Sounds Like Operation Upgrade is About to Commence...

[mrsgreeneyes]

I don't even tell my husband half the things that go on at work because I can't mention them without him trying to fix them. I've given up and only talk about work with girl friends.

Agreed. And when I do tell him something that’s going on, I preface it with saying, “I’m venting, I don’t need you to fix this.” And yet still...

 

[msop04]

Yes, melee was designed and built to match the center stone perfectly. DK even upgraded their stones to a better cut quality. I guess I should check with them to see what center stone I can add without creating a problem.

I didn't see the BGD Black you posted, but then again I searched for more carat weight. That particular stone is only 5.73x5.74. That's too much of a size difference IMO.

Keep in mind, she has a larger table so spread is better. 6.18x6.21 so it will rival most stones in the lower 0.90ct range.

And yes, due to the setting being custom designed, I need dimensions that are similar.

I saw some WF options too. This is where I'm kind of kicking myself as I didn't see a future "upgrade" coming so soon and WF is a vendor that currently has about 9 choices in the 0.856 - 0.930ct range, F+ color, $6,700 or less. But only one for the same dollars, although I could probably add a little scratch to the mix to get what we need. I'd just prefer to use that cash for the wedding.

The melee is going to look whiter and brighter than the center due to the smaller flashes. Therefore, if you decided to upgrade the center stone for an F color, then it would still be fine. If she thought an H is "pastel yellow", there is no way I'd get a G. I think F is a ripoff bc it's the tail end of the colorless range, but you're still paying for colorless... however, it would be much less expensive than a D or E.

What color environment was she looking at this ring? Were the walls off white or was the lighting less than stellar?? I can understand seeing "tint" in an H if suuuuper sensitive, but pastel yellow??? Nope.

 

[Wewechew]

Agreed. And when I do tell him something that’s going on, I preface it with saying, “I’m venting, I don’t need you to fix this.” And yet still...

YES!!!!!!!

 

[msop04]

Wait... didn't your lady choose this stone from the two you posted?? I may be confusing threads, but I thought you showed her the stone.

 

[msop04]

I know you put so much thought and effort into this so I'm sure you were quite surprised! I really believe (and there have been multiple accounts here on PS) that AGS is ever so slightly softer on color so your AGS H might be closer to a GIA I and that's where people usually start to notice tint. I'm not starting a debate on this but just saying I tend to agree so I would advise if you DO go the upgrade route, that you wait for an F which might be more like a GIA G. Also agree with you on not going much lower in size - staying at or just above the 6mm mark if you want to stay at something comparable or of course a little larger wouldn't hurt either haha

Btw, I chucked to myself reading this....it's so true and I do it ALL the time

Ahhhh... it was an AGS H! Yeah... hmmmm.... I think it's time to have the discussion of size vs color. Also, I would NOT have that setting remade. It was a PITA with a lot of blood, sweat, and tears for you! ...and it's exactly what she wanted. That said, I think you could set a somewhat smaller stone in it just fine. I'd ask DK to tell you the smallest diameter it could hold and still keep its aesthetic.

 

[Gussie]

I think I am going to tell DH about my DSS that way he can fix it!

 

[Babyblue033]

Conversations between a man and a woman quite often result in misunderstanding because the man will go off looking for a solution to a problem when the woman just wanted to talk about it.

Boy ain't that the truth. Often times I regret bringing up a topic because it spirals into something massive when all I wanted to do was to share something. In this case, did she mention the color because she is unhappy about it or just as something she noticed? Maybe she was surprised she was this color sensitive and was simply commenting. And now will she be unhappy/frustrated because you're now talking/worrying about the wall colors at her work, her tanned skin, and nitpicking at her beautiful ring and making her feel worse about it?

 

[Wewechew]

I think I am going to tell DH about my DSS that way he can fix it!

If your husband is anything like mine, that's the ONE thing he has no desire to try to fix.

