Newbie/Engagement Ring HELP

[murr01]

I am new to this forum and also engagement rings and diamonds. I have begun looking and think I have found the ring but decided to do some more research. I looked at a few local stores before going to Shane Co. I liked their salesperson better and the pitch didn't seem as fake as the other places. I also found a setting I like and possibly a diamond. Here is where I need help. Opinions on Shane Co? The diamond is 1.53 ct round SI1 clarity and G color with Very Good cut. The diamond is $14,900. Is this fair price? I was hoping to stay under 17-18K total. The setting I picked is $2400. I wanted to get a diamond closer to 2 carats but they seemed to be out of the price tag for this quality. Would anyone suggest lowering one of the quality categories to get a bigger diamond? I am open to any suggestions or comments, like I said I am new and need help.

Shane Co opinions?

Diamond/quality opinions?

 

[sonnyjane]

Hi!

I have a Shane Co. wedding set, but I got it before I really joined Pricescope. If I had known then what I know now thanks to this site, I don't think that I would have gone through them, at least not for the diamond. They had a really unique setting that I liked, so I figured I'd just get the diamond from them too, but in hindsight I could have done better online.

The specs you describe, the G SI1, is that GIA certified, or just their own grading? It makes a big difference. Also, I wouldn't go any lower than SI1, so if you'd like to go down in color, perhaps to an H or even I if your lady isn't color sensitive, that will cut some money off. Cut is really important, so don't go lower than VG, and again, is that just their grading, or is it GIA certified? Try to get information on the angles and percentages of the cut. These are things that I did not have when I bought through them and again, something I would change if I had it to do over!

Use the search tool on this site to see comparable prices to stones in that range to find out how their price compares.

 

[murr01]

Yes, it is GIA. I have researched some and asked to only see GIA

 

[sonnyjane]

Yes, it is GIA. I have researched some and asked to only see GIA

Excellent! I recommend going to some of the online sites recommended here, such as JamesAllen.com and Whiteflash, and looking at their inventories just to see if you can find a better deal elsewhere. You have a really good budget so you want to make sure you're getting the most from it.

 

[murr01]

Any other help would be appreciated.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

GIS Excellent is a broad range, and you'll find that we sometimes eliminate stones from that category. I would only look at GIA excellent or AGS Ideal cut. You are spending a large amount of money, so don't you want the best quality stone you can buy?

You'll get a better stone with some of these vendors. Their price generally will beat what you can find locally for the same quality. I am very thankful I came here before buying my anniversary diamond 5 years ago!

I have seen negative reviews of the store you mention in the past, but I don't know if they will show up on the search function or not. Try it and see.

 

[marcy]

Can you get the GIA certificate number and get the specs for us? Did you like the diamond? Is it one of thier Shane Classics? My wedding rings are from the Shane Company and I am very happy with them. I have a 1 ct solitaire and a 1/2 carat anniversary band. IMO I think their upgrade policy and lifetime warranty can't be beat. I have always had great service from them and I really like the comfort of being able to walk in and hand them my jewelry knowing they will fix any issues on sight, without charge and no questions asked. I would certainly recommend them.

Keep us posted on your search.

 

[farmer gal]

I don't know if you would be interesting in buying online but this might be a nice option for you. I would call ERD I don't know if they give a pricescope discount, they also have some really beautiful settings, or they can also make you a ring.

http://www.engagementringsdirect.com/1.51-carat-h-vs2-hearts-and-arrows-round-cut-diamond-gid-62784.html

 

[murr01]

I looked at the diamond before coming here and therefore didn't realize how important cut is. I will get the GiA cert number on Wednesday and post here. Hopefully someone will be able to advise me from that. I really like Shane Co warranty and trade in policy and that is why I would prefer to buy there compared to online but I want to get the most for my money so for a much better deal I will look elsewhere. I would like to maximize size but have a high quality diamond in the 15k range. Is 1.5 carats what I should expect to get for that price tag with high quality. One other thing the GIA cert on said diamond had a light blue fluorescence. From what I am reading this is not a big deal correct me if wrong.

