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SOS help me please OEC

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stci

Ideal_Rock
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I believed to have found the diamond of my dreams and I had reserved it but I find another one that I adore.

I found it at Abazias but not certified. I have write to John at Abazias and he said to me that it was possible that diamond either less although what it's write in specifications. I don't know anymore what to do. Do I run a very large risk by buying this diamond?

Here is the specifications from Abazias:

Carat Weight: 0.87
Color: I
Clarity: SI1
Depth%: 56.2
Table %: 65
Symmetry: GD
Polish: GD
Girdle: TN-
Culet: MD
Fluorescence: NO
Measurements: 6.44x6.30x3.58 Cut Grade: N/A

Please please help me!
 

JulieN

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Huge table. Get a picture.

Independent appraisal? AGA?

Tell them you're sending it there first and see if they come up with something else for you.
 

FacetFire

Brilliant_Rock
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Jun 26, 2006
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This is an OEC? Are you sure the depth and table aren't mixed up? Because those would be more normal specs for OECs if they were reversed...

If these are the correct specs, I would shy away...that table won't deliver the fire that OECs are known for...
 

simplysplendid

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Hi there,

I am also shopping for an OEC and I too was tempted by FacetFire''s beeyooteeful OEC. I have been looking since December 06 and have only recently managed to find one that I am asking for opinion on. I must say it is very tough looking for a little beauty over the internet and you probably have the same experiences that I have from some of the websites - the pictures are either unclear or may have receive little or no response from the vendor..

Anyway, good luck and enjoy the search!
 

stci

Ideal_Rock
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Date: 1/23/2007 10:51:09 PM
Author: FacetFire
This is an OEC? Are you sure the depth and table aren't mixed up? Because those would be more normal specs for OECs if they were reversed...

If these are the correct specs, I would shy away...that table won't deliver the fire that OECs are known for...
I don't understand why you say that FacetFire? Could you explain for me please? I can't find a site which could give me the best specifications of an OEC diamond.
 

stci

Ideal_Rock
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Jan 7, 2007
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2,514
I saw around fifty OEC until now and only one had a table of less than 60% (54% at Abazias).

Would it be impossible to find a beautiful OEC by Internet?

And... I have a question please. There would be a difference between Old European Cut and European Cut?
 

FacetFire

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 26, 2006
Messages
1,879
OECs are known for having smaller tables and higher crowns--often resulting in a deeper stone also. This is the only chart that I know of that attempts to give cut grades to OECs, which really do need to be viewed, but it can be very helpful in guiding you...

http://www.gemappraisers.com/oldcutgraderules.asp
 

stci

Ideal_Rock
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Thank you FacetFire!
 

stci

Ideal_Rock
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Finaly, I'm lost... I'm gonna cry in my bed... I search since many weeks and I can't found my diamond... I think my budget is too small...

I'm discouraged...
 

simplysplendid

Brilliant_Rock
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Nov 19, 2006
Messages
1,772
Hi there,

Don''t be discouraged! It takes a while to find a real beauty.. I have been searching a number of OEC threads and reading about them before starting my search in December. Facetfire''s link above to the gemappraiser.com website is very helpful. Alternatively, how about one that is already set in an original antique ring, I think that will be gorgeous too. I love antique-y jewelry and will begin looking for an antique ring similar to what Vix has got. I think Vix''s ring is gorgeous.

By the way, what size stone are you looking for? How about downgrading the size and looking for a better cut?
 

kcoursolle

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 21, 2006
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10,589
Don''t get discouraged, finding a really nicely cut diamond is not easy. Pictures really help with fancy cuts if you can get one.
 

diagem

Ideal_Rock
Trade
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Date: 1/23/2007 9:59:41 PM
Author:stci
I believed to have found the diamond of my dreams and I had reserved it but I find another one that I adore.

I found it at Abazias but not certified. I have write to John at Abazias and he said to me that it was possible that diamond either less although what it''s write in specifications. I don''t know anymore what to do. Do I run a very large risk by buying this diamond?

Here is the specifications from Abazias:

Carat Weight: 0.87
Color: I
Clarity: SI1
Depth%: 56.2
Table %: 65
Symmetry: GD
Polish: GD
Girdle: TN-
Culet: MD
Fluorescence: NO
Measurements: 6.44x6.30x3.58 Cut Grade: N/A

Please please help me!
If this is an OEC diamond, than the numbers don''t say anything.
You have got to look at the stone with your own eyes and make decisions based on your taste!
True, it has a bit of a large table for and OEC, BUT..., its a very spready stone and the 65% table could possibly complement a 0.87 ct. 6.4-6.3mm diameter.
I would imagine that the face up appearance would depend on the lgf of this stone.... and the division of the crown height vs. pavilion depth and angles....

