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The New GIA Ideal Cut - A Quantum Leap for Cut Grading at GIA

Texas Leaguer

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AGS Ideal Reports from GIA
One of the biggest developments in the gemological world took place at the end of 2022 when the Gemological Institute of America (GIA) acquired the technology and intellectual property of the American Gem Society Laboratories (AGSL), and rather quietly began issuing AGS Ideal reports for GIA diamonds.

In retrospect the move falls into the category of “shocking but not surprising”, considering that the GIA and AGS have been sister organizations since the founding of GIA in the 1930s, and have been close collaborators ever since. But as logical as the move is, it did take the industry by surprise, and has many important ramifications that will likely chart an all new approach for GIA with regard to the all important 4th C - CUT grading. The stealthy and low key way GIA rolled this out understates the enormous importance of the move for consumers and for the diamond industry as a whole.

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GIA Takes the Handoff from AGSL and Sprints out of the Gate
Almost immediately after announcing the acquisition, GIA began offering a digital AGS Ideal addendum report for any qualifying diamond submitted to GIA for full grading. In order to qualify the diamond would have to pass the AGS ray tracer for light performance as Ideal, aka AGS 0. Any grade lower than 0 will disqualify a stone for eligibility for the new report.

One of the most important aspects of the new AGS report is that it not only applies to round brilliant cuts, but to a variety of fancy shapes a well. To date, GIA has not offered an overall cut grade on any fancy shapes, so this is a MAJOR expansion of GIA’s footprint into cut grading. And it is likely to be a sign of things to come, and could be a game-changer for the certified diamond market by virtue of GIA’s impeccable reputation and enormous global reach.

Background - A Collegial Competition
The AGS established AGS Laboratories in 1996 for the purpose of performing more in depth analysis of diamond cut quality. The AGS Ideal report was born and quickly became the ultimate pedigree in diamond cut quality in the market. But the standards were very high and few diamonds in the market at the time would achieve the Ideal grade, so the AGSL remained a niche player serving only a small subset of diamond manufacturers and retailers catering to an emerging market for diamonds of the highest cut quality. But their success informed GIA and the rest of the diamond industry that there was a growing interest in cut quality analysis, particularly among a younger generation of diamond shoppers. This prompted GIA to get serious about developing their own cut grade system, which they finally released in 2005. In the intervening years AGSL had continued their advanced research in cut quality and at about the same time released their all new light performance-based cut quality grading system, leapfrogging GIA in terms of scientific sophistication. The peer reviewed AGSL system involves mathematically assessing the light performance of an accurate three dimensional model of the diamond, calculating the contribution of every facet by tracing over 30,000 light rays entering the diamond over the entire crown. Making the AGSL system even more compelling was the fact that the fundamentals could be applied to any facet arrangement to potentially develop a grading standard for any shape, including those not yet invented!

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The acquisition of the AGSL technology represents a bold stroke by GIA. It’s pretty clear that they intend to use it as their vehicle for developing their fancy cut grading standards going forward. In fact they have already begun that process in that they are offering AGS Ideal reports on a number of different fancy shapes, and they have made no changes to the AGS Ideal standard. Fancy shapes submitted to GIA for full grading, and which qualify, are eligible for an AGS Ideal addendum report. A diamond qualifies if it is a shape and facet arrangement that has had a grading standard developed and achieves the grade of AGS Ideal for that shape. Some of the shapes eligible today are oval, emerald cut, princess cut, and certain cushion cuts.

The New GIA Ideal Grade
With the release of the AGS Ideal report for round brilliant cuts, the GIA has shored up the biggest weakness in their current cut grading system for rounds; the fact that the Excellent grade is overly broad and contains stones with demonstrable light performance deficits. This has made it difficult for customers looking for the finest in diamond cut quality to identify the truly exceptional performers in the Excellent grade. Without changing a single thing with their round grading system, GIA solves that dilemma for shoppers by offering the AGS Ideal addendum report. AGS ideal is the bullseye in the center of the GIA Excellent category. With the addition of the AGS Ideal report, GIA has effectively segmented their Excellent category and established the new GIA Ideal grade.

