Need your help & input on diamond purchase

[supaflyjae]

Looking to purchase this diamond below certified via EGL USA. As you can see the cut grade is listed as N/A but the jeweler says it's "very good" and I should not worry about having a "brilliant" stone. Looking to the experts here to give me their input. Price is around $8500.

WEIGHT 1.21 CT
COLOR G
CLARITY VS2
MEASUREMENTS 6.84 x 6.81 x 4.25 mm
DEPTH 62.3%
TABLE 63%
CROWN 14.4%
PAVILION 45%
CROWN ANGLE 37.2
PAVILION ANGLE 42.1
GIRDLE thin to medium
POLISH excellent
SYMMETRY good
FLUORESCENCEnone
CUTLET very small
CUT GRADE n/a

 

[rubybeth]

Pass and walk away from this seller. HCA is only 'fair' and you do want the most brilliant stone you can find.

 

[JulieN]

ergh, no. rip off.

Something like this? http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-VS2-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1451986.asp or http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1511716.asp

 

[webdiva]

Looking to purchase this diamond below certified via EGL USA. As you can see the cut grade is listed as N/A but the jeweler says it's "very good" and I should not worry about having a "brilliant" stone. Looking to the experts here to give me their input. Price is around $8500.

What's the POINT of a diamond if it's not sparkly? Sounds like a $8500 paperweight. Leave that jeweler asap and check out the PS approved vendors. Get a SPARKLY diamond. <sigh>

 

[supaflyjae]

Thank you guys for all the input so far. So what is the flaw with this stone? What are it's weakest properties that tell you guys to stay away?

 

[warheadwl]

Thank you guys for all the input so far. So what is the flaw with this stone? What are it's weakest properties that tell you guys to stay away?

I'm a noob here, so take what I have to say w/ a grain of salt.

First, it's an EGL certified diamond, and people here believe that EGL inflates their grades. IOW, an EGL G VS2 is probably yellower and dirtier than a GIA/AGS G VS2. I'm pretty sure noone on this forum would suggest that you get an EGL certified diamond. Stick with GIA/AGS certified diamonds, which are much more respected here.

Second, the angles are out of the acceptable ranges, which will decrease performance. Use the HCA (https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca) to help you weed out bad diamonds (you should read around for the disclaimers of what the HCA can and can't do for you). The HCA is just a tool, not the definitive authority in diamond performance.

 

[rubybeth]

Thank you guys for all the input so far. So what is the flaw with this stone? What are it's weakest properties that tell you guys to stay away?

Aside from the fact that you don't know what the color/clarity really is with an EGL graded stone (stick with GIA and AGS stones unless looking at antique cuts!), it is cut very badly. The HCA lists fire as fair and scintillation as poor. You really do want the most fire and scintillation as possible, and the fact that this jeweler is saying you shouldn't worry about having a 'brilliant' stone is a red flag--he is a liar. You DO want the most brilliant stone, and the thing that affects the brilliance/sparkliness/light return of a diamond the MOST is CUT. Run away from this jeweler who clearly does NOT know what he is talking about or is trying to sell you a load. If your budget is $8,500, we can help find you something better within your budget.

Read a bit more here: https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds
And here specifically on cut: https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/diamond-cut

 

[rubybeth]

Example of a well cut stone in your budget ($7,880 with PS discount, 1.31 I VS1):

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/I-VS1-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1514111.asp

Ran the numbers from the GIA certificate in the HCA: https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca

 

[supaflyjae]

The issue I have with buying online is that even if all the numbers look good on paper, it still doesn't trump looking at the actual stone in person right?

I've read that HCA is used to weed out stones rather than used to select stones... does that mean any stone no matter what should be considered if the score is less than 2? What if the score was 5 or 7? Don't even consider it based on HCA?

 

[JulieN]

Yes, that is correct, a stone that scored say, a five, is an auto-reject. You really don't want a fish eye.

No, it doesn't mean that every stone under 2 is to be considered, as some of those combos can be very beautiful, but not well balanced. On the other hand, stones up to four can be considered if there is something you like about it....

 

[rubybeth]

The issue I have with buying online is that even if all the numbers look good on paper, it still doesn't trump looking at the actual stone in person right?

I've read that HCA is used to weed out stones rather than used to select stones... does that mean any stone no matter what should be considered if the score is less than 2? What if the score was 5 or 7? Don't even consider it based on HCA?

I would disagree that looking at an actual stone in person is somehow the best option for buying. If you are comparing two well-cut stones side-by-side, then yes, go with what your eyes see. But you seem to be working with a seller who is lying to you, so I'd steer clear of that and recommend you go with a vendor that offers images and other information about the stone, like James Allen, Good Old Gold, Whiteflash, Brian Gavin Diamonds, or others that people have used and given positive reviews of on Pricescope. This dealer does NOT have your best interest at heart in telling you that you shouldn't care about a stone's brilliance. What a load of c*ap.

And yes, the HCA is used for weeding, it means a stone under 2 is 'worth more consideration.' Above a 2, it's less likely to be 'worth consideration.' The one you are considering is not, in my opinion and that of I'd guess 98% of regular Pricescopers, not worth further consideration, and the fact that this seller is telling you it is... is a bad sign.

Edited to add: if you were looking at fancy cuts, my advice might be slightly different, but you are looking at a round cut, which has specific parameters which are easy to determine by numbers. The math doesn't lie. And PSers have no reason to lie to you, while this diamond dealer obviously does.

 

[supaflyjae]

Hi everyone,

So the dealer came back with these two GIA options and I'm wondering if their initial asking price is good. Both stones have slight white inclusions away from the center which I verified through a loupe.

1.03ct H VS1 XXX (HCA 1.2) $8750
1.36ct H VS2 XXX (HCA 1. $11250