shape
carat
color
clarity

Recommendations for Engagement Rings (with Setting)

downloadduckss

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 6, 2011
Messages
27
Hello

I'm thinking of popping the question soon. I'm thinking of spending US$5-6Gs but I don't know what combination of shape/colour/cut of diamond to get. My ideal size is 1.5ct but I'm not sure whether I can get a good combination within this budget. I'm hoping to purchase it online but I don't know the differences amongst online vendors. I was doing some research and it seems the popular places include:

www.bluenile.ca
www.whiteflash.com
www.briangavindiamonds.com

I have never had any experiences of purchasing anything this big online. Also, I'm located in Ontario, Canada and I was thinking of having it shipped to my buddy's place in New York... is this doable?

Would some please give this noob a good lecture? Please keep conversation in this thread professional.

Thanks
DD
 

slg47

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 4, 2010
Messages
9,667
downloadduckss|1307413765|2939529 said:
Hello

I'm thinking of popping the question soon. I'm thinking of spending US$5-6Gs but I don't know what combination of shape/colour/cut of diamond to get. My ideal size is 1.5ct but I'm not sure whether I can get a good combination within this budget. I'm hoping to purchase it online but I don't know the differences amongst online vendors. I was doing some research and it seems the popular places include:

www.bluenile.ca
www.whiteflash.com
www.briangavindiamonds.com

I have never had any experiences of purchasing anything this big online. Also, I'm located in Ontario, Canada and I was thinking of having it shipped to my buddy's place in New York... is this doable?

Would some please give this noob a good lecture? Please keep conversation in this thread professional.

Thanks
DD

I think you are looking at closer to 1 carat with your budget. As far as the online vendors you have listed...blue nile has the advantage of being canadian. on PS we generally recommend vendors who provide images and idealscope images, which blue nile does not. The other 2 vendors you listed will provide those images which are useful in evaluating diamonds.

However you can find good candidates on blue nile if you look for AGS0/GIA Ex with good HCA (pricescope.com/tools/hca). The difference with the vendors really comes down to the amount of information they provide as well as return/upgrade policies and what you are comfortable with.

Several of our Canadian PSers have ordered from these vendors so maybe they can advise you about shipping.
 

wreckem

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 15, 2011
Messages
49
I'm working with a $5-6k budget and 1 ct is a stretch for an ideal cut stone With the current market, it can be done but its going to be in the J SI1 range with a simple setting. J SI1 can be beautiful but its going to take quite a bit of looking to hit a ct at that price range. Thats when it comes to a round. Other cuts can be had for slightly cheaper.
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
You can order from any company you want and have it shipped to Canada. All you will pay is sales tax (GST/PST), there is no additional duty on diamonds and jewelry imported from the US. With our strong dollar, there is really no reason to limit yourself to companies who operate in Canada like BN.

Your budget is too small to jump the 1.5ct mark. That runs closer to $11k for a J Si1 these days. You can get a nice 1ct.

You need to decide on a diamond shape before anything else. Go see some stones in person. Or ask the intended wearer what she wants, that is always the best plan.

You also need to see some diamonds in person to decide what your comfort level is with color. Look for GIA or AGS graded stones only so you know the color grade is reliable.

When you know shape and color, then go from there.
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
wreckem|1307416659|2939574 said:
I'm working with a $5-6k budget and 1 ct is a stretch for an ideal cut stone With the current market, it can be done but its going to be in the J SI1 range with a simple setting. J SI1 can be beautiful but its going to take quite a bit of looking to hit a ct at that price range. Thats when it comes to a round. Other cuts can be had for slightly cheaper.

To elaborate on this point, princess and cushions, for example, are less per ct. than RBs, but they face up smaller. So in the end you pay about the same for a princess or an RB that *look* the same size to the eye.
 

CharmyPoo

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 10, 2004
Messages
7,007
As you have already heard, your budget is not realistic for a 1.5 ct in a round shape unless you drop to a really low color and clarity (probably with visible inclusions). The other option is to change cut just to hit the weight but the face up size will be smaller.