Thanks!

 

[murr01]

New Diamond! So I really wanted to be closer to 1.75 than 1.5 so Shane Co. got me another diamond to look at. I want your thoughts on the diamond compared to the one from James Allen both are below. Besides the obvious price difference what are opinions? Other suggestions? Considering price which diamond? I really like Brick and Mortar store and all of Shane Co's warranties/policies but for a price I will go online. Thanks for any help!

Shane Co. :

1.70 Carat
Color: G
Clarity: SI2
Cut: Excellent
GIA: 2131102273 01
$16,600

James Allen:

1.80 Carat
Clarity: SI2
Cut: Excellent
$14,860

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI2-Premium-Cut-Round-Diamond-1440613.asp

 

[murr01]

Shane Co. diamond is GIA: GIA: 2131102273

No 01 on end sorry!

 

[marchesa6989]

these don't score well on the Holloway Cut Advisor, which most pricescopers use to eliminate poor performing stones. so what we do is put the stats of the stone into the calculator and if it scores over 2 we eliminate it straight away. if it scores under 2, we ask for more information like an idealscope, which shows the light return within the diamond. you want maximum light return as that is what will make it sparkly!

let me have a look at james allen and see what they have in your budget that meets your specs

 

[marchesa6989]

ok here we go - these all score under 2 on the HCA and i did a check with James Allen and they are eye clean

1.81 H SI2 - the picture looks scary, but its due to poor lighting and photography. the plot shows lots of twinning wisps which are not visible to the naked eye and they confirmed it is definitely eye clean
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1416821.asp

1.70 H SI1 - http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1354047.asp

1.71 H VS2 - http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1442312.asp?b=16&a=12&c=77&cid=131


i personally have an H SI2 from AGS which is also ideal in cut. and it has twinning wisps and let me assure u that it is perfectly spotless in real life. but the camera can pick it up and bad lighting also doesn't help. i would vote for that one since that leaves plenty of room for a fantastic setting.

ps what kind of setting were you thinking of?

 

[murr01]

Thanks so much for your time and help Marcheasa! I had plugged the Shane Co. diamond into HCA prior to the post and saw that it scored 4 but didn't really know how much that meant. From what I am understanding the fact that GIA graded it excellent on cut does not mean much...? I have put a deposit down on the Shane Co. diamond but it is 100% refundable. Sounds like you are suggesting to look elsewhere. I am skeptical of the AGS as many people have told me to stick to GIA. I am also hesitant to buy without seeing in person especially a diamond that look so "dirty" in the picture. I do like the price and increased size though. Like I said before I am clueless when it comes to diamonds and only know what I have learned on here and from jewelry stores in the past two weeks so please be patient.

When you say you checked with James Allen about the diamonds, what do you mean? Did you talk to someone or just looked at it online?
Is James Allen a trustworthy and reputable online store? I am skeptical of not buying in person but do want a the prettiest diamond for my budget. Sorry I am just a little old school.

Feel free to give me any advice or criticism! If you feel strongly tell me don't buy that but this!

Thanks so Much!


The setting I picked from Shane Co is the one below with the diamond sitting on it. The diamond is just sitting loosely, not set. Sorry those are my ugly fingers!

 

[marchesa6989]

no problem murr! i know this is a big purchase and it can be scary to go it alone. now, in terms of AGS vs GIA, you'll actually find that AGS is just as well respected and many of those hearts and arrows premium diamonds are actually graded by AGS because they are known for their ideal cut (aka AGS000). GIA triple excellent is a very broad range with less specific criterion, which is why we use the HCA calculator. but AGS certification for triple ideal will provide a stone that performs well without having to even think twice about it.

