Pad looking tourmaline and question about recuts

[T L]

I won this 4.37 ct tourmaline today which to me anyways, looks like a pad. This picture shows it from two different vantage points so you could see the color better. I rarely see tourmalines this color, so I overlooked the obvious problem with it - the gargantuan window

. Do any of the lapidaries mentioned here do recuts on stones? It wasn't very expensive, so it's not like I'm taking a huge monetary risk by recutting it (it can only look better). Do you even think it's even worth recuttning? I just love the color and since I collect tourmalines, I had to have it. Usually when tourmalines are this color, there's a brown undertone, but this one doesn't have it, and it reminded me of a pad.

 

[Upgradable]

What are the dimensions? What shape are you hoping for? The color is beautiful, much like Linda W's avatar. I've had some tourmalines with beautiful sparkle after being well cut. I wish I could help with recommending a lapidary. Check out Jeff White and Dan Stair?

 

[T L]

Date: 11/27/2008 10:32:44 PM
Author: Upgradable
What are the dimensions? What shape are you hoping for? The color is beautiful, much like Linda W's avatar. I've had some tourmalines with beautiful sparkle after being well cut. I wish I could help with recommending a lapidary. Check out Jeff White and Dan Stair?

Thanks! These are the dimensions

10.7 Length. 9.5 Width. 6.3 Deep

It also reminded me of Linda W's pad, and that's one of the reasons I decided to bid on this. I'm sure Linda's pad is a billion times more luminous and gorgeous, but for a tourmaline, I thought, what the heck. I was hoping to get a cushion cut out of this stone.

 

[chrono]

Many of the cutters I know no longer do recuts.

 

[mochi]

I wonder why??

I love the color, it''s so pretty.

 

[T L]

Date: 11/28/2008 10:57:13 AM
Author: Chrono
Many of the cutters I know no longer do recuts.

Chrono,
Do you think it would be a good stone for a recut though? It was only $25, so if the cutter messed it up, I wouldn't be upset. I don't know who was ebaying last night, but there were some great finds since people were too busy with their holiday meals to bid on stones.

 

[Independent Gal]

I know that Jeff White had an emerald on his site that I was coveting which was a recut of a native cut stone. I don't know if he does that as a matter of course, but it might be worth asking? He's the only custom cutter I've worked with so I can't offer any other suggestions, I'm afraid.

 

[PrecisionGem]

The stone could be recut, but I think you are going to loose a lot of weight. If you are buying stones with the plan to have them recut, look for stones that are cut too deep, or maybe have a chip in them. The windowed stones are cut too shallow, with the last few steps on the pavilion cut well below the correct angles. So to fix this, a lot of material needs to be cut away. I bought a very windowed blue topaz one time, just to put an example up on my site of how cutting can correct a stone, and I think I lost 50% of the stone in the recut. This isn''t to say all recuts will loose this, as this stone was very shallow. I went shopping for a really horrid cut on purpose.

I don''t cut other people''s rough or finished stones for a number of reason, and I''m sure they are typical for most cutters.

1. It will take about 2 to 4 hours to do, so what do you charge? It seems kind of silly to pay $100 to recut a $20 stone.
2. If something goes wrong, and sometimes it does, then what?
3. I find recuts are not fun, it''s a lot more fun to turn a piece or rough into a finished stone. At least for me it is.
4. Cutting others rough: Buying good rough is difficult and takes a lot of learning. Very very very rarely is there a good piece of rough on eBay, so 90% the rough that someone thinks is going to turn into a stunning gem is really junk. That''s why its on eBay. So there is a big let down for the customer on the final stone.
5. Some one sends you a 10 ct rough, it''s poor quality and a bad shape, all you can get is a 1.5 ct stone out it, and even then it''s an ugly stone. Now you have an upset customer.

There are people out there who do recuts and will cut someone else''s rough however.

 

[T L]

Date: 11/29/2008 8:37:00 AM
Author: PrecisionGem
The stone could be recut, but I think you are going to loose a lot of weight. If you are buying stones with the plan to have them recut, look for stones that are cut too deep, or maybe have a chip in them. The windowed stones are cut too shallow, with the last few steps on the pavilion cut well below the correct angles. So to fix this, a lot of material needs to be cut away. I bought a very windowed blue topaz one time, just to put an example up on my site of how cutting can correct a stone, and I think I lost 50% of the stone in the recut. This isn''t to say all recuts will loose this, as this stone was very shallow. I went shopping for a really horrid cut on purpose.

