The Grammar Police Thread

[yennyfire]

Ohmygoodness, yes! Our Principal even sends out emails with errors! Gasp!

Yes, and then my children tell me that I’M wrong because there’s no way a teacher/principal could be incorrect. It boils my blood!

Other than all of those already mentioned, a couple others that bug me are when people say:

“Come see Anne and myself”....it’s “Come see Anne and me”....

“The girl THAT went to the mall”....people use “that” to describe a person, when it should be “The girl WHO went to the mall”...

Of course, my grammar is far from perfect, so other than trying to teach my children properly, I keep my thoughts to myself!

 

[MaisOuiMadame]

"per say" instead of "per se". Im not a native English speaker, but that is LATIN and doesn't have anything to do with what you are intending to "say".

 

[Madam Bijoux]

“Ink pen”. DUH: If it’s a pen, it contains some sort of ink. Whoever heard of a pencil pen?

 

[Madam Bijoux]

Using the word “Like” between every other word in a statement.

 

[AGBF]

“The girl THAT went to the mall”....people use “that” to describe a person, when it should be “The girl WHO went to the mall”...

"That" can be used to describe a person or a thing. "Who" can only be used to describe a person. "Which" can only be used to describe something inanimate.

 

[yennyfire]

"That" can be used to describe a person or a thing. "Who" can only be used to describe a person. "Which" can only be used to describe something inanimate.

Yes, I should have made that clearer.

 

[Dee*Jay]

In the vein of Madam B's ink pen... hot water heater.

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

Impact is a noun. You were not impacted by something you were affected.

Actually, impact is also a verb and is appropriate to be used as such in both the the transitive and intransitive senses.

 

[AGBF]

Actually, impact is also a verb and is appropriate to be used as such in both the the transitive and intransitive senses.

Sandy, I believe that the use of "impact" as a verb is very recent. Many people object to the trend of turning nouns into verbs and feel it is degrading English grammar. I do know that the phrase "impacted wisdom tooth" has been around for a while, however, so the word "impact" has clearly been used as more than a noun.

 

[Maria D]

From my hometown paper, the vagaries of AP style changes. It contains one of my pet peeves: when "more than" and "over" are interchanged.

https://mailtribune.com/tempo/the-f...ust-might-be-enough-to-reenergize-this-debate

The word "solution" is misspelled in the title!

Are copy editors no longer a thing? I see typos in my local paper, both in actual print and online, all the time.

 

[Matata]

The word "solution" is misspelled in the title!

Are copy editors no longer a thing?

Bahhahaaa. I didn't even notice. Usually when I find errors like that I circle them and send them to the editor A few weeks ago, the author's article was about staff cuts at the paper and how he was now writer, editor, and layout person. Good copy editors are rare.

Confession: As a former writer and editor, I am appalled by how mentally lazy I've become. The most frequent errors I make are the ones that bother me the most when other people make them -- misuse of their, there. I've even caught myself using they're instead of there

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

Sandy, I believe that the use of "impact" as a verb is very recent. Many people object to the trend of turning nouns into verbs and feel it is degrading English grammar. I do know that the phrase "impacted wisdom tooth" has been around for a while, however, so the word "impact" has clearly been used as more than a noun.

AGBF, if one were to consider the legendary Merriam-Webster as a reliable source, then it would appear that impact was first used as a verb and a couple of centuries later as a noun.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/yes-impact-is-a-verb

 

[clumberlove]

AGBF, if one were to consider the legendary Merriam-Webster as a reliable source, then it would appear that impact was first used as a verb and a couple of centuries later as a noun.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/yes-impact-is-a-verb

It just makes me flinch. It's a lazy use of language and seems ubiquitous these days. Everything is always impacting something else and it sounds horrendous. I will never accept it should be used as a verb, unless describing some awful bodily affliction.

 

[AV_]

You must have seen my so colled speling

 

[OreoRosies86]

Most of mine have been covered, but when people say "I find it ironic that..." when they are talking about something that's just coincidental.

 

[clumberlove]

Most of mine have been covered, but when people say "I find it ironic that..." when they are talking about something that's just coincidental.

It's all Alanis Morissette's fault! The only ironic thing about her song is that she wrote a song called "ironic" that didn't contain any irony.

