Rose cut diamonds by the yard - good or bad idea?

[lissyflo]

Hi,

I am thinking about a long diamonds by the yard necklace (around 34 inches) and would love to hear from anyone who either has one or has experience with rose cuts in general.

I have seen some rose cut versions on Grace's site (but they're high carat weight and out of budget unless I start selling internal organs) but there doesn't seem to be videos of them and I haven't seen a rose cut version of a DBTY in real life to get an idea of how they act.

It would be for a daily wear piece and I'd like something fairly casual and understated, and I generally prefer a gentle shimmer to full-on blinding bling, but I would still like something with life and interest. I was working along the lines of stones around 3.5mm, the same sort of size that I'd prefer in a brilliant cut version. Do you think this size would translate well to rosies?

I have asked for a couple of quotes - one from xothebijouxbox (I haven't tagged her here as I don't think vendors can participate in threads relating to potential sales?, but will ask when I hear from her about the quote) who has some beautiful rose cuts on her IG. The second vendor has advised against rose cuts for this style necklace (as they will lie against skin, she feels they would look dull and flat), which has made me nervous especially as I haven't seen one IRL. Does anyone have views or experience to help? I know cut and levels of bling are personal preferences, but hearing a range of opinions always helps!

Any views on backing rose cuts in this style of necklace? It would stop the colour of my clothes from coming through but would mean that I would only see metal if the stone flipped, and I know this is a style that would flip a lot. If the stones were foiled and the back maybe engraved to add some interest, do you think it would still look odd? If you have any kind of DBTY, roughly what proportion of the stones tend to be flipped at any one time (or is this hard to notice in MRBs as the culet still provides sparkle when flipped over?)?

I found a thread from a few years back where someone mentioned that their next project was going to be a rose cut DBTY but cannot now find the thread for the life of me - I was hoping to be able to tag whoever had mentioned it to ask for their advice!

Any and all opinions gladly welcome!

 

[MaisOuiMadame]

The idea sounds stunning... I agree with the thought that backed ones would look too metall-y when flipped.
Are rose cuts one of the cuts that have to be super squeaky clean to perform? If so, maybe this style isn't perfect.
I've read that many connoisseurs prefer moissy for rose cuts. What about commissioning a moissy version in 14 k from a Chinese vendor? If you fall in love you could upgrade to the real deal... There are lots of discussions re. Vendors in the fabulous fashion section....

 

[missy]

I appreciate rose cuts for what they are and under the best of circumstances find them ethereal and romantic. Having said that I would not personally choose a rose cut DBTY. They are harder to keep clean but more importantly (to me) is that they lack the liveliness of a non rose cut diamond. I agree they would look more flat and dull than their non rose cut diamond counterparts.

You write you want something with interest and life and I feel that a rose cut is not the top choice for that. If I were choosing and I had the budget I would go for OEC DBTY for max visual interest and liveliness but of course it is personal preference and I am sure you can create a beautiful rose cut DBTY if you are a fan. I look forward to seeing whatever piece you decide on and I know it will be stunning.

I have an MRB DBTY and I would say that a number of stones (20% if I am guessing and it is just my best guess) are flipped at any given time but yes they still have sparkle even when flipped.

 

[rockysalamander]

If you like rose cuts, why not look into double rose cuts? You'd have faceting on both sides. Then, you won't have a "back" to look at.

 

[OoohShiny]

If you like rose cuts, why not look into double rose cuts? You'd have faceting on both sides. Then, you won't have a "back" to look at.

Ooooh, nice graphic - I didn't know they existed!

Are there any videos of their performance? The window-y nature of Rose Cuts is something that I think would annoy me personally, so reducing that with a double rose cut could be awesome

 

[OoohShiny]

A quick skim on YT brought these up - could be useful??

 

[lissyflo]

Thanks you for your thoughts @kipari @missy @rockysalamander @OoohShiny

@rockysalamander - double rose cuts are a very good idea! I hadn’t seen them before but I love briolettes and they look slightly similar in the videos that Ooohshiny posted (thank you!). I googled them and an old LT listing of @yssie popped up - Yssie, if you see this and have time to post, as someone who’s seen the double rose cuts IRL, do you have a view on how they’d perform in a DBTY necklace? They would definitely remove the problem of metal backing/foiling, and maybe have slightly more life to them than a standard rosie if there’s 2 layers of facets? I would presumably still have the issue of them not performing well whilst dirty - although, thinking about it, the stones at the front would be in contact with clothes rather than skin, so it would only be the ones touching the back of my neck and my collar bone that would be in direct contact with skin.

