Okay, Libs, Cowboy Up and Watch This

[tradergirl]

Actually it isn''t hard at all. When it became obvious in October that he was going to be dragged across the finish line by the media no matter what he said or did, I took what I figured would happen and shorted the markets again. The markets are forward looking and they do not like what they see. Higher taxes, increase regulation, an administration beholden to unions and special interests and hostile to business. Whatever, I take the cards that are dealt and play them. The markets are down close to 20% or so since he was elected. Doesn''t sound like they''re buying into hopey changey. And I''ll cover soon so I only pay taxes at 2008 rates. I thought the markets would give him a pass for a few months and after we bottom here they probably will but it''s gonna get even uglier next year.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 11/19/2008 7:53:12 PM
Author: luckystar112

Date: 11/19/2008 7:25:40 PM
Author: beebrisk

That said, I also believe that the mainstream media had nearly everything to do with electing Obama. I don''t think I''ve ever seen such bias in my life, and I''ve lived through many elections. If Obama was an actor or rock star, we''d call it ''hype''. The media has a way of deifying those they love and vilifying those they don''t. We see this every day with all kinds of issues and with all kinds of people. Only this time the ''hype'' was full force, full steam and entirely unstoppable. The difference here is that usually what the media builds up, it usually then tears down. I''ve seen no sign of backlash. Yet.

I couldn''t agree more. And the media, without a doubt, will tear him down eventually. But I think it will be a while, because to do it within the next couple of years would only reflect on them poorly. So I think any controversial decisions will get a free pass for a while, unfortunately.

Unless, he actually does a good job. I know, call me crazy!

 

[zhuzhu]

I am really surprised that you give the Presidency this much power over economy.
To think that any president can "save" the economic mud slide happening for the past 8 years is IMO, rather naive.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 11/19/2008 8:11:57 PM
Author: tradergirl
Actually it isn''t hard at all. When it became obvious in October that he was going to be dragged across the finish line by the media no matter what he said or did, I took what I figured would happen and shorted the markets again. The markets are forward looking and they do not like what they see. Higher taxes, increase regulation, an administration beholden to unions and special interests and hostile to business. Whatever, I take the cards that are dealt and play them. The markets are down close to 20% or so since he was elected. Doesn''t sound like they''re buying into hopey changey. And I''ll cover soon so I only pay taxes at 2008 rates. I thought the markets would give him a pass for a few months and after we bottom here they probably will but it''s gonna get even uglier next year.

And I would hope not. If the people driving this market can be swayed simply by someone saying, I''m gonna change things, we''ve got problems. But then, we DO have problems, because this market has been wishy washy for a long time. Long before Obama ever came on the scene.

 

[luckystar112]

Date: 11/19/2008 8:12:23 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 11/19/2008 7:53:12 PM
Author: luckystar112

Date: 11/19/2008 7:25:40 PM
Author: beebrisk

That said, I also believe that the mainstream media had nearly everything to do with electing Obama. I don''t think I''ve ever seen such bias in my life, and I''ve lived through many elections. If Obama was an actor or rock star, we''d call it ''hype''. The media has a way of deifying those they love and vilifying those they don''t. We see this every day with all kinds of issues and with all kinds of people. Only this time the ''hype'' was full force, full steam and entirely unstoppable. The difference here is that usually what the media builds up, it usually then tears down. I''ve seen no sign of backlash. Yet.

I couldn''t agree more. And the media, without a doubt, will tear him down eventually. But I think it will be a while, because to do it within the next couple of years would only reflect on them poorly. So I think any controversial decisions will get a free pass for a while, unfortunately.

Unless, he actually does a good job. I know, call me crazy!

I don''t think there is such a thing as a perfect president. Even the best presidents have effed up in one way or another.