 

[msop04]

More importantly, she did not appreciate me nit picking her ring and said maybe I should ask her what she wants. I did, and she said nothing. She loves the ring as it is and it need not be perfect as she understands no diamond is perfect.

While that is an awesome answer. My concern with accepting it is that she loves it because I gave it to her and she is choosing to accept the imperfections to avoid hurting me or appearing materialistic. I've tried to reassure her none of that is going on but she keeps saying, "really, it's fine". My experience is that is the biggest oxymoron I've ever heard when it rolls off a woman's lips.

Wait... what?? I'm so confused by what she said here.

I'm having difficulty with this this statement, and it makes me sad for you, @sledge. We all know how you agonized over every single detail (no matter how "minor") in order to give your girl an amazing diamond and setting in a quality that she would've never received with the inspiration ring. I think I probably need to refrain from commenting on this part. <le sigh>

As you mentioned earlier, I think she needs to wear her ring and compare it with GIA XXX graded stones in the local shops to test her tolerance and preference for color.

 

[msop04]

@sledge
Another thought just popped into my head... do you think she may prefer the whiter flashes of a more 60/60 proportioned stone? I know that's blasphemy for some, but it may be that she does actually prefer it. If so, then you could possibly save some cash by upgrading the color and going with a 60/60 with great angles and be able to keep the size pretty much the same. Just a thought...

 

[msop04]

If your husband is anything like mine, that's the ONE thing he has no desire to try to fix.

Gosh, so true! What is wrong with these men of ours??

 

[sledge]

Does the tint bother her? Maybe she says that it's pastel yellow just as a descriptive fact and doesn't want to change anything. It's as if she's discovering some aspect of a tangible object she hasn't noticed before.

Conversations between a man and a woman quite often result in misunderstanding because the man will go off looking for a solution to a problem when the woman just wanted to talk about it.

I'm not sure to be honest. I know last night, she just blurted out "my diamond is yellow". I kind of blew it off and laughed because for awhile now she has given me grief about getting an "orange & black" diamond. I think she has done this for two reasons:

1. She busted me looking on BGD's website before I bought, proposed, etc. BGD's colors are black & orange. Additionally I was looking at an ASET and they use orange, purple & green for their ASET imaging instead of the traditional red, green & blue like most everyone else.
2. These are the colors of the college where I got my undergrad degree. Same school as her undergrad actually but she also has her masters which is what she supports for familial reasons & also because it supersedes her undergrad. Plus she only chose the undergrad college based on strength of program and convenience. She preferred to go elsewhere, so she's never really connected to the undergrad college.

Anyhow, I finally figured out she wasn't joking. I started inspecting but was wearing a lime green polo and it was reflecting big time in the stone. She then further clarified with it being tinted, pastel yellow but more faint, etc. Shortly after she went to bed because she wasn't feeling good.

This morning she said it wasn't a big deal, and it was "fine" and that maybe I was over analyzing the situation. I agreed to back off and will give her some time to have the conversation again, if she wants. My concern is it is a problem and the longer we wait, the less options I will have with BGD. Also I don't want her living with a stone she isn't happy with but "afraid" to say something about.

And yes, I agree....as men, we tend to want to fix everything. The good news is we do it because we care about you ladies.

 

[msop04]

I'm not sure to be honest. I know last night, she just blurted out "my diamond is yellow". I kind of blew it off and laughed because for awhile now she has given me grief about getting an "orange & black" diamond. I think she has done this for two reasons:

1. She busted me looking on BGD's website before I bought, proposed, etc. BGD's colors are black & orange. Additionally I was looking at an ASET and they use orange, purple & green for their ASET imaging instead of the traditional red, green & blue like most everyone else.
2. These are the colors of the college where I got my undergrad degree. Same school as her undergrad actually but she also has her masters which is what she supports for familial reasons & also because it supersedes her undergrad. Plus she only chose the undergrad college based on strength of program and convenience. She preferred to go elsewhere, so she's never really connected to the undergrad college.

