Uncertified with good clarity and color.

[biglou904]

I am a long time lurker, first time poster. I have done a lot of research on the forum...hats off.

I have read a lot of the postings and have a post I''d like to throw out regarding an uncertified diamond I am looking into. I have literally looked at over a hundred diamonds in the last 2 months and I looking at buying soon. I have looked online, at the large shops,and at the small independent shops. I still haven''t made a commitment yet. I can tell a G from an I color and can usually guess a VS2 or an SI1 using a loup. Knowing the research, I would obviously get an independent appraisal before buying.

About this uncert. diamond.

All I was told: 1.56 G VS2 Round Diamond. (I have her taking measurments for me)

ctw : 1.56 - I weighed it using her scale to verify

Cut : (See below)
Flouresence: Don''t really know how to tell other than looking for a milky hue.
Symmetry: (See below)
Polish: Haven''t been able to really tell between an GIA EX and a Good. Higher magnification?
Color: It is significanctly whiter than a GIA certifed "I" I would think at least an H
Clarity: I feel very strongly that his an SI1 or better compared to other diamonds. I found the stone to be very clear through a loup with no visible inclusions with the exception of a 2 very small specks on the outer portion of the crown. It sits under a facet edge that I only noticed at an angle. I feel it could be covered with a prong easily.

I was worried about paint or laser drilling I looked extremely hard through the 30x lens. I have only caught one laser drilled diamond which the jeweler admitted openly aafter I asked him and the price reflected it before I viewed it. How easy is it to normally spot?

Cut: The diamonds sparkle was very nice compared to most I have seen. It has appeal but it didn''t knock me dead. (Some lighting issues I hope.) Here is what I thought "looked" weird.

To me (the untrained eye) the table appeared to be "smaller" than I expected. Now that being said, I compared it to a simialr stone with a larger 59.6% table that appeared to have more fire and jumped out a bit more. I should have her measurements on Friday as a starting point. I am also not sure of how the table was centered so maybe some symmetry issues. I will have a fresh look on Friday (as I had to walk away to refocus after going crosseyed) but I think the Cut is "off".

My ranking for my search is:
1) Cut
2) Color
3) Clarity

All that being said, "IF" I am interested and once I have it independently appraised I should have a better perspective. I feel very confident in the color being at least an H and clarity of at least an SI1. At a price of $9500 (including them obtaining a GIA certificate.) I think it is a great price. I would not anticipate a high Cut grade because it didn''t sparkle as well as I had hoped. I''ll report my findings on Friday when I get better light.

Thanks for letting me post!

 

[JohnQuixote]

Date: 9/20/2006 8:43:16 PM
Author:biglou904

All that being said, 'IF' I am interested and once I have it independently appraised I should have a better perspective. I feel very confident in the color being at least an H and clarity of at least an SI1. At a price of $9500 (including them obtaining a GIA certificate.) I think it is a great price. I would not anticipate a high Cut grade because it didn't sparkle as well as I had hoped. I'll report my findings on Friday when I get better light.

Thanks for letting me post!

Prudent way to proceed. Be sure the appraiser is truly independent, meaning someone who does not sell diamonds - and is not connected with the person selling the diamond. In this case a great deal rests on the appraiser's shoulder's so I would recommend finding one with the ability to perform greater analysis than a fast affirmation.

Here is a discussion where several appraisers weigh in on different components of appraisals. Neil Beaty (DenverAppraiser) gives a numbered list halfway down the page. It includes comparisons to an assumed grading report but could be adapted to your situation.

Though the price seems good, it's still a lot of money. It's perfectly reasonable for you to question why a large stone of that alleged class was not graded, and to expect to be allowed to have it appraised before committing to it.

 

[solange]

Would you have to pay for the GIA certification if you do not buy the stone? I came across a similar situation when I was looking in the Diamond District. It was a 7 1/2 carat supposedly H color stone at an unbelievable price--too good to be true. The stone had a lot of life and no visible inclusions to the naked eye. It looked great to me and I had seen many stones.

THe dealer was willing to send the ring--the stone was already set in a platinum and diamond mounting--to the GIA but I would have had to pay $600 whether I bought the stone or not. He explained that the stone would have to be taken out of the mounting and also would be out of circulation for a while. I passed on it and bought a smaller GIA certified stone through a Priceline vendor.

If you do decide to go for it, I would suggest that you send it to one of the very well known Priceline recommended appraisers because I have found that, even in the NYC Diamond District, it i very difficult to find a qualified appraiser. Good luck whatever you decide to do.

 

[maxspinel]

I did a search on the pricescope price statistics and $9500 is comparable for those 1.5 ct, H/SI1 diamonds with certificates. Since the price is comparable, diamonds with certificates do minimize a lot of risk. Uncert diamonds should sell at a bigger discount. A friend of mine bought an uncert 2.0 ct H/VS2 diamond last year from her client in the bank for $6500. The diamond, even though weighted at 2.0 ct, was cut very deep; besides looking a lot smaller, it lacks sparkle. Somebody actually thought it was only a 1.5 ct. It seems to be a great deal but she doesn''t wear it often since it looks really dull and small compared to her peers'' 2 carats. Cut is not the only factor but at least it has to be within certain acceptable limits.

 

[biglou904]

Thanks for the responses. I read through the check list and it pretty much covered everything I was planning on asking. I will plan on dumping it into Exel and made a template to give him.

JohnQuixote, I saw on another thread you mentioned reference knowing a Houston appraiser. I don't recall pricescope.com's policy on referencing appraiser's names but if it is allowed, any chance of getting the info on an appraiser? I know of one but I have not contacted any so any local knowledge would be great.

To answer the question regarding the jeweler. She is willing to send out the stone to obtain a GIA cert. I don't want her to until I have a better degree on the quality of the cut.

Hey maxspinel:
Yep I priced the same stone (H SI1) and found a few on pricescope that met or were around the same price. I was hoping to establish a coservative benchmark before potentially making an offer. Several of them had medium-stroong fuoresence. In my initial post I mentioned that I have not had success with identifying a stone with strong fluoresence. I am getting more experience but is there a better way for a consumer to detect this? Honestly, I am having difficulty in seeing "a coudy or hazy appearance" when viewing through either a loup or 30x scope on a strong fluoresence.

One other thing. She also had a cert.(Getting the lab) 1.56 I SI2 which she bought from someone who sold or traded in their ring. The price is $7000 which is a good price. I hadn't thought much about this stone as I prefer a whiter color and better clarity as well. I'll report my findings tomorrow on this one as well.