James Allen is a very reputable store and if you do a search on here, you'll find many happy pricescopers. What i like about them is they have customer service available 24/7, and when i was buying my own diamond let me tell you i was asking them questions at a million miles a minute, all hours of the day. Their service is great and if you communicate with them yourself, you'll feel comfortable. In terms of buying online they have a strong 100% refund policy, A+ rating by the BBB and if you buy via credit card you have that added layer of protection too. But seriously it is unheard of to have a problem with them.

What you can do is actually request James Allen to get their gemologist to compare those 3 stones - ask for an idealscope which will let us know about light return and which one performs best, ask which one looks more visually stunning in person when comparing the 3, and ask which one is 100% eye clean. i would never recommend something that i wouldn't buy myself. just a reminder that these pictures are highly magnified and are taken so that you CAN see any inclusions, as they want the online process to be transparent. i doubt that Shane&Co showed you your diamond under microscope. i would also ask them to take a better picture of that 1.81 H SI2 as i can tell you that the lighting and photography has made it look a lot worse than it would be otherwise.

regardless of whether you go with these options, please return that diamond. if it scores a 4 on HCA, you can find better and cheaper. if you prefer something cleaner for peace of mind i can also find some options that are still within budget. but my logic is if it is the most sparkly, eye clean diamond why would you need to go higher in clarity?

let me show you something:
here is a magnified picture of my stone. scary huh? i knew it was an AGS000 so it would have optimal light return and be really sparkly. and the certificate plot showed these are twinning wisps.


this is what it looks like in person:


i can guarantee it is 1000000% eye clean. no inclusions to be seen no matter how hard you try!

here is an educational link that shows different types of inclusions:
http://goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/InclusionGallery/
it is written by a well respected diamond vendor here on Pricescope. scroll to the bottom and check out twinning wisps. also do a forum search to see what has been said about them. lots of people call them "the favorite inclusions to have" because you save so much money but it is definitely not visible to the naked eye.

another user just bought his stone and if you read his past posts, you'll see i also recommended him the SI2 out of his selections because it had twinning wisps and it was cheaper. he took our advice and ended up immensely happy:
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/90-carat-round-i-si2-excellent-cut-platinum-solitaire.169266/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/90-carat-round-i-si2-excellent-cut-platinum-solitaire.169266/[/URL]

worst case scenario if you see the stone in person and don't like it you can definitely return it.

here are some setting you might like - if you scroll towards the bottom, on the right side of the page you can see what the setting looks like in real life, not just on a model:
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/pave/White-Gold-2-1mm-French-Cut-Pave-Engagement-Ring.html
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/pave/18k-White-Gold-0-54ct-French-Cut-Pave-Diamond-Ring.html
http://www.jamesallen.com/designer-engagement-rings/meno-collection-by-danhov/ring/item_412-4013.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/pave/Scroll-Basket-Pave-Set-Diamond-Engagement-Ring.html
of course you can choose which metal type you want as well.

 

[murr01]

Wow! You are amazingly helpful! I cannot tell you how much I appreciate your help!!! I have requested what you said from James Allen, they said it would take up to 3 business days. Now the diamonds show up as on hold. Hopefully that is b/c I requested them to be inspected. I am going to wait to hear back and then I think I will be ordering one of the two (hopefully)! I feel more comfortable now and will be getting my deposit back from Shane Co. next week. I like the first setting you showed as well from James Allen. All together this will be $2000 plus cheaper for a bigger stone that is way better cut! You have been so helpful, more then most jewelry stores. Hopefully this all works out and I will be joining the "twinning wisps fanclub." I will keep you updated on what the gemologists from James Allen say, as I may need your help from that. The only disadvantage of going online is sizing and cleanings that were included free from Shane Co. but I guess that isn't much in the end. Please let me know if you have anymore advice you think I may find useful!

P.S. your ring is beautiful!! That is what sold me!