I don''t cut other people''s rough or finished stones for a number of reason, and I''m sure they are typical for most cutters.

1. It will take about 2 to 4 hours to do, so what do you charge? It seems kind of silly to pay $100 to recut a $20 stone.
2. If something goes wrong, and sometimes it does, then what?
3. I find recuts are not fun, it''s a lot more fun to turn a piece or rough into a finished stone. At least for me it is.
4. Cutting others rough: Buying good rough is difficult and takes a lot of learning. Very very very rarely is there a good piece of rough on eBay, so 90% the rough that someone thinks is going to turn into a stunning gem is really junk. That''s why its on eBay. So there is a big let down for the customer on the final stone.
5. Some one sends you a 10 ct rough, it''s poor quality and a bad shape, all you can get is a 1.5 ct stone out it, and even then it''s an ugly stone. Now you have an upset customer.

There are people out there who do recuts and will cut someone else''s rough however.

Who???

BTW, I am expecting to lose a lot of carat weight on the recut because it is shallow. I think it''s worth paying $100 to recut it. Just because I didn''t pay a lot for the stone doesn''t necessarily mean that it''s not a nice stone. I think it''s worth a recut. I think the fact that I didn''t pay a lot means that if something does go wrong, then I''m not going to lose too much.

 

[PrecisionGem]

I agree, if you end up with a 3 ct stone, and it only cost you $25 + $100 for a recut, that''s still a good deal.

 

[T L]

Gene,
One thing no one even mentioned to me is if this is even worth a recut. As you can see, it's a very light stone, so do you think that recutting it would make it somehow lose more color? I like the brightness of it, as I do with most tourmalines I purchase, and I intend on setting it in rose gold.

Heck, I still didn't receive it and it might be a dud, but the photos above came from a video of the stone turning at different angles. It looked nice and bright on the video. I have yet to ever see a tourmaline of this color and I searched all over the web. They tend to be more saturated then this stone, and have brownish undertones.

 

[neatfreak]

It''s a pretty color! I hope it works out for you!

 

[movie zombie]

if you bought it for the color and just had to have it, why not just leave it? not all stones need to be set and not all stones in a personal collection need to be perfect.

movie zombie

 

[T L]

Date: 11/29/2008 11:59:32 AM
Author: movie zombie
if you bought it for the color and just had to have it, why not just leave it? not all stones need to be set and not all stones in a personal collection need to be perfect.

movie zombie

Movie Zombie,
I''m shocked!! Didn''t you know that there''s a commandment "Thou shall not have a gemstone with a window!" At least I know the PS gemstone purists here would love such a commandment!

I do get what you''re saying though, and I do have some beautifully colored gemstones in my collection with windows, including my rare violet/blue tourmaline. I guess after seeing all the gorgeous cut stones on this board, I''m starting to get a bit more picky about cutting. I do think this is a rare color for tourmaline, but if it''s not, then someone correct me if I''m wrong, because I don''t claim to be an expert on tourmaline even though I''m "Tourmaline_Lover." I don''t even care if people say it''s hideous, although I know PS''ers are far too polite to say such things.

On other gemstone forums, they''re a bit more blunt, but I do appreciate the honesty. My feelings will not be hurt since I only paid $25 for the stone, and it''s not like I''m expecting that I hit the treasure trove. There are people on this forum with a much better eye for colored gems than myself. I almost think of it as a hidden talent.

 

[Gailey]

TL, that colour is to die for. I hope when it arrives the colour is the same as the vendor''s photo.

I''ve also heard that re-cutting may lose or change the colour of the stone. To me, that would be a huge risk if that colour is as good as it looks in the photo.

I don''t know about you, but sometimes I wish all I knew about windows was the phone number of the man who comes to clean mine twice a year - now I''m hyper-sensitive to windows.

