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Shall I go for it?

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Lizzie

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 12, 2003
Messages
8
Hi Everyone

I have come across two stones which I am considering at the moment. Since everyone on this site is so knowledgeable, I thought I''d get some opinions.

No 1 - cost $6570
Round brilliant, 1.01 ct E VS2
Measurements: 6.27-6.31x4.00mm
Depth 63.6%
Table 58%
Girdle - thick, faceted
Culet- none
Polish -excellent
Symmetry - excellent
Flourescence - none

No. 2 - cost $5600
Round brilliant, 1 ct F VS2
Measurements: 6.26-6.30x3.84mm
Depth 61.1%
Table 61%
Girdle -slightly thick to thick, faceted
Culet- none
Polish -excellent
Symmetry - good
Flourescence - none

That''s the only info I''ve got - basically from the GIA cert. No info on pav or crown angles. I used my ideal scope (yes, it came in handy)on it and saw the arrow patterns for the first stone, not as clear as some of those I''ve seen posted on this site, but apparent nonetheless. From my inexperienced eye, there was also some bits of white (light leakage?) around the edges. I think the VS2 grading is due mainly to the feather marked out in the report. Seems quite large on the cert, but apparent to the eye. Diamond #2 - couldn''t see any arrows but light leakage seemed quite low (red colour with small whitish specks at the edges)

Which would you go for?
 

Yupi

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 8, 2003
Messages
74
It's easier to see the arrows in the first one because of the excellent symmetry. From my limited knowledge, first stone's cut is better, and cut is the most important thing out of the 4Cs.
 

Rhino

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Mar 28, 2001
Messages
6,272
Yea but with a 63.6% depth the stone is going to look alot smaller than it should. You can get a super ideal .9xct stone for the same price that'll look just as big (if not moreso) and be more brilliant.

Peace,
Rhino
 

RockDoc

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 15, 2000
Messages
2,509
Lizzie

I suppose it makes sense to ask if you've seen the "super ideal" type stones to compare with the two you listed.

Obviously,neither stone has the ultimate proportions, but one or both may be fine performing stones, if the "cats meow" type stone isn't in your budget or if other characteristics are more desireable to you.

This is where you need to either get professional help rendered after the expert can examine the diamonds and compare them properly, or for you to possibly go see other stones and do more research if you're not sure about the cut quality you want.

Hope this helps.

Rockdoc
 

RockDoc

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 15, 2000
Messages
2,509
Garry

Seems like you've been blessed with xray vision advising this consumer to buy because they are cheap rather than what the customer may actually want.

It isn't the right price if its the wrong stone for the consumer.

Not every consumer wants the cats meow, but I think it is good prudent advice to check out and compare the different cuts.

Stones of these proportions are sold every day, and while that many purchases are made without having all the relevant information, some consumers wish size or another characteristic other than cut.

Personally, I like really well performing stones, but that shouldn't mean that the consumer should be force fed.

To buy a stone primarily because of its price would result in everyone buying in using this logic in everyone taking your advice buying simulants or bort.

There is more to this than price....

Then to advise a consumer not to seek profesisonal help is stupid. Its their choice - since its their money... not yours. This particular customer is contemplating spending $ 5000 - $6000.00.. THis isn't chump change - people here work hard for this type of money.

Plenty of consumers don't get their stones checked, and many do. But it's their decision to either have peace of mind or not to.

Rockdoc
 

RockDoc

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 15, 2000
Messages
2,509
Garry

There are plenty of stones with similar proportions that DO perform well.

Perhaps this is the case, but the ONLY way to determine this is to personally examine the stones, rather than poo poo them without seeiing them.

Rockdoc
 

RockDoc

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 15, 2000
Messages
2,509
Garry

I could understand your position if they crown and pavilion averages were stated, but they aren't.

Just because they may not be the optimum combination doesn't mean the stone require a muzzle and leash.

It amazes me that you can analyze without allthe pertinent information even at a bare minimum!

Further, you provide what is supposed prudent advice that a consumer may risk $ 5000-$ 6000 of their money!!

oh well!

Rockdoc
 

Caratz

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 4, 2002
Messages
222
I can see the point of getting a stone checked after you have a pretty definite idea of what you want and have made a decision to buy (assuming everything checks out with the appraisal), but I agree with Garry that it is a waste of money to pay an appraiser hundreds of dollars to evaluate a mediocre cut only to find out that a Sarin report with Diamcalc (or the HCA) would have indicated the same conclusion.
 

Mara

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2002
Messages
31,003
Lizzie--keep looking. For around $6500 you can get a 1c beautifully cut stone and know that the dimensions are are inline with excellent cut without having to 'hope' they will show up okay at an appraiser, and spend the $$ to ship and pay the appraiser, etc. You have a good, healthy budget, not sure if you are looking online or off, but also never buy just from a GIA cert, get the crown and pav angles and if possible a very detailed Sarin with all angles noted. When you have it narrowed down to a stone you really feel strongly about, then send it off for an appraisal. I do have to agree with Garry that you shouldn't waste your $$ on a stone that is mediocre from the basic numbers, not when your budget *could* accomodate an excellently cut same color, same clarity stone.

For comparisons sake and not knowing if you are searching online or off, I've listed just a few stones that I found using the 'cut quality' search of 'excellent' that are well within your range. There are countless more stones out there on very reputable sites. These are just two that popped up in the quick search I did.

http://www.niceice.com/certcopies/ags0003501601/index.htm
1.01 E VS2 Hearts and Arrows AGS 0 $6700 HCA 1.6

http://www.niceice.com/certcopies/1034fvs2_ags3174803/index.htm
1.03 F VS2 Hearts and Arrows AGS 0 $6800 HCA 1.2

Also on www.goodoldgold.com, Jonathan has around 15 stones that are around 1c and E/F VS quality for around the $6-7k range. I was on there the other day looking for someone else. Check them out. Lots of cool reports too and pretty animations!


There are plenty of other stones online. Nice Ice and GOG give you detailed reporting (including Sarins!) that many other co's do not. EVEN if you do not shop online, view the sites I listed for educational purposes and research, and read up on what you should be asking the offline vendors you are considering. If they cannot at least supply a Sarin, keep looking. You'll find something!! There are thousands of stones out there!

Good luck!!
 

flowerpower

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 9, 2003
Messages
65
In any case, Lizzie, since you're in Singapore (if I'm not mistaken), it's quite difficult to get diamond vendors to allow you to bring the stone to an appraiser either before the sale is made or as a condition to the sale. You'd probably have to buy the stone first, then take it to an appraiser, and if it turns out to be a poorly cut diamond (as I'm afraid the numbers do seem to suggest), I'm not sure if most stores will allow you to return the diamond.

That's precisely why the initial process of weeding out likely poor performers in the first instance is so important!

Mara is right about at least considering the option of purchasing online. I understand your concern since you're not based in the US, but there really is no hassle and risk to the process if you select a reputable vendor. You basically choose a diamond, email the vendor with more questions (if you have any), then wire the money over and the stone will arrive at your doorstep in a matter of days!

Otherwise, if you'd rather buy from a B&M, just keep looking; you can keep posting the specs of the diamonds you've seen, and I'm sure the experts would be happy to comment on them.

Good luck!
 

Lizzie

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 12, 2003
Messages
8
Thank you all for your honest opinions. I am still looking around, on and offline. Will keep posting questions...
 
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