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 11/19/2008 8:22:45 PM
Author: luckystar112

Date: 11/19/2008 8:12:23 PM

Author: Ellen

Date: 11/19/2008 7:53:12 PM

Author: luckystar112

Date: 11/19/2008 7:25:40 PM

Author: beebrisk

That said, I also believe that the mainstream media had nearly everything to do with electing Obama. I don''t think I''ve ever seen such bias in my life, and I''ve lived through many elections. If Obama was an actor or rock star, we''d call it ''hype''. The media has a way of deifying those they love and vilifying those they don''t. We see this every day with all kinds of issues and with all kinds of people. Only this time the ''hype'' was full force, full steam and entirely unstoppable. The difference here is that usually what the media builds up, it usually then tears down. I''ve seen no sign of backlash. Yet.

I couldn''t agree more. And the media, without a doubt, will tear him down eventually. But I think it will be a while, because to do it within the next couple of years would only reflect on them poorly. So I think any controversial decisions will get a free pass for a while, unfortunately.

Unless, he actually does a good job. I know, call me crazy!

I don''t think there is such a thing as a perfect president. Even the best presidents have effed up in one way or another.

Agreed...but since Obama isn''t even the president yet he''s got a few months before he can really eff anything up. And I think blaming the state of the economy on him is a little ridiculous and premature.

 

[beebrisk]

Date: 11/19/2008 8:16:24 PM
Author: zhuzhu
I am really surprised that you give the Presidency this much power over economy.

To think that any president can ''save'' the economic mud slide happening for the past 8 years is IMO, rather naive.

Eight years of an economic mudslide? Not.

In fact, less than 2 years ago the stock market was at an all-time high, unemployment at all-time lows.

I don''t know about you, buy I had a heck of a nice time in the market until about about 4 months ago when Barney Frank and Chris Dodd "assured" us that Frannie and Freddie were "fundamentally sound".

 

[luckystar112]

Date: 11/19/2008 8:30:15 PM
Author: thing2of2


Agreed...but since Obama isn''t even the president yet he''s got a few months before he can really eff anything up. And I think blaming the state of the economy on him is a little ridiculous and premature.

lol. There is this joke on another website that I sometimes visit about gas prices. Everytime the price of the barrel would go up, someone would say something like, "Gas prices to go up on news of Britney Spears shaving her head", or some other celebrity reference to poke fun at all the excuses people were making.

 

[tradergirl]

Z: readl the polls - a good percentage of people think he's going to walk in, pass out money to everyone and make everything all better! It's not me who thinks that, it's them!

The point I was making is not what he can or can't do personally, it is what WS perceives he WILL do or what his ideology is. Raising taxes in a recessionary environment and driving up the cost of business through increased regulation or increased presence by unions is not going to be helpful. The funny thing is though, if you look, WS donated a lot of money to him so go figure!

It really doesn't matter to me. I don't like it but I'll adapt.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 11/20/2008 3:03:59 AM
Author: tradergirl
Z: readl the polls - a good percentage of people think he''s going to walk in, pass out money to everyone and make everything all better! It''s not me who thinks that, it''s them!

The point I was making is not what he can or can''t do personally, it is what WS perceives he WILL do or what his ideology is. Raising taxes in a recessionary environment and driving up the cost of business through increased regulation or increased presence by unions is not going to be helpful. The funny thing is though, if you look, WS donated a lot of money to him so go figure!

It really doesn''t matter to me. I don''t like it but I''ll adapt.

if he''s really gonna do that ...we''ll see the Dow at 6000 and the S&P @ 600

 

[crown1]

chris matthews appeared on jay leno the other night. i believe he admitted bias and promoting obama. maybe i interpreted him wrong. did anybody else catch that?

i took the video to be showing that people heard what they wanted based on the media''s bias. it was clear to me and many i talked to that the media and nbc in particular were pushing for obama and being unfair to palin. and just for the record i am independent.

i agree with an above poster that the president (any president) is not responsible for the economy. there are too many factors involved in said economy for any one person to have the control. no president made banks make poor loans or people spend more than they could afford. companies are no longer run by people who take pride in a product and being fair to their workers but by money hungry people who sometimes buy competing companies only to shut them down. workers are no longer interested in having pride in what they do but what they can get. i think we all did this to ourselves and we all have to be a part of the fix.