 

[murr01]

I am very inquisitive and want to double check everything. Just a quick question b/c I have read differing opinions about the HCA. Should a diamond truly be eliminated b/c it scores bad on that. Here is a post I saw on another forum saying it is not a good tool. How do you feel? I understand nothing about cut so I am just checking, http://www.diamondreview.com/forum/topic/5168-holloway-cut-advisor/

If you have some spare time would you mind checking out Shane Co's loose diamonds and possibly suggesting one from there just so I can have one more option! (like I need any more options)! I understand if you do not have time or if the site has a policy against that just let me know. Thanks so much again!

 

[marchesa6989]

well for starters i'm glad you put those stones on hold at James Allen - what they will do is get that information you requested, and when they get back to you, they continue to hold the stones for a further 24 hrs so you can decide whether or not you want to purchase one. don't forget to ask for the Pricescope price (if you go to resources at the top of the page, featured sponsor, click on James Allen, it will recognise you as a PS member so you can see the discount)

i am a very meticulous and methodical person, and detailed in my research into any topic. so i'm using what has taken me a lot of research in order to give advice. i don't know if you know statistics but regarding the HCA let me explain it this way:
it has a high sensitivity - so using it and looking for stones that score under 2 will choose a truly ideal cut stone a large % of the time. then once you have that result, you then ask for an idealscope to verify that result and check the light return (and of course get pictures of the stone and confirm it is eye clean). a small number of these stones will not perform well on idealscope, perhaps due to inclusions that obscure light return or some other reason. there is also a very minute % of stones that are false negatives so they will be excluded by the HCA when they DO perform well. however the caveat to this is that you'd have to be able to analyse the stone in person, be skillful and possess the tools to make the assessment. so the PS community has concluded that since alot of us buy stones online or not physically seen, the HCA calculator does the job of weeding out the bad ones.

i did a quick search on Shane&Co and the fact that they for starters sell IGI stones is a big booboo for me. also alot of the excellent cut GIA stones perform really poorly on the HCA. not just over 2, but scores like 4 or 5 which is a big NO DEAL. they have some AGS000 stones which i trust, but i can't comment on whether they are eye clean. plus they are smaller than the ones i found you and more expensive. but the choice, of course, is yours.
1.51 G SI1 $17615 http://www.shaneco.com/Catalog/ProductDetail.aspx?XS=879674
1.50 G SI1 $17500 http://www.shaneco.com/Catalog/ProductDetail.aspx?XS=825232
1.51 G SI1 $17465 http://www.shaneco.com/Catalog/ProductDetail.aspx?XS=852288

albeit waiting for the exact results and feedback from James Allen, i would say that those earlier stones i selected will not disappoint. to me the choice is obvious (and note I did also list one that was VS2 if you prefer that), and the reason i'm willing to help is that i know in life money doesn't come easily. no matter if you're looking for a $1000 stone or $20000, everyone has to work hard for their money. and for the men on the forum, any money not spent on the ring can go towards a beautiful proposal or honeymoon for their loved one. i listened to the advice on PS and read up for myself to get that evidence, and the ring i purchased outdoes anything i saw at the stores for half the price. in real life i would never give patients medical advice that i wouldn't give to a family member or myself...same goes on here.

hope that all makes sense. i think we should wait for what James Allen says next week and go from there. what do you think?

 

[murr01]

I am sold on James Allen going to get my money back from Shane Co tomorrow. You have truly been an awesome help! Hopefully those stones workout from JA. Will you be willing to help me next week once I hear back from JA? I will need help comprehending the info. The Pricescope discount plus no sales tax being collected all in all is going to save me $3000+ which is awesome and I am confident I will end up with something much nicer. I am however having a hard time finding a setting on JA that I am 100% sold on. I like the first one you listed earlier but in stores seemed to always like ones that had flat/smoother sides if that makes sense...? I will keep browsing JA and checking out settings! I am so excited/nervous right now but you are so helpful and I appreciate it. I hope that you will be on and able to help me during crunch time next week when I hear back from JA.