ASET Light Maps
It’s not surprising that GIA has embraced ASET (Angular Spectrum Evaluation Tool), considering it is a foundational component of the AGSL light performance system. The addendum report can be ordered with a computer generated ASET map on the report. This light map is a graphical representation of the diamond’s specific light handling ability, and also provides some visual information about facet precision. The AGS Ideal grade does not specifically require perfect optical symmetry, but this light map can reveal aspects of precision that may be a value to those looking for the best of the best in cut craftsmanship.

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The Ultimate Validation of AGSL Light Performance Cut Grading
The acquisition of the AGSL technology is not only a brilliant move by GIA as a springboard to advanced cut quality grading, but it represents the ultimate validation for the work done by the many top-flight researchers who contributed to the development of the AGSL light performance grading system. There is no greater affirmation of the quality and importance of a diamond grading system than to be adopted and immediately deployed by GIA in their worldwide operations. And the fact that the system moves forward without revision is the ultimate compliment to the AGS and their outstanding cut grading team for the pioneering work they have done through the years.
 

smitcompton

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Hi,
So, only those diamonds that meet the AGS Ideal 000 will have an addendum attached to show the superior cutting and light performance of a particular diamond. This now may include ovals, cushions, emerald cut, and princess cuts as well.

Since GIA's business is mainly with dealers, how will the dealers explain to their customers that an excellent grade is not top grade. I don;t know how dealers will like that. If the price of the goods is commensurate with the rating, I don't see a problem. But since diamond dealers seem to want top dollar for their goods, and when customers learn that excellent/ideal is not the best, I see problems. I understand this is not new and seems to work as of now. But I just wonder about the customer.

This article mentions , at least a few times that GIA is worldwide. Outside of the US there are only 2 labs, one In London, one in Bangkok. It's primarily a US Lab and has been promoted here as the best lab and if a stone is graded by GIA the dealer gets a better price on his diamond.
So, I come to an interesting development. While channel surfing last week, I came upon QVC selling lab diamonds. They sell mined diamonds and use the GIA cert for those goods. On this forum we see IGI used to grade lab-diamonds. QVC is using GIA to grade lab diamonds. It didn't take long for a vendor to determine how to make more money from lab diamonds. Does anyone really believe that GIA can grade lab diamonds better than IGI> can? Are we soon going to get an addendum for light performance from AGSL when GIA certs a lab stone. Just throwing this out there.

Annette
 

Karl_K

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GIA for lab diamonds is hiding the growth method and treatments which the market has decided makes a difference in value.
Like De Beers and their for fun stuff only, they are trying to force the market using their 800lb gorilla status by hiding that information.
That is not consumer friendly.
For all diamonds off the lists I am personally going to assume a GIA report means treated cvd.
From a trustworthy stocking dealer its a discussion to have with them if they do not disclose it on their listing.
Frankly I wish the FTC would step in and demand disclosure.
I'm in the good crystal is good crystal and bad crystal sucks camp no matter how its made but the disclosure still should be made.
 
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Hi,
So, only those diamonds that meet the AGS Ideal 000 will have an addendum attached to show the superior cutting and light performance of a particular diamond. This now may include ovals, cushions, emerald cut, and princess cuts as well.

Since GIA's business is mainly with dealers, how will the dealers explain to their customers that an excellent grade is not top grade. I don;t know how dealers will like that. If the price of the goods is commensurate with the rating, I don't see a problem. But since diamond dealers seem to want top dollar for their goods, and when customers learn that excellent/ideal is not the best, I see problems. I understand this is not new and seems to work as of now. But I just wonder about the customer.

This article mentions , at least a few times that GIA is worldwide. Outside of the US there are only 2 labs, one In London, one in Bangkok. It's primarily a US Lab and has been promoted here as the best lab and if a stone is graded by GIA the dealer gets a better price on his diamond.
So, I come to an interesting development. While channel surfing last week, I came upon QVC selling lab diamonds. They sell mined diamonds and use the GIA cert for those goods. On this forum we see IGI used to grade lab-diamonds. QVC is using GIA to grade lab diamonds. It didn't take long for a vendor to determine how to make more money from lab diamonds. Does anyone really believe that GIA can grade lab diamonds better than IGI> can? Are we soon going to get an addendum for light performance from AGSL when GIA certs a lab stone. Just throwing this out there.

