Vaccinations: Do your kids get them?

[packrat]

MC, I''m under the impression the flu shot protects against 3 strains of influenza. I think it''s kind of a hit or miss deal, as nobody can accurately predict which 3 strains are going to be the leading contenders for the following flu season, and they have to make the vaccine ahead of time. They guess the best they can. Last years prediction wasn''t the best and a lot of people got hit w/influenza A. Most of our medical office did and all 4 of us did at the same time-every one of us had been vaccinated. This years was better-I think we saw a couple few patients at our office and that was it. But again, just b/c you get the shot, doesn''t mean it''s going to cover all the strains you''ll come in contact with. It''s not a guarantee you won''t get sick, it''s a precaution.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

Date: 6/6/2009 12:50:26 PM
Author: MC

Date: 5/26/2009 2:49:14 AM

Author: Dancing Fire

Date: 5/23/2009 11:41:04 PM

Author: hlmr

What I really don''t agree with is the flu shot. I am so against it for average healthy people. I understand the elderly and anyone who is prone to illness getting it though.

funny thing about them flu shots...

i known a few friends whom always get their flu shot every year and they are the ones that usually get hit with the flu. i never had a flu shot in life and haven''t caught the flu in 15 yrs.

Doesn''t the flu shot protect against the previous year''s virus?


Everyone here says their pro-vaccination. . .I wonder if others on PS have postponed vaccinations but are afraid to speak out? It''s a difficult decision to make and it''s just as difficult to be attacked for making that choice.


One mom friend of mine admitted not finishing vaccinating her older son after he had hurrendous reactions to the first set of vaccinations he had. He ended up in the hospital because of it.

I think your mom''s friend''s case is different, that''s a pretty legitimate reason to be cautious of future vaccinations. Some vaccinations are live, and can very rarely cause a reaction, and very rarely someone can have an allergic reaction to one. And I would stop further vaccines until I figured out why the reaction happened too.

I can also understand people foregoing vaccinations for religious reasons, or if their children have certain medical conditions that might make vaccinations less safe, or have known allergies to vaccine components.
I think what I''m against is people denying vaccinations because of unproven perceptions like the autism link, and thus increasing the risk for their own children as well as others, on the basis of a rumor. Or denying them because of a "well, if everybody else does it, then I don''t have to" mentality that I just can''t support.

 

[icekid]

Date: 6/6/2009 2:41:27 PM
Author: packrat
MC, I''m under the impression the flu shot protects against 3 strains of influenza. I think it''s kind of a hit or miss deal, as nobody can accurately predict which 3 strains are going to be the leading contenders for the following flu season, and they have to make the vaccine ahead of time. They guess the best they can. Last years prediction wasn''t the best and a lot of people got hit w/influenza A. Most of our medical office did and all 4 of us did at the same time-every one of us had been vaccinated. This years was better-I think we saw a couple few patients at our office and that was it. But again, just b/c you get the shot, doesn''t mean it''s going to cover all the strains you''ll come in contact with. It''s not a guarantee you won''t get sick, it''s a precaution.

Exactly right, packrat. Each year they create a flu vacc with a prediction of the strains that are likely to cause illness. It''s impossible to get it exactly right, since they must do it in advance to create enough vaccine to cover those who need it.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

Heh, yeah, it''s kind of a misconception that flu vaccines will prevent the flu (the way polio vaccines prevent polio). I hear rumor that next year''s batch will be quadravalent (4 strains) rather than the standard trivalent, partially due to the swine flu.

Speaking of swine flu, if anyone''s still concerned, it doesn''t seem (as of now) to be a very virulent strain, or much more dangerous than the average yearly flu.

 

[icekid]

Date: 6/6/2009 6:40:04 PM
Author: MakingTheGrade

Speaking of swine flu, if anyone''s still concerned, it doesn''t seem (as of now) to be a very virulent strain, or much more dangerous than the average yearly flu.

swine flu is ridiculous

 

[MakingTheGrade]

Date: 6/6/2009 6:58:16 PM
Author: icekid

Date: 6/6/2009 6:40:04 PM

Author: MakingTheGrade


Speaking of swine flu, if anyone''s still concerned, it doesn''t seem (as of now) to be a very virulent strain, or much more dangerous than the average yearly flu.

swine flu is ridiculous

I know! My mom called me on the phone to tell me not to eat pork (wtf?), and they were selling surgical masks at the check out of CVS!