Anyhow, I finally figured out she wasn't joking. I started inspecting but was wearing a lime green polo and it was reflecting big time in the stone. She then further clarified with it being tinted, pastel yellow but more faint, etc. Shortly after she went to bed because she wasn't feeling good.

Okay... so from a female's POV, I can tell you that if it was "fine" she wouldn't have mentioned it was yellow. That doesn't mean it's necessarily a "problem," but it did bother her enough to tell you. My opinion is that if she sees yellow, then it's not going to go away. I would be frank with her, as you are in a time crunch to "fix" it for her. You've worked to hard for there to be "niceties" in order to avoid hurt feelings or some other nonsense. This was a painstaking and expensive purchase, and I know you just want her to love it. If "okay" was good enough, then you would've gotten the ring from Kay or Jared. It's more easily fixable if you act sooner than later... Ya'll will be married and there will be much more serious issues you'll have to deal with. It's time for #realtalk.

This morning she said it wasn't a big deal, and it was "fine" and that maybe I was over analyzing the situation. I agreed to back off and will give her some time to have the conversation again, if she wants. My concern is it is a problem and the longer we wait, the less options I will have with BGD. Also I don't want her living with a stone she isn't happy with but "afraid" to say something about.

And yes, I agree....as men, we tend to want to fix everything. The good news is we do it because we care about you ladies.

OMG... I had a dang novel and it didn't post... brb.

 

[farrahlyn]

I've tried to reassure her none of that is going on but she keeps saying, "really, it's fine". My experience is that is the biggest oxymoron I've ever heard when it rolls off a woman's lips.

 

[TreeScientist]

Conversations between a man and a woman quite often result in misunderstanding because the man will go off looking for a solution to a problem when the woman just wanted to talk about it.

Damn, this is so true. I figured this out about a year into my first long term relationship. Every time she told me about her problems, I took that as an invitation to offer my opinion on what she should do. Because why else would a human tell you a novelette about their problem unless they wanted advice on how to solve it? (guy thinking) Then I would just make her more upset by offering my advice. This led to her eventually just not telling me most of her problems... but I would still be able to tell there was something going on by the way she was acting... so I would ask her what is wrong... And she would say "Nothing, I'M FINE"... which led to more frustration.

About one year in I Googled something like "Why do women tell men their problems but don't want advice?" and got a huge number of hits. Apparently I wasn't the only guy confused about this, but there were quite a few articles explaining that women need to emotionally process their problems, so when they're "venting out loud" to you, they're usually not looking for you to butt in with a solution.

So I changed my approach. Whenever my girlfriend came to me to vent, I started just using slightly modified versions of the classic therapist "I see. So how does that make you feel?" line. And, by golly, it worked!

I've continued the "Just keep your big mouth shut and and listen Tree" approach, and it has made my relationships with women so much better. I've realized that between 95-99% of the time, women don't want a solution to their problem. And if they do, they'll most likely come out and ask after they're done venting "So what do you think I should do?" at which point I've learned that it's OK to open my big mouth. I've even started asking during the venting session "“Is this is a problem that you want help solving? Or do you just want to vent?” Get it right out there in the open right away.

I have no clue why this is not taught to all young boys before they hit puberty and start dating. Would make our lives so much easier from the get-go.

 

[sledge]

@sledge
Another thought just popped into my head... do you think she may prefer the whiter flashes of a more 60/60 proportioned stone? I know that's blasphemy for some, but it may be that she does actually prefer it. If so, then you could possibly save some cash by upgrading the color and going with a 60/60 with great angles and be able to keep the size pretty much the same. Just a thought...

Hmmm...possibly. I hadn't thought of that; however, the table is 57.9 with a depth of 60.1 so I wouldn't think I'd see a drastic difference but I could be wrong.

