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Trade Advertising - when Hearts & Arrows is not.

Todd Gray

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jan 20, 2009
Messages
1,297
As a member of the diamond trade, we're subjected to a myriad of advertisements from diamond companies every day, some are better than others, most just end up in the trash... but I received a really nice 8 page glossy magazine-like offering today from a company that obviously spent a lot of money developing their ad campaign - tragically, it seems they have no idea what actually constitutes a "Hearts & Arrows" quality diamond and I found it kind of amusing as I thought to myself "practically everybody on Price Scope probably knows more about Hearts & Arrows diamonds than these guys..." take a look at the proportions of the diamond and then the ASET pic and the images for the "Hearts & Arrows" diamond (!) Wowza :shock:

tragic-advertising001.jpg
 

yssie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
20,748
Oh dear :sick:
 

Yogidude

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 28, 2012
Messages
1
Hi Todd.

You helped me get a diamond for my 10th anniversary about 8 years ago at niceice.com. I see that the site does not seem to exist anymore are you still active in the industry? I would love to use your expertise to pick out some new Diamonds.

Thanks
Drew
**edited by moderator. please read our policies on posting personal contact information**
 

Christina...

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 7, 2011
Messages
5,028
I find this extremely frustrating, and consider myself to be very fortunate to have found pricescope. I find myself wondering how many jewelers, that either know better or not, ended up with this advertisement in their mailboxes and are now pushing these diamonds onto their customers. It makes be realize all over again how important communities like Pricescope are and how wonderful and helpful the people here have been in taking their time to continue to guide me and so many others in their diamond purchases. Thank you PS!!
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,805
The thing about that is, they would be MUCH better off just marketing it as a GIA Excellent or AGS Ideal cut and just show the magnified image of the stone and not try to market it as H&A, which it is clearly not. It may even be equally as beautiful to the eye, but it shouldn't be marketed as H&A.
 

Rhino

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Mar 28, 2001
Messages
6,273
What is scary is that many within our trade do in fact consider this a genuine Hearts & Arrows diamond and is why, when clients say they are looking at a Hearts & Arrows with so and so I always ask ... Where is the photographic evidence? I never believe it without the evidence as I see this happening all over. Thanks for sharing this Todd.
 

Lotus99

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 25, 2012
Messages
390
But, I see hearts... I see arrows...

At least some of them... in some places :lol:
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,780
At least on this page of the advert they aren't actually claiming that it's a hearts and arrows diamond, they're just showing the view through a h&a type viewer, among others. The claim that this has been graded h&a by someone must appear somewhere else. They've got several other interesting stats like a Pavilion Open of None and a fluorescence grade of FL2+. What's that? Presumably there's a scale somewhere to explain these things. Assuming so, this is a LOT more informative than they typical seller written report. I'm reasonably impressed with the reporting, if not so much the stone. You may not want the stone but if they really do provide this much information about what they're offering and they have some rational scales and consistent methodology, I would call this quite informative.

Does it say that the photomicrograph is only a 'nearby' photo? Interesting choice of words.
 

diagem

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Oct 21, 2004
Messages
4,960
denverappraiser|1335659666|3183222 said:
They've got several other interesting stats like a Pavilion Open of None and a fluorescence grade of FL2+. What's that? Presumably there's a scale somewhere to explain these things. Assuming so, this is a LOT more informative than they typical seller written report. I'm reasonably impressed with the reporting, if not so much the stone. You may not want the stone but if they really do provide this much information about what they're offering and they have some rational scales and consistent methodology, I would call this quite informative.
I agree, I have witnessed this type of info on stock lists provided by some mega-manufacturers from India.
I believe some claim to offer much more grading info on their Diamonds.
And yes, quite informative and makes it easier to purchase assortments by wholesalers scattered all over the world.
 

oldminer

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Sep 3, 2000
Messages
6,411
Having dealt with chain retailers for some years, the phrases which say "OPEN" mean that the seller is telling prospective buyers that no inclusions break into the surface as open blemishes or crevices, etc. While not our official terminology, such details are of great importance to major chain buyers who seek a certain consistency and level of quality. Obviously, they rarely but high quality diamonds, so the kinds and amounts of inclusions in their particular diamonds have many additional versions of acceptable or unacceptable.

I agree that the H&A effect in this diamond is not what a "fine" H&A image looks like, but no one can deny they see hearts and arrows in this image. That's one of the reasons I generally say H&A is just a fortunate marketing opportunity rather than a sure fire way to judge a diamond's quality of cut. So few consumers know how to determine that the H&A image they are being shown is not representative of a fine cut. This situation leaves those selling the truly fine diamonds that have H&A at a distinct disadvantage. It hurts their sales pitch by devaluing it, and it hurts in the financial side because it does cost extra to get a fine H&A pattern.

In our business we often see the biggest liars do the most business. I suppose it is true in other businesses, too, but this is the only business I have any close knowledge of. The best suggestion for consumers before making ANY sort of purchase of financial and emotional importance is to inform themselves BEFORE making their decision to buy. In my many years in the business, this place, PRICESCOPE, has been one of the very few examples where people get told the truth and where the vendors are selling based on facts, research, and straight practices. A lot of consumers do find Pricescope, but certainly not the majority. There is still lots of work to be done.
 

Rhino

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Mar 28, 2001
Messages
6,273
I agree Neil, Dave, Y, ... the info offered is indeed helpful and I'd rather have it than not have it for sure. The educated consumer who sees the report should be able to easily identify the discrepancies.
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,780
I'm glad we don't know whose ad this is. Maybe I'm reading your comments wrong but I don't see a shred of evidence to call them liars. In fact they seem to be spectacularly transaprent here (again, assuming the scales are rational and the methodology is consistent). 'Hearts and arrows' is a squishy term anyway and not everyone uses it the same way, which is the point of this thread and thanks to Todd for pointing it out, but in this case there doesn't even seem to be a claim being made.
 
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