Here''s a couple of links to a gentleman who seems to know a thing or two about re-cuts. I don''t have personal experience of his work, but he has re-cut an emerald for a friend of mine and she was delighted with the results. It might be worth asking for his evaluation of the stone once you receive it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RJku5iMcmQ
http://www.thegemdoctor.com/

Please keep us posted!

 

[T L]

Thanks for the kind words. Here it is so you can see the culet - something else a cutter would want to evaluate. The vendor told me it's from Mozambique, and as you can see, there's a needle in there, which reminds me of Mozambique stones. The rest of the stone looks totally clean except for the one needle.

 

[movie zombie]

I HATE WINDOWS in color stones.....almost as much as i hate E X T I N C T I O N, but not quite.

but sometimes a stone just says buy me anyway. and it all depends on what you intend to use it for. there is absolutely no way i personally would set this stone and i wouldn't recut it if its only worth $25. however, if i liked the color enough to buy it in the first place, i'd give it a treasured spot in my jewelry box and look at it often. if you're happy with the color nothing else matters. and with that needle in there, i'd be looking at that stone often just for fun. it gives it personality, but i just would not spend more $ on it.

enjoy this stone as it is. i've got some stones that i will never set but i like them anyway........not all stones are meant to be set but that doesn't mean they can't be appreciated.

movie zombie

 

[strmrdr]

What you need is a gemologist/cutter.
They hang do out on some forums.
Do a Google search for "gemology forum"
I cant link you one but there are a few out there.

 

[colormyworld]

Looking at the last picture posted I would be surprized if there is a large window. In the other pictures from the video I think you are seeing mostly a "tilt" window. Because the picture is not looking straight down thru table at 90 degrees.

That is a beautiful glowing orangy pastel "padaradascha" color. Quite uncommon in tourmaline. Nice find!

 

[T L]

MZ - I love the color on this stone so much, I do think it's worth setting and even spending money on recutting. I want to enjoy it all the time, not just when it's sitting in a box. If the color pans out to what it is on the video I took these screen shots from, I think it's a rare color. I went to some other gemology forums and emailed some lapidaries, and the gemologists/lapadaries concurred that it's a very uncommon color for tourmaline. I'm now a bit more excited about it, and it makes me happy to spend so little on something that is rare in color. It does happen occassionally that you can find a bargain on ebay. However, it may still turn out to be a dud. We'll see, and I'll keep everyone posted. Hopefully it doesn't need a recut and the window isn't too bad, but I have a feeling it might be. I just love bright colored tourmalines. Like you, nothing drives me more nuts than extinction as well. I can sometimes live with a little window since it sometimes gets diminished when set, like a cuprian tourmaline I have with great color. However, I absolutely detest and I cannot tolerate extinction. That's probably why I go for these lighter tourmalines.

 

[movie zombie]

its not a dud if you like it!

movie zombie

 

[T L]

MZ,
It might be a dud when in the sense that the color doesn't appear to match what the vendor showed in the video after I receive it. In any case, a 4.37 carat clean tourmaline in any color for $25 is still a good deal. I know the color is not everyone's cup of tea, but I love it, and I have yet to ever see one like this. I wonder if it was part of a bicolored piece with a lighter tip?

I also wanted to thank you for your honesty about the stone. I really appreciate that.

 

[movie zombie]

or maybe facing up the color is great and the fade toward the cutlet just doesn''t register. i''m guessing they needed to cut it that way to keep the weight up. what is going to count is the face up unless you were planning to set it so that the whole stone showed. when do you get this stone? i hope you post some pictures!

movie zombie

ps you''re welcome re the honesty......

 

[T L]

Well its coming from Asia so . . . . maybe in my next lifetime.

No seriously, I've ordered from this dealer before, and it takes around two to three weeks. Don't worry, if you know me, I'll post so many pictures that you'll start seeing the stone in your dreams, and perhaps nightmares!

If there's one thing I love doing, it's taking pictures of gems. I'm so excited about this gem, it will probably seem like an eternity before I get it. It reminds me so much of orange sherbert. However, you hit the nail on the head about the window and the lack of color toward the cutlet. That's why I think this stone could use and benefit from a recut.

 

[LostSapphire]

Pretty stone!

Just to chime in re: recuts: Jeff White no longer does recuts unless it is a stone that he has sourced for a client. Sorry.

LS