 

[packrat]

Regarding swine flu, my cousin sent me an email on how funny it is that there''s all this screeching about swine flu and people running around with masks on, bathing in sanitizer...yet can''t be bothered to protect themselves against STD''s with a condom.

 

[icekid]

Date: 6/6/2009 8:30:31 PM
Author: packrat
Regarding swine flu, my cousin sent me an email on how funny it is that there''s all this screeching about swine flu and people running around with masks on, bathing in sanitizer...yet can''t be bothered to protect themselves against STD''s with a condom.

haha, this is a good point!

 

[MakingTheGrade]

Date: 6/6/2009 8:30:31 PM
Author: packrat
Regarding swine flu, my cousin sent me an email on how funny it is that there''s all this screeching about swine flu and people running around with masks on, bathing in sanitizer...yet can''t be bothered to protect themselves against STD''s with a condom.

Yeah..cause it''s not like STDs can kill or maim you...
Seriously, people can overreact to the oddest things. I partially blame the media though, you''d think we were having an ebola epidemic or something with all the hype.

 

[packrat]

Date: 6/6/2009 9:53:39 PM
Author: MakingTheGrade

Date: 6/6/2009 8:30:31 PM

Author: packrat

Regarding swine flu, my cousin sent me an email on how funny it is that there''s all this screeching about swine flu and people running around with masks on, bathing in sanitizer...yet can''t be bothered to protect themselves against STD''s with a condom.

Yeah..cause it''s not like STDs can kill or maim you...

Seriously, people can overreact to the oddest things. I partially blame the media though, you''d think we were having an ebola epidemic or something with all the hype.

Haha, I know it. More people are probably killed in any given year by falling coconuts or something random like that than this particular flu strain. As for the media..on cnn.com for the longest time there were so many headlines about it and the CDC it was almost hard *not* to join in the panic!

 

[KaeKae]

I am new to PS and brand new to the FH&H forum, but I wanted to give my familiy''s experience after the Guardasil vaccine. A year or two after this vaccination was made available, my daughter recieved the vaccine after both my own OB/GYN and her pediatrician had recommended it. I had known other girls who had it with no trouble. I had searched the internet and found nothing negative. She had a severe reaction to it: dizzyness, weakness, it was as if she had suddenly come down with a virus, and was just not herself for days. Both doctors assured me this was unusual, but nothing to be concerned about. She did have the second shot, which I regret. Days later, she began having seizures. Still, the doctors say there is not connection, but I don''t agree. They say the seizures would have begun right away, but we didn''t even know they were seizures at first, it took several weeks and three doctors to diagnose, so she may have had one or more sooner and we didn''t know. A year and a half later, my daughter is taking anti-seizure medication, twice a day. She may or may not grow of of this. Of course, she did not have the last booster, and her younger sister will not have the shots. Please parents, do your homework and think carefully before you give your children vaccinations.

 

[sparklyheart]

Date: 6/6/2009 12:50:26 PM
Author: MC

Date: 5/26/2009 2:49:14 AM
Author: Dancing Fire

Date: 5/23/2009 11:41:04 PM
Author: hlmr
What I really don''t agree with is the flu shot. I am so against it for average healthy people. I understand the elderly and anyone who is prone to illness getting it though.

funny thing about them flu shots...
i known a few friends whom always get their flu shot every year and they are the ones that usually get hit with the flu. i never had a flu shot in life and haven''t caught the flu in 15 yrs.

Doesn''t the flu shot protect against the previous year''s virus?

Everyone here says their pro-vaccination. . .I wonder if others on PS have postponed vaccinations but are afraid to speak out? It''s a difficult decision to make and it''s just as difficult to be attacked for making that choice.

One mom friend of mine admitted not finishing vaccinating her older son after he had hurrendous reactions to the first set of vaccinations he had. He ended up in the hospital because of it.

Some kids will have reactions to vaccines and that is a possible contraindication to future vaccinations. However, kids also have reactions to antibiotics, pain medications, food, drinks, etc. You don''t see parents out there refusing to medicate their child if they are sick or feed them if they are hungry because of this. I''m not trying to attack anyone for their decisions, I just want parents to make *informed* decisions, not decisions based on what one person said happened to their kid. Unfortunate things DO happen because of all of the modern day medicine we have created. There is a fine line between doing too much and possibly causing harm and not doing enough and possibly letting harmful things happen. How do you decide which route to take?

