Quit a friendship due to political/social issues?

[CherryBlossom]

Have you ever felt like you knew someone but all of a sudden they open their mouth and say something that just shocks you? I recognize that we shouldn't be judgmental and strive to be more tolerant and have friends from all walks of life, but last night a good friend of mine used the N word when referring to an African American waiter. She also went on a rant about African Americans and basically said some things that sounded absolutely crazy and racist to me. She also let me know that she dislikes Obama and is convinced that he's born in Kenya and a Muslim. Which btw really pisses me off, because whenever I hear people say that, I want to ask them "so what of it? why do we keep talking about him being a Muslim? what are you implying without directly saying it?" She was just flipping out and I sat there in disbelief and absolutely clueless as to how address every one of her crazy statements.

I have known this person for years, and although I have never seen them interact with a lot of people of color, I never assumed that they were racist. I knew she watched Fox news a lot but overall found her to be apolitical She's a chemist, exceptionally smart, very sweet, timid, and overall rational. This is not someone who drinks a lot or has ever really said anything irrational to me before. In fact, I would say that she has a great head on her shoulders, and I used to admire her.

I just don't know to address this. In my heart I know that I don't see this person the same way after this incident, I can't really see myself being close to her any longer or sharing things about my life.

How important are these things to you when it comes to your friends? Yes, we shouldn't be judgmental but isn't friendship built on mutual aid? For me, it's very important that to respect my friends and how they view the world and/or behave in it. Don't you have to respect someone in order to share important things about your life w/ them or ask them for advice?

I'm so frustrated right now. I'm going to dinner party tonight and I am going to see her again. awkward turtle

 

[HollyS]

Re: Ever stopped being friends w/ someone due to politics?

I can't think of a single incident where it mattered that much.

I have avoided people who wanted to talk too much about politics. But they probably weren't really good friends.

 

[kenny]

You can end any friendship you like for whatever reason you like.
Trust your gut.

 

[movie zombie]

yes, i have....and i would do so in this instance. personally, for me life is to short to spend it around people whose values i don't share.

MoZo

 

[JewelFreak]

Something like that would bother me enough to affect the friendship. (But Fox doesn't have anything to do with it. 1/3 of their viewers identify themselves as liberals.) Davi's on the money: trust your gut.

A friend I'd known since high school & whose social views I always assumed to be pretty liberal, about 15 yrs later suddenly came out with some stunning talk about Jews. I gawped in shock. After that I kind of let the friendship fade away. I felt we just didn't have similar takes on the world.

I have known people whom I was very fond of for their kindness, down-to-earthness & humor, who had one or another racial prejudice but did not talk about it. Maybe 2 of those -- and I still loved them for their good qualities. I never saw or heard of their behaving badly to anyone. As long as they had enough respect not to make me listen to their stuff, taking into account the many good things they did, I couldn't cut them out of my life. Sometimes you have to leave it to the Higher Power to judge. Other times, it's up to you. Gut call.

--- Laurie

 

[chemgirl]

I think you should do whatever feels right to you.

My childhood best friend came out with some really offensive anti-gay ranting a few years ago and it did affect our relationship. I just can't respect her anymore because of it. We still talk and I see her whenever we're in the same town, but I don't feel the same way about her. I don't plan on ending the friendship, but I am definitely distancing myself from her. Its not even a conscious decision, its just happening because of how I feel about her now. On an interesting side note, she voiced these opinions at work and lost her job because of it. I think she's realizing that its not socially acceptable and I sincerely hope she adjusts her views.

Maybe its worth letting your friend know that you don't share her views and you don't want to discuss them in the future.

 

[iheartscience]

I would absolutely not be friends with anyone who refers to an African-American person as the n word. The end. I would stop hanging out with them and I would tell them why, too.

I also wouldn't be friends with anyone who believes Obama is a Kenyan Muslim, either. I like to surround myself with people who have a solid grasp on facts and reality.

As for the liberals supposedly watching Fox, they must all work for the Daily Show and Stephen Colbert. Either that or they like a good laugh and tune into Glenn Beck to get it.

 

[Circe]

Under similar circumstances, I'd probably torpedo the friendship on the spot, because I wouldn't be able to keep myself from saying exactly what I was thinking in response. I am many things, but capable of holding my tongue, I am not.