A few more questions/opinions I would like answered.

1. 4 or 6 prongs?

2. Platinum or white gold? My girlfriend is in Dental school and being a dentist means lots of hand washing and/or hand sanitizer. Some jewelers have suggested platinum b/c of this and others have suggested white gold. I saw you mentioned medical advice so you must also be in healthcare.

 

[murr01]

Sorry to keep posting but I submit my posts and then remember something else. Is the second setting posted the same as the first except it has diamonds all the way around? I do not like the cathedral style that is why I ruled out 3 and 4. Thanks

 

[marchesa6989]

glad to be of help murr i'm about to fly overseas for a week but will have internet access so i'll keep my eyes peeled for this thread. so don't panic!!

let's talk about the setting now. there's a few things you mentioned there, but what i would like to know is do you know what she prefers? have you been ring shopping together or has she made any hints? people like very different things. i, for example, like delicate rings because i have very small hands. some like substantial bands. also what size does she wear? if she has a bigger sized hand, then going for a ring that is even a few fractions of a mm larger may look better.

now practicality will be an issue. what i'm considering is getting a band to wear to work instead of wearing my ring (i'm a doctor). mine has pave on it that i'm worried will get damaged by constantly gloving and degloving, plus i don't need patients (or anyone else at work for that matter) making assumptions based on my ring. so maybe a 5 stone ring with 0.2ct stones that sit low and flush.

i went for white gold because platinum can patina over time and likewise i'm not 100% sure on whether hand sanitizer and other things we use around the hospital will affect it. at least with white gold, worse case scenario i figured i could get it replated. but really i'm not an expert on that and i think you will probably hear varying advice. both metals have a different look to them too, and i prefer the shinier appearance of white gold.

will she definitely be wearing hers to school/work? if so you'll want to choose a setting that doesn't stick up as much, where the stones sits more flush on the hand. i think i know what you're talking about in terms of smoothness, but also you have to consider whether you like extra metal on the edges of the side stones, or whether you don't want to see that. for example do you like this?
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/pave/18k-white-gold-pave-set-4-prong-diamond-engagement-ring.html this one probably matches what i think you want most
(i don't know if this counts as cathedral) http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/settings-with-sidestones/Common-Prong-Engagement-Ring.html
these ones looks a little different to what you described but might be nice: http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/settings-with-sidestones/ring/item_58-1908.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/settings-with-sidestones/ring/item_58-1085.asp

6 vs 4 prongs is a timelong debate. 6 is probably a little safer than 4, and i personally prefer 6 because it keeps the stone looking round and to me is more classic. 4 claws can make it look a little more squarish/cushionish sometimes. when i spoke to James Allen during my own search, they did say that you can change the head on most designs to 6 claws but there may be an additional fee.


PS saw your additional post. yes i think they are the same. for practicality perhaps not all the way around is a wiser option.

 

[murr01]

We have not been ring shopping in person but have looked online and she has hinted on friend's facebook pics etc. about what she likes. We have been together for 8 years so I know her taste pretty well. I know she will like something simple. She has very small hands and fingers. Size 6.

I am sure at first she will wear it to school and clinical all the time. I want to buy assuming she will wear all the time b/c I think she would like to be able to.

I also prefer the shine/lack of patina of white gold. I just wanted to make sure you or others didn't disagree since she is in the medical field. I will be getting white gold.

I like being able to see the diamond more from 4 but like the security of 6 since she always is gloving and de-gloving for security. I think this will just be a decision I have to make.

We both found the same setting(the first one) so that must say something. I like the first one you in your last post and then I look at the last one you posted and I also like that...

Have fun overseas and thanks again for help.

