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Opinions on this 3.02 ct Antique Cushion J SI2 AGS Please <3

Liking85

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Messages
9
This is my first post on this forum, so please bear with me... We're currently looking for an antique cushion cut through our close family friend who is a jeweler. It's been pretty difficult to find a good stone, and I was recently shown the one below. I'm in love with the stone with my only hesitation being the twinning wisps. They're really only noticeable when the stone is still and i'm looking for them, but I wanted to know your knowledgeable opinions on it. Thanks for your help in advance :)

LAsaNY7tQLaDjGGB%qkbOg_thumb_11bf4.jpg UNADJUSTEDNONRAW_thumb_11bea.jpg fullsizeoutput_b2e8.jpeg


 
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flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2015
Messages
2,146
I have never liked doing any large business transaction with friends, friend's friend, or family friends. It often does not go well.

Speaking of the diamond, I think it is decent enough to consider if the price is right. It is beautiful, although there is leakage and the contrast is a bit persistent. I would like to see the full report. Is there anything under the comment section?
 

monipod

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2019
Messages
232
If the price is right, it looks like a nice stone. I would suggest that the twinning wisps give the 'crushed ice' effect though right? The colour is lovely otherwise.
 

foxinsox

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 18, 2015
Messages
3,017
To be perfectly honest, if you know they’re there, you’ll look for them and they’ll bug you. I don’t love the ring that you can see in the middle of those still pictures. Is it shallow?
I also think the facets could be better organised. However I’m only looking at some videos and stills. You’ve seen it in person and hopefully away from the jewellers lights. Did you like the light play?
 

Liking85

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Messages
9
I have never liked doing any large business transaction with friends, friend's friend, or family friends. It often does not go well.

Speaking of the diamond, I think it is decent enough to consider if the price is right. It is beautiful, although there is leakage and the contrast is a bit persistent. I would like to see the full report. Is there anything under the comment section?
I have never liked doing any large business transaction with friends, friend's friend, or family friends. It often does not go well.

Speaking of the diamond, I think it is decent enough to consider if the price is right. It is beautiful, although there is leakage and the contrast is a bit persistent. I would like to see the full report. Is there anything under the comment section?

The price is amazing. It's hard to capture it's true faceting pattern by photo, its brilliance is amazing. Here is the other info on the stone. Thank you for your help :)
AGS.png
 

Liking85

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Messages
9
It's not so much as a crushed ice, but kind of like there may be a fingerprint mark in it. It's really hard to capture the stone right (i'm not good at this). It's gorgeous otherwise.

If the price is right, it looks like a nice stone. I would suggest that the twinning wisps give the 'crushed ice' effect though right? The colour is lovely otherwise.
 

Liking85

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Messages
9
For me personally the facets are too small and unorganized. What I find pleasing in antiques are larger facets. But this is subjective. Only purchase if you are in love. It's too much money for a luxury purchase not to be in love.
It actually has the larger facets, I just couldn't get a proper picture of it. I agree on loving it. I do love it, I'm just getting cold feed because it is such a big purchase. Thank you for your advice :)
 

Liking85

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Messages
9
To be perfectly honest, if you know they’re there, you’ll look for them and they’ll bug you. I don’t love the ring that you can see in the middle of those still pictures. Is it shallow?
I also think the facets could be better organised. However I’m only looking at some videos and stills. You’ve seen it in person and hopefully away from the jewellers lights. Did you like the light play?
The light play is amazing. The circle in the middle is the open cutlet, that is typical for antiques, it's not shallow at all. I took it outside to view it as well. You're making me think I should go back at it again today :). Thank you for replying!!
 

Bonfire

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Messages
3,083
The facets aren’t turning on and off. The center stays dark. I think you can do better, however if you love it than that’s your answer.
 

OcnGypZ

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 18, 2006
Messages
293
Can you post a photo/video of the stone in regular office lighting/and outside shade?
 

missy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 8, 2008
Messages
31,146
I believe a deal is only a deal if you’re getting exactly what you want.

As others have shared this stone doesn’t appear to be well cut. I also don’t care for the inclusions. You can do better. The facets appear disorganized and not aesthetically pleasing to my eye. They don’t alternate on and off rather more are off than on at any moment.

Having said that if you adore it then you have your answer. But since you’re asking I think you can get a more lovely stone. And we are happy to help.
 

LightBright

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Mar 11, 2013
Messages
658
Can you tell us what you are considering a good price for a 3.02 carat K color SI2 Med blue fluorescent stone? Are you open to working with other vendors?

What is it you are looking for? Are you looking for a real antique or a modern cut antique? Have you looked around at other antique cuts (old mine cut, antique cushion, old European cut, etc.) and you know this cut type is what you want?

Have you thought about your cost parameters, color parameters, dimension parameters, clarity and things like flourescence?
How does this current diamond stack up to what you want?

Is this a forever purchase? Is this your engagement ring?
 

Liking85

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Messages
9
The facets aren’t turning on and off. The center stays dark. I think you can do better, however if you love it than that’s your answer.
Can you post a photo/video of the stone in regular office lighting/and outside shade?
I believe a deal is only a deal if you’re getting exactly what you want.