I'm trying to think about the disagreements I do have with friends. One's fatphobic: one defends our legal system re: prosecution of sexual violence; one drives me batty by being too liberal to take seriously, even for me. But none of them of them actively reinforces the worst tendencies of our society ... which is where I'd draw the line. No virulent prejudice, not against anyone - that nonsense is contagious.

 

[jstarfireb]

I don't think I'd mention anything or make any drastic changes, but as someone else mentioned, I'd just let the friendship fade away. I wouldn't hang out with her as much, and I wouldn't make any effort to be with her one-on-one, only in your social circles. And then if she noticed and brought it up to you (which it sounds like she wouldn't given her personality), I'd tell her the truth - that you were shocked by her use of a racial slur and have a hard time remaining friends with someone who would say that.

 

[Indylady]

Yes, I would leave the friendship.

 

[monarch64]

I would also leave the friendship. There is absolutely no need for disrespectful speech during conversations with my peers.

If one of my friends said something as abominable and rude and disrespectful as that, I would have had to gather all of my strength not to slap her. Who SAYS something like that??? HELL, WHO THINKS THAT?

I used to hear similar sentiments growing up and in high school in my hometown. Blech. Never had the stomach for it, and never will.

 

[MAC-W]

<snip>
I recognize that we shouldn't be judgmental and strive to be more tolerant

<snip>

Why?

I dont understand this statement.



IMO, there are some things that should never be tolerated and should absolutely be judged.

If we tolerate everything and judge nothing, then bad behaviours and attitudes are free to proliferate with no checks.

Thats not a world I would want to be part of.

 

[Brown.Eyed.Girl]

I would absolutely not be friends with anyone who refers to an African-American person as the n word. The end. I would stop hanging out with them and I would tell them why, too.

I also wouldn't be friends with anyone who believes Obama is a Kenyan Muslim, either. I like to surround myself with people who have a solid grasp on facts and reality.

As for the liberals supposedly watching Fox, they must all work for the Daily Show and Stephen Colbert. Either that or they like a good laugh and tune into Glenn Beck to get it.

Once again, Thing says everything I'm thinking.

I would be extremely bothered if a friend displayed racist/bigoted/offensive behavior like that. It would definitely affect my perceptions of him/her, and I don't think I could be friends with a person who called African-Americans the N word, or was stupid enough to believe Obama was a Kenyan Muslim. Honestly, I'd feel a bit betrayed too that someone I considered to be a good friend turned out to be so different ... almost as if I never knew that person at all. A bit hyperbolic, I know, but still.

The Fox News thing... well like Thing said, I'm sure there's SOME entertainment value there... if for nothing else than the hilarity of seeing how out of touch with reality Glenn Beck is....

 

[JewelFreak]

Hey folks -- to clarify, it's 1/3 of the audience for the newscasts that identify themselves as liberal. Because you get more info there. Others are self-censored -- watch the Fox newscasts & see. You get stuff the other media don't even report & I'd rather be informed, whether or not I like what I hear. If the opinion programs drive you nuts, don't watch them -- but there is a strict divide between news reporting & editorializing on Fox. They don't bury stories so the "dumb" public will be too ignorant to disagree w/their viewpoint. I watch it for that reason -- if anywhere else provided the same breadth, I'd watch that. So MediaMatters & MoveOn tell you NOT TO WATCH it, gasp, you'll be poisoned (by what?)! If you take their word for it, you do the same as conservatives who follow every word of Rush L. You dislike that, don't you? Do your own thinking!

Sorry for the threadjack. I can't agree more with you who would end a friendship over the N word. Unacceptable for any reason.

--- Laurie

 

[Amys Bling]

You can end any friendship you like for whatever reason you like.
Trust your gut.

I agree. It is a deal breaker for me. It's one thing to have some difference of opinions but whatbyou described and how you felt about it seems like a big deal, it is to me at least!