one thing that really concerned me about an obama voter was the lady who was so thrilled at his victory and on national tv told a reporter that it was the best day of her life and now she no longer needed to worry about her mortage or insurance. i think she is in for a rude awaking since we all know she will still have to pay her mortage and insurance. call me stupid but i don''t get why the liberals are not able to be more fair about mccain/palin. i don''t mean you needed to vote for them just not blame them for everything that ever went wrong.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 11/19/2008 8:22:45 PM
Author: luckystar112

Date: 11/19/2008 8:12:23 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 11/19/2008 7:53:12 PM
Author: luckystar112

Date: 11/19/2008 7:25:40 PM
Author: beebrisk

That said, I also believe that the mainstream media had nearly everything to do with electing Obama. I don't think I've ever seen such bias in my life, and I've lived through many elections. If Obama was an actor or rock star, we'd call it 'hype'. The media has a way of deifying those they love and vilifying those they don't. We see this every day with all kinds of issues and with all kinds of people. Only this time the 'hype' was full force, full steam and entirely unstoppable. The difference here is that usually what the media builds up, it usually then tears down. I've seen no sign of backlash. Yet.

I couldn't agree more. And the media, without a doubt, will tear him down eventually. But I think it will be a while, because to do it within the next couple of years would only reflect on them poorly. So I think any controversial decisions will get a free pass for a while, unfortunately.

Unless, he actually does a good job. I know, call me crazy!

I don't think there is such a thing as a perfect president. Even the best presidents have effed up in one way or another.

True, and I never said anything about being perfect. But if a president is basically doing a good job (or trying), if they do mess up (and it's not horrific), I don't think the press or public are necessarily going to tear them down for it. Then again, we're in such an unprecedented mess, it might not matter what he does, he'll get it from somebody.

 

[ksinger]

Date: 11/20/2008 3:42:57 AM
Author: Dancing Fire

Date: 11/20/2008 3:03:59 AM
Author: tradergirl
Z: readl the polls - a good percentage of people think he''s going to walk in, pass out money to everyone and make everything all better! It''s not me who thinks that, it''s them!

The point I was making is not what he can or can''t do personally, it is what WS perceives he WILL do or what his ideology is. Raising taxes in a recessionary environment and driving up the cost of business through increased regulation or increased presence by unions is not going to be helpful. The funny thing is though, if you look, WS donated a lot of money to him so go figure!

It really doesn''t matter to me. I don''t like it but I''ll adapt.

if he''s really gonna do that ...we''ll see the Dow at 6000 and the S&P @ 600

Why not? We''ve already taken the DEregulation paradigm as far as we could, and look where it got us...

And at the rate we''re going DF, we''re going to see a 6000 Dow BEFORE Obama takes office.

 

[tradergirl]

Karen: I don''t think so until next year, but I also didn''t think we''d lose this much altitude this fast. It is the perfect storm though. I''m going to try buying commodities for a trade, oil, corn and such.

To put it in perspective, from the time the market topped in March of 2000 until it reached the levels it is at now, took 2.5 years. We have done it in a little over a year this time. I think you could see an epic rally between now and say February.

 

[sklingem]

OK - maybe conservatives - including those who designed and conducted the survey - should spend their time (a) rethinking the future of the GOP and (b) working on solving this country's problems in a bipartisan way instead of continuing with the negativity, divisiveness and mudslinging (which obviously worked great during election time)??? How about that??? Or maybe actually talk about the bigger issues that the survey suggests - that a lot of people in this country are not informed enough/interested in politics or policies that candidates stand for, and what that means with respect to our educational system?
But that would probably be too intellectual or useful. Please don't blame the media or democrats for the fact that people are more familiar with Joe Sixpack, Joe the Plumber, Obama's "connections with terrorists" or his "Muslim beliefs". That is the kind of "knowledge" that the GOP is keen on spreading. It all makes me so utterly SICK. And that video is so utterly POINTLESS to say the least. Too sad that it seems worthy of anybody's attention or time, here on PS or anywhere. But I certainly won't be surprised to find a video posted here soon of an Obama voter who used to have a childhood friend who cruelly pinched his neighbor's cat. And those are people who voted for Obama! OMG!

BITTER, BITTER people ...