As others have shared this stone doesn’t appear to be well cut. I also don’t care for the inclusions. You can do better. The facets appear disorganized and not aesthetically pleasing to my eye. They don’t alternate on and off rather more are off than on at any moment.

Having said that if you adore it then you have your answer. But since you’re asking I think you can get a more lovely stone. And we are happy to help.

I think you're all right.. I have already asked for him to bring in a better quality stone around 2.5ct to compare it too. I don't think I would have posted on here if I was really gung ho for it. I'm not an expert, that's why I wanted to know your opinions, which i'm grateful for. I don't want to end up with a stone knowing I should have done better.



Here's an outside video

The video above titled video 4 is the best one I have inside the store.
 

LightBright

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Mar 11, 2013
Messages
658
I think this stone looks very pretty but the inclusions and flourescence should bring the price down and should be things you can accept.

Keep in mind that because of the depth, the stone’s dimensions might be a little smaller than a modern cut 3 carat. You should like the finger coverage size. I love the puffy crown. I think light play is pretty, IMO. Med blue flourescence will make the K color appear whiter in many environments but you should be okay with the blue color it throws off in direct sun. Many people are okay with it, but flourescence affects price and resale price. K color is relatively high color for an old cut, but make sure it doesn’t have a green or brown tint. The inclusions don’t really bother me probably because I can’t see them in these videos. But you should be okay with them visually and as a mind clean issue. They should not bug you. They will also affect price and resale value.

You could compare this stone with those of other vendors like try Old World Diamonds for comparative prices and stones. Alex Park of Parks Fine Group on Instagram carries some very nice old cut stones. He doesn’t list prices but his prices are very good, IMO. An added benefit of buying from Alex is that you will be able to use him to set your stone and he is an excellent setting designer. He does not set outside stones.

I would buy the stone you are considering for the right price. I think it is quite pretty and I love the chunk factor. You will have to accept some flaws (clarity and flouro). But I would want to think about your answers to the questions listed above as see where this stone falls.
 
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Inked

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 22, 2019
Messages
91
I am a new poster also but I actually spent probably the last 6-9 months actively looking for an antique cushion around the 2.5 J color range. I would pass on that one personally. I mean, even at a rock bottom price I would pass because I would always be disappointed with the faceting and feel like I wasted money I could put toward exactly what i wanted.. Again, with the antique stones it's so personal and your eye just has to like it, but I would pass on it. I bought a stone that was outside my parameters because my eye just liked it though, so if you love it thats all that matters!
 

Liking85

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Messages
9
I think this stone looks very pretty but the inclusions and flourescence should bring the price down and should be things you can accept.

Keep in mind that because of the depth, the stone’s dimensions might be a little smaller than a modern cut 3 carat. You should like the finger coverage size. I love the puffy crown. I think light play is pretty, IMO. Med blue flourescence will make the K color appear whiter in many environments but you should be okay with the blue color it throws off in direct sun. Many people are okay with it, but flourescence affects price and resale price. K color is relatively high color for an old cut, but make sure it doesn’t have a green or brown tint. The inclusions don’t really bother me probably because I can’t see them in these videos. But you should be okay with them visually and as a mind clean issue. They should not bug you. They will also affect price and resale value.

You could compare this stone with those of other vendors like try Old World Diamonds for comparative prices and stones. Alex Park of Parks Fine Group on Instagram carries some very nice old cut stones. He doesn’t list prices but his prices are very good, IMO. An added benefit of buying from Alex is that you will be able to use him to set your stone and he is an excellent setting designer. He does not set outside stones.

I would buy the stone you are considering for the right price. I think it is quite pretty and I love the chunk factor. You will have to accept some flaws (clarity and flouro). But I would want to think about your answers to the questions listed above as see where this stone falls.
I've actually looked at both Old World and Alex Park. I love what they both have to offer and their prices aren't overinflated like some other jewelers. To be honest, a part of me would feel really guilty going through another jeweler, but I know I shouldn't. The price is fantastic for the stone. I think I need to be a little patient and look into some other stones as well to at least compare it to this one. Thank you for your thoughts, it's really helpful.
 

LightBright

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Mar 11, 2013
Messages
658
Hi Liking85. I’m going to say a couple things, don’t take them personally. First, it would be best if you worked with the dealer who offers the stone you like, not the other way around. I would cast a wide net to find the stone you want. Try luxury consignment sites, eBay, Loupe Troop, Diamond Bistro, Parks Fine Group for very good prices. (Adam sometimes has stones that he considers “budget”, but you will compromise on clarity or color or they may not be certed.)

Know what type of cut you want and then be flexible. You are not going to find a perfectly cut antique diamond for a very good price in today’s market unless you are very lucky. Since it seems like you are more price conscious and have guilt over price and even vendor, I can say that if price is a big deal, you need to set the price parameter that feels comfortable to you and don’t deviate. You might need to compromise to get the price you want, if you want a budget price.