Alternatively, you can try the second hand market which might get you something in your desired range but from what I saw ... that is pushing it as well. I have been looking in the same price range for my friend ... unfortunately, 5 - 6 K doesn't get you that much these days.
 

lknvrb4

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 1, 2009
Messages
3,738
I just wanted to add that goodoldgold.com is an excellent place to look. Very nice people.
 

thk3

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 9, 2011
Messages
32
CharmyPoo|1307432426|2939658 said:
As you have already heard, your budget is not realistic for a 1.5 ct in a round shape unless you drop to a really low color and clarity (probably with visible inclusions). The other option is to change cut just to hit the weight but the face up size will be smaller.

Alternatively, you can try the second hand market which might get you something in your desired range but from what I saw ... that is pushing it as well. I have been looking in the same price range for my friend ... unfortunately, 5 - 6 K doesn't get you that much these days.


This just sounds pretentious. I imagine you weren't trying to offend anyone, but unfortunately not everyone has the means you apparently do and by saying 5-6k doesn't "get you much," you are demeaning their purchase. Maybe a reply with more couth would be more effective and less likely to look like an attempt at feigning elitism.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
57,942
I do not think Charmy meant anything like that! Diamonds have gone up recently and $5000-6000 will not buy what it would have bought even a year ago. Even then, metals were high and diamonds were high, and I think you would have been hard pressed to get a nice carat with setting at that price. People who haven't been looking at diamonds are not aware of the pricing. For this budget, I'd be looking at the .90 range with a simple setting or go to .80 maybe with a halo setting.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
57,942
Here are some examples:

The WF stones will have an additional pricescope discount if you ask:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2650814.htm

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2645959.htm

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8272/ (this one is from Canada if that is something you might like)

Just as an example, a 1.06 J SI:

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8336/ ($6461)

Your absolutely best bet if you want to hit the 1 ct. mark (the stone is about $1000 less due to the fluorescence):

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/diamond-detail/?product_id=BLAGS-104052029005
 

farmer gal

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
1,063
I didn't know if your total budget was 6 with setting but here is a few I found

Make sure you get the pricescope disocunt

Round

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2650814.htm

Diamond accented setting within your budget

http://www.whiteflash.com/engagement-rings/diamond-settings/rounded-open-cathedral-diamond-engagement-ring-626.htm

They have tons of beautiful settings, but wasn't sure what your total budget was :wink2:

I thought I would throw one out from BGD you would have to call for discounts, I would also have them check to see if this diamond is eyeclean.

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/diamond-detail/?product_id=AGS-104051075003

I also thought I would throw some BGD blues out at you. If you go on their website they have more info on blues

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/diamond-detail/?product_id=BLAGS-104052029005

IF your budget is 6 for the diamond then these might be within your reach with discounts

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/diamond-detail/?product_id=BLAGS-104050981001

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/diamond-detail/?product_id=BLAGS-104052029004
 

CharmyPoo

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 10, 2004
Messages
7,007
thk3|1307449094|2939710 said:
This just sounds pretentious. I imagine you weren't trying to offend anyone, but unfortunately not everyone has the means you apparently do and by saying 5-6k doesn't "get you much," you are demeaning their purchase. Maybe a reply with more couth would be more effective and less likely to look like an attempt at feigning elitism.

Yikes - I certaintly didn't mean to sound that way and am sorry it came across as pretentious. It was suppose to be more of a vent and whine from my part with the raising diamond costs.
 

thk3

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 9, 2011
Messages
32
CharmyPoo|1307454144|2939748 said:
thk3|1307449094|2939710 said:
This just sounds pretentious. I imagine you weren't trying to offend anyone, but unfortunately not everyone has the means you apparently do and by saying 5-6k doesn't "get you much," you are demeaning their purchase. Maybe a reply with more couth would be more effective and less likely to look like an attempt at feigning elitism.

Yikes - I certaintly didn't mean to sound that way and am sorry it came across as pretentious. It was suppose to be more of a vent and whine from my part with the raising diamond costs.

