Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in class

[Puppmom]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Telephone, I really like that illustration.

My children are 21, 6 and 3. During their informative years they have/will spend almost as much time with their teacher as they do with my husband and me. I think of education as so much more than math and reading. Teaching children to be upstanding citizens is an important part of education. Teaching them to stand up for what they believe in and how they can contribute is an important part of education. It saddens me that I have to teach my young children not everyone is treated equally and some really unfair things happen in this world. But, if I don't teach them, they will perpetuate the ignorance of my generation. I was basically taught that racism is wrong (well, duh) but also taught that it was GONE (easy for white parents to tell their white children). It is far from. My parents had good intentions. They thought ignoring these issues was the right thing to do. They did not want to burden me with the truth.

As for the shirt, my 6 year old wouldn't get it. Unless his teacher comes in to school in a costume, he wouldn't notice a difference. For maybe one of his more mature peers who does get it - I think it's a perfect teaching moment - far from a distraction. I've never been a fan of dress codes anyway.

 

[Rhea]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

No, t-shirts weren't cheap then. The point is the same, we were taught about an excluded minority, by teachers, using methods and instruments to get our attention. While no t-shirts were worn, one of us went around in a wheelchair all day, another on crutches or in leg braces, etc. As times, and the lessons, were slightly different those instruments were the ones that got our attention. I'm certain going black face to make a point wouldn't be looked kindly upon. If we're taking your example of my example that's exactly what the teachers would be doing.

That is absolutely NOT what I was suggesting, and I'm absolutely puzzled that you somehow inferred that from my complimenting your story.

I was implying that that would be the equivalent teaching method in the story that you complimented. No, our teachers didn't wear t-shirts, our teacher taught by having us brief live the other students lives. Frankly I think the t-shirts are the better idea.

 

[Arcadian]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

I don't know about anyone here but I grew up in the projects. Wayne Minor to be exact. Project life will do one or 2 things; you either grow from it and make something out of your life and get the hell out of it, or you let that sh*t swallow you up and you start that cycle with a new generation. My parents set out to make sure their kids got out.

And thats what it takes. It takes a parent (or 2) or someone held in high enough regard to do it. And its A LOT of work.

When I was growing up, there were some outlets, parks and playgrounds within the communities, after school programs and even some community centers, but these days, much of the outlets for kids are gone. Either because its too dangerous to let them outside or, money got earmarked for some politicians pet project.

And therein lies the problem with many of them getting into trouble, got in with the gangs, started slinging drugs to make it day to day. These kids are kids, they see Beeboo with a pocket full of money, a souped up ride and think he's got it made. They may not know that this kid is making less than minimum wage and one slip-up on either the dope or cash will get him a pine box and a cemetery plot as a prize. This is what they look up to. They sit in their apartment or whatever maybe hungry, dreaming big, wanting to get out, and they see Beeboo so they figure thats what they need to be.

The perpetuation of the stereotype, propagated because of a need to survive. Is it right? No. But it where it came from.

That cycle rinses and repeat enough times and you got kids that before they're 18 have rap sheets as long as your arm. That will harden a person beyond what you or I can fathom. Getting arrested is street cred, F*ck the police is an anthem, and most don't even realize until its too late that they're destroying the very thing they claim to love. Some don't care (or say they don't care), but most do.

A lot of the responsibility starts at home I will agree with that. But how can you say that when you got a momma who is too overworked and barely sees her child because she works whatever shift they give her to keep the lights on and the rent paid? Or, momma is on crack, (hell daddy on crack?) and they sell little sister to feed their habit? Or they send you to the store to "get some food" without money? Where are the positive outlets for these kids? The rundown neighborhood schools that don't get the funding? The community center that has 50-11 crack heads sitting outside? The park that got taken over by the dope dealers or is the line in the sand for gang fights?

