Find your diamond
Find your jewelry
shape
carat
color
clarity

Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punched?

Joined
Dec 1, 2003
Messages
13
Long story short; designing new eternity band - want to sell my GIA 4 carat diamond and my jeweler is willing to sell it "at no profit" - but - says it will go for "20 back"in talking to his buyer. In researching here, I think that is way short - any experts want to weight in?
4 carat Round Brilliant Cut
GIA cert and independent appraisal by Harry Cannon
Table: 54.2%
Girdle Med to slightly thick
Crown 34.85 degrees
Depth: 62.4%
No Cutlet
NO fluorescence
Excellent finish and symmetry on cert - Very good /excellent on appraisal
Grade SI2 Color E
No dark inclusions to naked eye - VERY eye clean. a few needles/crystals but not to naked eye. Borderline SI1.

Jeweler told me 20 back on Rap would be $60K - I say based on what I've researched, this is above average and deserves more.
Thoughts?
 

centralsquare

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
2,201
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

I don't have a sense of a fair price, but I would love to see photos of that rock! :bigsmile:
 

Amys Bling

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
11,025
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

centralsquare|1314066383|2997080 said:
I don't have a sense of a fair price, but I would love to see photos of that rock! :bigsmile:

I second this.

Also contact other vendors- JbEG specifically and ask about consignment.
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,822
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

The cert is what counts, not the appraisal. 20 back is an entirely reasonable offer, generous even, although the claim about 'no profit' strikes me as problematic. He may or may not be able to sell it for more than that and, frankly, it doesn't matter what he gets for it. Most jewelers don't have the cash flow to take something like this into inventory and are going to want to do a consignment sort of deal. A commission sales person who gets a zero commission may not drive the best deal but I guess it depends on your guy and what else he's getting out of it. I assume this is a consignment deal? If you want to shop it around, there's lots of companies that buy and trade in this sort of thing. All you need do is ask. Scan the cert, show copies and see what the various competitive bidders have to say. Do be prepared that there's a difference between a cash offer and a consignment offer and you're likely to get more of the later.

What's the date on the cert? Have you got a cut grade? it may be worth your trouble to 'upgrade' the cert, especially if your appraiser thinks you've got a likely candidate for a GIA-excellent or AGS-ideal cut. Did you discuss marketing strategy with him?
 

captainmcgee

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 10, 2010
Messages
329
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

My 4ct RB SI2 E color Triple Ex cut was purchased last year for about $77,000USD.

Just food for thought.
 

MissStepcut

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 29, 2011
Messages
1,720
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

"Profit" is after you spend money on insurance, marketing, staff expenses, etc. Don't assume a 1:1 ratio between profit and sales prices.
 
Joined
Dec 1, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

The person I am dealing with is the owner/custom jewelry designer - I have worked with him on many pieces. The person interested in buying the stone is one of his diamond brokers.

The class cut of the stone is 1B. It does have the Hearts and Arrows light pattern.

Most stones with these specs I am seeing on inventory lists have medium to strong fluorescence - not finding many with none. Does this increase the value compared to the competition?

I will try to post a picture - right now it is in a platinum setting with princess cuts on the bands - 7 CTW. That was the other option - trying to find a buyer that wanted the entire ring - but I'm assuming that would be even harder to do! With the significant value involved I would be very leery having it sit somewhere on consignment...
 

John P

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
May 1, 2008
Messages
3,563
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

diamondsareagirlsbestfriend|1314107898|2997330 said:
The class cut of the stone is 1B. It does have the Hearts and Arrows light pattern.
I'd imagine that either he or his broker will want to get an updated report. The class system is outdated. GIA now has a proportions-based system based on table, depth, girdle and averages of all the primary and secondary angles. If the diamond is a GIA Excellent in cut it will be worth more than it will with a lesser cut grade. FWIW the data you have given looks promising in that regard.