It sounds on the basis of comments here and from one of the vendors that standard rose cuts would not be a great idea. The ones on Grace’s site are very intriguing and appealing but I did have a niggle about there not being videos to see them in movement - it’s eadier to make things look great in a static shot sometimes. They are also significantly higher carat weight than I was envisaging, so again possibly misleading my eye!

Missy - an OEC version would be amazing but I’m not sure how easy it would be to match similar facet patterns? With a long necklace, I’d be looking at the bottom part frequently while wearing it (I’m a bit of a compulsive fiddler!) and I don’t know if seeing differences would bother me. Newly cut antique style stones would be amazing but $$$$!

My alternative plan would be a Whiteflash Color Me Mine version. The WF diamonds by the yard seems to get great reviews on here. I think I’d opt for alternating diamond and yellow sapphire stations - the yellow hopefully would be neutral and would reduce the bling a little, so I could ‘test the water’. I’ve asked how easy it would be to swap out the sapphire stations for diamond ones further down the line, if I find that I want all diamond after all (and WF could hopefully then use the sapphire stations to create a shorter, sapphire by the yard necklace for me). I’m waiting to hear if that’s feasible as that would give me some future options.

Hhhmmm, lots to consider!

 

[elizat]

I like rose cuts and own some, but count me as someone that doesn't think a dbty is the best, unless they have a closed back with foiling or a faux foil. They can look really translucent. I like the idea of a double rose cut though, as opposed to a standard rose cut. You might ask Parks Fine Group if they can quote it as well.

 

[JPie]

Adam at Old World Diamonds had a rosie DBTY a while back: https://www.instagram.com/p/BjaWBcCDKo3/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=7hlgny4d4lvq

I tried one in person before and I liked it, though I can see why it's not for everyone. If you expect it to have the fire and brilliance of a MRB or OEC, then it'll be a disappointment to you. I like the idea of the double rose cut but I've heard they can be prohibitively expensive. Kataoka stacks two rose cuts back to back because it's cheaper.

 

[lissyflo]

Adam at Old World Diamonds had a rosie DBTY a while back: https://www.instagram.com/p/BjaWBcCDKo3/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=7hlgny4d4lvq

I tried one in person before and I liked it, though I can see why it's not for everyone. If you expect it to have the fire and brilliance of a MRB or OEC, then it'll be a disappointment to you. I like the idea of the double rose cut but I've heard they can be prohibitively expensive. Kataoka stacks two rose cuts back to back because it's cheaper.

Thank you for the link - I’m not sure I’d have the nerve to drill through that many stones (or one even!). The stones were too close together for what I’m thinking of, but it’s good to know there are some rose DBTY out there! I had looked at OWD but they haven’t got anything at the moment.

I had an inkling that the double rose cuts would be pricey. Typical...

 

[JPie]

Thank you for the link - I’m not sure I’d have the nerve to drill through that many stones (or one even!). The stones were too close together for what I’m thinking of, but it’s good to know there are some rose DBTY out there! I had looked at OWD but they haven’t got anything at the moment.

I had an inkling that the double rose cuts would be pricey. Typical...

If by chance you're in the SF Bay Area, Carat & Stones on Union Street in SF had a rosie DBTY. It was also laser-drilled, but at least it could give you an idea of whether you like the look.

 

[foxinsox]

There’s always moissy if you want to go the rose cut route - not just cos it’s cheaper but they make really good rose cuts thanks to the double refraction. JuliaB cuts double rose cuts and also jubilee cuts if that appeals at all. Apologies at mentioning the M-word but in this cut I actually think it’s the better material to use. Moot point of course if you want actual vintage diamonds etc

 

[lissyflo]

If by chance you're in the SF Bay Area, Carat & Stones on Union Street in SF had a rosie DBTY. It was also laser-drilled, but at least it could give you an idea of whether you like the look.