For some of our friends, they didn't have what you could call "a home" unless it was at our place. We weren't allowed to bring "the streets" into our home, none of our friends were either. Schoolwork was a priority. There are too few people out there like my parents who were willingly to take a kid in and hopefully turn them around.

I bring up my background not so people would feel sorry but so you can understand me and see my POV.

I love that there are those who are passionate about what BLM is supposed to be about. And I do love the discussion, for and against. That group has a lot of faults, for all the good its trying to do, but IMO its early yet, lets see where they take this. I think that there are some important learning moments to be had from all POV's.

But to call someone racist because they happen to disagree? No, please. offensive. Make your case. Disagree, or agree to disagree, but that type of name calling is way out of line.

Even "I" don't agree with everything that BLM is doing. even "I" feel that some of their members should practice what they preach, because some of them do prescribe to the F*ck the police anthem. If black lives really matter, How the hell come you don't protest in Chicago when there's black on black crime? When they're shooting at the police (some of whom are also black) and putting black lives at risk? Personally I feel like its not cool to say "F*ck the police" from one side of your mouth but cry and go crazy when your house is being shot up hollaring "where the police at?"

The other side of that is black officers. Do they matter? They protect and serve right along with their white and brown(or yellow) counterparts. I know and have worked with enough black officers that hmm... feel some sort of way about how BLM are handling this.

but to bring it home;

I do NOT feel that BLM tshirts are condusive to elementary school in and of themselves. This may be a current event, but my feeling is that it needs to be handled with some delicacy, especially at the elementary school stage. Some teachers might segregate the class without actually meaning to. IMO, this is stuff that should be worked into the class syllabus with enough supported history (and maybe an eye opening field trip) behind it that it actually makes sense. I believe they should at least let the parents KNOW what they're doing before its done. Again its a hot topic, and while they may be the teacher of that class, that is still not their child.

My personal feeling is that all lives matter. I don't care if you're purple with yellow polka dots, your life matters too. But, BLM is supposed to be specific in its aim and goal, which is why its not called All Lives Matter.

Who you are, your life style or color shouldn't matter for you to agree or to disagree... I'm actually OK with white lives matter. Don't bring KKK rhetoric into it, but sure, get a tshirt if it makes you feel better.

I love you all. Believe that. Carry on.

BTW, I made peanut butter pie this week.

 

[partgypsy]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

My random thoughts. I am generally not a fan of politicizing the education environment or process. I remember in HS a teacher I had handing out brochures about animal cruelty to get us involved, with really explicit pictures of animal torture. I'm an animal lover but felt it was inappropriate she was doing that in role of teacher. So I'm also not a fan of teachers wearing buttons, shirts of hot button topics (go ahead and wear your I heart dolphin suspenders, no to handing out pamplets of Japanese killing dolphins).

6-9 year olds, most are not going to be super-aware of a tee-shirt with "BLM". However I DO feel that discussion about Black lives matter, just like occupy wall street are important civic movements to highlight injustices occurring in the US at the present time. It would actually seem odd to be ignored in school. I probably would think middle school is a more appropriate age to talk about these things myself however, as part of a civics, history, social studies course.

I personally do not feel that teachers wearing a BLM is somehow an extreme or race baiting statement, or upsetting, distracting to learning. To say it may cause the children to be in an unsafe environment or place them in danger? I don't even know where someone is going with that statement (the tee shirt is going to cause race riots/assassination attempts?). And I really don't understand how people read "black lives matter" as "white lives don't matter" or "'police lives don't matter".

 

[the_mother_thing]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

I didn't know everyone shouting "save the rainforest!" was actually shouting "chop down every other forest!"

Saying "black lives matter means non black lives DONT matter" Um, not true. Saying you like chicken isn't saying you hate beef. Just because one thing gets more attention during this time doesn't mean that other things don't matter.

also - how fu*king selfish/white privilege is it to turn something about black people into something about whites haha. Seriously, do people not see the irony?!

