Princess, Vatche X-Prong & the Middle Man

[rockupied]

I picked, and we purchased, a GIA Square Modified Brilliant 1.27 VVS2 F stone. I liked the Vatche X-Prong but wanted some modifications from what I was seeing (I wanted a 2.5mm shank with no taper and v-tip prongs, instead of ball).

I contacted Vatche (Eclipse) via e-mail and was informed that my requests could be accommodated but that I would have to go through a local dealer. Can''t say I''ve been overly impressed with the "middle-man" thus far, but they are my life-line to getting a Vatche setting.

They obtained a quote for me of $1,500 (in January). Friday we took the stone to the middle man and ordered the ring. Yesterday they called and stated that the price had gone up by $300 and that the matching band (also custom made by Vatche) would cost about $300 more than we were anticipating. The only explanation for the drastic increase was that the price of platinum had gone up exponentially in value in less than a month.

Does this sound right? I have no idea how the "middle man" is paid. Do they mark up what Vatche charges or does Vatche pay them. I just don''t want to get taken by the local dealer. I’m a little disappointed that I can''t deal directly with Vatche and I guess I wouldn''t be so concerned if I had warm fuzzies about the local dealer.

Any insight would be appreciated.

 

[pqcollectibles]

Timing is everything and platinum has been on the upswing for a while now. I got my plat ring a month ago, and the price was climbing then. The Vendor is being honest with you about the increase in metal costs. Whether Vatche is charging $300,.... I don't know. A charge to perform custom work on an existing set design is also not out of line either. Maybe someone who has had a Vatche design altered will comment on their experience.

 

[rockupied]

pqcollectibles,

Thanks for your input and your answer regarding the increase in metal costs. Upon a little research I found a chart showing platinum as a high of $868 and a low of $812 for the past 60 days. I don't know how many ounces are in the setting. Guess I need to research that, next, for me to be comfortable with the quoted price increase.

Please, let me clarify, I was well aware that customization would not come cheap and I have no heartache with paying Vatche since that is where all the work is being done. I was expecting the local dealer would be my professional consult, but I just don't feel that way at all.

I don't think the local dealer should be paid heftily out of my pocket since all they did is write on a piece of paper what I wanted and sent my diamond out. I could have done those things myself.

 

[diane5006]

Hi yes plat is up in price...and Vatche does not deal with the public...you have to go through one of their authorized retailers...of which there are many...as far as I know the prices are set by Vatche and are fairly stable so you wont see significat variation in price from vendor to vendor...

If you don't like the vendor you have can you use another one...as your "middle person"

I had to have my setting custom modifed by them and I am soo glad I did

Also...make sure you have the size right because if you need to have it resized it will have to go back to Vatche (via your middle person) for sizing...otherwise it voids the warranty...one PS member had a bad exp when someone else tried to size their ring

Good luck

 

[Nicrez]

Hey Maggie, what's making you stick to Vatche? I obsessed over a good tiffany-like x-prong and convinced myself and my guy that the Vatche was IT. I saw it at Micahel C. Fina, a retailer of Vatche ( yes, they don't work with the public directly), and noticed, I didn't like several things, INCLUDING their quality. I got a quote to have my setting customized for about $800 or so (2.5 weeks ago), and that's still LESS than the standard $1400 for the x-prong at MCF.




Just go to a jeweler and have your band custom designed, since you want the x-prong redesigned anyway. Why go to a branded band maker to have them charge you up the wazoo for improving on their design, when you can have a good metalsmith make one exactly FOR you, at probably less...Try looking for someone to make it for you where you live or on-line there are some good people too!




I say if they can't accomodate your requests easily and smoothly, go out and get it made yourself! Good luck!

 

[rockupied]

diane,

I'm glad you seem pleased with what Vatche did for you! I didn't think that the price would vary too widely between vendors but I wasn't sure. I'm definitely beginning to feel reassured.

Thanks for the info on sizing and the luck!

 

[rockupied]

Nicrez,

I can't exactly describe why I'm stuck on Vatche. I looked for other settings and couldn't find any that bit me. I thought about going to a local person and having it made. I can assure you it was not a spontaneous decision. It was just a gut feeling and I've come to accept that nothing I ever do is easy.

Since the whole experience isn't over yet, I'm disinclined to say that it hasn't been smooth. Both Vatche and the local dealer have answered all my questions in a timely manner. I guess I just expected better face-to-face, professional customer service since we're spending a lot on a custom piece. Who am I to think that customer service is a necessity?

I hope that your setting turns out great!

