URGENT: Grading a diamond.

[yaz]

I''m planning to buy a ring today and wanted to get a very quick comment or two on whether I should be suspicious of the deal. Here are the details:

Brand and make: Simon G, LP1923 (white gold; includes 0.5 carats of small diamonds)
Accredited by: Accredited Gem Appraisers (AGA)
Table width: 56.2
Crown height: 14.9
Crown angle: 34.4
Pavilion depth: 43.6
Girdle thickness: Medium
Total depth: 62.3
Culet size: closed
UV fluorescence: Slight blue
AGA cut class: 1B
American ideal cut
*Approximate* GIA color: D
*Approximate* GIA clarity: SI2
Quoted price for Simon G ring and the main diamond: $5,000 (Cash on hand: $3,500)

So, my questions:
1. How reliable is AGA? I know that anything other than GIA is automatically worth less. A great rating means nothing if the system isn''t reputable and comparable.
2. What do "approximate* GIA values mean? I get the feeling that this is merely guesswork, since GIA hasn''t touched the diamond. I especially suspect that the color (D) isn''t accurate, considering the price.

Please respond quickly -- I''m planning to do this today. Thanks so much.

 

[kenny]

Date: 11/24/2009 12:45:32 PM
Author:yaz


Quoted price for Simon G ring and the main diamond: $5,000 (Cash on hand: $3,500)

What does this mean?
Does it mean the price is $5000 but you have only $3500?
If so, you can't afford it.
That's why I think it must mean something else.

Do you have the pavilion angle in percentage?

Tell us about the seller...
Private party or a jeweler?
Brick and Mortar or online sale?
New or used?
Is this on eBay?
All this affects the price.

Oh, and what is the carat weight of the main diamond?

Isn't AGA run by one of the appraisers that posts here?
If so that will affect what people are willing to post about it.
Nobody wants to hurt the feelings of a PS regular.

 

[yaz]

| What does this mean?
| Does it mean the price is $5000 but you have only $3500?

This means I have $3,500 in cash and can pay $1,500 in installments. I was just wondering if the cash-on-hand should help me negotiate a lower price.

| Do you have the pavilion angle in percentage?

It lists only the pavilion depth: 43.6 percent.

| Private party or a jeweler?

It''s Golden Nugget, on Jeweler''s Row in Philadelphia. (www.goldennuggetjewelry.com) My former roommate bought his there. Seems reputable, but who knows?

| New or used?

It''s new.

| Is this on eBay?

No; see above.

| Oh, and what is the carat weight of the main diamond?

It''s 1.14.

| Isn''t AGA run by one of the appraisers that posts here? If so that will affect what people are willing to post about it. Nobody wants to hurt the feelings of a PS regular.

Yes, but I''m having a difficult time finding independent assessments of AGA''s ratings. That lack of information concerns me, but I''ve also seen some generally good comments about it.

I''m in a pinch, in more ways than one. I don''t want to get ripped off. I''m afraid of paying $5,000, thinking I''ve gotten a great deal and learning later that the AGA ratings are less than accurate. That''d piss me off very much. So I''m hoping people in this forum will be completely honest.

 

[stitch]

Date: 11/24/2009 12:45:32 PM
Author:yaz
I''m planning to buy a ring today and wanted to get a very quick comment or two on whether I should be suspicious of the deal. Here are the details:

Brand and make: Simon G, LP1923 (white gold; includes 0.5 carats of small diamonds)
Accredited by: Accredited Gem Appraisers (AGA)
Table width: 56.2
Crown height: 14.9
Crown angle: 34.4
Pavilion depth: 43.6
Girdle thickness: Medium
Total depth: 62.3
Culet size: closed
UV fluorescence: Slight blue
AGA cut class: 1B
American ideal cut
*Approximate* GIA color: D
*Approximate* GIA clarity: SI2
Quoted price for Simon G ring and the main diamond: $5,000 (Cash on hand: $3,500)

So, my questions:
1. How reliable is AGA? I know that anything other than GIA is automatically worth less. A great rating means nothing if the system isn''t reputable and comparable.
2. What do ''approximate* GIA values mean? I get the feeling that this is merely guesswork, since GIA hasn''t touched the diamond. I especially suspect that the color (D) isn''t accurate, considering the price.

Please respond quickly -- I''m planning to do this today. Thanks so much.

From the number that you provided, I got the HCA states that based on your depth your girdle is dangerously thin. Are you sure you have the right numbers?

 

[kenny]

Too good to be true.
The price is way too low.
Something's up.

I found this 1.14ct D SI1 for $75oo that scores 2.4 on HCA (not the best cut but likely better than the one you are considering).
It was graded by AGS, a highly reputable gem lab, so the D SI1 grades are believeable.
Your's apparently has no lab report so its true grades could by anything.
That's why people want reports from independent labs.

Click Here

I'll bet that D SI2 is not the grades GIA or AGS would give the diamond you are considering.
You don't know what you are getting - Do NOT trust the seller to grade it!
A jeweler never gives anything away.

I'd pass.

 

[kenny]

I went to their website and looked at 4 random round diamonds.
All 4 had EGL reports.

EGL grades soft.
That means a stone that EGL gave a D grade to may get a grade that is a few grades lower from GIA or AGS.
Same for clarity.
This is shocking but true.
This makes comparison shopping impossible.
You can't compare a EGL D SI2 to a GIA D SI2.
The EGL will be much cheaper (but they are NOT equal - the EGL D will likely be yellower than a GIA D).
It makes buyer of EGL diamonds think they got a great deal when they compare it to the price of a GIA or AGS stone, when the truth is they don't even know WHAT they got.

BTW their database did not have a 1.14 D SI2.
That may mean it does not even have an EGL report.

I'd pass on this seller.

 

[oldminer]

AGA is my old lab which I sold to Chris DiCamillo in January of 2008.....What great timing! He and the staff are very good and independent gemologist appraisers which I trained for many years and all have GIA diplomas. They take pride in doing an honest and accurate job. No small lab is exactly equal to AGSL or GIA, but the guys at AGA try hard to grade right without being overly harsh. It is a constant tightrope walk.

You would find the grading of a "D" color is likely very accurate and the clarity of SI2 may be SI2 or at the very worst a high I1. That is how the game must be played by any honest operation doing work for retail firms. I doubt you need to worry a great deal over the grading from AGA, but likely as not, the stone is sufficiently discounted to reflect the reality of its actual grade and actual worth anyway. If you love the stone and the price is right, then probably you''ll have no real issue at all.

 

[tyty333]

Using crown and pav % I got HCA 2.3 - worth buying if the price is right (we usually recommend not considering diamonds
that score over 2)

light return - excellent
fire - very good
scintillation -very good
spread - very good

Make sure you looked at the stone under different lighting condictions?

 

[sarah95]

I know Golden Nugget very well. I can't speak to the stats on your diamond, but I would tread very carefully there. Though I will say, AGA is the appraiser I use as well and I think they're wonderful.