By your reasoning, I guess my high school should have told the ONE family (who complained and SUED the district about a 90-second graduation blessing) that their religious beliefs (or lackthereof) really weren't any less important just because a blessing was shared with the entire graduating class, and just carried on with the ceremony as planned.

 

[the_mother_thing]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

I like this comic to explain blm to people who think its exclusionary.

It's only perceived as exclusionary when others make an effort to talk about it, share perspective, understand the other side, and are instead offensively chastised for having "white privilege". Or do you not see the irony in THAT?

 

[ruby59]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

What I am saying is I think that you greatly underestimate the abilities of many good teachers who are more than able to integrate ideas about racism, sexism and discrimination into their every day teaching material and I also think you underestimate the ability of the kids to be able to take these ideas on board in a sensible fashion.

__________________________________________________

Those are not the ones I am concerned about. As you know in any profession, there are the good and the bad.

And as a parent I would want to know what this teacher's motives are before such a sensitive subject is brought up in front of my children.

As I asked before, does this particular teacher have a chip on her shoulder? Will she be non biased or make my child feel bad?

 

[ruby59]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

t's 2016 and black citizens are still being gunned down by police officers in broad daylight
______________________________________________
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/09/14/man-wanted-in-shooting-death-north-carolina-cop-arrested-in-rhode-island.html

But I guess the killing of a police officer is fine?


Wow, this has to be some kind of record. I figured it might be a couple of hours until someone posts a Fox News article profiling a "black thug" and asking if it's cool to gun down cops.
_______________________________________________

It is merely a response to your post about what is going on in the year 2016.

It cuts both ways, Elliott.

 

[momhappy]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

My random thoughts. I am generally not a fan of politicizing the education environment or process. I remember in HS a teacher I had handing out brochures about animal cruelty to get us involved, with really explicit pictures of animal torture. I'm an animal lover but felt it was inappropriate she was doing that in role of teacher. So I'm also not a fan of teachers wearing buttons, shirts of hot button topics (go ahead and wear your I heart dolphin suspenders, no to handing out pamplets of Japanese killing dolphins).

6-9 year olds, most are not going to be super-aware of a tee-shirt with "BLM". However I DO feel that discussion about Black lives matter, just like occupy wall street are important civic movements to highlight injustices occurring in the US at the present time. It would actually seem odd to be ignored in school. I probably would think middle school is a more appropriate age to talk about these things myself however, as part of a civics, history, social studies course.

I personally do not feel that teachers wearing a BLM is somehow an extreme or race baiting statement, or upsetting, distracting to learning. To say it may cause the children to be in an unsafe environment or place them in danger? I don't even know where someone is going with that statement (the tee shirt is going to cause race riots/assassination attempts?). And I really don't understand how people read "black lives matter" as "white lives don't matter" or "'police lives don't matter".

I was the one who posted about potential safety concerns. No, I wouldn't expect a race riot, but the bottom line is that you don't know what to expect.
This is an interesting article:
http://dailycaller.com/2016/09/13/elementary-school-teachers-wear-blm-shirts-to-talk-about-systematic-oppression/
The article says that the day the teachers wear the shirts, community leaders will greet school children as they enter the school (so it's not just about wearing a shirt that might go unrecognized by a young kid). It also states that they expect some contention, but they feel that's good because it could spark a debate with those who disagree.
They are EXPECTING a certain amount of disagreement and to me that's clearly a potential safety issue. Is this really something that adults should be debating in an elementary school while a school day is in session I agree with teaching kids about these sorts of issues (and most schools have a curriculum that includes race), but I absolutely do not agree with this method. I think it's irresponsible.

 

[ruby59]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Clearly a few posters here think Lincoln fixed everything in 1863 with the Emancipation Proclamation.
______________________________________
6 million Jews were killed in the gas chambers. And as a people they moved on and made good lives for themselves.

 

[telephone89]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

[By your reasoning, I guess my high school should have told the ONE family (who complained and SUED the district about a 90-second graduation blessing) that their religious beliefs (or lackthereof) really weren't any less important just because a blessing was shared with the entire graduating class, and just carried on with the ceremony as planned.