 

[Nicrez]

Diane, I understand totally. I am a "discriminating consumer", aka: pain in the pavillion customer, but I did a cost-benefit analysis of going with a custom Vatche or a custom job. It priced better and to be so picky and have the control of the finished product from head to toe just made more sense for me...Maybe the headache for you is to find a jeweler.




Fair enough. I just suggest it as an option to paying more for something that could possibly be done cheaper and done with more control on your end.




Also if the jeweler is local to you, you could see the cast before it's done and then when it's set. If you are happy with Vatche's work and quality, I say go for it, but you'll notice that when clients complain, it behooves a seller not to listen, and perhaps your words will not fall on deaf ears...Hopefully it all works out perfectly, and when it does we expect some great pics!!!

 

[rockupied]

First: My experience with the "middle man" turned out fine. They said it would take 6-8 weeks, and they were right on. We had the e-ring back in six and the matching band came the following week.

They were instructed to contact my fiancé when the ring came in (so there would be SOME element of surprise for me). Even though I knew it was "in the time frame" for the ring to be back, he caught me off guard and surprised me on Easter eve.

Second: WOW! It turned out exactly as I had pictured. Eclipse (Vatche) did a wonderful job with the setting. "Precious"

is set in a custom platinum Vatche X-Prong. The shank is 2.5mm with no taper, and the prongs are v-tip and very unobtrusive to the stone. It sparkles like crazy in all kinds of light. The ring size is 5 ¾.

Third: Okay, I wouldn't consider these "great" pics, but it is the best I could do. They are taken with an older digital camera (flash off) in bathroom lighting with a magnifying glass held up to the lens.

Fourth: I have found PS to be a fabulous abundance of information… and addictive.

 

[verticalhorizon]

Wow... they did a great job on the v-tip prongs. Was the head pushed in a little bit so that the matching band would sit flush?

Also, what are the specs on the stone?

Again congrats!

 

[rockupied]

Actually, I did not make any specifications for the matching band other than for it to be 2.5mm. They do not sit perfectly flush, but that is okay with me because there will be times I will not be able to wear my e-ring. Worn alone, my wedding band won't look strange since there is no notch.

The only specs I have for the stone are from the GIA report:

Shape and Cutting Style: Square Modified Brilliant
Measurements: 5.99 x 5.96 x 4.26 mm
Weight: 1.27 carat
Proportions
Depth: 71.5%
Table: 71%
Girdle: Thin to Medium
Culet: None
Finish
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Very Good
Clarity Grade: VVS2
Color Grade: F
Fluorescence: None

I ordered this stone from an internet vendor. When it arrived I immediately took it to a local appraiser for two reasons: 1. to make sure it was what it was supposed to be. 2. for insurance purposes. Come to find out that my insurance wouldn't cover a loose stone so it sat in a safe deposit box until it got mailed off for setting.

When it came back in the setting I took it back to the same appraiser for three reasons: 1. to make sure it was the same stone. 2. to make sure the stone was not damaged during setting. 3. for insurance purposes.

Between the two appraisals I read all kinds of nifty stuff on PS. So that got me curious about proportions not mentioned on the GIA report. When I took it back to the appraiser the second time, I asked him if he could determine the crown angle. His response was "that doesn't matter for fancy cuts".

I know better than that (thanks to PS), but he was doing what I wanted him to do and I was pleased with the replacement value that he gave the ring.

If there was a way to get that information now that it is set, that would be nice as I am curious after reading all the stuff posted on PS. If not, that's okay too- the numbers don't matter now that I own it and most importantly, I like it no matter what the numbers would come out to be.

 

[verticalhorizon]

You could probably request that information from the original vendor. Based on the order number or lot number, many vendors have the additional info when 'showing' the diamond to potential buyers.

Ask them if they have a Sarin report for your stone.

I should also add that the spread seems really good for a princess. Many princes cuts are cut poorly and are too deep.

 

[valeria101]

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On 5/6/2004 3:55:08 PM maggie wrote:



#1: I asked him if he could determine the crown angle. His response was 'that doesn't matter for fancy cuts'.

#2: If there was a way to get that information now that it is set, that would be nice as I am curious after reading all the stuff posted on PS.

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Taking it by points:

#1: wel... he was almost right: it would do little good to have one pavilion angle for the square, just the two numbers would not be sufficient info to determine light return and there si HCA version for these squares to help interpert those numbers...

#2: Sure. How about the Ideal Scope ? The thing would give you an idea where the stone stands on an overall rating of briliance. If briliance is what you are after (and this is what knowing the numbers is for) you can measure it directly - now that you have the stone in hand.

Those numbers are just good to (approximately) evaluate stones remotely against an idealized model of optics for each cut... as far as I understand.




Oh, and the ring looks very nice