 

[Irishgrrrl]

Date: 11/20/2008 10:41:37 AM
Author: rob09
OK - maybe conservatives - including those who designed and conducted the survey - should spend their time (a) rethinking the future of the GOP and (b) working on solving this country''s problems in a bipartisan way instead of continuing with the negativity, divisiveness and mudslinging (which obviously worked great during election time)??? How about that??? Or maybe actually talk about the bigger issues that the survey suggests - that a lot of people in this country are not informed enough/interested in politics or policies that candidates stand for, and what that means with respect to our educational system?
But that would probably be too intellectual or useful. Please don''t blame the media or democrats for the fact that people are more familiar with Joe Sixpack, Joe the Plumber, Obama''s ''connections with terrorists'' or his ''Muslim beliefs''. That is the kind of ''knowledge'' that the GOP is keen on spreading. It all makes me so utterly SICK. And that video is so utterly POINTLESS to say the least. Too sad that it seems worthy of anybody''s attention or time, here on PS or anywhere. But I certainly won''t be surprised to find a video posted here soon of an Obama voter who used to have a childhood friend who cruelly pinched his neighbor''s cat. And those are people who voted for Obama! OMG!

BITTER, BITTER people ...

Uh-oh, Rob! You used the "B" word! They REALLY don''t like that!

 

[sklingem]

Irish - you always make my day with your emoticon. I have said it before and I will say it again. Can''t stop laughing everytime I see it!

 

[Irishgrrrl]

Date: 11/20/2008 11:08:00 AM
Author: rob09
Irish - you always make my day with your emoticon. I have said it before and I will say it again. Can''t stop laughing everytime I see it!

Glad it makes ya smile, Rob!

 

[luckystar112]

lol. I don't get offended by the word "bitter". It appears some Dems have forgotten how whiny they were in 2000 and again in 2004---. Like nails on a chalkboard, really. I'm sure they can say the same thing about the perceived bitterness from the conservatives right about now. The losing party is always accused of being bitter sore losers. I guess I don't care because it's so unoriginal.

 

[luckystar112]

Date: 11/20/2008 8:05:09 AM
Author: Ellen
True, and I never said anything about being perfect. But if a president is basically doing a good job (or trying), if they do mess up (and it''s not horrific), I don''t think the press or public are necessarily going to tear them down for it. Then again, we''re in such an unprecedented mess, it might not matter what he does, he''ll get it from somebody.

It''s like that Lincoln quote:
"I claim not to have controlled events, but confess plainly that events have controlled me."

That is why I will always give the President the benefit of the doubt, including Obama. And Dubya too--I''ll be interested in reading his book if he does write one. But I agree that Obama will get it from somebody eventually. I DON''T think it is because he will totally suck as POTUS--I think it''s because that''s just what they do!

 

[starsapphire]

Oh, I've gotten over my bitterness by now. But, I am more concerned with going forward with the future. And what will happen. If it will be good or bad. I just was totally turned off by the virtual worship of all things Obama. Kids singing about him, celeb music videos singing about him, celebrities emailing him, Obama Girl, people fainting at his speeches, the comparisions of great people to him...etc.....wondering about what kind of dog they are getting.......come on he is just a man. I don't like the glorification of our leaders, no matter who they are. He is not a rock star!

 

[HollyS]

Date: 11/20/2008 11:51:38 AM
Author: starsapphire
Oh, I''ve gotten over my bitterness by now. But, I am more concerned with going forward with the future. And what will happen. If it will be good or bad. I just was totally turned off by the virtual worship of all things Obama. Kids singing about him, celeb music videos singing about him, celebrities emailing him, Obama Girl, people fainting at his speeches, the comparisions of great people to him...etc.....wondering about what kind of dog they are getting.......come on he is just a man. I don''t like the glorification of our leaders, no matter who they are. He is not a rock star!

Amen. Idol worship is always misplaced, unwarranted, and often dangerous. And in many cases, as in this one, simply ridiculous.

Let the man actually accomplish something -- besides winning the hot seat -- before we slather him with praise. He hasn''t earned any. I''m perfectly willing to stand back and let him have his moment to shine. But I''ll lay in a supply of Tarnex just in case.