Did you go to a school of this religion? Ie Catholic school who made a catholic prayer? I don't see the connection. Maybe if an atheist wore a shirt that said 'jesus didn't die for me', and the rest of the folks were offended? I'm just trying to find a parallel with religion, because I don't think your example is the same.

 

[telephone89]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

I like this comic to explain blm to people who think its exclusionary.

It's only perceived as exclusionary when others make an effort to talk about it, share perspective, understand the other side, and are instead offensively chastised for having "white privilege". Or do you not see the irony in THAT?

There IS no other side.
They are saying that black lives matter. We do not need to CONSTANTLY REMIND PEOPLE THAT WHITE LIVES MATTER. EVERYONE FU*KING KNOWS THIS. This is ingrained into our society and culture.

 

[the_mother_thing]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

I don't know about anyone here but I grew up in the projects. Wayne Minor to be exact. Project life will do one or 2 things; you either grow from it and make something out of your life and get the hell out of it, or you let that sh*t swallow you up and you start that cycle with a new generation. My parents set out to make sure their kids got out.

And thats what it takes. It takes a parent (or 2) or someone held in high enough regard to do it. And its A LOT of work.

When I was growing up, there were some outlets, parks and playgrounds within the communities, after school programs and even some community centers, but these days, much of the outlets for kids are gone. Either because its too dangerous to let them outside or, money got earmarked for some politicians pet project.

And therein lies the problem with many of them getting into trouble, got in with the gangs, started slinging drugs to make it day to day. These kids are kids, they see Beeboo with a pocket full of money, a souped up ride and think he's got it made. They may not know that this kid is making less than minimum wage and one slip-up on either the dope or cash will get him a pine box and a cemetery plot as a prize. This is what they look up to. They sit in their apartment or whatever maybe hungry, dreaming big, wanting to get out, and they see Beeboo so they figure thats what they need to be.

The perpetuation of the stereotype, propagated because of a need to survive. Is it right? No. But it where it came from.

That cycle rinses and repeat enough times and you got kids that before they're 18 have rap sheets as long as your arm. That will harden a person beyond what you or I can fathom. Getting arrested is street cred, F*ck the police is an anthem, and most don't even realize until its too late that they're destroying the very thing they claim to love. Some don't care (or say they don't care), but most do.

A lot of the responsibility starts at home I will agree with that. But how can you say that when you got a momma who is too overworked and barely sees her child because she works whatever shift they give her to keep the lights on and the rent paid? Or, momma is on crack, (hell daddy on crack?) and they sell little sister to feed their habit? Or they send you to the store to "get some food" without money? Where are the positive outlets for these kids? The rundown neighborhood schools that don't get the funding? The community center that has 50-11 crack heads sitting outside? The park that got taken over by the dope dealers or is the line in the sand for gang fights?

For some of our friends, they didn't have what you could call "a home" unless it was at our place. We weren't allowed to bring "the streets" into our home, none of our friends were either. Schoolwork was a priority. There are too few people out there like my parents who were willingly to take a kid in and hopefully turn them around.

I bring up my background not so people would feel sorry but so you can understand me and see my POV.

I love that there are those who are passionate about what BLM is supposed to be about. And I do love the discussion, for and against. That group has a lot of faults, for all the good its trying to do, but IMO its early yet, lets see where they take this. I think that there are some important learning moments to be had from all POV's.

But to call someone racist because they happen to disagree? No, please. offensive. Make your case. Disagree, or agree to disagree, but that type of name calling is way out of line.

Even "I" don't agree with everything that BLM is doing. even "I" feel that some of their members should practice what they preach, because some of them do prescribe to the F*ck the police anthem. If black lives really matter, How the hell come you don't protest in Chicago when there's black on black crime? When they're shooting at the police (some of whom are also black) and putting black lives at risk? Personally I feel like its not cool to say "F*ck the police" from one side of your mouth but cry and go crazy when your house is being shot up hollaring "where the police at?"