Jeweler told me 20 back on Rap would be $60K
He's being straight with you.
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,822
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

So this is a cash offer from a 3rd party buyer who has already seen it and is already in the can as opposed to a consignment deal where the stone sits around until a viable bidder turns up? Given that, this is a strong bid and I'm not sure you'll see more even if you get the GIA yourself (you can bet that the FIRST thing the buyer is going to do is send it in to GIA if you haven't already done it). GIA is going to cost about $300 plus whatever it takes to get the stone to them and back and they'll tie up about a month of time. Shipping is going to be tricky because registered mail has an insurance limit of $50,000 so you're looking at armored carriers or working with someone who has 3rd party supplimental insurance. You're looking at hundreds of dollars and significant aggrivation. Again, talk to your appraiser about these questions. You hired them for their expert advice, use it.

No fluorescence is popular and it tends to drive up prices when compared to otherwise similar fluorescent stones but I suspect the buyer has already considered this in their offer. Bear in mind that your client is a dealer, not a consumer. The prices you're looking at here are retail offers and this dealer is planning on selling it for a profit before it reaches the next customer (even if you're guy isn't, and I still have my doubts about this). If you've got the skills, time and a bit of luck you can retail it yourself and you may be able to get a better offer that way but I have to say that people shopping in this price point tend to be fairly picky aobut where they buy things and the whole Craigslist/ebay strategy doesn't usually work out so well.
 

Rockdiamond

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
8,401
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

It sounds like the deal is almost too good.

AS Neil mentioned, selling something like this privately is daunting to say the least.
Would you want to invite potential buyers to your home- or would it be more dangerous to meet them elsewhere?
Would the buyer come with hundred dollar bills- or would you have to take a check?
All these reasons- and more- are why dealers paying cash for diamonds offer a fraction of the wholesale price.

Please be careful- make sure of the terms of sale- when you'll get your money and in what form.
It really sounds almost too good to be true.....
 
Joined
Dec 1, 2003
Messages
13
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

Thank you all so much for the input - safety and security are absolutely a factor - my husband is an attorney and will be handling that side of the transaction to make sure all goes well, regardless of who ends up buying the stone. I am being very careful/selective in who I approach re: the sale, even if it means not netting as much money in the long run.

I also have the option to sit tight if experts weighing in speculate the market value may continue to climb on this type of stone - I am not in any hurry and would like to maximize my profit -

Also - have any jewelers out there custom designed an eternity band over 8 carats? In Platinum? My current platinum setting is 4 ct center stone with 15 princess cuts totaling 7 CTW. My bands are all attached, so the eternity ring would actually be thinner than the current.

And last question; I have heard two different opinions vs. cast ring vs "the old fashioned way" of hand forging - I was told casting it may not provide as much stability? True?
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,822
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

The dealer offer you've got in the can may not be available forever. In fact, it almost certainly won't. If you're going to try and get more elsewhere and use them as a backup 'plan B', make sure they don't have an expiration date on this offer.
 

MichelleCarmen

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 8, 2003
Messages
15,880
Re: Selling 4 Carat Round Brilliant - am I being sucker punc

denverappraiser|1314398895|3000856 said:
The dealer offer you've got in the can may not be available forever. In fact, it almost certainly won't. If you're going to try and get more elsewhere and use them as a backup 'plan B', make sure they don't have an expiration date on this offer.
Yep, how long have you been looking for an offer on the diamond and how long are you willing to wait for a better offer?

Good luck. And, yes, post us a photo!
 
Be a part of the community It's free, join today!
    Style File: Julia Roberts
    Style File: Julia Roberts
    Top 5 Honeymoon Destinations
    Top 5 Honeymoon Destinations
    Tennis Bracelet Love
    Tennis Bracelet Love

Need Something Special?

Get a quote from multiple trusted and vetted jewelers.

Holloway Cut Advisor



Diamond Eye Candy

Click to view full-size image.
Top