 

[iheartscience]

Hey folks -- to clarify, it's 1/3 of the audience for the newscasts that identify themselves as liberal. Because you get more info there. Others are self-censored -- watch the Fox newscasts & see. You get stuff the other media don't even report & I'd rather be informed, whether or not I like what I hear. If the opinion programs drive you nuts, don't watch them -- but there is a strict divide between news reporting & editorializing on Fox. They don't bury stories so the "dumb" public will be too ignorant to disagree w/their viewpoint. I watch it for that reason -- if anywhere else provided the same breadth, I'd watch that. So MediaMatters & MoveOn tell you NOT TO WATCH it, gasp, you'll be poisoned (by what?)! If you take their word for it, you do the same as conservatives who follow every word of Rush L. You dislike that, don't you? Do your own thinking!

Sorry for the threadjack. I can't agree more with you who would end a friendship over the N word. Unacceptable for any reason.

--- Laurie

SNORT. That's simply not true.

And I don't watch Fox News because I dislike the way they manipulate the news to fit their narrative. I prefer to get my news the old fashioned way-from actual reporters. MediaMatters and MoveOn have nothing to do with it.

As for thinking freely, it sounds like you've been listening to a little too much Fox yourself. If you actually believe they're "fair and balanced" it's time to step away from the TV.

 

[FrekeChild]

I would absolutely not be friends with anyone who refers to an African-American person as the n word. The end. I would stop hanging out with them and I would tell them why, too.

I also wouldn't be friends with anyone who believes Obama is a Kenyan Muslim, either. I like to surround myself with people who have a solid grasp on facts and reality.

As for the liberals supposedly watching Fox, they must all work for the Daily Show and Stephen Colbert. Either that or they like a good laugh and tune into Glenn Beck to get it.

Once again, Thing says everything I'm thinking.

I would be extremely bothered if a friend displayed racist/bigoted/offensive behavior like that. It would definitely affect my perceptions of him/her, and I don't think I could be friends with a person who called African-Americans the N word, or was stupid enough to believe Obama was a Kenyan Muslim. Honestly, I'd feel a bit betrayed too that someone I considered to be a good friend turned out to be so different ... almost as if I never knew that person at all. A bit hyperbolic, I know, but still.

The Fox News thing... well like Thing said, I'm sure there's SOME entertainment value there... if for nothing else than the hilarity of seeing how out of touch with reality Glenn Beck is....

My step-MIL or whatever you want to call her (husband calls her "my dad's wife") called our nephew the "N" word...she, however, is essentially a mail order bride from the Ukraine. So I don't exactly give her opinion/words much value. In fact, I blatantly ignore her completely.

I only associate with ONE person who is not of my political leanings, and that's because during the rest of the four years that don't revolve around major political elections, she's pretty freaking cool. She would NEVER EVER EVER say those kinds of things about another person or their race. Otherwise, I just cannot deal with people who do not share the same values as I do.

Especially, if they are like my dad's ex-GF, who is a religious Rush/Glenn Beck/Fox lover who thinks that people who cannot afford medical insurance/care should die from their ailments...which is a big part of the reason she is an ex.

 

[FrekeChild]

Hey folks -- to clarify, it's 1/3 of the audience for the newscasts that identify themselves as liberal. Because you get more info there. Others are self-censored -- watch the Fox newscasts & see. You get stuff the other media don't even report & I'd rather be informed, whether or not I like what I hear. If the opinion programs drive you nuts, don't watch them -- but there is a strict divide between news reporting & editorializing on Fox. They don't bury stories so the "dumb" public will be too ignorant to disagree w/their viewpoint. I watch it for that reason -- if anywhere else provided the same breadth, I'd watch that. So MediaMatters & MoveOn tell you NOT TO WATCH it, gasp, you'll be poisoned (by what?)! If you take their word for it, you do the same as conservatives who follow every word of Rush L. You dislike that, don't you? Do your own thinking!

Sorry for the threadjack. I can't agree more with you who would end a friendship over the N word. Unacceptable for any reason.

--- Laurie

SNORT. That's simply not true.

And I don't watch Fox News because I dislike the way they manipulate the news to fit their narrative. I prefer to get my news the old fashioned way-from actual reporters. MediaMatters and MoveOn have nothing to do with it.

As for thinking freely, it sounds like you've been listening to a little too much Fox yourself. If you actually believe they're "fair and balanced" it's time to step away from the TV.

What the bleep is MediaMatters?

Agreed with T2of2 on her analysis of Fox news and their manipulation of events...