Annette

According to their website, GIA has labs in India (Mumbai and Surat), China (2 in Hong Kong), Japan (Tokyo), Thailand (Bangkok) - as you mentioned; USA (Carlsbad and NY), UAE (Dubai), Botswana (Gaborone), South Africa (Jo’burg), and Israel (Ramat Gan). They actually don’t seem to have a lab in Europe at all.
 

Alistair Stillwell

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As an owner of an a cut above diamond, I'm interested in whether GIA's new AGS Ideal reports have been adopted for this brand. Additionally, could you provide your insights on how GCAL certifications measure up against those from GIA?
 
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Texas Leaguer

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As an owner of an a cut above diamond, I'm interested in whether GIA's new AGS Ideal reports have been adopted for this brand. Additionally, could you provide your insights on how GCAL certifications measure up against those from GIA?

Hello Alistair,
If I understand you first question, yes the new report is adopted for our A CUT ABOVE brand. The baseline requirement for the brand has always been an AGS 0. We post all of the specs and qualifications to our website for full transparency. Over the years we have had many customers request a GIA report in addition to the AGSL report - now they get both automatically.

GCAL is a fine lab which does in-depth cut quality analysis. Like the former AGSL they have a much smaller footprint in the industry than GIA and it is hard to say how they might compare in terms of color and clarity grading, which is what prompts many customers to defer to GIA, whether or not that preference is based on fact or just on reputation.
 

Texas Leaguer

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Since GIA's business is mainly with dealers, how will the dealers explain to their customers that an excellent grade is not top grade. I don;t know how dealers will like that. If the price of the goods is commensurate with the rating, I don't see a problem. But since diamond dealers seem to want top dollar for their goods, and when customers learn that excellent/ideal is not the best, I see problems. I understand this is not new and seems to work as of now. But I just wonder about the customer.



Annette
Annette,
You make some good points and this is a good question. I would expect that the powers that be at GIA have pondered this issue exhaustively, and still decided to deploy the AGS light performance system. This is one reason that gives me confidence that they intend to expand on it in the future. But exactly how they will do that is not clear to me. They could adopt the whole system and perform ray tracing on all stones and let the chips fall where they may on the cut grades, or they may continue to do this hybrid - parameter based categorization for overall cut grade, and light performance Ideal report only on those stones that pass the ray tracer as AGS0. I would think they would ultimately be looking for a unified solution.

It will certainly be interesting to see how this developments!
 

smitcompton

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Hi,

According to their website, GIA has labs in India (Mumbai and Surat), China (2 in Hong Kong), Japan (Tokyo), Thailand (Bangkok) - as you mentioned; USA (Carlsbad and NY), UAE (Dubai), Botswana (Gaborone), South Africa (Jo’burg), and Israel (Ramat Gan). They actually don’t seem to have a lab in Europe at all.

Hi,

In a discussion with Garry(cutnut rock) I looked up GIA labs and those two locations were all that turned up. I didn't get any push back then and Texas Leaguer hasnt corrected that either. I don't mind being corrected, but that is the info I got when I looked it up. I never thought that GIA was so prolific.

Annette
 

Karl_K

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Hi,



Hi,

In a discussion with Garry(cutnut rock) I looked up GIA labs and those two locations were all that turned up. I didn't get any push back then and Texas Leaguer hasnt corrected that either. I don't mind being corrected, but that is the info I got when I looked it up. I never thought that GIA was so prolific.

Annette

They added more labs a few years back.
Some producers were lab shopping because GIA had consistency issues between the labs for a time.
I believe some of those listed locations are take in offices not full labs and is not a full list.
Rumor is that not all labs grade all types and some shipping between labs happens as well as for qc checks..
What % is done where is not disclosed that I have seen.
 

RunningwithScissors

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I'd love to hear more about how the AGS report is being applied to fancy shapes. Trying to find well-cut fancies is difficult and nerve-wracking for consumers, even those of us on PS who know a thing or two about light return.

Does this mean some of the shapes are being graded as Ideal now? If so, which ones? And do the experts on here agree with what GIA considers "Ideal" in the fancies? Or is there a range, like we find in Excellent cut? (I kinda take everything GIA says about cut grading with a pinch of salt).