Also she mentioned the diamond is white to her from the top. She sees the tint when she catches the side of the stone. Which makes sense as stones are graded from the side.

I think this is a situation where her setting is causing me problems because it's not really hiding the weakness of an H colored stone very well. In fact its exposing it. I should have caught this in the design phase and either adjusted the setting or swapped stones then.

 

[msop04]

Let's try this again... only much less detailed. *booooo*

From a female POV, I can tell you that if the color wasn't a "big deal" then she wouldn't have mentioned that it looked yellow to her. If she sees yellow now, it's my opinion that it will not change... and neither will her feelings about it. You need to be frank with her. This is fixable, but the longer you wait will cost more money. Ya'll will be married soon, and there will be much more serious issues you'll have to deal with... It's time for #realtalk.

 

[TreeScientist]

God I love this one. I'm saving this to show to my fiancé.

 

[msop04]

Hmmm...possibly. I hadn't thought of that; however, the table is 57.9 with a depth of 60.1 so I wouldn't think I'd see a drastic difference but I could be wrong.

Also she mentioned the diamond is white to her from the top. She sees the tint when she catches the side of the stone. Which makes sense as stones are graded from the side.

I think this is a situation where her setting is causing me problems because it's not really hiding the weakness of an H colored stone very well. In fact its exposing it. I should have caught this in the design phase and either adjusted the setting or swapped stones then.

The setting isn't your problem. She wanted that setting, set high. If she's worried about the color from the side, then she prefers a higher color.

ETA: an H isn't a low color... she is just very sensitive.

 

[msop04]

@sledge, what was the color of the stone in the inspiration ring from Kay/Jared/maul shop? Is it possible that she just has more time to "examine" the ring now that it's on her hot little hand?? Not that it changes how she views the color, but I'm just trying to make sense of it all...

 

[atp223]

Is the color she is seeing possibly attributable to the environment (e.g. surrounding colors of walls) and/or lighting where she is/lives/goes/works? Because if so - and others with high color diamonds can chime in here to confirm - I’m not sure how much ‘improvement’ she may see unless those factors change as well.

And please know that I’m not trying to rain on your shopping parade at all. Just thinking through the possibilities as you embark on possibly upgrading the stone with BGD’s requirements and finding a similarly sized diamond to fit that gorgeous setting. This gang will for sure help if that’s what is needed.

I came here to say the same thing! Seeing color in a BGD H of that size really surprises me. My almost 3 carat I colored sig H&A we just got from them (with negligible fluoro) looks bright white outside and in most rooms in our house. In our kitchen, which has cream colored cabinets and light brownish granite, with soft white overhead lights (2700 K), it looks a little tinted. But I attribute that tint to the surroundings, not the actual stone. I don’t know which indoor lights have fluorescence and which don’t, so I don’t know how to tell you to check and make sure it’s not the fluorescence making it look whiter, but I would encourage her to check it out in different rooms and different environments to see if she is always seeing that tint...

Good luck!

 

[sledge]

LOL thanks, I needed that!

Damn, this is so true. I figured this out about a year into my first long term relationship. Every time she told me about her problems, I took that as an invitation to offer my opinion on what she should do. Because why else would a human tell you a novelette about their problem unless they wanted advice on how to solve it? (guy thinking) Then I would just make her more upset by offering my advice. This led to her eventually just not telling me most of her problems... but I would still be able to tell there was something going on by the way she was acting... so I would ask her what is wrong... And she would say "Nothing, I'M FINE"... which led to more frustration.

About one year in I Googled something like "Why do women tell men their problems but don't want advice?" and got a huge number of hits. Apparently I wasn't the only guy confused about this, but there were quite a few articles explaining that women need to emotionally process their problems, so when they're "venting out loud" to you, there usually not looking for you to butt in with a solution.

So I changed my approach. Whenever my girlfriend came to me to vent, I started just using slightly modified versions of the classic therapist "I see. So how does that make you feel?" line. And, by golly, it worked!

