old mine cut from Mark T

[gracie007]

I have always been a size girl....wanted the biggest diamond for the budget...If you remember a few days I made a post about an old mine cut I had found that was 2 carats, but had a visible flaw in it
( a bubble in the corner). The EGL cert said it was an SI1, but I did not think SI1 had flaws very visible to the naked eye...anyway, it bothered me and I thought I would always be self consious about it. I had been pretty down abut it, because besides that, I loved it. Mark T sent two down yesterday to a jeweler in Dallas ( Pampillonia-awesome people in Dallas) and there it was . A smaller diamond than the other-( i think it is 1.59 or 1.6) but the sparkliest thing i have ever seen...I was very surprised because I always thought Old mines were not that sparkly(which was not a problem for me) and had a Large Culet! I was so excited...and so surprised that I loved the smaller one...that makes me sound bad, but you know, some peple are size people ! I am so excited and just wanted to share that

 

[mamchris]

gracie,
My grandmothers ring is an old mine cut, while it is a very small stone, the thing sparkles like crazy, I don''t really understand why because I thought there was less facets. I just got a 2ct cushion and it doesn''t have the same scintillation, but I love the shape. I know there is a reason why old mines sparkle, but I forget why. Anyway, as you found it comes down to what your eye chooses.

 

[belle]

so glad you decided to look at more stones..it sounds like you found something you really love.

 

[ecf8503]

Can we see some pics?????

 

[Iceman]

The sparkle !



You will find that Old Mine cuts have a sparkle of their own. You wont see the pin fire, and scintilation you do in a round brilliant cut , but more of broad flashes.

 

[valeria101]

Date: 3/1/2006 9:14:58 AM
Author: mamchris


My grandmothers ring is an old mine cut, while it is a very small stone, the thing sparkles like crazy, I don''t really understand why because I thought there was less facets.

Hm... why not. The ''sparkle'' has allot more to do with the angles those facets are cut at than the numbers of them. This is one interesting Q!

With all the pricescop-ing, i did get to learn a few things (half way?). Some of the bits of wisedom tossed around mostly about RBC seem to apply: for example, that the actual size of the facets does matter somewhat to how bright a diamond looks, but that also means than fewer facets on a smaller diamonds and more on the larger ones make sense.

As far as I can tell, there should be ''ideal '' proportions for the old mine facet pattern as for any - if anyone would take the trouble to pin those down as it happened for the more in demand rounds and princesses. Since there are H&A squares, I''d bet someone, somewhere knows what those ideal proportions are!

Anyway, I don''t think OMC have fewer facets than the round brilliant - those should have the same number of facets, placed in the same way (both are brilliant cuts after all).

[picture below]


Only the OMC have those facets of different sizes, and the squarish shape sometimes means that the index between some of the facets is small - i.e. the facets blend together nearly flat and become hard to tell from one another, which may create the impression that there are fewer facets. That also happens if one would cut a modern round brilliant with extremely ''painted'' facets

- which might happen, but I have never seen anything that extreme larger than 20 pts or so.

I wish I had a stash of diamonds to show examples... Hunting them down on the Net is always feasible, but it didn''t occur to me to add the right images to the same stash until this thread came up... so, I don''t have them. Diam Calc can make up tell-tale models if anyone wants to see that

 

[valeria101]

This refused to upload onto the previous post .... the pic tries to show correposnding facets (same ones, only way different in size) between the old and the modern brilliant cuts.

 

[gracie007]

Whew...yall are too smart for me All I know is that is so sparkly...I do not have any picures sadly..I thought about it..but I felt crazy asking to whip out a camera..kind of like I was in a museum and while they might let you, they don''t love it mmm, but i might email the jeweler and ask if they could take one..I wanna look at it again!..Mark T questioned my boyfriend abou the Old mine cut.,..he said he doesnt get many requests for those...so I am glad to se soem people like them besides me

 

[tiger007g]

YAY!!!

Congratulations!! Welcome to the old mine owner''s club... it seems that we really are a pretty rare breed indeed!

Now all you have to think about is the setting

Mine won''t be ready for another month or so...

 

[roxy7]

This is my boyfriend''s heirloom Old mine cut. I love the sparkle and character.

 

[roxy7]

Another photo. I must admit that there is something about the older cuts that just makes my heart flutter.

 

[fatafelice]

so I am glad to see some people like them besides me

I like them too!!!!

I can''t wait to see pictures...but I am confused...Have you purchased it yet or are you still considering your options?