Thanks!
 
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Hi,



Hi,

In a discussion with Garry(cutnut rock) I looked up GIA labs and those two locations were all that turned up. I didn't get any push back then and Texas Leaguer hasnt corrected that either. I don't mind being corrected, but that is the info I got when I looked it up. I never thought that GIA was so prolific.

Annette

I wasn’t aware about Tokyo etc either; but GIA definitely has labs (at least some grading services are provided here) in India, first one of which opened in ~2008 I believe. It is also considered the gold standard here in india, with HRD a close second and IGI an acceptable third (though both HRD and IGI trade at a discount to GIA, with IGI’s discount greater than HRD).

I got the list from here - https://www.gia.edu/locations

Here’s an article from 2018 about their india operations (if you’re interested) - https://www.gia.edu/gia-news-press/india-lab-celebrates-10-years

They apparently used to have a lab in Antwerp for their European operations which shut down - https://www.gia.edu/laboratory-antwerp-belgium-shipping-instructions

Sorry if you think I jumped in unnecessarily. I was extremely confident about GIA having a lab in india, and then when I googled it after seeing your comment I went down the rabbit hole.
 
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oldminer

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Grading round diamonds for cut quality has been good for consumers and the diamond business. GIA has provided a wide ranged of cuts that perform well to the eye and work well with a mix of lighting scenarios. I generally think it is useful without being overly restrictive. The same can be said for Garry Holloway's HCA and "Looks Like" system. All three fairly well agree with one another in allowing a range of light behavior and cutting styles to get recommended scores and grades.

The AGS system of cut grading is spot on for top grades of rounds. If you want the best cut, the AGS system cuts right to the point if cut and sparkling light return matters most to you.

With fancy shapes, the waters get much deeper and the dangers to the cutters and to sales increase exponentially. One must decide if influencing consumers to pick a limited set of length to width ratios or shape outlines in order to get a high scoring fancy are smart moves or potentially detrimental. Consumers often like shapes of fancy stones to be their choice, not as close to a limited set near what labs will see and better than others. There are many iterations of fancy shapes which appeal to the public which are average in light behavior, but beautiful and individual in their appearance. Will grading fancy shapes make the market better and what will be the end result for all concerned? I believe this is why grading fancy shapes is a process of what looks like foot dragging. Making a system that gives an excellent and dependable result has worked because of the geometric simplicity of round brilliants, but the complexity of most fancy shapes is not only a scientific problem, but one which will have an impact on how to handles rough diamonds in ways that have not been fully developed so far. All the software for planning rough fancy shapes will need a lot of re-programming and how will consumers react to fewer choices due to availability and awareness of cut grading?

I hope to be around when all of this comes to the market having been looking at fancy shape parameters and their cut grading since before the 1990's. IGI is hot on the trail to make their own fancy cut grading available. GCAL, now combined with IGI, is prepared to support such services. GIA knows they need to do the work and get it in place. "When?" is the big open question. How well it is done remains a hope and a fear. My suggestion is to start with a broad system first and work out the bugs. Once that is in place, find the locations of the highest performance of each shape and denote those as the 0 grades for each. Make variety acceptable not denied.
 

smitcompton

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Hi,
Well I must say I don't quite knowhow I becae so interested in gem labs.

To my Friend in India-- If I read Karls post corecty the only full service labs are in New York and Carlsburg. The other labs dont even grade diamonds but send them to the US Perhaps thats why we both got different readings and no-one pused back on me. I personaly woldn't define them as labsm just as drop off placess.. But its good to know people can get a GIA cert from almost anywhere. But its done in the US. (I think)-open to correction.

My reading of TL post is that they have developed a system for IDEAL fancy cut stones. I want to know who is selling them? But I may have mis-read.

Why don't dealers demand cutters do a better job at producing diamonds of excellent cut. Lift the whole industry up. Another poster bought a lab diamond and I remember her comment. She said the lab diamonds sparkled so much they put the mined diamonds to shame. She bought a 3ctw lab.
Lately, I think the HCA should be in jewelry shops. I do think its a brilliant devise. This ought to be used more for the little guy, like me,

If you remove crap diamonds from the market you may honestly say- diamonds are semi scarce. My comments only.