Sadly I’m the wrong side of the Atlantic but thanks for the heads up! Choice here is limited at the best of times, but I don’t hold out much hope at all of tracking a rose cut version down here.

 

[lissyflo]

There’s always moissy if you want to go the rose cut route - not just cos it’s cheaper but they make really good rose cuts thanks to the double refraction. JuliaB cuts double rose cuts and also jubilee cuts if that appeals at all. Apologies at mentioning the M-word but in this cut I actually think it’s the better material to use. Moot point of course if you want actual vintage diamonds etc

Thanks! I had a look at some moissy options after Kipari suggested one as a trial too, and I know LAD cut rose and OEC moisses which I could be sorely tempted by. I had diamond in my head for this one and I can be slow in changing gears though! Your rose cut toi and moi is one hell of an advert for moissy!!

 

[yssie]

Thanks you for your thoughts @kipari @missy @rockysalamander @OoohShiny

@rockysalamander - double rose cuts are a very good idea! I hadn’t seen them before but I love briolettes and they look slightly similar in the videos that Ooohshiny posted (thank you!). I googled them and an old LT listing of @yssie popped up - Yssie, if you see this and have time to post, as someone who’s seen the double rose cuts IRL, do you have a view on how they’d perform in a DBTY necklace? They would definitely remove the problem of metal backing/foiling, and maybe have slightly more life to them than a standard rosie if there’s 2 layers of facets? I would presumably still have the issue of them not performing well whilst dirty - although, thinking about it, the stones at the front would be in contact with clothes rather than skin, so it would only be the ones touching the back of my neck and my collar bone that would be in direct contact with skin.

It sounds on the basis of comments here and from one of the vendors that standard rose cuts would not be a great idea. The ones on Grace’s site are very intriguing and appealing but I did have a niggle about there not being videos to see them in movement - it’s eadier to make things look great in a static shot sometimes. They are also significantly higher carat weight than I was envisaging, so again possibly misleading my eye!

Missy - an OEC version would be amazing but I’m not sure how easy it would be to match similar facet patterns? With a long necklace, I’d be looking at the bottom part frequently while wearing it (I’m a bit of a compulsive fiddler!) and I don’t know if seeing differences would bother me. Newly cut antique style stones would be amazing but $$$$!

My alternative plan would be a Whiteflash Color Me Mine version. The WF diamonds by the yard seems to get great reviews on here. I think I’d opt for alternating diamond and yellow sapphire stations - the yellow hopefully would be neutral and would reduce the bling a little, so I could ‘test the water’. I’ve asked how easy it would be to swap out the sapphire stations for diamond ones further down the line, if I find that I want all diamond after all (and WF could hopefully then use the sapphire stations to create a shorter, sapphire by the yard necklace for me). I’m waiting to hear if that’s feasible as that would give me some future options.

Hhhmmm, lots to consider!

Dutch white clear rose cuts like the ones I had are very rare. I don’t know where you’d go for them - unless they were custom cut I imagine they could take a long time to source, and I also imagine they would be quite pricey. I sold that set for far less than the stones were worth for personal reasons.

In my opinion a DBTY is the perfect use for these sorts of stones - they have more color and sparkle than regular rosies, and do more to obfuscate skin underneath, but they retain that very characteristic diaphanous, liquid look.

My advice: if you do happen to run into some at a fair price - buy and don’t look back, whether or not you have a plan for them. They’re rare.

 

[foxinsox]

Thanks! I had a look at some moissy options after Kipari suggested one as a trial too, and I know LAD cut rose and OEC moisses which I could be sorely tempted by. I had diamond in my head for this one and I can be slow in changing gears though! Your rose cut toi and moi is one hell of an advert for moissy!!

It totally converted me that’s for sure! It’s so rainbowy! I’m thinking about a pair of double rose cuts for earrings at some point.

 

[lissyflo]

I’m thinking about a pair of double rose cuts for earrings at some point.

Great minds think alike! I’ve asked for an idea of prices on standard and double rose cuts but, if they prove too expensive for a DBTY, it had occurred to me that they’d make great earring stones. I love the rose cut dangle styles that Grace posts fairly regularly on IG but always wondered if they’d get a bit lost in hair, whereas something in the same flavour but with a little more ooomph would be perfect!