I've continued the "Just keep your big mouth shut and and listen Tree" approach, and it has made my relationships with women so much better. I've realized that between 95-99% of the time, women don't want a solution to their problem. And if they do, they'll most likely come out and ask after they're done venting "So what do you think I should do?" at which point I've learned that it's OK to open my big mouth. I've even started asking during the venting session "“Is this is a problem that you want help solving? Or do you just want to vent?” Get it right out there in the open right away.

I have no clue why this is not taught to all young boys before they hit puberty and start dating. Would make our lives so much easier from the get-go.

Haha yeah I've tried that. Mid stream I've caught myself and re centered myself. I have concluded I like to fix things and save people.

While they can be strengths, they are also weaknesses.

While I don't want to make this a big ordeal I just want to fix it now while we have more options and it's less costly than deal with suppressed feelings, etc and have it be a bigger issue later.

Let's try this again... only much less detailed. *booooo*

From a female POV, I can tell you that if the color wasn't a "big deal" then she wouldn't have mentioned that it looked yellow to her. If she sees yellow now, it's my opinion that it will not change... and neither will her feelings about it. You need to be frank with her. This is fixable, but the longer you wait will cost more money. Ya'll will be married soon, and there will be much more serious issues you'll have to deal with... It's time for #realtalk.

Sorry you lost your post. But thank you for typing it again!

This is what I tried this AM but she wasn't receptive. Either it's really okay or she is refusing to deal with it. I have a feeling it's the latter and will try again face to face instead of over the phone.

 

[msop04]

I came here to say the same thing! Seeing color in a BGD H of that size really surprises me. My almost 3 carat I colored sig H&A we just got from them (with negligible fluoro) looks bright white outside and in most rooms in our house. In our kitchen, which has cream colored cabinets and light brownish granite, with soft white overhead lights (2700 K), it looks a little tinted. But I attribute that tint to the surroundings, not the actual stone. I don’t know which indoor lights have fluorescence and which don’t, so I don’t know how to tell you to check and make sure it’s not the fluorescence making it look whiter, but I would encourage her to check it out in different rooms and different environments to see if she is always seeing that tint...

Good luck!

+100!

P.S. take her to Walmart for viewing, and she'll love it again.

 

[farrahlyn]

OK, i just had to post the above memes, they are some of my favorites as I am guilty of "IM FINE" as well. Women are crazy sometimes. Just go with it.

so i agree with the comments that you need to have a frank discussion but give her some time to think about it for a day or two. Start off by "i don't want to upset you by bringing this up. You should know, I LOVED creating your ring, i did it because i wanted it to be everything YOU wanted and i wanted it to be absolutely beautiful. I only want you to be happy with it! Please know that if you are unhappy with the stone and the tint will bug you, i would absolutely be happy changing the stone. i love you and i want you to be happy with it forever."

I hope your conversation with her goes well!

 

[msop04]

While I don't want to make this a big ordeal I just want to fix it now while we have more options and it's less costly than deal with suppressed feelings, etc and have it be a bigger issue later.
Sorry you lost your post. But thank you for typing it again!

This is what I tried this AM but she wasn't receptive. Either it's really okay or she is refusing to deal with it. I have a feeling it's the latter and will try again face to face instead of over the phone.

I feel you are right... you need to reinforce that it's totally okay, but she needs to tell you NOW so it can be fixed. Tell here this exactly (in bold red above). If she STILL won't give you a direct answer, then you can rest easy knowing that you've done everything you can to make her happy. However, I know I'd probably say "screw this" and just switch out the damn stone for an F and nip it in the bud to avoid future issues.

Disclaimer: I don't know anything about your fiancé other than what has been posted, but I am female (and admittedly a difficult one, at that), and I used to play this game too. It took a while for me to figure out that it doesn't get me what I want in the long run -- it even makes it worse, so now I just say what I want and what I mean.