 

[Circe]

My step-MIL or whatever you want to call her (husband calls her "my dad's wife") called our nephew the "N" word...she, however, is essentially a mail order bride from the Ukraine. So I don't exactly give her opinion/words much value. In fact, I blatantly ignore her completely.

I only associate with ONE person who is not of my political leanings, and that's because during the rest of the four years that don't revolve around major political elections, she's pretty freaking cool. She would NEVER EVER EVER say those kinds of things about another person or their race. Otherwise, I just cannot deal with people who do not share the same values as I do.

Especially, if they are like my dad's ex-GF, who is a religious Rush/Glenn Beck/Fox lover who thinks that people who cannot afford medical insurance/care should die from their ailments...which is a big part of the reason she is an ex.

Uh ... Freke? That sounds little pot, kettle - don't give credence to her words because she's an idiot using racist cant, not because she's from the Ukraine!

BTW, not sure here, but is she actually using the American N-word, or possibly something that sounds a lot like it, but with a soft, drawn-out "e" sound, sounds like "neger?" Just asking, because in Russian/Ukranian, as far as I'm aware, that's actually still considered to be the polite, politically correct, sensitive term - always throws me for a loop around native speakers if the topic of race comes up. (Well, that, or a lot of the Russian speakers out in Brighton have race issues, which is not necessarily out of the question.) Definitely not defending the use of the word if it's the American epithet, but if she's still a wonky ESL speaker and nobody's explained it to her, it might be unintentional.

 

[loriken214]

YES! I'm a very tolerable person, to a point. This type of behavior would end things for me. Nuff said!

Lori

 

[Jennifer W]

Not someone I'd want to be close to. Anyone overhearing her express those views would assume she's talking to a like-minded individual, unless they also hear you correct her.

There are plenty people I get on with and with whom I share social, political and moral values - I'd tend not to want to spend time or invest in a friendship with someone whose opinions were obnoxious to me.

 

[kenny]

<snip>
I recognize that we shouldn't be judgmental and strive to be more tolerant
<snip>

Why?
I dont understand this statement.
IMO, there are some things that should never be tolerated and should absolutely be judged.
If we tolerate everything and judge nothing, then bad behaviours and attitudes are free to proliferate with no checks.
Thats not a world I would want to be part of.

I totally agree.
Where did this, "Thou shall not judge" thing come from?
How absurd.
Every one of us judges everything and everyone all day long.
It's essential.

I'd replace, "Thou Shall not Judge" with, "Thou shall Judge, but Respect Diversity".

 

[junebug17]

I know I live a pretty sheltered life, but don't the majority of people in this day and age know it's really inappropriate to use that racial slur? How odd that this friend never exhibited any racism until that moment.

My thought is you don't know her as well as you thought. If it was me, I'd talk to her about it and let her know how I felt about what she said. And the friendship would fizzle out, because I don't think I could be close to someone who held those views.

 

[JewelFreak]

[quote="junebug17|1306686363|2933152"
My thought is you don't know her as well as you thought. If it was me, I'd talk to her about it and let her know how I felt about what she said. And the friendship would fizzle out, because I don't think I could be close to someone who held those views.[/quote]

Good point, Junebug. It's weird when that happens, but it does -- somebody you've known forever comes up with a totally unexpected thing. Your advice to say something is good. The friendship would end either way, so letting the person know how you feel is worthwhile.

Thing, no need to get snarky -- you don't know what my politics are & we can't discuss them here, not that I'm interested in doing so. I'm not gonna bite you for whatever you watch or think; I'd appreciate similar from you. I have friends from all over the political spectrum & almost all extremes of it; we don't sneer at each other. I gave an opinion. We're allowed to do that in this country, hopefully without unpleasantness.

 

[partgypsy]

I've had to listen to the Obama is a muslim, foreigner, and "Satan" (as referred to in Revelations) from patients as I often work with older white veterans living in rural areas. I would like to correct them, but I'm not supposed to talk about politics at work, so I let them say whatever they are going to say and I change the conversation. But it bothers me. To say the least, I didn't like Bush and disagreed with his politics when he was in office for 8 years. But I really disliked anyone calling him names or making fun of him. Even if you disagree with the politics, it really makes me feel uncomfortable when people insult the president. It makes me feel like I'm no longer living in an civil society.
So, while I do have relatives and other people I've had to listen to this kind of speech, I would never willingly listen to it from someone who is supposed to be a friend. As someone else said, life is too short.

