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jake06783

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 12, 2009
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I was in the wholesale gemstone business for years and LOVED it! My first job was working for the foremost sapphire cutter (ok, lapidary!)in the world. Back then we weren''t so fussy about the title!...Anyway, he was the most respected sapphire dude in the Far East to our West! To this day, decades later, I can spot one of his stones a mile away( usually in an auction house brochure/or fine jewelry retailers'' ads, or in a adds for BIG sapphires! ..How many good 20 to 40 carat sapphires are out there anyway? Its so neat to find a place where I can see and hear what "privates" (as we wholesalers, called y''all buyers back then)I used to wonder who the hell WORE this stuff??? ha ha...Just want to put something out there... each colored stone requires different facets to bring it up to its perfect state of... beauty/perfection...there is a science, but, also an ART to the cut...I see here, that some are caught up in the mechanical side of how and where facets are put...NO! NO! NO!...The best stones that came out of our office sometimes started off as 40 carat ugly buggers and ended up as 3 carat GEMS!!!...its not about a formula of faceting (like diamonds), its about where the lapidary( the artist)sees the color and then places those sometimes, strange facets...its a HUGE risk,and a great and stressful ART but when it works, WOW!!!!...''do we keep the weight and sell at per carat weight with a slight profit, or do we lose the weight and make a "GEM" quality stone that can double or triple at price and rarity because it is now PERFECT,there is a risk factor there (what if the stone breaks on the wheel, or the decision was wrong??? (it is , after all, bidness!) The temptation is hard to deal with...it disturbs me, that people seem to think that, as with diamonds, choosing where a facet goes is mathematical, not artful...Anyway, I am just babbling right now, because I am so happy to find a place where the fine art of gemstones can be discussed!! And, well...I have a place to babble!! and it has been years since I have been with people that appreciate my first professional love!
Ps-I have no clue as to how to track my stupid post! Hellllp!
 

LD

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Messages
9,682
Welcome!


Feel free to babble away! We all do!
 

jake06783

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 12, 2009
Messages
30
i''m having a horrible time navigating this place!! Thank you for responding! I''m afraid to "click"out now because I don''t know if I''ll be able to find where I have left off!

I can eyeball a rough stone and tell what should be done with it, but I''ll be damned if I can navigate this site!!!

Sooooo, frustrating!! Makes me feel...uh...OLD!
 

LD

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
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9,682


Ok, well you''ve posted in the Coloured Stone section - but this forum moves FAST so you just have to keep coming back and checking!!!!
 

colormyworld

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 30, 2005
Messages
1,172
Date: 3/24/2009 5:52:22 PM
Author:jake06783
I was in the wholesale gemstone business for years and LOVED it! My first job was working for the foremost sapphire cutter (ok, lapidary!)in the world. Back then we weren''t so fussy about the title!...Anyway, he was the most respected sapphire dude in the Far East to our West! To this day, decades later, I can spot one of his stones a mile away( usually in an auction house brochure/or fine jewelry retailers'' ads, or in a adds for BIG sapphires! ..How many good 20 to 40 carat sapphires are out there anyway? Its so neat to find a place where I can see and hear what ''privates'' (as we wholesalers, called y''all buyers back then)I used to wonder who the hell WORE this stuff??? ha ha...Just want to put something out there... each colored stone requires different facets to bring it up to its perfect state of... beauty/perfection...there is a science, but, also an ART to the cut...I see here, that some are caught up in the mechanical side of how and where facets are put...NO! NO! NO!...The best stones that came out of our office sometimes started off as 40 carat ugly buggers and ended up as 3 carat GEMS!!!...its not about a formula of faceting (like diamonds), its about where the lapidary( the artist)sees the color and then places those sometimes, strange facets...its a HUGE risk,and a great and stressful ART but when it works, WOW!!!!...''do we keep the weight and sell at per carat weight with a slight profit, or do we lose the weight and make a ''GEM'' quality stone that can double or triple at price and rarity because it is now PERFECT,there is a risk factor there (what if the stone breaks on the wheel, or the decision was wrong??? (it is , after all, bidness!) The temptation is hard to deal with...it disturbs me, that people seem to think that, as with diamonds, choosing where a facet goes is mathematical, not artful...Anyway, I am just babbling right now, because I am so happy to find a place where the fine art of gemstones can be discussed!! And, well...I have a place to babble!! and it has been years since I have been with people that appreciate my first professional love!
Ps-I have no clue as to how to track my stupid post! Hellllp!
Welcome to the forum Jake06,

I am very much in agreement with your thinking about the art of the lapidary. So many seem to think it is all about the numbers with no or very little thought given to what will bring out the best color in a COLORED stone. Please don''t be bashful about sharing some of your stories from your many years in the business.
 