Sorry if I overreacted, I just had a sinking feeling when I read that, I was scared my ring wouldn't be "enough." Maybe just pre-ring giving jitters. Anyway, sorry again.
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
thk3|1307457736|2939794 said:
CharmyPoo|1307454144|2939748 said:
thk3|1307449094|2939710 said:
This just sounds pretentious. I imagine you weren't trying to offend anyone, but unfortunately not everyone has the means you apparently do and by saying 5-6k doesn't "get you much," you are demeaning their purchase. Maybe a reply with more couth would be more effective and less likely to look like an attempt at feigning elitism.

Yikes - I certaintly didn't mean to sound that way and am sorry it came across as pretentious. It was suppose to be more of a vent and whine from my part with the raising diamond costs.

Sorry if I overreacted, I just had a sinking feeling when I read that, I was scared my ring wouldn't be "enough." Maybe just pre-ring giving jitters. Anyway, sorry again.

To me, and many others in the real world thk3, $5k is a LOT to spend on a ring! The sad thing is that with diamond prices rising so fast, it buys so much less than it did just a year ago :blackeye: We all lament how little our money buys anymore, no matter the budget. And your ring is a knockout ;))
 

Amys Bling

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
11,025
Dreamer_D|1307423850|2939627 said:
You can order from any company you want and have it shipped to Canada. All you will pay is sales tax (GST/PST), there is no additional duty on diamonds and jewelry imported from the US. With our strong dollar, there is really no reason to limit yourself to companies who operate in Canada like BN.

Your budget is too small to jump the 1.5ct mark. That runs closer to $11k for a J Si1 these days. You can get a nice 1ct.

You need to decide on a diamond shape before anything else. Go see some stones in person. Or ask the intended wearer what she wants, that is always the best plan.

You also need to see some diamonds in person to decide what your comfort level is with color. Look for GIA or AGS graded stones only so you know the color grade is reliable.

When you know shape and color, then go from there.

Ditto. 5k doesn't buy what it used to! You are probably looking at 1ct if you want get get an ideal cut (really sparkly)... Cut is the one C people don't skimp out on... One carat is a beautiful size and nothing to sneeze at, look at the under 1ct thread for inspiration.
 

wreckem

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 15, 2011
Messages
49
Dreamer_D|1307462662|2939851 said:
thk3|1307457736|2939794 said:
CharmyPoo|1307454144|2939748 said:
thk3|1307449094|2939710 said:
This just sounds pretentious. I imagine you weren't trying to offend anyone, but unfortunately not everyone has the means you apparently do and by saying 5-6k doesn't "get you much," you are demeaning their purchase. Maybe a reply with more couth would be more effective and less likely to look like an attempt at feigning elitism.

Yikes - I certaintly didn't mean to sound that way and am sorry it came across as pretentious. It was suppose to be more of a vent and whine from my part with the raising diamond costs.

Sorry if I overreacted, I just had a sinking feeling when I read that, I was scared my ring wouldn't be "enough." Maybe just pre-ring giving jitters. Anyway, sorry again.

To me, and many others in the real world thk3, $5k is a LOT to spend on a ring! The sad thing is that with diamond prices rising so fast, it buys so much less than it did just a year ago :blackeye: We all lament how little our money buys anymore, no matter the budget. And your ring is a knockout ;))

$5-6k(diamond & setting together) buys quite a bit less than what it did in when I first started looking earlier this year. It's to bad I didn't have all the money together at that time. It doesn't help when sales tax might eat $400-500 of my budget either depending on where I buy.

The size of diamond the OP can get depends on if the budget is for the diamond or for the whole enchilada and what type of setting he is looking for.
 

bigdiamondtinygal

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 2, 2007
Messages
310
Hi there and welcome!

Would you consider an antique diamond? You might be able to get more bang for your buck that way.

Here's a beautiful antique ring from the very reputable Doyle & Doyle - just a bit over your budget but a gorgeous ring for the price:

http://www.doyledoyle.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=20897&itemtemplate=PDGCommTemplates/HTN/Item_ring.html&sn=dia

Also, this may be way off base but here is a beautiful yellow diamond ring in your budget. Many people here have purchased from diamonds by lauren:

http://rockdiamond.com/index.php/jewelry/loose-dimaond-90ct-cushion-gia-fancy-yellow-vs2-r3393
 

downloadduckss

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 6, 2011
Messages
27
Thanks for the great help guys!