I have been going crazy looking for an OMC for my e-ring. I waste a lot of time trying to convince vendors/jewelers that: YES, I do know what I am talking about! YES, I am sure that I don''t want a round! and YES, I do want a slightly large/large culet!

I''m glad that Mark T was able to find some OMCs for you. I tried to work with him a few months ago, and he was very helpful and nice, but he only sent me some certs for modern stones. Tell me more about this 2 ct. OMC...

...maybe I can live with a little bubble...near the corner you said?

Please take pics as soon as you can!!! You too Tiger! I need to live vicariously through someone!

 

[decodelighted]

Roxy ... way to come through with the eye candy! Gracie, you''re up! Just charm that jeweler into a few snaps, wontcha?

OMC are so ... SPECIAL. Maybe ... one day ...

 

[diagem]

Date: 3/1/2006 5:41:15 PM
Author: fatafelice

so I am glad to see some people like them besides me

I like them too!!!!

I can''t wait to see pictures...but I am confused...Have you purchased it yet or are you still considering your options?

I have been going crazy looking for an OMC for my e-ring. I waste a lot of time trying to convince vendors/jewelers that: YES, I do know what I am talking about! YES, I am sure that I don''t want a round! and YES, I do want a slightly large/large culet!

I''m glad that Mark T was able to find some OMCs for you. I tried to work with him a few months ago, and he was very helpful and nice, but he only sent me some certs for modern stones. Tell me more about this 2 ct. OMC...

...maybe I can live with a little bubble...near the corner you said?

Please take pics as soon as you can!!! You too Tiger! I need to live vicariously through someone!

Question?

Do you really find it soooo hard to find an OMC... "not round" "with a large culet"???

 

[fatafelice]

Date: 3/1/2006 6:26:18 PM
Author: DiaGem

Question?

Do you really find it soooo hard to find an OMC... ''not round'' ''with a large culet''???

Not to hjack this thread...But I think you are missing my point.


I have not been able to find many OMCs, period. And it has been hard to get jewelers/verndors to take me seriously because they seem to think that the only reason I say I want an OMC or old cut cushion is because I am uninformed.

In the past month, I have spoken to three different people to whom I felt I had to justify and explain why I actually like large culets as they were trying to convince me that I shouldn''t want a stone with an open culet.

Two of those people disagreed with my desire for a cushion to begin with and tried to sell me round brilliants and asschers, alternately.

One of them told me I was never going to find what I am looking for as his wife (a G.G.) has been looking for a cushion for over a year and has had no luck...

One of them also actually argued with me and insisted that OMCs were always round until he got out a book and looked it up...

I don''t think it is incorrect to claim that finding a nice OMC within my parameters is difficult...and that a lot of dealers out there either don''t know much about or don''t want to deal in those stones.

 

[gracie007]

Well, my boyfriend told me today he did buy the old mine! yeah! ( we cant keep anything to ourselves for some reason)//....fatafelice---if you are interested in that other OMC i will giev you the jewelers name and number....i will try to post some pictures...she sent me an email with lots of pictures of it....let me know

 

[fatafelice]

Gracie: That is SO exciting!

And I know what you mean, my BF and I are no good at keeping secrets either...we always end up giving eachother presents early because we are so excited about them!

I am definitely interested in seeing pics of the 2ct. if you have them and in getting the jeweler''s number, though I''m not sure... are we allowed to post that kind of info? If you just give me the name, I bet I can look it up. Is it the one you mentioned earlier?...Pampillonia in Dallas?

Now get a move on with the pics!

Do you have some of your stone as well?! You know we are all dying to see them!

 

[roxy7]

Another thing to consider with old mine cuts is the open culet and (in some cases) the maltese cross. Both are visible in the OMC i posted above.

While large culets and bow ties (a maltese cross is like two bow ties that form the shape of a cross) are usually regarded as a negative aspect of old diamonds, I kind of like them. Especially the maltese cross....so much cooler than just one bow tie.
The culet doesn''t bother me at all, except for the fact that I read once that some cultures consider the open culet to allow evil spirits to enter your diamond (like I don''t already have enough to worry about!).

 

[diagem]

Date: 3/2/2006 7:35:17 AM
Author: roxy7
Another thing to consider with old mine cuts is the open culet and (in some cases) the maltese cross. Both are visible in the OMC i posted above.