jake06783

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 12, 2009
Messages
30
for fun...and perhaps all you young''uns know this...but, BEFORE yellow sapphires were heated...the boss would come back from sri lanka or where ever with these HUGE very PALE yellow sapphires (mind you,back then if it wasn''t blue or yellow, it was considered trash!)but i digress, as I do!...anyway, these HUGE yellows (the size of golf balls) were PALE PALE icky barely yellow stones...he showed me how , if you tilted the stones (oh and they were at this point badly faceted)anyway...if we tilted them to the light, you would see a totally CLEAR glass like stone except for perhaps a drop of color (like a pin dot) in them...then he would go to the wheel with them and come back out with a totally yellow (back then, not good) or GOLDEN (very good!) stone...minus 40- percent of its weight! The ART was to make the facets reflect back and forth off that tiny pin dot of color...AND, when he was done, when I would turn the stone over (trying to find that white glassy look...it was gone! The stone was refracting GOLD or YELLOW everywhere!! NO CLEAR GLASSINESS (is that a word?) anywhere!! It was truly ...oh I don''t know...dare I say it???
MAGIC!
And when I saw my first Padparadjah (before and after) !!! Whew!! Damn, do I miss that magic!
I met my (almost ex) hubby in that biz...and we still talk and wonder/marvel over the art of the lapidary...it is an art, i say!
PS---I still am having trouble finding my way back to this string!! Sheeesh!! LOL
 

cushioncutnut

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 22, 2008
Messages
4,030
Date: 3/24/2009 5:52:22 PM
Author:jake06783
I was in the wholesale gemstone business for years and LOVED it! My first job was working for the foremost sapphire cutter (ok, lapidary!)in the world. Back then we weren''t so fussy about the title!...Anyway, he was the most respected sapphire dude in the Far East to our West! To this day, decades later, I can spot one of his stones a mile away( usually in an auction house brochure/or fine jewelry retailers'' ads, or in a adds for BIG sapphires! ..How many good 20 to 40 carat sapphires are out there anyway? Its so neat to find a place where I can see and hear what ''privates'' (as we wholesalers, called y''all buyers back then)I used to wonder who the hell WORE this stuff??? ha ha...Just want to put something out there... each colored stone requires different facets to bring it up to its perfect state of... beauty/perfection...there is a science, but, also an ART to the cut...I see here, that some are caught up in the mechanical side of how and where facets are put...NO! NO! NO!...The best stones that came out of our office sometimes started off as 40 carat ugly buggers and ended up as 3 carat GEMS!!!...its not about a formula of faceting (like diamonds), its about where the lapidary( the artist)sees the color and then places those sometimes, strange facets...its a HUGE risk,and a great and stressful ART but when it works, WOW!!!!...''do we keep the weight and sell at per carat weight with a slight profit, or do we lose the weight and make a ''GEM'' quality stone that can double or triple at price and rarity because it is now PERFECT,there is a risk factor there (what if the stone breaks on the wheel, or the decision was wrong??? (it is , after all, bidness!) The temptation is hard to deal with...it disturbs me, that people seem to think that, as with diamonds, choosing where a facet goes is mathematical, not artful...Anyway, I am just babbling right now, because I am so happy to find a place where the fine art of gemstones can be discussed!! And, well...I have a place to babble!! and it has been years since I have been with people that appreciate my first professional love!
Ps-I have no clue as to how to track my stupid post! Hellllp!
That is truly "facinating"!
I would love to see a rough stone faceted in person. Although the lapidary you speak of may have cut without using all the mathematics, which makes the stone command a higher premium, most consumers prefer to have a lovely cut stone that can come at a reasonable price whether mathematics are used or not. I have to admit, I am one of them. Thanks for sharing your story and welcome!
 

oldmancoyote

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 22, 2008
Messages
755
Hello Jake, welcome. And thanks for the interesting posts; please keep them coming!
 

marcy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 27, 2007
Messages
24,088
Welcome Jake. I loved reading your post.
 

mochi

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 3, 2008
Messages
4,234
Facinating... and welcome, Jake!!
 

Gayletmom

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Nov 29, 2008
Messages
735
Welcome to the boards, Jake! You will get the hang of them soon-it doesn''t take long for us jewelry lovers. Love reading about your experiences as I am new to colored gems. I enjoy learning about them, especially from those of you who are so passionate.
 

ma re

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 10, 2008
Messages
2,698
Welcome!

Looking forward to stories of your experiences, but also to your advice and expertise. I can only confirm what Tourmaline Lover said in your other introductory post - I don''t have anyone to babble with, cause I have this weird interest
Love to hear about ordinary folks just enjoying gems and jewellery, but just as much, I enjoy the science and magic behind gems and jewellery.