Not all OEC are cut deep!!! please remember that these diamonds were cut allmost 100 years ago (1900-1930''s +/-) and back in those days, a lot of cutters cut the best diamond they could from the rough diamond material they had. you can find very heavy OEC and Flat ones, and both possibilities can be amazingly gorgeous gems... it is up to your eyes only!!!
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Messages
37,598
Based on all the numbers posted, this is a very shallow but spready stone. In short, it will look very big for its carat weight. HOWEVER, the 56% depth makes me wonder if it could possibly have a fish eye.
That is not a good thing. It also most likely has a low crown height. I would definitely pass on this stone.

I suppose you are looking for an OEC. What are your specs in terms of size, colour, clarity and cost, if I may ask?
 

stci

Ideal_Rock
Joined
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2,514
Thank you for your responses everybody!

I would like:

Size: biggest as possible!

Color: I or better
Clarity: SI1 or better
table: + - 50%

My ENORMOUS budget is 2000$
 

FacetFire

Brilliant_Rock
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1,879
This one might be worth finding out more about: http://antiqueengagementrings.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=1573

And I know this one might be a bit above your budget, and color is lower than you'd like, but I just think it's a gorgeous OEC and had to show it to you: http://antiqueengagementrings.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=1549

Try not to get frustrated! It can really be tricky! There are tons of little antique jewelers out there that don't have websites, either. Are you able to visit any local stores?
 

Vix

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
134
SimplySplendid, thank you so much for the compliments on my ring! While I read up on older cuts on Pricescope and elsewhere before looking, in the end I just went with what I loved and what fit the budget (under $1000).


Stci, you have done a lot more hunting than I ever did...your frustration is understandable! I second the recommendation to look locally as well. I''m in a small city -- not sure about your location -- but I started off by looking at a couple of high-end antique jewelry shops, then went down to the pawnshop/estate jewelry storefronts and asked about older cuts. The latter move is how I got referred to "The Guy" who handles the bulk of older diamonds. [Including ones that at least one of the fancy shops source FROM him!]

Per my jeweler, I do have a European cut vs an OEC (my ring and setting are ~ 1920s). I think this is a reputable explanation. Good luck in your hunt!


European Cut
Obsolete. A diamond brilliant whose proportions were worked out mathematically for light falling perpendicularly on the crown. It was never adopted as a common form of cutting. The angle of the pavilion facets to the girdle is 38° 40’; of the bezel facets, 41° 6’. The table is 56% of the girdle diameter; crown depth, 19%; and pavilion depth, 40%. It is not to be confused with the old European cut.

http://www.diamondarticles.com/diamond-glossary.php
 

diamondsrock

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 5, 2005
Messages
970
stci the rings facefire posted are incredible and worth taking a look at. Both are really beautiful.

This is a really nice one well under your budget but I''m thinking you''d like a larger stone:

http://www.jamesmeyerjewelry.com/1227.html

This jeweler does a lot of older cut diamonds in platinum milgrain bezels which I just adore. I think it really complements the diamond and protects it as well.

Good luck in your search!
 

Shay37

Ideal_Rock
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Messages
3,343
Date: 1/24/2007 8:39:56 PM
Author: diamondsrock
stci the rings facefire posted are incredible and worth taking a look at. Both are really beautiful.

This is a really nice one well under your budget but I''m thinking you''d like a larger stone:

http://www.jamesmeyerjewelry.com/1227.html

This jeweler does a lot of older cut diamonds in platinum milgrain bezels which I just adore. I think it really complements the diamond and protects it as well.

Good luck in your search!
Diamondsrock, you bad bad girl. You have led me to the site of eyecandy that I may not be strong enough to resist. Arrrrrgggghhh!!!!


shay
 

diamondsrock

Brilliant_Rock
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Messages
970
lol Shay! I found out about that jeweler from this board (I think?) quite a while back and saved it under my favorites. He has some really cool stuff!
 

stci

Ideal_Rock
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Jan 7, 2007
Messages
2,514
Now, I have two choises:

I would like to have your opinion... which one

Choise #1:

.80 carats
K color
Table: 48%
Measurement: 5.90 x 3.75
Clarity: SI1
Price: 2250$
From: AntiqueEngagementRing.com
CERTIFIED






Choise #2:
.85 carats
E - F color
Table: ?
Measurement: 5.75 x 5.60 x 3.65
Clarity: SI1
Price: 1699$
From: Ebay.com
INDEPENDANT APPRAISAL







I know it's not usual to buy on Ebay but... price...