While large culets and bow ties (a maltese cross is like two bow ties that form the shape of a cross) are usually regarded as a negative aspect of old diamonds, I kind of like them. Especially the maltese cross....so much cooler than just one bow tie.
The culet doesn''t bother me at all, except for the fact that I read once that some cultures consider the open culet to allow evil spirits to enter your diamond (like I don''t already have enough to worry about!).

through my personal experience, a lot of people love that "Maltese Cross Efect"... According to some..., it reminds them of the "historic" Diamonds in museums and books.

Like the Regent or the Tiffany Yellow etc, etc...

 

[gracie007]

LETTING EVIL SPIRITS IN THROUGH THE CULET????.///...oh my gosh, i wish i hadnt read that!! someone say some more nice things about OMC''s so i dont freak out !! duick
Fatafelice- email me privately--go to my profile- and i will send you the pictures asap--it is a different jeweler than previously posted!
The jeweler said his camera was "acting up" and he couldn''t take a picture

what?? i asked him to try to find another one ...hee hee

 

[tiger007g]

"I have not been able to find many OMCs, period. And it has been hard to get jewelers/verndors to take me seriously because they seem to think that the only reason I say I want an OMC or old cut cushion is because I am uninformed."

fatafelice - Did you try Ari at Singlestone? I worked long-distance with him and had a very good experience.

He had A LOT of inventory of OMCs. The first time I called him, he read off a list of 5 or so stones that he had that might have fit my specs. Their website only shows some examples... I wanted one that was more elongated rather than square-ish, so it took longer to find one. I totally know what you mean about the large culet... my new baby has a large culet and I wouldn''t have it any other way

MarkT also didn''t have anything when I was working with him.

He did, however, show me some beautiful modern cushions, but their "personality" is definitely different.

During my appraisal, Martin Fuller mentioned that he knew a guy, Michael Goldstein, who is apparently an authority on old cut stones and also produces newly-cut very authentic-looking OMCs. I found his website here.

Good luck!

 

[roxy7]

I'm sorry, gracie!!! Believe me, I am one of the most superstitious people, and I still think that the culet/evil spirits thing is just plain silly.

When I was driving to work this morning I was thinking about this thread and had an interesting thought. beauty is not something that is completely quantifiable, and diamonds reflect that. Sure, to a certain degree beauty is quantifiable -- symetry, etc. But on the other hand, there is always an exception to the rule when someone thinks that they have found a formula to beauty.

Diamonds are the same way, and old mine cuts are a reflection of that. So many people on this board would never consider an OMC because it doesn't fit the "beauty" formula -- large culet, imperfect color, not as much brilliance as a round.... BUT old mine cuts (and OECs) have a separate kind of beauty and fire and life to them that makes them, IMHO, have such a different type of beauty, an unconventional beauty. The modern round diamond is the Halle Berry of diamonds (flawless, gorgeous, striking) , but the OMC would be more subtle, like a Mona Lisa or a Renoir painting -- something where the beauty hits you in such a different way...........it's unconventional, but is still undeniable

Oh, geez, I am in such trouble when I wax philosophical about diamonds

I will be so proud to wear one on my hand one day.

 

[gracie007]

Good reference , since I am a painter

.... I was looking at three diamonds- 2 cushions and 1 OMC- and I kept asking everyone in the jewlery store which one they liked...my boyfriend was laughing at me saying, "who cares! you are gonna wear it"..and it is so true..everyone is just so different...it is like basing your decision on what car you buy depending on what other people get-insanity Having said that, I did not know large culets were considered bad..it is why I like OMC''s. It is somewhat weird to love a diamond that is "technically" not as desirable..i am rambling...i knew i would never be a round daimond girl and am so glad i found out about this cut through PRICESCOPE! love it....will be posting pics AS SOON as I get that baby! thanks yall, love reading everything here...

 

[fatafelice]

Gracie: I'd love to email you, but we don't have access to eachother's info anymore. I wish there was some way that members could mutually contact one another...

And tell your jeweler that he had better come up with some pics, or else!

Tiger: I have contacted Ari at Singlestone. He was really helpful and is still a possible source for me, though he didn't have anything I was that interested in at the time. I checked out Michael Goldstein, but he is trade only. I guess if I had a jeweler around here that I trusted, I could go through them, but no luck with that so far.

I also agree with the Halle Berry/Mona Lisa comparison. There is just something so intriguing about old stones.

 

[gracie007]

FATAFELICE--call kelsi at DFW diamonds...that is where the OMC diamond is...and i think it is 1.93 or 1.96...not 2 carats...if that matters...Good luck!