The other side of that is black officers. Do they matter? They protect and serve right along with their white and brown(or yellow) counterparts. I know and have worked with enough black officers that hmm... feel some sort of way about how BLM are handling this.

but to bring it home;

I do NOT feel that BLM tshirts are condusive to elementary school in and of themselves. This may be a current event, but my feeling is that it needs to be handled with some delicacy, especially at the elementary school stage. Some teachers might segregate the class without actually meaning to. IMO, this is stuff that should be worked into the class syllabus with enough supported history (and maybe an eye opening field trip) behind it that it actually makes sense. I believe they should at least let the parents KNOW what they're doing before its done. Again its a hot topic, and while they may be the teacher of that class, that is still not their child.

My personal feeling is that all lives matter. I don't care if you're purple with yellow polka dots, your life matters too. But, BLM is supposed to be specific in its aim and goal, which is why its not called All Lives Matter.

Who you are, your life style or color shouldn't matter for you to agree or to disagree... I'm actually OK with white lives matter. Don't bring KKK rhetoric into it, but sure, get a tshirt if it makes you feel better.

I love you all. Believe that. Carry on.

BTW, I made peanut butter pie this week.

Thank you for bravely sharing your experience & perspective, Arcadian! It makes it far easier for us to understanding and open up discussions about these topics. I wasn't in a big city, but also grew up in 'subsidized housing' as a young child. A lot of the things I witnessed & experienced growing up, I cannot even write about. That's just an FYI for those who've alleged I have some sort of 'white privilege'; what I have, I earned and worked my butt off for using the negative childhood experience as motivation.

And I made peanut butter cookies this week as well. There is one left ... for about another 2 minutes.

 

[telephone89]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Thank you for bravely sharing your experience & perspective, Arcadian! It makes it far easier for us to understanding and open up discussions about these topics. I wasn't in a big city, but also grew up in 'subsidized housing' as a young child. A lot of the things I witnessed & experienced growing up, I cannot even write about. That's just an FYI for those who've alleged I have some sort of 'white privilege'; what I have, I earned and worked my butt off for using the negative childhood experience as motivation.

And I made peanut butter cookies this week as well. There is one left ... for about another 2 minutes.

Just because someone grows up poor doesn't mean they don't have white privilege.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gina-crosleycorcoran/explaining-white-privilege-to-a-broke-white-person_b_5269255.html

 

[Niel]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

JoCoJenn white privilege comes from being white. Not wear you grew up.

 

[ruby59]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Of course it is.

In my school we discussed current events. That's part of education. IT'S CALLED NOT IGNORING REALITY.

So it is completely and totally appropriate. AND educational.

________________________________________

Well in mine it is called a holiday tree, and a winter pageant.

We had a plaque that stood for 50 years removed because it bothered one student's parents.

A dress code is strictly enforced.

You cannot have it both ways.

Nothing wrong with current events and incorporating it into a civics lesson in a proper way. And vetting how the teachers will conduct it similar to how their planned curriculum must be OK'd by the principal and school board.


But to flout the rules and just wear them? In my schools a student would get sent home if he did the same. Students learn from their teachers to follow the rules/

 

[the_mother_thing]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Did you go to a school of this religion? Ie Catholic school who made a catholic prayer? I don't see the connection. Maybe if an atheist wore a shirt that said 'jesus didn't die for me', and the rest of the folks were offended? I'm just trying to find a parallel with religion, because I don't think your example is the same.

You said that "saying 'black lives matter' doesn't make other lives matter any less."

Likewise, having a religious blessing over the graduating class didn't make one non-believers' "lack of belief" any less, either. Yet my high school/district (public) was sued, and had to pay the family dearly.

The reason I equate these two is because neither religion nor racial discrimination has a place in public schools (or any other government entity). And BLM's intentions can be as pure as snow; however, the slogan itself IS exclusive. And that is what is on the t-shirts.