Annette
 
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Hi,
Well I must say I don't quite knowhow I becae so interested in gem labs.

To my Friend in India-- If I read Karls post corecty the only full service labs are in New York and Carlsburg. The other labs dont even grade diamonds but send them to the US Perhaps thats why we both got different readings and no-one pused back on me. I personaly woldn't define them as labsm just as drop off placess.. But its good to know people can get a GIA cert from almost anywhere. But its done in the US. (I think)-open to correction.

My reading of TL post is that they have developed a system for IDEAL fancy cut stones. I want to know who is selling them? But I may have mis-read.

Why don't dealers demand cutters do a better job at producing diamonds of excellent cut. Lift the whole industry up. Another poster bought a lab diamond and I remember her comment. She said the lab diamonds sparkled so much they put the mined diamonds to shame. She bought a 3ctw lab.
Lately, I think the HCA should be in jewelry shops. I do think its a brilliant devise. This ought to be used more for the little guy, like me,

If you remove crap diamonds from the market you may honestly say- diamonds are semi scarce. My comments only.

Annette

From what I got from Karl's link - they grade natural diamonds up to 3.99ct on location in Mumbai (and lab grown dossiers can be done up to 9.99ct), but for everything else except for pearls they send them out. Though actually, I also believe that just by submitting the diamond in Mumbai for example doesn't mean it'll be graded in Mumbai, even if its a size and type they could do on location.

Either way, the most comprehensive lot of services is offered by their US locations only, so you're right there, but all of the locations they call "labs" offer at least some grading services (albeit with size restrictions, or they don't do coloured stones/perhaps not coloured diamonds etc.).

It's not really relevant to the wider discussion though, sorry for the digression.
 

smitcompton

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Hi,

I just had an Aha moment.

There can be no excuse for poorly cut diamonds. Lab diamonds are the same composition as mined diamonds and are being cut in Ideal/Excellent cuts. If you eliminate poor quality diamonds you may a the desirable effect of having a luxury item, that will be in shorter supply and will compete on an equal basis with cut quality of the lab diamonds.

Send poor quality diamonds back to DeBeers. Those dealing in high quality diamonds ought not think they can get sky high prices. $4000.00 for a 1ct H vs1-si1is a nice luxury item for people to strive for . !0,000 is ridiculous. Yes I dare to put a price on a diamond even an excellent cut.

Annette
 

MissGotRocks

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Hi,
Well I must say I don't quite knowhow I becae so interested in gem labs.

To my Friend in India-- If I read Karls post corecty the only full service labs are in New York and Carlsburg. The other labs dont even grade diamonds but send them to the US Perhaps thats why we both got different readings and no-one pused back on me. I personaly woldn't define them as labsm just as drop off placess.. But its good to know people can get a GIA cert from almost anywhere. But its done in the US. (I think)-open to correction.

My reading of TL post is that they have developed a system for IDEAL fancy cut stones. I want to know who is selling them? But I may have mis-read.

Why don't dealers demand cutters do a better job at producing diamonds of excellent cut. Lift the whole industry up. Another poster bought a lab diamond and I remember her comment. She said the lab diamonds sparkled so much they put the mined diamonds to shame. She bought a 3ctw lab.
Lately, I think the HCA should be in jewelry shops. I do think its a brilliant devise. This ought to be used more for the little guy, like me,

If you remove crap diamonds from the market you may honestly say- diamonds are semi scarce. My comments only.

Annette

It’s all about the money. Super ideal cut diamonds require much more rough material be wasted. They aren’t cut for diamond weight but rather for light performance. Money lost but money gained with higher sale prices of those diamonds. There are many, many diamonds rated 3ex by GIA that are not ideal cut. To demand better cut goods, many of those would need to be recut. Recut costs money, loses weight and loses money. Just follow the money trail for some answers to your questions. Higher priced goods probably don’t always sell as fast as they, of course, cost more. I am sure there are many more mediocre diamonds available and sold than there are ideal cut diamonds. As long as they sell, why bother to lose money with ideal cut?
As for the three carat lab diamond putting mined diamonds to shame, that is all about cut quality. If they were both cut to ideal standards, I doubt anyone would see a difference. Always have to compare apples to apples.
I thought I remembered that you had ordered a diamond. Did you receive it and did you like it?
 