 

[AGBF]

AGBF, if one were to consider the legendary Merriam-Webster as a reliable source, then it would appear that impact was first used as a verb and a couple of centuries later as a noun.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/yes-impact-is-a-verb

Sandy-I did not know "impact" was used in the distant past as a verb, only divining that it might have been from the phrase I mentioned above, "impacted wisdom tooth". I have never seen "impact' used as a verb in any old English or American literature I have read, however. I wonder if, in the distant past, before it became a noun*, it was used as it now is. In short, I wonder if people wrote or said simply that one thing impacted another. Do you know?

Deb

*I am taking it on faith that Merriiam-Webster is correct that "impact" was a verb prior to becoming a noun.

 

[AGBF]

I just clicked on the link you posted, Sandy, and see that I wouldn't have come across the use of "impact" as a verb (except in phrases such as "impacted wisdom tooth" or "impacted bowel") unless I were reading older English than I do. The use of impact as verb goes back centuries.

 

[Karl_K]

“Ink pen”. DUH: If it’s a pen, it contains some sort of ink. Whoever heard of a pencil pen?

quill pen - or just a pen.
ink pen - called that because they contain their own ink vs needing a bottle of ink.
Paint pen - contains paint instead of ink
gel pen - contains gel instead of ink.

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

I just clicked on the link you posted, Sandy, and see that I wouldn't have come across the use of "impact" as a verb (except in phrases such as "impacted wisdom tooth" or "impacted bowel") unless I were reading older English than I do. The use of impact as verb goes back centuries.

I am no etymologist by any stretch, but when I read about things that I have no knowledge of, only a perception of, I look it up. @clumberlove claimed that the word impact shouldn't be used as a verb, and I had never heard that before. Having worked in the legal field for so long, and in personal injury specifically, the word impact is often used and I had actually never heard even a hint of it's supposed use as a noun only. Knowledgeable attorneys are QUICK to point out errors of that nature!! That's why I looked into the use of the word as a verb, to see if I and dozens of attorneys I've worked with have used it incorrectly over the years.

I daresay that perhaps there are regional differences in education or usage, much like the uses of the words pop vs. soda, or sneakers vs. tennis shoes. I don't know, but I am satisfied that I was not ignorantly using the word impact improperly as a verb or adjective.

 

[clumberlove]

I am no etymologist by any stretch, but when I read about things that I have no knowledge of, only a perception of, I look it up. @clumberlove claimed that the word impact shouldn't be used as a verb, and I had never heard that before. Having worked in the legal field for so long, and in personal injury specifically, the word impact is often used and I had actually never heard even a hint of it's supposed use as a noun only. Knowledgeable attorneys are QUICK to point out errors of that nature!! That's why I looked into the use of the word as a verb, to see if I and dozens of attorneys I've worked with have used it incorrectly over the years.

I daresay that perhaps there are regional differences in education or usage, much like the uses of the words pop vs. soda, or sneakers vs. tennis shoes. I don't know, but I am satisfied that I was not ignorantly using the word impact improperly as a verb or adjective.

Maybe it is a difference between British and American usage. I have only known it used as a verb in the past decade or so. Previously I only ever heard "had an impact" or "the impact". I think it is part of a general trend of using nouns as verbs, which seems to be one of the ways modern English is changing. Language is always evolving so we will all have to accept new uses of language eventually. We don't have to like it though

 

[Matata]

I daresay that perhaps there are regional differences in education or usage, much like the uses of the words pop vs. soda, or sneakers vs. tennis shoes. I don't know, but I am satisfied that I was not ignorantly using the word impact improperly as a verb or adjective.

In additional to regional and cultural differences, I suspect there are words used in certain professions that, when used the same way in the mainstream, would be viewed as incorrect usage. I'm going to have to do some research into that because my interest is piqued.

 

[lissyflo]

In additional to regional and cultural differences, I suspect there are words used in certain professions that, when used the same way in the mainstream, would be viewed as incorrect usage. I'm going to have to do some research into that because my interest is piqued.

Definitely not preferred use, in the UK anyway!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-33223503

 

[Madam Bijoux]

quill pen - or just a pen.
ink pen - called that because they contain their own ink vs needing a bottle of ink.
Paint pen - contains paint instead of ink
gel pen - contains gel instead of ink.

I stand enlightened! Thanks for the clarification

 

[AGBF]

@Matata and @sandy -

I believe that I have lived through the changing of the use of "impact" and can tell you the story of its transition, in both British and American English-from use as a noun to use as a verb in the past 100 years. I didn't make the sweeping claim that it had never been a verb, but I might have done so in my ignorance of the history of its origins, had I been in a mood in which I was making sweeping pronouncements. As I have been writing (ad nauseum) only the niggling phrase "impacted tooth" kept me from being sure I was looking at a total noun in the word "impact". After all, a tooth could not be "impacted" by a noun. It had to be impacted by a verb.