PS - you don't need to drop "F-bombs" to get your point across.

 

[ruby59]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

This happened because: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Exercise_Clause

The government is the school, had a plaque up and the family felt as though the school was supporting a religion, not allowed with public money. Quite simple really.
________________________________________

I know why this happened. I was there. It is the school my children and I graduated from. We were at the meetings.

This plaque was donated by the first graduating class.

And not as simple as you think.

It was a plaque one child felt ostracized her. Actually it was her parents. That was the reason they wanted it down. They used what you posted as a excuse to have it done.

 

[ruby59]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Good point, Mom. I did not think of that.

All it takes is one nut to take exception to this and cause an incident at the school.

In this day of school shootings, I would not want my kids to become a potential target.

And to conclude. Teachers are supposed to set good examples for their students. To teach them to obey the rules of the school.
And if they do not agree with them, then how to go about legally changing them.

 

[Tekate]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

My elementary school was a mixed education level one with some students who were on a level that as pre-teens (older than us by some years) they were being taught basic life skills such as counting change, cooking basic meals, polite interaction with others, and traffic safety. As students (I was at that school from age 6-9) we were required to learn how to interact with this group, ask if and how they needed help rather than assume, and to treat them as individuals who were valued and valuable members of society. The take away lesson was that their, these handicapped kids, lives mattered. Not that ours didn't. Every other day of the week our little self-absorbed, able-bodied and able-minded classes went on as normal, but stopping to learn how to interact with them during these lessons didn't hurt us one bit. Over 25 years later and I still hold those lessons dear and flash back to them when necessary, they shaped me for the better for ever. Never once did I think their lives mattered more than mine from these lessons. I think that's a helicopter parent thought.

This is the same type of thing. A minority is being discriminated against and it's never too early to teach kids and ask them to stop and think about the human on the other end of their actions, words, and even worse sometimes, inaction.

That is an absolutely beautiful way to go about teaching the lesson! And your example drives home the exact point I was trying to make - there are ways to teach lessons about inclusion without appearing to exclude anyone in the process.

I can't convey enough that I don't ask this question with sarcasm (disclaimer b/c on the internet, it'd be easy enough to assume it is): did anyone wear a t-shirt that said "Handicapped Lives Matter" to convey that lesson?

My guess is 'no'.

You argument is a strawman.. Handicapped people are not shot running away, shot because they are handicapped and there are no preconceived notions that handicapped people are all killers because it's a bad, handicapped neighborhood, where a lot of handicapped people are lazy and won't work, they would rather wear their pants down around their butts (although some handicapped people may be doing that)..

 

[the_mother_thing]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Just because someone grows up poor doesn't mean they don't have white privilege.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gina-crosleycorcoran/explaining-white-privilege-to-a-broke-white-person_b_5269255.html

JoCoJenn white privilege comes from being white. Not wear you grew up.

It's ignorant, discriminatory & offensive - period!

 

[Niel]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Just because someone grows up poor doesn't mean they don't have white privilege.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gina-crosleycorcoran/explaining-white-privilege-to-a-broke-white-person_b_5269255.html

JoCoJenn white privilege comes from being white. Not wear you grew up.

It's ignorant, discriminatory & offensive - period!

Agree to disagree I suppose as I feel that exact way about the opposition

 

[the_mother_thing]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

You argument is a strawman.. Handicapped people are not shot running away, shot because they are handicapped and there are no preconceived notions that handicapped people are all killers because it's a bad, handicapped neighborhood, where a lot of handicapped people are lazy and won't work, they would rather wear their pants down around their butts (although some handicapped people may be doing that)..

And a teacher is going to have THOSE discussions with elementary-age children, huh?

I think not.

 

[Tekate]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

This happened because: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Exercise_Clause

The government is the school, had a plaque up and the family felt as though the school was supporting a religion, not allowed with public money. Quite simple really.
________________________________________

I know why this happened. I was there. It is the school my children and I graduated from. We were at the meetings.