 

poptart

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 23, 2006
Messages
1,899
Oh I love that first gold one you posted! Yum!

*M*
 

FacetFire

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 26, 2006
Messages
1,879
Personally, I would never buy something like this through eBay...you just don''t know what you''re getting. Any straight on shots of the eBay ring so you can see the diamond better? I just love the stone on that one from antiqueengagementrings...
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Messages
37,598
I have two strikes against the ebay stone and I'll tell you why:

1. Measurements
The AER is 0.8ct and has a diameter of 5.9mm
The Ebay is 0.85ct and has a diameter of 5.75mm
Comparing the two, the AER has a slightly less carat weight yet faces up BIGGER! So the AER stone is a better buy in terms of size.

2. I really don't trust anything from ebay unless it is for cheap stuff only. Even with a return policy, it can be a PITA when it is a he said/she said thing. I've seen enough complaints voiced here on PS about Ebay purchases to steer me away for good except for stuff that costs in the hundreds only or REALLY reputable companies like Signed Pieces who also sells on Ebay.

ETA
I checked out the AER ring and WOW! If you don't mind the K/L colour and the slight nick near the bezel, WOW!
I love the chunky faceting, the large culet, sweet 48% table and a not overly deep depth 63%. Plus, the setting is an original antique. What is there not to love?
 

diamondsrock

Brilliant_Rock
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May 5, 2005
Messages
970
I vote for number one. Just make sure if you don''t like it you can return it (I''m not familiar with their return policy).
 

FacetFire

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 26, 2006
Messages
1,879
Date: 1/25/2007 7:52:02 AM
Author: Chrono
I have two strikes against the ebay stone and I''ll tell you why:

1. Measurements
The AER is 0.8ct and has a diameter of 5.9mm
The Ebay is 0.85ct and has a diameter of 5.75mm
Comparing the two, the AER has a slightly less carat weight yet faces up BIGGER! So the AER stone is a better buy in terms of size.

2. I really don''t trust anything from ebay unless it is for cheap stuff only. Even with a return policy, it can be a PITA when it is a he said/she said thing. I''ve seen enough complaints voiced here on PS about Ebay purchases to steer me away for good except for stuff that costs in the hundreds only or REALLY reputable companies like Signed Pieces who also sells on Ebay.

ETA
I checked out the AER ring and WOW! If you don''t mind the K/L colour and the slight nick near the bezel, WOW!
I love the chunky faceting, the large culet, sweet 48% table and a not overly deep depth 63%. Plus, the setting is an original antique. What is there not to love?
That is exactly how I feel about the AER stone...it''s exactly the kind of cut I look for in an OEC!
 

stci

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 7, 2007
Messages
2,514
But, how not to take care of the L color and diamond that is broken while paying 1000$ more for the AER ring? It's difficult... I'm affraid! If I want to change the setting, will the diamond fall in pieces?
 

FacetFire

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 26, 2006
Messages
1,879
If you aren''t comfortable with the color, no one can talk you into it. You won''t be happy with the lower color no matter how much someone else likes it. THe nick doesn''t bother me, because it''s not even visable. You can probably communicate with them about whether it poses any structural problems...that''s what I would do. Also, consider finding out more about these:

http://antiqueengagementrings.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=1580

http://antiqueengagementrings.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=1573

Remember, with OECs, the diamond''s width can vary greatly no matter what the carat weight is...so find out measurements. A .65 can face-up just as large as a .80 if the .80 is deeper...
 

firebirdgold

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 30, 2005
Messages
2,216
My e-ring is an original antique with an OEC from AER. I was very worried about buying a OEC online without seeing it, and even more worried that I''d be letting loose my "It''s a chunk of carbon" bf to select the ring all by himself from the AER site. I called and talked to Leigh and he reassured me that he carefully selects his OEC''s so that all of them were beautiful and sparkly.

He was right. It''s sparkly in all kinds of light, looks great even when it''s dirty, and is wonderfully beautiful! I definitely recommend AER.com.
 
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