smitcompton

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It’s all about the money. Super ideal cut diamonds require much more rough material be wasted. They aren’t cut for diamond weight but rather for light performance. Money lost but money gained with higher sale prices of those diamonds. There are many, many diamonds rated 3ex by GIA that are not ideal cut. To demand better cut goods, many of those would need to be recut. Recut costs money, loses weight and loses money. Just follow the money trail for some answers to your questions. Higher priced goods probably don’t always sell as fast as they, of course, cost more. I am sure there are many more mediocre diamonds available and sold than there are ideal cut diamonds. As long as they sell, why bother to lose money with ideal cut?
As for the three carat lab diamond putting mined diamonds to shame, that is all about cut quality. If they were both cut to ideal standards, I doubt anyone would see a difference. Always have to compare apples to apples.
I thought I remembered that you had ordered a diamond. Did you receive it and did you like it?

Hi MissRocks,

While all the points you make are good, money and marketing have been responsible for the (my words) chaotic diamond industry. Luxury goods don't have a percentage of their goods low quality. I see it as elevating the diamond industry. They just have to re-direct their marketing and quality of goods to a higher level. Remove the junk. jUST MY MUSINGS.

Yes, I tried to purchase a diamond from James Allen. It was a bad experience. This was my second time trying to buy from James Allen. First, I wanted to pay it off in three months, which is a nice option. It took three tries and more than four days to set this up. Next, I asked that the gemologist look at two things for me and let me know. what he/she thinks. The Rep was not knowledgeable at all. Their time-line was a week.
When it reached two weeks, I called, they had no answer, so I cancelled. I don't need a diamond that badly That afternoon after I cancelled, I was notified the diamond was being sent. I didn't want it any more. The gemologist never answered my legitimate questions. It was very disappointing. But I got over it. , Hope you are well.

Annette
 

MissGotRocks

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Hi MissRocks,

While all the points you make are good, money and marketing have been responsible for the (my words) chaotic diamond industry. Luxury goods don't have a percentage of their goods low quality. I see it as elevating the diamond industry. They just have to re-direct their marketing and quality of goods to a higher level. Remove the junk. jUST MY MUSINGS.

Yes, I tried to purchase a diamond from James Allen. It was a bad experience. This was my second time trying to buy from James Allen. First, I wanted to pay it off in three months, which is a nice option. It took three tries and more than four days to set this up. Next, I asked that the gemologist look at two things for me and let me know. what he/she thinks. The Rep was not knowledgeable at all. Their time-line was a week.
When it reached two weeks, I called, they had no answer, so I cancelled. I don't need a diamond that badly That afternoon after I cancelled, I was notified the diamond was being sent. I didn't want it any more. The gemologist never answered my legitimate questions. It was very disappointing. But I got over it. , Hope you are well.

Annette

I am sorry the diamond didn’t work out for you. I have been buying and trading diamonds for many years now. The money and marketing as you say, has created a lot of angst for me over the years. That is why for me, in the diamond market, Whiteflash has been a breath of fresh air. They have their ACA diamonds in stock, have knowledgeable personnel to answer questions, and provide top notch customer service. Diamonds are expensive by nature and bad deals by those less scrupulous, cause money to be wasted and more wear and tear on the soul than I am willing to tolerate. I hope that you find the perfect diamond for you at a price that is comfortable for you.

All is well here and I hope it is with you too. Take care!
 

smitcompton

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Hi,
I admit my afternoon is not busy, so I offer up more comments on the strange world of diamonds.

In my mind I have compared the diamond world , and the luxury handbag world, and the luxury car world and this thought stands out to me.

No-one would consider buying a Maserati if the salesmen said. This car comes with a dented fender and has 3 spots on the leather upholstery. We have graded it an SI2 due to these imperfections. We have another Maserati with only a dent in its front fender and is graded an si 1. Any Takers?

What about a Gucci handbag? I have our latest model in the popular blue color, (to wear with jeans). It only has a small scratch on the back that is not deep, and I'm sure some shoe polish would improve that loo, but the front has a larger scratch in the leather. We have graded this a SI1. Its a very good buy.