This plaque was donated by the first graduating class.

And not as simple as you think.

It was a plaque one child felt ostracized her. Actually it was her parents. That was the reason they wanted it down. They used what you posted as a excuse to have it done.

So? her parents didn't like a prayer on the wall of their publicly funded school, maybe back in 63 when we were all homogeneous, white, christian/catholic/and some jews, but today we are not and people are different and do not want any religion in schools, it may not have bothered most people (i'm sure most students could have cared less).. but boy the parents on both sides were up in arms. There were many unhappy people in my neck of the woods in the 50s and 60s who were Jewish.. shunted at their holiday(s), when we allow religion into public life today it can be offensive. Difference is - that one child can say something today and then they couldn't. Have you been stopped from your spiritual life in your home? bet not. It wasn't an excuse, they used law, law works both ways.. seems like there was a lot of name calling going around then.. http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/27/us/rhode-island-city-enraged-over-school-prayer-lawsuit.html

I see there was the history and love of the past and what is fair today.. someone is always going to get hurt, upset or angry.. funny if you read this you see that people were selling a Tshirt with the 'prayer' on it! I wonder if anyone wore the shirts to school??? America is becoming less and less religious, that is a fact. http://www.pewforum.org/2015/05/12/americas-changing-religious-landscape/

 

[Tekate]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

You argument is a strawman.. Handicapped people are not shot running away, shot because they are handicapped and there are no preconceived notions that handicapped people are all killers because it's a bad, handicapped neighborhood, where a lot of handicapped people are lazy and won't work, they would rather wear their pants down around their butts (although some handicapped people may be doing that)..

And a teacher is going to have THOSE discussions with elementary-age children, huh?

I think not.

We are talking about your thoughts on would people wear Handicapped lives matter. What are THOSE discussions????? I am saying: Handicapped people are not discriminated because of their skin color, they were and probably still are discriminated against because they are handicapped, but it's come a long way from mentally challenged kids being stuck in the basement of my elementary school, mainstreaming... it took laws for force schools to open the doors to handicapped students.

 

[momhappy]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Good point, Mom. I did not think of that.

All it takes is one nut to take exception to this and cause an incident at the school.

In this day of school shootings, I would not want my kids to become a potential target.

And to conclude. Teachers are supposed to set good examples for their students. To teach them to obey the rules of the school.
And if they do not agree with them, then how to go about legally changing them.

It seems we live in an environment these days where it doesn't take much at all for someone to "snap" and lash out at people. I am actually really surprised that the school can get away with this sort of thing. I can't understand why an elementary school would think it was appropriate to potentially have adults (who might disagree) debate an emotionally-charged issue in the entry way of their school

 

[telephone89]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Did you go to a school of this religion? Ie Catholic school who made a catholic prayer? I don't see the connection. Maybe if an atheist wore a shirt that said 'jesus didn't die for me', and the rest of the folks were offended? I'm just trying to find a parallel with religion, because I don't think your example is the same.

You said that "saying 'black lives matter' doesn't make other lives matter any less."

Likewise, having a religious blessing over the graduating class didn't make one non-believers' "lack of belief" any less, either. Yet my high school/district (public) was sued, and had to pay the family dearly.

The reason I equate these two is because neither religion nor racial discrimination has a place in public schools (or any other government entity). And BLM's intentions can be as pure as snow; however, the slogan itself IS exclusive. And that is what is on the t-shirts.

PS - you don't need to drop "F-bombs" to get your point across.