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Date: 6/7/2009 2:11:26 AM
Author: KaeKae
I am new to PS and brand new to the FH&H forum, but I wanted to give my familiy''s experience after the Guardasil vaccine. A year or two after this vaccination was made available, my daughter recieved the vaccine after both my own OB/GYN and her pediatrician had recommended it. I had known other girls who had it with no trouble. I had searched the internet and found nothing negative. She had a severe reaction to it: dizzyness, weakness, it was as if she had suddenly come down with a virus, and was just not herself for days. Both doctors assured me this was unusual, but nothing to be concerned about. She did have the second shot, which I regret. Days later, she began having seizures. Still, the doctors say there is not connection, but I don''t agree. They say the seizures would have begun right away, but we didn''t even know they were seizures at first, it took several weeks and three doctors to diagnose, so she may have had one or more sooner and we didn''t know. A year and a half later, my daughter is taking anti-seizure medication, twice a day. She may or may not grow of of this. Of course, she did not have the last booster, and her younger sister will not have the shots. Please parents, do your homework and think carefully before you give your children vaccinations.

Thanks for sharing your experience. This is one vaccine that I''ll take a wait-and-see approach on before considering it.

 

[LtlFirecracker]

Immunizations are not without risk, no medical treatment is. What you are balancing is a risk/benefit. Most of the severe side effects are rare, but not unheard of. That is why parents have to sign a consent for immunization. What you have to realize, is that the potential risks for these disease is greater and that is why we immunize. The risks from the disease is greater than the potential effects from the immunization. For example, if an unimmunized women gets rubella in her first trimester of pregnancy, the baby has a severe potential for multiple congenital malformations including mental retardation. That is why we immunize against rubella, not because of the disease in children and adults. Measles has the potential to case severe brain damage in 1/500- 1/1000 of people who contract it. We are talking about total developmental regression of motor and cognitive skills. I have seen this, and it totally changed my mind about immunizations. The child was from South America, and his mother was in this country desperate to get help for him, will the only thing that could have been done for him would have been to immunize him before he got measles. I am sure if she had access to it her her country she would have gotten it. From my experience, I don''t first generation immigrants from 3rd world countries refusing immunizations.

As for the cervical cancer immunization, I do encourage girls to be immunized. Cervical cancer is rare in this country, but that is because it is caught early. Women have to go through lots of procedures to get rid if it including ones that put her at risk for having a premature baby in the future. I have seen one case of cervical cancer in the US. The women was paralyzed and in significant irretracable pain. It is a miserable way to die. And it is one of the most common causes of cancer in places were medical care is hard to come by.

 

[soocool]

Date: 6/7/2009 2:11:26 AM
Author: KaeKae
I am new to PS and brand new to the FH&H forum, but I wanted to give my familiy''s experience after the Guardasil vaccine. A year or two after this vaccination was made available, my daughter recieved the vaccine after both my own OB/GYN and her pediatrician had recommended it. I had known other girls who had it with no trouble. I had searched the internet and found nothing negative. She had a severe reaction to it: dizzyness, weakness, it was as if she had suddenly come down with a virus, and was just not herself for days. Both doctors assured me this was unusual, but nothing to be concerned about. She did have the second shot, which I regret. Days later, she began having seizures. Still, the doctors say there is not connection, but I don''t agree. They say the seizures would have begun right away, but we didn''t even know they were seizures at first, it took several weeks and three doctors to diagnose, so she may have had one or more sooner and we didn''t know. A year and a half later, my daughter is taking anti-seizure medication, twice a day. She may or may not grow of of this. Of course, she did not have the last booster, and her younger sister will not have the shots. Please parents, do your homework and think carefully before you give your children vaccinations.

I previously mentioned that my DD''d friend had a severe reaction to the Gardasil vaccine when she was 13. I just found out this weekend that my friend''s 15 year old was hospitalized last week less than 24 hours after receiving the vaccine. Apparently she had a seizure. I definitely want to protect my DD, but still need more info on this one.