 

[Bella_mezzo]

Marchesa gave you GREAT advice and I am so glad that you are going with JA. I think you'll be way happier with the final ring and have a sizeable chunck of change left in your pocket-)

Good luck finding a setting you love! I think that's even harder than finding a good diamond

If you do some PS searches you can see a lot different examples of pave and other kinds of diamonds in the band.

My faves at JA are the french cut pave and the slim cathedral http://www.jamesallen.com/designer-engagement-rings/meno-collection-by-danhov/ring/item_412-4013.asp

I don't personally care for the baskets/heads/prongs at JA as much as others (I prefer the swoopier look and thinner more sculpted prongs of vatche, mark morrell, etc.) but I suspect that you could ask for the prongs to be thinned and maybe pointed at the tips if you like that look.

Also, if you did end up falling in love with a setting from somewhere else you can still get the JA diamond and have it set in a non-JA setting...

This is going to be a gorgeous ring!!!

 

[murr01]

Bella, thanks for the advice. I never thought about getting a setting elsewhere but I am still going to look at JA some. I am starting to cut it close on time to get it bey Christmas!

March, do you have any sideviews of your ring?

Thanks!

 

[marchesa6989]

to be honest, i know alot of people on PS are very picky about their setting's profile (we are a bunch of diamond perfectionists after all) and focus on if it is swoopy, cross prong, shape of the prongs, has little melee stones etcetc. but in real life, myself included, if you have a stunning stone and a pretty setting, from my experience noone's really looking at the side. not that you want the profile to be ugly or anything, but for me it's not a major factor.

i dunno if you saw the pictures of the rings that they made for other customers:
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/sold/settings-with-sidestones/4062/Engagement-Ring-Settings-With-Side-Stones.html (that's the one with the bigger side stones)
http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/sold/settings-with-sidestones/3309/Princess-Cut-Engagement-Rings-With-Side-Stones.html
(the one with the smaller delicate pave)

some real life perspective may help, although they aren't the best quality pictures. both look nice to me!

btw i saw the delivery date on the website. oh my you are cutting it close! hopefully they get back to you ASAP!!!

 

[murr01]

Thanks for the pic of your ring. VERY Pretty! I am leaning toward the first one you picked out(link below) better shipping date and I think will be simple yet beautiful and she will love it.

http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/pave/White-Gold-2-1mm-French-Cut-Pave-Engagement-Ring.html

 

[marchesa6989]

OHH that was the one you were talking about. yeah it is definitely a good choice...it will complement your generously sized centre stone very well!!!

(btw flight delays are the worst. thank the lord for diamonds to wile away the time haha)

 

[murr01]

I understand that.. Travel almost weekly for work. What are your feelings on color? Suggested stone is H in color, will that be noticeable? Yours is an H and looks stunning to me so I am guessing you will say that H is fine. What all should I plan on asking JA when I talk to them next week? Ask for the idealscope image, ask if it is eye clean...? What else?

 

[marchesa6989]

color was a big point of contention for me. you won't believe how many times i went to see loose stones, as well as letting vendors do blind tests on me, to see for myself. if you read on here, alot of people say that I or even J looks white, but not to me. i can see it plain as day and can pick them out from a bunch. H however i can't. one might say, they are only 1 grade away from each other, but it makes all the difference. it all depends on color sensitivity though. so for me, that was the sweet spot - as low as i could go whilst being 100% happy with the purchase. in my opinion H (or above if you feel like it) is the safe way to go!

you should talk to JA now to make sure when they pull the stones next week they check:
if it is eyeclean (maybe ask to take new photos of the stones as some of them were really bad quality)
light return via an idealscope picture
how the 3 stones compare to each other and what is their recommendation

that should do the trick and give us enough info to make a good, informed decision!

 

[murr01]

Thanks for the info on color. That is what I asked them to look at so we should be good. I actually only asked them to look at the first two stones b/c of the considerable price difference of the 3rd.

Any other PSers have opinions on these or will more chime in once we hear back from JA? I trust MArch's advice but a 2nd opinion wouldn't hurt.