 

[farrahlyn]

God I love this one. I'm saving this to show to my fiancé.

It aint nothin but the truth! Even my 9 year old son has learned that when mom has had enough and says curtly "ok, fine. go ahead!" that he better back up and rethink what hes saying or doing!

 

[baby monster]

I'm not sure to be honest. I know last night, she just blurted out "my diamond is yellow". I kind of blew it off and laughed because for awhile now she has given me grief about getting an "orange & black" diamond. I think she has done this for two reasons:

1. She busted me looking on BGD's website before I bought, proposed, etc. BGD's colors are black & orange. Additionally I was looking at an ASET and they use orange, purple & green for their ASET imaging instead of the traditional red, green & blue like most everyone else.
2. These are the colors of the college where I got my undergrad degree. Same school as her undergrad actually but she also has her masters which is what she supports for familial reasons & also because it supersedes her undergrad. Plus she only chose the undergrad college based on strength of program and convenience. She preferred to go elsewhere, so she's never really connected to the undergrad college.

Anyhow, I finally figured out she wasn't joking. I started inspecting but was wearing a lime green polo and it was reflecting big time in the stone. She then further clarified with it being tinted, pastel yellow but more faint, etc. Shortly after she went to bed because she wasn't feeling good.

This morning she said it wasn't a big deal, and it was "fine" and that maybe I was over analyzing the situation. I agreed to back off and will give her some time to have the conversation again, if she wants. My concern is it is a problem and the longer we wait, the less options I will have with BGD. Also I don't want her living with a stone she isn't happy with but "afraid" to say something about.

And yes, I agree....as men, we tend to want to fix everything. The good news is we do it because we care about you ladies.

Good idea to table this for a while, let it percolate. IMO bring it up again in a few weeks and ask her if she wants to change the stone to a higher color. I'm sure she knows you want her to be happy with the ring.

 

[msop04]

I want to add that you're handling this situation with the utmost sensitivity and care, @sledge. You sound like good marriage material to me!

(can you talk to Mr. msop04 for me, please?? mama needs an upgrade!! )

 

[LightBright]

First, I love the setting you designed. The profile is magnificent. I love the way the diamond’s profile is exposed; to me one of the pleasures of diamonds is being able to see the exposed pavilion exactly as shown in your meticulously designed setting, so one can admire the color from the side.

If you are going to go for a whiter stone, take the following with a grain of salt.

I’m very color sensitive. As someone who was bothered by the tint of a G, I finally in the end told myself only AGS certified E (or GIA certified F) was the way to go. I have an AGS E now and it’s ~just~ white enough, although not as white as my GIA E that I lost. You might try out a couple Fs and Es side by side to see if you can find one “white enough”. You might try medium fluorescence, if your fiancé is okay with that. Honestly, I would select an SI1 ACA or CBI with the help/assessment of a trusted gemologist (I’m not sure how BGD handles inclusions but I’m sure it’s the same rigorous assessment) to get a larger and whiter stone. Both companies (BGD might too) have rigorous standards on inclusions. You will not see inclusions in a sub one carat superideal without difficulty. I urge people not to buy into the idea that (minute carefully assessed) flaws in a natural diamond are indicative of a lack of integrity or value. I love my rock, and the minute speck of inclusion is a natural part of my rock. “Senior level” eyesight doesn’t hurt either. A note on cut. Stick with superideal of any brand. It makes a huge difference and is worth the premium.

 

[atp223]

I posted before I finished reading the thread and being seeing the pics of how open it is on the sides. It sounds like you have a good understanding of the issue. I’ve now had two BGD I’s and if you looked hard you could definitely see color from the side. But my settings have never been nearly as open as yours.

It just seems like such a hassle and financial burden to redo everything - especially when it’s possible she was just making an observation and doesn’t really care. I totally do this to my husband - he thinks I am complaining, but I’m really just making an observation. I hope this is the case for you!