 

[LtlFirecracker]

Date: 6/7/2009 8:24:55 PM
Author: soocool

Date: 6/7/2009 2:11:26 AM

Author: KaeKae

I am new to PS and brand new to the FH&H forum, but I wanted to give my familiy''s experience after the Guardasil vaccine. A year or two after this vaccination was made available, my daughter recieved the vaccine after both my own OB/GYN and her pediatrician had recommended it. I had known other girls who had it with no trouble. I had searched the internet and found nothing negative. She had a severe reaction to it: dizzyness, weakness, it was as if she had suddenly come down with a virus, and was just not herself for days. Both doctors assured me this was unusual, but nothing to be concerned about. She did have the second shot, which I regret. Days later, she began having seizures. Still, the doctors say there is not connection, but I don''t agree. They say the seizures would have begun right away, but we didn''t even know they were seizures at first, it took several weeks and three doctors to diagnose, so she may have had one or more sooner and we didn''t know. A year and a half later, my daughter is taking anti-seizure medication, twice a day. She may or may not grow of of this. Of course, she did not have the last booster, and her younger sister will not have the shots. Please parents, do your homework and think carefully before you give your children vaccinations.

I previously mentioned that my DD''d friend had a severe reaction to the Gardasil vaccine when she was 13. I just found out this weekend that my friend''s 15 year old was hospitalized last week less than 24 hours after receiving the vaccine. Apparently she had a seizure. I definitely want to protect my DD, but still need more info on this one.

This is interesting. All these stories should be reported so that we can see if there is a true cause and effect, and if there is what the incidence is.

 

[icekid]

Date: 6/7/2009 8:26:48 PM
Author: LtlFirecracker

Date: 6/7/2009 8:24:55 PM

Author: soocool

Date: 6/7/2009 2:11:26 AM


Author: KaeKae


I am new to PS and brand new to the FH&H forum, but I wanted to give my familiy''s experience after the Guardasil vaccine. A year or two after this vaccination was made available, my daughter recieved the vaccine after both my own OB/GYN and her pediatrician had recommended it. I had known other girls who had it with no trouble. I had searched the internet and found nothing negative. She had a severe reaction to it: dizzyness, weakness, it was as if she had suddenly come down with a virus, and was just not herself for days. Both doctors assured me this was unusual, but nothing to be concerned about. She did have the second shot, which I regret. Days later, she began having seizures. Still, the doctors say there is not connection, but I don''t agree. They say the seizures would have begun right away, but we didn''t even know they were seizures at first, it took several weeks and three doctors to diagnose, so she may have had one or more sooner and we didn''t know. A year and a half later, my daughter is taking anti-seizure medication, twice a day. She may or may not grow of of this. Of course, she did not have the last booster, and her younger sister will not have the shots. Please parents, do your homework and think carefully before you give your children vaccinations.

I previously mentioned that my DD''d friend had a severe reaction to the Gardasil vaccine when she was 13. I just found out this weekend that my friend''s 15 year old was hospitalized last week less than 24 hours after receiving the vaccine. Apparently she had a seizure. I definitely want to protect my DD, but still need more info on this one.

This is interesting. All these stories should be reported so that we can see if there is a true cause and effect, and if there is what the incidence is.

Interesting... occasionally we don''t see rare side effects until a medication is tested on the general population. Only time will tell! I have not heard of seizures before this myself, though.

 

[KaeKae]

Date: 6/7/2009 8:42:23 PM
Author: icekid

Date: 6/7/2009 8:26:48 PM
Author: LtlFirecracker

Date: 6/7/2009 8:24:55 PM

Author: soocool

Date: 6/7/2009 2:11:26 AM


Author: KaeKae


I am new to PS and brand new to the FH&H forum, but I wanted to give my familiy''s experience after the Guardasil vaccine. A year or two after this vaccination was made available, my daughter recieved the vaccine after both my own OB/GYN and her pediatrician had recommended it. I had known other girls who had it with no trouble. I had searched the internet and found nothing negative. She had a severe reaction to it: dizzyness, weakness, it was as if she had suddenly come down with a virus, and was just not herself for days. Both doctors assured me this was unusual, but nothing to be concerned about. She did have the second shot, which I regret. Days later, she began having seizures. Still, the doctors say there is not connection, but I don''t agree. They say the seizures would have begun right away, but we didn''t even know they were seizures at first, it took several weeks and three doctors to diagnose, so she may have had one or more sooner and we didn''t know. A year and a half later, my daughter is taking anti-seizure medication, twice a day. She may or may not grow of of this. Of course, she did not have the last booster, and her younger sister will not have the shots. Please parents, do your homework and think carefully before you give your children vaccinations.