I think that’s my future funds allocated until about 2030 now...

 

[lissyflo]

Dutch white clear rose cuts like the ones I had are very rare. I don’t know where you’d go for them - unless they were custom cut I imagine they could take a long time to source, and I also imagine they would be quite pricey. I sold that set for far less than the stones were worth for personal reasons.

In my opinion a DBTY is the perfect use for these sorts of stones - they have more color and sparkle than regular rosies, and do more to obfuscate skin underneath, but they retain that very characteristic diaphanous, liquid look.

My advice: if you do happen to run into some at a fair price - buy and don’t look back, whether or not you have a plan for them. They’re rare.

Thank you, Yssie - much appreciated!

Rare and potentially very expensive - I sure know how to pick ‘em Although, actually, I think @rockysalamander needs to take some blame as the one who suggested them in place of rose cuts!

(On a completely random note, I don’t know whether I’m more in awe of your extensive diamond knowledge or your vocab range. Diaphanous - such a beautiful word!)

 

[foxinsox]

Great minds think alike! I’ve asked for an idea of prices on standard and double rose cuts but, if they prove too expensive for a DBTY, it had occurred to me that they’d make great earring stones. I love the rose cut dangle styles that Grace posts fairly regularly on IG but always wondered if they’d get a bit lost in hair, whereas something in the same flavour but with a little more ooomph would be perfect!

I think that’s my future funds allocated until about 2030 now...

Oh gawd I know. I already have a few too many things I don’t wear enough so I feel guilty but oh! So many pretties

 

[rockysalamander]

Thank you, Yssie - much appreciated!

Rare and potentially very expensive - I sure know how to pick ‘em Although, actually, I think @rockysalamander needs to take some blame as the one who suggested them in place of rose cuts!

Guilty as charged!

 

[MaisOuiMadame]

Great minds think alike! I’ve asked for an idea of prices on standard and double rose cuts but, if they prove too expensive for a DBTY, it had occurred to me that they’d make great earring stones. I love the rose cut dangle styles that Grace posts fairly regularly on IG but always wondered if they’d get a bit lost in hair, whereas something in the same flavour but with a little more ooomph would be perfect!

I think that’s my future funds allocated until about 2030 now...

Ever since I read your first post I thought briolettes might be a great match for you. There's a multi coloured necklace on Loupetroop.com atm.

https://loupetroop.com/listings/necklaces-and-pendants/fancy-color-briolette-chain-6528238

I have no clue about that vendor, but I think it's nice to see that many briolettes and how they can be made into a necklace



Thinking earrings @yssie s work of art earrings come to mind

2018: Asymmetric briolette diamond station earrings

(16) G/H/I briolettes (3.85ctw) (Not from WF)
(2) 0.34ct H VS2 ACAs
(1) 3.50mm ACA melee
(4) 2.75mm ACA melee
Pt 950/Ru bezels and 1mm chain, 2"

I received these baby briolettes as a gift last year. I felt I ought to save them for an _elegant_ piece _with gravitas_, but I couldn't get the thought that they'd make darling drops out of my head, and I couldn't stop trawling Etsy for asymmetric designs, and after a few months of analysis paralysis I caved and gave myself permission to turn them into very-casual very-lighthearted earrings.

The earrings are custom 2" 'WF by the Yard' drops with graduated melee. From Sheerah on the missing bezel station:
In all honestly I think Leon's head may have exploded just a little when I reiterated that you *did* want a blank space on that particular earring


From WF:



Studio1040 in LA hung the briolettes. I asked for an uneven distribution that used a cluster of briolettes to replace the missing bezel station and Jacqui did a marvellous job aligning them They're perfectly, beautifully "symmetrically asymmetric"

The earrings are ~5ctw finished.




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[MaisOuiMadame]

Those are so beautiful it HURTS to look at them...

 

[AV_]

A chain with diamond dew drops is quite a sight & diamonds really do look like water drops this way.