I’d like to see a close up of the stone for more time on a video ON THE HAND to write this off. I’D like to see more stills. I’d like you to take it home and take lots of photos and let us review. I can’t tell much from very short videos. What I’m seeing is overall sparkle, decent faceting and nice dimensions. I can see the cut isn’t “perfect prototype” antique cut, but I don’t see clear problems either. What I do see is a lot of fine lines called, Feather Inclusions. Do they affect the visual clarity of the stone? Does that bother you in person?

What bothers you about this diamond?

Last, I’m curious,what does the girdle of the stone look like? Is it shiny and faceted or rough or frosted?
 
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Liking85

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Messages
9
Hi Liking85. I’m going to say a couple things, don’t take them personally. First, it would be best if you worked with the dealer who offers the stone you like, not the other way around. I would cast a wide net to find the stone you want. Try luxury consignment sites, eBay, Loupe Troop, Diamond Bistro, Parks Fine Group for very good prices. (Adam sometimes has stones that he considers “budget”, but you will compromise on clarity or color or they may not be certed.)

Know what type of cut you want and then be flexible. You are not going to find a perfectly cut antique diamond for a very good price in today’s market unless you are very lucky. Since it seems like you are more price conscious and have guilt over price and even vendor, I can say that if price is a big deal, you need to set the price parameter that feels comfortable to you and don’t deviate. You might need to compromise to get the price you want, if you want a budget price.

I’d like to see a close up of the stone for more time on a video ON THE HAND to write this off. I’D like to see more stills. I’d like you to take it home and take lots of photos and let us review. I can’t tell much from very short videos. What I’m seeing is overall sparkle, decent faceting and nice dimensions. I can see the cut isn’t “perfect prototype” antique cut, but I don’t see clear problems either. What I do see is a lot of fine lines called, Feather Inclusions. Do they affect the visual clarity of the stone? Does that bother you in person?

What bothers you about this diamond?

Last, I’m curious,what does the girdle of the stone look like? Is it shiny and faceted or rough or frosted?
I"m not taking it personally at all, I really appreciate your advice. I've reached out to a few other vendors just to see what's out there (Leon Mege, Good Old Gold, Ive reached out to Alex Park, Ring Concierge, Jewels By Grace and so on) but have this weird loyalty thing that I'm realizing I need to let go of. My boyfriend has pushed me to reach out again to those vendors, just to see as my jeweler has only been able to really bring in one stone in 3 weeks. We're leaving for Europe in December, and I know my boyfriend wants it done before then :).

We have a good budget, I believe, we're looking at under 20k including the setting (eternity micro pave in 18k rose gold with a pave under halo in a cathedral setting ) and taxes (if applicable), so I don't think I'm too price conscious? I don't mind going smaller to get a better stone.

I'm going to head over to the jeweler again this week. I'll try and get more photos and longer videos.

Thanks again, really. This is a huge purchase and not being an expert it means a lot to hear from you and the others on this site.
 
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LightBright

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Mar 11, 2013
Messages
658
Hi Liking85. Now I know your budget, and that this is for a special engagement ring, I’d recommend that you really try to identify the 4C (and other) parameters for what you exactly want, and have people here try to help you find that. If you do think you want this particular antique cushion that’s good, but if you want to look for another within a certain price range, I think you might be able to find something less included (if the inclusions bother you) with the help of this forum. I’d take one last look at your current stone, there is something wonderful about such a large size and relatively light color K with flour that makes it appear whiter, and I think it is lively and pretty, but you may want to look elsewhere for more options too.

A pave custom ring in rose gold will run you roughly $3-5k. That leaves you roughly $15-17k for an antique cushion.
 
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foxinsox

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 18, 2015
Messages
3,017
The light play is amazing. The circle in the middle is the open cutlet, that is typical for antiques, it's not shallow at all. I took it outside to view it as well. You're making me think I should go back at it again today :). Thank you for replying!!
The culet isn't what I'm referring to - I mean the lighter ring around the under the table facets which in OEC usually means fisheye due to girdle reflection. Not sure why it's coming up here since that depth isn't shallow at all!
Thing is though, if you love it in person and crucially, away from the jeweller's lights which will make anything sparkle, then you've got more information than we have. It's hard to get good photos - I couldn't get any good ones of my (shallow and technically not good but actually lovely in person) OEC until I had had some time with it.
SO you seeing it trumps what we might see in the imaging you have already.
How much is it? I could forgive a few things if it's a super good price..
 

Liking85

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Messages
9
The culet isn't what I'm referring to - I mean the lighter ring around the under the table facets which in OEC usually means fisheye due to girdle reflection. Not sure why it's coming up here since that depth isn't shallow at all!
Thing is though, if you love it in person and crucially, away from the jeweller's lights which will make anything sparkle, then you've got more information than we have. It's hard to get good photos - I couldn't get any good ones of my (shallow and technically not good but actually lovely in person) OEC until I had had some time with it.
SO you seeing it trumps what we might see in the imaging you have already.
How much is it? I could forgive a few things if it's a super good price..
It’s a old mine/antique cushion cut, maybe that‘a why that ring is showing up? It’s $16k for the stone, so it’s a killer deal. He has a 2.5ct he’s bringing in for me to see Friday and also an elongated modern cushion. At least then I can compare between those and go from there.
 
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