I previously mentioned that my DD''d friend had a severe reaction to the Gardasil vaccine when she was 13. I just found out this weekend that my friend''s 15 year old was hospitalized last week less than 24 hours after receiving the vaccine. Apparently she had a seizure. I definitely want to protect my DD, but still need more info on this one.

This is interesting. All these stories should be reported so that we can see if there is a true cause and effect, and if there is what the incidence is.

Interesting... occasionally we don''t see rare side effects until a medication is tested on the general population. Only time will tell! I have not heard of seizures before this myself, though.

I hadn''t heard anything about seizures, either before my daughter started having them 18 months ago. Even then, the info was very scarce. Since then, I''ve seen more info on the net, including on the epilepsy websites. I think I was one of the first parents to talk about it there, but now I''m seeing more. I don''t think parents should simply boycott all vaccines, but I do think we need to be careful about them. I sure wish I had waited on the Guardasil, and probably would have if had hadn''t had so much encouragement from both our doctors. Btw, doctors are required to report all adverse reactions, so assuming they do so, the data is being collected.

 

[LtlFirecracker]

Yes, there is something called the vaccine registry that events that occur around immunizations are reported too. They can than take that data and determine if the event is associated with the immunization or not (vs an event that was independent of the immunization and just happened to show up at the time the immunization was given). For example, the old rotavirus vaccine used to have increased rates of the intestines telescoping into each other (intusscuption). They discontinued the immunization and made a new formulation which we have been giving the last couple years. They than collected the data again. They found that that a small percentage of children who got the immunization developed intusscuption, but then they looked at the incidence and realized it is not higher than the spontaneous incidence in the general population before the immunization came out. Therefore, the new vaccine was determined to be safe.

For the Gardisil immunization, medical updates have discussed the increased incidence of fainting around the immunization and now recommend that girls be sitting or laying down. I have yet to see any reports of increased seizure activity, although I will let you know if something like that is published in the pediatric literature.

 

[Diamond Confused]

When I have children I will not vaccinate them until they are at least 5 and even then they will not get all of them. It is ridiculous how many vaccines children receive in their most vulnerable stage. And so many of them seem unecessary; for instance the chicken pox vaccines. Those weren''t around when we were kids and we all survived.

My baby brother died of SIDS just two days after receiving his 3 month vaccines. I don''t think it was a coincidence

 

[ksinger]

Date: 6/10/2009 9:54:48 AM
Author: Diamond Confused
When I have children I will not vaccinate them until they are at least 5 and even then they will not get all of them. It is ridiculous how many vaccines children receive in their most vulnerable stage. And so many of them seem unecessary; for instance the chicken pox vaccines. Those weren''t around when we were kids and we all survived.

My baby brother died of SIDS just two days after receiving his 3 month vaccines. I don''t think it was a coincidence

Spoken like someone who has never had shingles or knows what post herpetic neuralgia can do to a person.

 

[LtlFirecracker]

I saw a 6 week old with chicken pox once. She got it from her 14 year old brother. She ended up in the ICU - she came back to the ward about a week later, but it scared a lot of us.

A lot of the immunizations at the 2, 4, and 6 month age are for diseases that babies get very sick from. The hib vaccine protects against meningitis (the doctors about 20 years ahead of me tell us "youngins" that we don''t know what meningitis is because we came in after this immunization). Bacterial meningitis is a very serious disease and can lead to death or long term brain damage. It also prevents against epiglottitis - the airway can close very quickly with this condition and the teaching is to put a breathing tube in if you suspect this. This bacteria is out in the community. Pertussis protects against whooping cough, that can be very severe in babies. It is also on the rise, and something that is being seen in pediatric ER''s. There were some rare but bad side effects in the older version, but they have changed the formulation (acellular) and the immunization is much safer than it was in the past.

About spreading the immunizations out, there is no scientific evidence to support this. There are less proteins in the immunization now than the shots I had as a kid (even though there are more immunizations). Most babies are not considered protected until they have received their second set of shots (i.e. their 2 and 4 month shots), some need all three to be protected.