Okay I misunderstood - apologies.
But I still disagree. Does religion have a place in PUBLIC schools? Debatable. I think learning about religions, and how they shaped cultures is a very interesting and important part of sociology. It's truly fascinating! However, praying isn't learning. Praying isn't teaching. So yes, I can see how someone would be upset with this at a public school. Send your child to catholic school if you want group prayer to be included.
Are there any black only schools that these black kids can go to to learn about how they are racially discriminated against? I don't think so, and I'm assuming you aren't for schools to be race segretated, so that is a moot point.
What isn't, is how discrimination SHOULD and NEEDS to be taught to children - how to recognize it, how to avoid it, how to fight against it. We teach children about the holocaust and how wrong it was - why can't we teach children about something wrong going on right now?

And again, you seem to misunderstand their slogan. Just because something matters doesn't make everything else not matter. That's just not how it works.

And lastly, I like swearing. It is part of how I talk, and actually does get the point across. It isn't directed AT you, but at my point.

 

[telephone89]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Just because someone grows up poor doesn't mean they don't have white privilege.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gina-crosleycorcoran/explaining-white-privilege-to-a-broke-white-person_b_5269255.html

JoCoJenn white privilege comes from being white. Not wear you grew up.

It's ignorant, discriminatory & offensive - period!

Do you understand the meaning of ignorant? Did you even read the link I posted? It seems like you are ignorant - aka lacking knowledge - of this term and what it means.

 

[the_mother_thing]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

You argument is a strawman.. Handicapped people are not shot running away, shot because they are handicapped and there are no preconceived notions that handicapped people are all killers because it's a bad, handicapped neighborhood, where a lot of handicapped people are lazy and won't work, they would rather wear their pants down around their butts (although some handicapped people may be doing that)..

And a teacher is going to have THOSE discussions with elementary-age children, huh?

I think not.

We are talking about your thoughts on would people wear Handicapped lives matter. What are THOSE discussions????? I am saying: Handicapped people are not discriminated because of their skin color, they were and probably still are discriminated against because they are handicapped, but it's come a long way from mentally challenged kids being stuck in the basement of my elementary school, mainstreaming... it took laws for force schools to open the doors to handicapped students.

My point was - her school was able to effectively carry out lessons reinforcing the need to respect and appreciate others who are different, without having to wear a divisive t-shirt to spark the discussion.

You're layering (kind of confusingly, so bear with me) things I think you feel blacks are being shot for with the story Rhea shared. But I don't think those things (that you stated blacks are being shot for) are going to be the topics of discussion with elementary kids as a result of teachers wearing these shirts. They're not even close to being age-appropriate discussion.

 

[the_mother_thing]

Re: Seattle Elementary teachers to wear BLM t-shirts in clas

Okay I misunderstood - apologies.
But I still disagree. Does religion have a place in PUBLIC schools? Debatable. I think learning about religions, and how they shaped cultures is a very interesting and important part of sociology. It's truly fascinating! However, praying isn't learning. Praying isn't teaching. So yes, I can see how someone would be upset with this at a public school. Send your child to catholic school if you want group prayer to be included.
Are there any black only schools that these black kids can go to to learn about how they are racially discriminated against? I don't think so, and I'm assuming you aren't for schools to be race segretated, so that is a moot point.
What isn't, is how discrimination SHOULD and NEEDS to be taught to children - how to recognize it, how to avoid it, how to fight against it. We teach children about the holocaust and how wrong it was - why can't we teach children about something wrong going on right now?

And again, you seem to misunderstand their slogan. Just because something matters doesn't make everything else not matter. That's just not how it works.

And lastly, I like swearing. It is part of how I talk, and actually does get the point across. It isn't directed AT you, but at my point.

I'm not saying I believe religion doesn't belong in school. Society removed all mention of it along with a lot of other things over time. It doesn't matter if I agree or disagree with them. And no, of course I don't think schools should be segregated. They SHOULD teach about historical discrimination, segregation, and talk about ways we can avoid it - absolutely! Same for the Holocaust. It's history, which has an uncanny way of repeating itself if you DON'T learn from it.

But a t-shirt with a slogan containing a racially-divisive message (regardless of what it means) is not necessary to teach those things. And it's really not necessary in elementary school.