 

[lissyflo]

Ever since I read your first post I thought briolettes might be a great match for you. There's a multi coloured necklace on Loupetroop.com atm.

https://loupetroop.com/listings/necklaces-and-pendants/fancy-color-briolette-chain-6528238

I have no clue about that vendor, but I think it's nice to see that many briolettes and how they can be made into a necklace



Thinking earrings @yssie s work of art earrings come to mind

Thanks @kipari . I saw the briolette chain on LT - I love the earthy golden colours.

I *think* either briolettes or double rose cuts would give me exactly what I’m after. I’ve got a rough quote to do something with doubled-up rose cuts (to achieve a similar effect to the Dutch ones, but using two back-to-back standard rose cuts). But obviously that doubles the price for the stones needed and, for the amount of stones that I’d need for a long chain, it’s too risky for something where I haven’t seen the effect in real life.

I think I’ll park the necklace idea for a while and consider earrings at some stage, as a way to see the effect but without committing to a large number of stones! - either Foxinsox’s suggestion of JuliaB moissanite Dutch rose cuts or try the back-to-back rose cuts.

And I’m 100% with you re: Yssie’s asymmetric briolette drops - stunningly beautiful and so unique.

 

[JPie]

Here are examples of what back-to-back rosies look like. I’m not sure of the clarity of these stones, but they take on almost a frosty look from some angles. I have both of these and I see a lot of rainbows from them. If you want them to look like drops of water then I agree that briolettes could be a good alternative.

 

[lissyflo]

Here are examples of what back-to-back rosies look like. I’m not sure of the clarity of these stones, but they take on almost a frosty look from some angles. I have both of these and I see a lot of rainbows from them. If you want them to look like drops of water then I agree that briolettes could be a good alternative.

Thanks @JPie ! On your settings does the stone on the back sit within the basket somehow, so it’s purely there to change the light return from the front stone? I was wondering how it might work on a necklace, where I’d want both sides to be ‘free’ and fully visible in case of flipping. Presumably some kind of double bezel to hold them together back to back might work?

 

[JPie]

@lissyflo exactly, they’re set so you don’t see the one in back at all. I think a bezel could hold them in place so you can see both sides.

 

[PreRaphaelite]

I love the idea of rose cuts as a dbty and doubly so as double-rose in delicate bezels. Like others have said, the reflective quality is different from other cuts but if you wanted that elemental, ethereal feel for daily wear, you really can't go wrong. Looking forward to seeing your project and wishing you great results with it (and its totally not because I'm jealous and living vicariously through other people's jewels this week... definitely not that)!

 

[yssie]

My concern with back to back stones is the same as with fully-enclosing cups and foil-backed stones - grime, water, and other residue will eventually get between the stones and it’ll be impossible to fully clean

Doubling the stones back-to-back will slightly change light return quality and will obfuscate skin underneath slightly more. For a ring the obfuscation is especially helpful IMO, but for a DBTY (vs. the ring, say) I don’t know that the double-up adds enough to justify the cleaning issues...

If you really want double-sided rose cuts - they’ll turn up. Sooner or later. And they’re really, really, really worth waiting for

Thank you for the kind words on my earrings @kipari, @lissyflo! Fully drilled briolette beads - that you can pass a thread all the way through - might be (yet another) option?

 

[lissyflo]

My concern with back to back stones is the same as with fully-enclosing cups and foil-backed stones - grime, water, and other residue will eventually get between the stones and it’ll be impossible to fully clean.

Doubling the stones back-to-back will slightly change light return quality and will obfuscate skin underneath slightly more. For a ring the obfuscation is especially helpful IMO, but for a DBTY (vs. the ring, say) I don’t know that the double-up adds enough to justify the cleaning issues...

If you really want double-sided rose cuts - they’ll turn up. Sooner or later. And they’re really, really, really worth waiting for

Thank you for the kind words on my earrings @kipari, @lissyflo! Fully drilled briolette beads - that you can pass a thread all the way through - might be (yet another) option?

Fantastically helpful information, @yssie - thank you!

I had failed to think through that dirt etc would eventually track its way beneath the bezel and therefore between the stones. And for cleaning too - I’m in a really hard water area, so any water trapped between the stones would eventually cause mineral build up as well, on top of general grime.

Right, that pretty much seals the deal for Dutch rose cuts, or possibly briolettes.

Let the waiting commence (because patience is up there as one of my most highly developed virtues ...)