Now, for a perfect Maserati, it will cost 2 million, and that perfect Gucci will set you back, $50000, Priced to perfection. We are competitive.

Diamonds work differently. Since change is occurring at present perhaps more change would be smart.

I enjoy thinking, even if unrealistic r making a fool of myself at times.

Annette:)
 

LightBright

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Does the Ideal grading from GIA happen in a typical grading report, or do you have to request it specially?

This looks like a new service where an AGS type report option has been added to GIA services that is separate and by request.

In other words, will their customary services lead to Ideal status if warranted or do you have to seek out that service?

Sorry for the Noobie question.
 

MissGotRocks

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Does the Ideal grading from GIA happen in a typical grading report, or do you have to request it specially?

This looks like a new service where an AGS type report option has been added to GIA services that is separate and by request.

In other words, will their customary services lead to Ideal status if warranted or do you have to seek out that service?

Sorry for the Noobie question.

This was the part of the explanation that @Texas Leaguer wrote:

Almost immediately after announcing the acquisition, GIA began offering a digital AGS Ideal addendum report for any qualifying diamond submitted to GIA for full grading. In order to qualify the diamond would have to pass the AGS ray tracer for light performance as Ideal, aka AGS 0. Any grade lower than 0 will disqualify a stone for eligibility for the new report.

I sort of read this to say that if the diamond qualifies for the AGS 0 grade, that report would accompany the GIA report. If that is the case, I assume you can’t request it because you can only get it if the diamond qualifies. I don’t know if there is an additional fee for it or not. Hopefully, he will come back for a more detailed answer to your question.
 

smitcompton

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Hi,

I just thought of another representation.

Customer at the Waterford Crystal Store.

Customer, Sir, where do have the seconds of Waterford crystal at the shop.

Saleman" Oh, madam, Waterford. unlike others, never sells seconds. If we make a mistake in the item, we throw it back into the kilns and it is remade to perfection. Our beautiful crystal pieces are graded FL. They give off sparkles like diamonds do.
Absolutely perfect.
Yes, the pieces are expensive, but not prohibitive. Many do enjoy them.

Annette
 

LightBright

Brilliant_Rock
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GIA for lab diamonds is hiding the growth method and treatments which the market has decided makes a difference in value.
Like De Beers and their for fun stuff only, they are trying to force the market using their 800lb gorilla status by hiding that information.
That is not consumer friendly.
For all diamonds off the lists I am personally going to assume a GIA report means treated cvd.
From a trustworthy stocking dealer its a discussion to have with them if they do not disclose it on their listing.
Frankly I wish the FTC would step in and demand disclosure.
I'm in the good crystal is good crystal and bad crystal sucks camp no matter how its made but the disclosure still should be made.

I agree the FTC needs to demand disclosure! It’s shocking they don’t.
 

LightBright

Brilliant_Rock
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Messages
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This was the part of the explanation that @Texas Leaguer wrote:

Almost immediately after announcing the acquisition, GIA began offering a digital AGS Ideal addendum report for any qualifying diamond submitted to GIA for full grading. In order to qualify the diamond would have to pass the AGS ray tracer for light performance as Ideal, aka AGS 0. Any grade lower than 0 will disqualify a stone for eligibility for the new report.

I sort of read this to say that if the diamond qualifies for the AGS 0 grade, that report would accompany the GIA report. If that is the case, I assume you can’t request it because you can only get it if the diamond qualifies. I don’t know if there is an additional fee for it or not. Hopefully, he will come back for a more detailed answer to your question.

Thank you, I have same questions hopefully Texas Leaguer or others can clarify. Is the report automatically given to all eligible stones? Or must customers request it and pay extra. In other words we might not know what we have so is Ideal status automatically disclosed/revealed. Or is it possible Ideal still falls through the cracks if you don’t request the additional investigation.
 

MissGotRocks

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Thank you, I have same questions hopefully Texas Leaguer or others can clarify. Is the report automatically given to all eligible stones? Or must customers request it and pay extra. In other words we might not know what we have so is Ideal status automatically disclosed/revealed. Or is it possible Ideal still falls through the cracks if you don’t request the additional investigation.

