it, or your parents if they''re willing. I cant believe parents act like this at times like this, it''s so vindictive and juvenile. Sorry Haven...
 
I think you might as well tell him to stuff it. (Or rather, just let it go.) The thing is, if you invite these people, he'll be mad about something else. The way you did it, or that you're spending too much money (even though the extra is for *his* guests) or that the sky is blue. It's tough, but my experience with a father who can be like this is that giving in won't improve your relationship with him - just change the focus to whatever the next thing is.

I'm so sorry this is happening! And you're right - the only thing you really *can* do that will help is to make sure it doesn't come between you and your fiance. {{{hugs}}}

ETA: I forgot to say, I think you should let him pay for the rehearsal dinner. The thing is that he probably does actually want to do it, while at the same time needing to be mad in some dramatic way. It's like simultaneously knowing that it's his own fault that he dropped the ball and being mad at you. By refusing the money, you'll be rewarding his bad side, cutting off his good side, and punishing yourself and your FI more than him. Just my $0.02.
 
Thanks for all of your advice, ladies. It sounds like he should be stuffing it right now, huh?

Well, here''s what happened: FI called his SIL (FI''s brother''s sister) because she seems to be the only one my FFIL will speak with. SIL convinced FI to allow FFIL to invite extra people, so she then called my FFIL and got a list of new people to invite.

Without talking to me first. I was more upset for about a second, and then I decided to just let it go.
I have no idea how many people FFIL added because I haven''t seen this new list.

I''m not optimistic that this is going to change his behavior because, as many of you perceived, FFIL just likes to be angry. I will be happy to be done with this and move on, though, because I do not like allowing any stress into my life.

As for the RD, I really don''t want FFIL to pay for it. I know that he probably wants to pay for it deep, deep down inside, but the fact that he''s being forced by my FSIL just makes me uncomfortable. The money isn''t the issue. We have the money, my parents offered to pay for it, and even our very closest family friend offered to pay for the RD because she loves us and wants to contribute. I think I''m going to have FI schedule a talk with his dad to tell him thank you but no thank you. Is this destructive? I''d rather not have any strings attached.
 
Just found out--he added ten additional people to the guest list.
We''re getting married in eight weeks.
I''m just going to grin and bear it, and let this be a lesson for the future.
 
Will they all come? Maybe they will have plans? Seat them all at one table, tell your photographer not to bother with them.
 
Date: 5/9/2008 6:29:41 PM
Author: Gypsy
Will they all come? Maybe they will have plans? Seat them all at one table, tell your photographer not to bother with them.
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Lol Gypsy. Love it. And I agree, they might just be invites he felt he needed to extend but they likely might just send a gift and not show.
 
As for the RD, I really don''t want FFIL to pay for it. I know that he probably wants to pay for it deep, deep down inside, but the fact that he''s being forced by my FSIL just makes me uncomfortable. The money isn''t the issue. We have the money, my parents offered to pay for it, and even our very closest family friend offered to pay for the RD because she loves us and wants to contribute. I think I''m going to have FI schedule a talk with his dad to tell him thank you but no thank you. Is this destructive? I''d rather not have any strings attached.
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For what it''s worth.....

I wouldn''t do this. I do think it''s destructive. It will seem like you''re being retaliatory because you were unhappy about adding extra guests and therefore trying to take something away that you know he wants to do deep down inside. More than that, it''s allowing yourself to get sucked into behavior that you wouldn''t otherwise engage in. It takes two to tangle. Choose for this moment to be placid and let it go.

You''re almost married; the wedding is eight weeks away. Nine weeks from now, it will be over, and life will go on. You are marrying his son, so he will play a role in your life for a very long time. Don''t do something now in the heat of being upset that will set a difficult tone later.

I agree with you that FFIL is being completely unreasonable. I think you are in the right to be outraged at being asked to add more guests at this late date. But FI agreed to it, and it''s done. This isn''t the proverbial hill I''d want to die on if I were in your shoes.

I''m sure some of this is coming from his hurt that his wife isn''t here to share in this day. I don''t think that excuses this behavior at all, but I can see where a little leniency would be a compassionate thing.

If FFIL continues to be a PIA after the wedding, you''ll have plenty of time (when you''re feeling less stressed) to set boundaries, etc.

This is a really magical time for you.....or, at least, it was for me in the weeks leading up to my wedding. It felt surreal and wondrous to be on the brink of getting married. Don''t let someone else usurp the joy and enjoyment of this time for you; it won''t come again.
 
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