Have fun!
 

jake06783

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 12, 2009
Messages
30
Gosh! So much to read on this site!! I keep going back and forth from Sapphires to Emeralds (my hubby and I were big in Emeralds way back when!) anyway, I see that the 20+ years spent at home raising my child (my other favorite career!) has left me woefully out of the loupe! oooops LOOP! ha ha... The guy I worked for averaged about 28& to 32% weight loss when he cut stones...Is that still good???
Funnily, I see my husband''s name mentioned here often! I had no idea he was so well known! We''ve been separated for almost 4 years, so I''m not privvy to what goes on in his day to day life anymore...small world!
 

jake06783

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 12, 2009
Messages
30
Odd, but I see here that he has "retired!" That''s news to me! Anyway, he''s a good guy...we had our bad moments at the beginning of the end,as does anyone that is about to split up, I s''pose. His name is Steven Bliss...do you know him??
 

Harriet

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,823
I've only met him once.

Jake, I have a question. Another dealer told me that sapphires often have off-centre culets because they're cut to retain weight. Is this true? If so, why would weight retention require asymmetry? Is it because of the crystal shape? Thanks!
 

jake06783

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 12, 2009
Messages
30
I''m not sure. Keep in mind that I was in that end of the biz over 25 years ago( God! perhaps, 35 years ago?? UGH!)...as far as I recall, the only reasons to "retain" weight are A) to get the best color or B) make more money. I come from the, no matter how much weight the stone loses, COLOR is the most important thing!
I have been lamenting my 8mm over 3 carat round burma ruby that I bought (for a song) and then wore and wore down to the point where I needed it re-polished...I sent it to a guy that I still believe is the BEST lapidary in this country and it came back under 3 carats (3 carat round burmas were a rarity back then, I hope they still are!!LOL) anyway, it came back GORGEOUS, still 8mm round, but under 3 carats! I actually cried...Now, the stone is totally beat! I made it into a pinky ring, and wore it every day for years...I am sooooo afraid to have it polished again!! Because I KNOW, that the right thing to do for it is to lose a mm, and more weight...and then it will be ..."just another pretty ruby" NOT a RARE pretty BIG ruby!!
Jeeze, I think I may be babbling again! So sorry! These old brain cells are a jiggling and a moving!! Hopefully soon, the old memories and the new info I find here will Gel! I feel like I need to DeFrag my brain!
 

jake06783

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 12, 2009
Messages
30
sheesh! I don''t think I answered your question properly! Wish I could reference your question while I am responding...but so far, don''t seem to be able to! Anyway...Culette question/off center...off center is not bad...if it enhances color, for sure...Sometimes it is neccesary...the beauty of colored stones is that they really are individual little pieces ... kind of like people, they have their own personalities and flaws and ...!

Bet I still haven''t answered your question! So sorry. Give me a few weeks to get my head back in the game!
 

oldmancoyote

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 22, 2008
Messages
755
Date: 3/25/2009 1:28:12 PM
Author: jake06783
sheesh! I don''t think I answered your question properly! Wish I could reference your question while I am responding...but so far, don''t seem to be able to! Anyway...Culette question/off center...off center is not bad...if it enhances color, for sure...Sometimes it is neccesary...the beauty of colored stones is that they really are individual little pieces ... kind of like people, they have their own personalities and flaws and ...!

Bet I still haven''t answered your question! So sorry. Give me a few weeks to get my head back in the game!
It should appear below the post you are editing - just scroll down on the screen and you should see the whole thread.
 

ma re

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 10, 2008
Messages
2,698
Just a little info for our new member - the easiest way to get attention of girls (and boys) of this forum is to post pictures; loose gemstones, jewellery, whatever, as long as there are pictures
We like to drool over other people''s jewellery


P. S. If you have pics of some fine stones that you''ve seen in real life (since you''ve worked with some nice ones), that can''t hurt either
For educational purposes, of course...
 

jake06783

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 12, 2009
Messages
30
My camera is on vacation with someone right now, but as soon as he is back, I plan on posting some pics of what is left of my own stuff! I have my sad unpolished ruby and the pink cab rings...and my fifth anniversary band of diamonds that I have worn for ohhhh, 20+ years through thick and thin! Sadly, the rest of my treasures are gone.
PS- Is it me or is this site incredibly slow at loading pages??
 

Harriet

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,823
Jake, you''re not alone. I have a 4.97 ct. Burmese red spinel (it''s already just shy of the 5 ct. mark) that I nicked. At some point, I''ll have to get it polished and take some weight loss.
 

LtlFirecracker

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 29, 2008
Messages
4,837
Welcome,

I love hearing some of your stories. This is my favorite forum on PS, I am sure you will enjoy it too.
 
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