Would you guys be able to help with these questions:
1) Why do some vendors post the "wire" price?
2) And why do some vendors post a "Pricescope Wire" price?
3) What is the best 4Cs combination I can get if i want to spend US$5500 (excl. setting / taxes)?
4) What are the other charges if I want to have it shipped to New York City? (taxes, shipping, etc -- b/c I'm from Ontario, Canada)
5) How much do retailers usually charge to put the diamond and setting together?

DD
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
1) Why do some vendors post the "wire" price?
2) And why do some vendors post a "Pricescope Wire" price?

Most PS vendors offer a discount if you pay by wire and an additional discount if you are from PS and pay by wire. Varies by vendor. Usually between 3% and 5%.

3) What is the best 4Cs combination I can get if i want to spend US$5500 (excl. setting / taxes)?

Well GIA Ex or AGS0 for cut, and then after that you need to decide about color and clarity and what you are comfortable with. Go see stones in person to decide.

4) What are the other charges if I want to have it shipped to New York City? (taxes, shipping, etc -- b/c I'm from Ontario, Canada)

Shipping is included. No matter where it ships to, you legally need to pay GST/PST when you bring the ring back to Canada. There are no duties or anything, just regular sales taxes. I suggest you ship it to yourself in Canada and just pay the taxes like a good boy ;)) . Save yourself the hassel of bringing it accross the border.

5) How much do retailers usually charge to put the diamond and setting together?

If they sett you the stone, then there is no charge to set it. If you decide to buy the setting at a different vendor, there is a fee around $100 usually, maybe more or less. The vendor selling the setting will not take responsibility for your stone during setting, so you might want insurance on the diamond during that process. It is simpler to have the stone set by the person who sells the diamonds because they will take responsibility for the stone during setting.
 

bigdiamondtinygal

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 2, 2007
Messages
310
Here are a few of Round Brilliants in your budget. As many others said, if you are looking for a well cut round brilliant 1.5 carats is probably not realistic for that budget unless you a willing to sacrifice quite a bit on the cut, color and clarity of the sotne:

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-VS2-Premium-Cut-Round-Diamond-1380476.asp

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2650814.htm

If you/your fiance are willing to consider and/or like lower colors and antique cuts there are some beautiful larger stone options (but it is totally personal preference). I personally love warm older cuts (as do many others here). You can find lots of old cut rings here if you search. Anyway here are a few nice old cuts to give you an idea:


http://www.oldworlddiamonds.com/inv_details.php?ID=1599&SHAPE=OM&PAGE=3

http://www.oldworlddiamonds.com/inv_details.php?ID=2575&SHAPE=OM&PAGE=3

http://www.oldworlddiamonds.com/inv_details.php?ID=1331&SHAPE=EU&PAGE=29
 

vintagelover229

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
3,518
I just wanted to add that if your a little discouraged by the size that your budget will allow you to buy new you could consider going estate or vintage. Here are a few sites that have good reputations around here for you to check out.

www.jewelsbyericagrace.com
http://www.doverjewelry.com/
www.antiquengagementrings.com
www.newyorkestatejewelry.com

Also if you have a style that you like I can try and search for good deals via other sources as well. I got my 1.64 H VVS1 vintage e-ring for under 5k (I'll attach a photo if you request one). Its a RB and it was prior to the diamond hike (even estate pieces have increased in price) but you can get a beautiful round (old European cut) that's beautiful for your budget.