In recent years people have begun to use the noun "impact' as a verb. As far as I know, and I do not read legal briefs but do read newspapers and magazines that quote them, this has not been done in business or in the legal field until recently. It hits the wrong note with those of us who read a great deal because it is not the use we are used to.

I found the following in my travels.

"Consider the following comments from Dictionary.reference.com/browse/impact:
Usage Note: The use of impact as a verb meaning “to have an effect” often has a big impact on readers. In our 2001 survey, 85 percent of the Usage Panel disapproved of the construction to impact on, as in the sentence These policies are impacting on our ability to achieve success; fully 80 percent disapproved of the use of impact as a transitive verb in the sentence The court ruling will impact the education of minority students. It is unclear why this usage provokes such a strong response, but it cannot be because of novelty. Impact has been used as a verb since 1601, when it meant “to fix or pack in,” and its modern, figurative use dates from 1935. It may be that its frequent appearance in the jargon-riddled remarks of politicians, military officials, and financial analysts continues to make people suspicious. Nevertheless, the verbal use of impact has become so common in the working language of corporations and institutions that many speakers have begun to regard it as standard. It seems likely, then, that the verb will eventually become as unobjectionable as contact is now, since it will no longer betray any particular pretentiousness on the part of those who use it."

https://www.grammar.com/Impact-as-a-Verb

 

[Matata]

I believe that I have lived through the changing of the use of "impact" and can tell you the story of its transition

There are things I must endure but will never perpetuate (at least while in a state of sobriety) and using impact as a verb is one of them.

 

[AGBF]

Maybe it is a difference between British and American usage. I have only known it used as a verb in the past decade or so. Previously I only ever heard "had an impact" or "the impact". I think it is part of a general trend of using nouns as verbs, which seems to be one of the ways modern English is changing. Language is always evolving so we will all have to accept new uses of language eventually. We don't have to like it though

As we have discussed in other threads, the difference in perspective is that of linguistics experts versus grammarians. Grammarians try to enforce the rules of grammar in a language as they exist. Experts in linguistics follow a language as it changes, noting how and why it has done so. Most languages change. Ebonics comes to mind. Languages change less when the people who speak them are isolated, caught in a ghetto. That is why the Sephardic Jews of the Ottoman Empire spoke a Spanish (Ladino) that was closer to ancient Spanish than the modern people in Spain do. The Jews were isolated from others as they spoke their Spanish to each other.

Deb

 

[AGBF]

In additional to regional and cultural differences, I suspect there are words used in certain professions that, when used the same way in the mainstream, would be viewed as incorrect usage. I'm going to have to do some research into that because my interest is piqued.

Your posting reminded me of something else I do not like. I do not like to see someone write that his interest has been "peaked". Nor do I like to read that someone "towed the line". And, please, don't get me started on the pudding and now the expression that things are "baked in". The expression that actually made sense was "The proof of the pudding is in the eating". I feel lucky, now, if I hear someone on television say "The proof is in the pudding" (which makes no sense). Usually I hear something is baked in, instead.

No one cares if he makes sense when he speaks anymore.

AGBF

 

[AGBF]

If this thread continues, I may hit 20,000 postings while ranting about grammar!

AGBF

 

[clumberlove]

As we have discussed in other threads, the difference in perspective is that of linguistics experts versus grammarians. Grammarians try to enforce the rules of grammar in a language as they exist. Experts in linguistics follow a language as it changes, noting how and why it has done so. Most languages change. Ebonics comes to mind. Languages change less when the people who speak them are isolated, caught in a ghetto. That is why the Sephardic Jews of the Ottoman Empire spoke a Spanish (Ladino) that was closer to ancient Spanish than the modern people in Spain do. The Jews were isolated from others as they spoke their Spanish to each other.

Deb

I do feel that I may be a slightly hypocritical grammar pedant, as I do not always use correct grammar in my spoken language. I have a fairly strong regional accent, which does not always lend itself to correct grammar unless I am concentrating. For context, I don't know if you've ever read the redwall books, my accent is a milder version of how the moles speak. As I previously stated I work in science so I find it important to use written language precisely in order to properly convey information. I try to speak better in a professional context