 

[AmeliaG]

I avoid people who are prone to long rants - even if I agree with them most of the time. They're angry and unhappy people. Ranting once in awhile in a forum is fine but if a person is ranting most of the time when we're together, it gets old and rather depressing.

 

[wannaBMrsH]

I agree that you should trust your instincts and let the friendship fade...

As far as the n word, I know so many people from outside of the US, that unless I absolutely know that they are being racist, I don't ever blink unless the n word actually ends in gger...

In Latin American countries, everyone uses the word "negro" to refer to those who are dark-skinned and it is not considered a slur of any sort. In fact, to refer to someone as "African-(American, Caribbean, etc.)" is considered much more insulting because they should just be referred to as American, Caribbean, etc...unless you KNOW that they actually hail from Africa. Adding the "African-" prefix is considered much more insulting and even ignorant in most Latin American and European countries. In Germany, for example, there isn't an "African-" prefix. If someone is from Africa, they are referred to as Afrikaner, if they are from Boston, they are Amerikaner.

My husband was initially shocked because I have cousins that are very dark-skinned and everyone refers to them as "negro" and "negra" but this isn't any different from referring to very light-skinned people as "guero" or "guera" and it's not considered an insult any more than stating someone is short or tall, blonde or brunette...

 

[Dancing Fire]

[quote="FrekeChild|

What the bleep is MediaMatters?

Agreed with T2of2 on her analysis of Fox news and their manipulation of events...[/quote]


are there other news channels?...

 

[iheartscience]

Thing, no need to get snarky -- you don't know what my politics are & we can't discuss them here, not that I'm interested in doing so. I'm not gonna bite you for whatever you watch or think; I'd appreciate similar from you. I have friends from all over the political spectrum & almost all extremes of it; we don't sneer at each other. I gave an opinion. We're allowed to do that in this country, hopefully without unpleasantness.

You do realize that this: "So MediaMatters & MoveOn tell you NOT TO WATCH it, gasp, you'll be poisoned (by what?)! If you take their word for it, you do the same as conservatives who follow every word of Rush L. You dislike that, don't you? Do your own thinking!" is snarky, don't you? Don't dish it out if you can't take it.

And I don't care what your politics are. Fox News is a well-oiled Republican propaganda machine, and that includes the "news" shows. I'll give Shep Smith a pass, but he's the only one.

Edited to add italics

 

[Autumnovember]

My step-MIL or whatever you want to call her (husband calls her "my dad's wife") called our nephew the "N" word...she, however, is essentially a mail order bride from the Ukraine. So I don't exactly give her opinion/words much value. In fact, I blatantly ignore her completely.

I only associate with ONE person who is not of my political leanings, and that's because during the rest of the four years that don't revolve around major political elections, she's pretty freaking cool. She would NEVER EVER EVER say those kinds of things about another person or their race. Otherwise, I just cannot deal with people who do not share the same values as I do.

Especially, if they are like my dad's ex-GF, who is a religious Rush/Glenn Beck/Fox lover who thinks that people who cannot afford medical insurance/care should die from their ailments...which is a big part of the reason she is an ex.

Uh ... Freke? That sounds little pot, kettle - don't give credence to her words because she's an idiot using racist cant, not because she's from the Ukraine!

BTW, not sure here, but is she actually using the American N-word, or possibly something that sounds a lot like it, but with a soft, drawn-out "e" sound, sounds like "neger?" Just asking, because in Russian/Ukranian, as far as I'm aware, that's actually still considered to be the polite, politically correct, sensitive term - always throws me for a loop around native speakers if the topic of race comes up. (Well, that, or a lot of the Russian speakers out in Brighton have race issues, which is not necessarily out of the question.) Definitely not defending the use of the word if it's the American epithet, but if she's still a wonky ESL speaker and nobody's explained it to her, it might be unintentional.

THIS!


And yes, Circe is completely right about the way that Russians/Ukrainians say that word in the Russian/Ukraine language. Whenever my parents say it, throws me for a loop too.