I am not trying to scare people, but there is a reason that immunizations are being done, and it is because the risks of a long term adverse outcome from these diseases are very real ones. Yes, they are not common, as long as a significant portion of the population continues to immunize. But, I have seen sick babies - it is one of the hardest things to see, and I can''t imagine how hard it is for the parents to see that. Any anytime they are sick because of a preventable cause, it just breaks my heart even more.

 

[ksinger]

Date: 6/11/2009 12:48:43 AM
Author: LtlFirecracker
I saw a 6 week old with chicken pox once. She got it from her 14 year old brother. She ended up in the ICU - she came back to the ward about a week later, but it scared a lot of us.

A lot of the immunizations at the 2, 4, and 6 month age are for diseases that babies get very sick from. The hib vaccine protects against meningitis (the doctors about 20 years ahead of me tell us ''youngins'' that we don''t know what meningitis is because we came in after this immunization). Bacterial meningitis is a very serious disease and can lead to death or long term brain damage. It also prevents against epiglottitis - the airway can close very quickly with this condition and the teaching is to put a breathing tube in if you suspect this. This bacteria is out in the community. Pertussis protects against whooping cough, that can be very severe in babies. It is also on the rise, and something that is being seen in pediatric ER''s. There were some rare but bad side effects in the older version, but they have changed the formulation (acellular) and the immunization is much safer than it was in the past.

About spreading the immunizations out, there is no scientific evidence to support this. There are less proteins in the immunization now than the shots I had as a kid (even though there are more immunizations). Most babies are not considered protected until they have received their second set of shots (i.e. their 2 and 4 month shots), some need all three to be protected.

I am not trying to scare people, but there is a reason that immunizations are being done, and it is because the risks of a long term adverse outcome from these diseases are very real ones. Yes, they are not common, as long as a significant portion of the population continues to immunize. But, I have seen sick babies - it is one of the hardest things to see, and I can''t imagine how hard it is for the parents to see that. Any anytime they are sick because of a preventable cause, it just breaks my heart even more.

Well, you should scare people. The reality of these diseases is far scarier than the unsupported phantasms that some people have about the dangers of vaccination. As I mentioned above about shingles, for instance, If I and my generation could have escaped the substantial risk of shingles later in life, by a chicken pox vaccine as a kid, I would have gladly had one, and I''m sure my mom would have given it to me. And for the record, I''ve HAD shingles. A case caught early due to my mom recognizing it and going to an after-hours clinic rather than waiting one extra minute. Doing so saved at least 2 days, (it was a Friday) and very probably saved my sight, as I had it above my left eye and it was getting worse. I also know a person who has post herpetic neuralgia, and he is in pain to some degree or other all the time from it.

I heard that they recently came up with a shingles vaccine targeted to the elderly? They are most at risk, but I know you can get it at any point in life. A friend of mine has a daughter in her 20''s who had it multiple times....

 

[soocool]

ksinger, I mentioned earlier in this thread that my dad lost the sight in his eye from shingles, because he was misdiagnosed. I never had chicken pox and the doctor did not recommend that I get the vaccine at my age (52). But my daughter is vaccinated!

I wonder, if the same people who don''t like the idea of getting immunizations for their kids, do they get their pets (dogs & cats) immunized?
If they do, what is the difference?

 

[packrat]

We do a lot of shingles vaccinations for older people at our office. One of our providers described what it''s like to have shingles to me at work one day and it just sounds horrible! I''ve never had chicken pox..tho when I was growing up (back in the day) was when the thought was to purposely expose your child to it so they''d get it and be done. It didn''t work, no matter how hard mom tried!

We also a few years ago had meningitis go thru the community..a few kids died and several ended up in intensive care. To the best of my knowledge, that vaccine is one that''s offered when they''re young, and most colleges require documentation that kids have had it before they start. These kids were all HS seniors, and regardless if they''d been vaccinated when they were younger, it just takes ONE person to contract it and spread it. One kid was fine one day, said "Mom my neck hurts" the next day-and that was it. These diseases are nothing to mess with.

The benefits far outweigh the risks in my eyes. I want my kids to be as protected as they can possibly be. I''d rather they have the protection of being fully vaccinated, knowing that there''s no 100% guarantee, than not be protected at all.