Below is for sale at JBEG (first link) and is right under 7k but its 1.43 carats OEC center stone. It will give you an idea of the appearance of vintage stones (not all are cut equal just a heads up) They also have a Tacori with an ideal RB in there for just under 8k that is a halo too.
http://jewelsbyericagrace.smugmug.com/Jewelry/Rings-Antique-diamonds/143ct-Old-European-Cut-Diamond/11839065_MxqBM#836968073_tiE53

http://jewelsbyericagrace.smugmug.com/Jewelry/Modern-and-Estate-Pieces/Tacori-3-Stone-Ring/12541381_JM6zY#899697913_vUzLi

Another option is to check out pearlmens and see what they have on their great deal section. they have an artcarved (and a few other nice designer) engagement rings right now in your budget. Bill is great and will be 110% honest with you about the cut and everything on the pieces

http://www.pearlmansjewelers.com/jewelry-specials/previously-owned-jewelry/rings/207PO1/0/
 

slg47

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 4, 2010
Messages
9,667
pears are not graded for cut.

what shape are you looking for? I would try to narrow that down first.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
I'm not liking that Costco pear. It's not a very attractive example of it's shape. Let's see if I can find you something a little prettier.


Alright, here's what I'd do.

Call James Allen and have these pulled and looked at by one of their Gemologists.

Have them pick three out of the ones listed: the three picked should be completely eyeclean, face up white (even the tip) and have a minimum bowtie, and be very bright stones.

Then get an ASET of the three and post them here for us to help you pick.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/D-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Pear-Diamond-1373897.asp D color, great proportions, lovely size (pears face up large so this 7 x 5 diamond is going to look great on the hand).

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Pear-Diamond-1371602.asp E color, great proportions, and bigger than the last ( 8 x 5) and has the potential to be a nice bright stone without too much of a visible bowtie.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI2-Premium-Cut-Pear-Diamond-1351369.asp Full carat weight and G color (great value)... check to see if eyeclean and bright and how the bowtie appears. Lots of potential here.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Pear-Diamond-1232167.asp This one has my personal favorite shape of all of them. H color and Vs2 clarity... check for bowtie and brightness as well as color. Very nearly 8 x 6 in size it will look just fabulous on the hand if everything checks out.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-SI2-Ideal-Cut-Pear-Diamond-1260751.asp E colored stone. Check to see if it is eyeclean, another one that could be a great value if everything falls into place (brightness, bowtie, eyecleanliness).

Here are some settings for a pear that will make the center shine:
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/settings-with-sidestones/-Platinum-Tapered-Baguette-Diamond-Engagement-Ring.html

And http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/channelset-rings/White-Gold-Engagement-Ring.html

And http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/pave/18k-White-Gold-2-4-4mm-Pave-Set.html

And http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/settings-with-sidestones/Antique-looking-Bezel-Pave.html

And http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/settings-with-sidestones/ring/item_58-865.asp

And http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/settings-with-sidestones/open-prong-Side-Stones-ring.html

And, my personal favorite, http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/solitaire-rings/ring/item_57-7656.asp
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,225
Since you originally wanted a 1.5 carat stone, I think choosing either a pear or an oval will give you that look of a large center stone that you want, within budget and pears and ovals tend to look large for their carat weight. I would try to go for a .75 to 1.1 carat oval or pear personally and then spend around 1200 for an 18K white gold setting.
 

downloadduckss

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 6, 2011
Messages
27
Just out of curiosity, what are the benefits for ordering from jamesallen? I wonder how much of a markup to they charge compare to the competitors such as whiteflash
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
downloadduckss|1307761404|2943062 said:
Just out of curiosity, what are the benefits for ordering from jamesallen? I wonder how much of a markup to they charge compare to the competitors such as whiteflash

They have a very low markup. They have a different business model than WF. They are sort of a hybrid company -- they have access to many stones easily and can take photos and images for you and assess them, but they do not own the stones (with some exceptions), so they keep overhead down. JA is my personal first choice when someone has a budget and does not necessarily want to upgrade later on.

They also have a 60 day refund policy and pay the return shipping on returns, so there is no risk involved. Very good policies.

One thing you need to know is the margins for online diamond companies are very small. For a company like JA I would wager their markup is in the range of 5% in many cases. They make money on volume.
 

downloadduckss

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 6, 2011
Messages
27
I still haven't decided on the shape yet... Which shape would you recommend if I wanted the diamond to look big from far away?

thanks
 
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