Well, I don’t know the answer definitively. If memory serves me correctly, the merger between GIA and AGS happened in December of last year. If GIA graded the diamond after the merger, then I would assume it would have been offered to you even if you had to pay a fee for it? If GIA graded the stone before December, then this wasn’t in place. I guess it would be possible to send your diamond to GIA for regrading to see if it qualified for the AGS 0 designation.
Hopefully, he will chime in here for clarification for you.
 

Texas Leaguer

Ideal_Rock
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I think this page answers several of the questions asked above.

CARLSBAD, California – April 16, 2024 – GIA (Gemological Institute of America), the world's foremost authority in gemology, is now offering printed AGS Ideal® Reports. This report complements a GIA diamond grading report to capture a diamond’s beauty holistically. The AGS Ideal Report measures light performance, including brightness, fire, and contrast, from center to edge.

From April 15 to May 15, 2024, GIA is offering the printed version of the AGS Ideal Report for just $2.50, a 50% discount. This limited-time promotion is available globally.

The AGS Ideal Report is available with the following GIA reports: Diamond Grading Report, Diamond Dossier, Laboratory-Grown Diamond Report, Laboratory-Grown Diamond Report Dossier, eReport, and Diamond Focus™ Report.

The fee for the printed AGS Ideal Report is in addition to the $25 price for the service. GIA will offer printed AGS Ideal Reports for clients with previously issued digital AGS Ideal Reports without having to resubmit the stone back to GIA. To order the printed report, click here: GIAokta.my.site.com/clientportal/s/p-agsiform

For more information, visit: GIA.edu/ags-ideal-report
 

MissGotRocks

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
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Messages
16,661
I think this page answers several of the questions asked above.

CARLSBAD, California – April 16, 2024 – GIA (Gemological Institute of America), the world's foremost authority in gemology, is now offering printed AGS Ideal® Reports. This report complements a GIA diamond grading report to capture a diamond’s beauty holistically. The AGS Ideal Report measures light performance, including brightness, fire, and contrast, from center to edge.

From April 15 to May 15, 2024, GIA is offering the printed version of the AGS Ideal Report for just $2.50, a 50% discount. This limited-time promotion is available globally.

The AGS Ideal Report is available with the following GIA reports: Diamond Grading Report, Diamond Dossier, Laboratory-Grown Diamond Report, Laboratory-Grown Diamond Report Dossier, eReport, and Diamond Focus™ Report.

The fee for the printed AGS Ideal Report is in addition to the $25 price for the service. GIA will offer printed AGS Ideal Reports for clients with previously issued digital AGS Ideal Reports without having to resubmit the stone back to GIA. To order the printed report, click here: GIAokta.my.site.com/clientportal/s/p-agsiform

For more information, visit: GIA.edu/ags-ideal-report

Thanks for the additional info!
 

LightBright

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
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Messages
1,757
I think this page answers several of the questions asked above.

CARLSBAD, California – April 16, 2024 – GIA (Gemological Institute of America), the world's foremost authority in gemology, is now offering printed AGS Ideal® Reports. This report complements a GIA diamond grading report to capture a diamond’s beauty holistically. The AGS Ideal Report measures light performance, including brightness, fire, and contrast, from center to edge.

From April 15 to May 15, 2024, GIA is offering the printed version of the AGS Ideal Report for just $2.50, a 50% discount. This limited-time promotion is available globally.

The AGS Ideal Report is available with the following GIA reports: Diamond Grading Report, Diamond Dossier, Laboratory-Grown Diamond Report, Laboratory-Grown Diamond Report Dossier, eReport, and Diamond Focus™ Report.

The fee for the printed AGS Ideal Report is in addition to the $25 price for the service. GIA will offer printed AGS Ideal Reports for clients with previously issued digital AGS Ideal Reports without having to resubmit the stone back to GIA. To order the printed report, click here: GIAokta.my.site.com/clientportal/s/p-agsiform

For more information, visit: GIA.edu/ags-ideal-report

Seems like a very reasonable price even un-discounted, to potentially validate the value of an Ideal Cut diamond.

Thank you very much for alerting us to this additional service (product of the GIA/AGS merger) and the discussion Texas Leaguer.
 
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