Need help: Robbin bros purchase decision

[Lorelei]

Date: 5/25/2008 9:25:45 AM
Author: Deelight
There was a thread a little while ago talking about the MSID diamond you can read it here https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/anyone-know-about-msid-diamonds.83958/
LOL Dee, great minds think alike!

 

[lanced]

Hi all,
Thanks all of you for typing your opinions to help me making such a big decision.
My wife and I are now tipping toward delaying the purchase to find a better diamond. The 54% depth and the IGI report are the key reasons we are backing away. I''m willing to pay a little more at a local store, but I must know exactly what I''m getting. Buying a IGI cert diamond leaves me doubt about the true grading of this stone. If I lower the clarity and color by 1 grade, I can find much cheaper diamond online.

Anyhow, this does not mean I won''t make a stupid mistake later buying else where. Just that I''m delaying a potential mistake here

I don''t think buying diamond is a good idea anyway But it''s my wife''s wish so be it.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 5/25/2008 9:28:11 AM
Author: lanced
Hi all,
Thanks all of you for typing your opinions to help me making such a big decision.
My wife and I are now tipping toward delaying the purchase to find a better diamond. The 54% depth and the IGI report are the key reasons we are backing away. I''m willing to pay a little more at a local store, but I must know exactly what I''m getting. Buying a IGI cert diamond leaves me doubt about the true grading of this stone. If I lower the clarity and color by 1 grade, I can find much cheaper diamond online.

Anyhow, this does not mean I won''t make a stupid mistake later buying else where. Just that I''m delaying a potential mistake here

I don''t think buying diamond is a good idea anyway But it''s my wife''s wish so be it.

If you can, ask to see some AGS0 or GIA Excellent if you prefer to buy from a jeweller. If you would like to buy online, then we will be pleased to help you!

 

[gwendolyn]

Date: 5/25/2008 9:32:39 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 5/25/2008 9:28:11 AM

Author: lanced

Hi all,

Thanks all of you for typing your opinions to help me making such a big decision.

My wife and I are now tipping toward delaying the purchase to find a better diamond. The 54% depth and the IGI report are the key reasons we are backing away. I'm willing to pay a little more at a local store, but I must know exactly what I'm getting. Buying a IGI cert diamond leaves me doubt about the true grading of this stone. If I lower the clarity and color by 1 grade, I can find much cheaper diamond online.


Anyhow, this does not mean I won't make a stupid mistake later buying else where. Just that I'm delaying a potential mistake here


I don't think buying diamond is a good idea anyway But it's my wife's wish so be it.

If you can, ask to see some AGS0 or GIA Excellent if you prefer to buy from a jeweller. If you would like to buy online, then we will be pleased to help you!

We can also help with a purchase for B&M jewelers if you want us to, but you'd need to make sure you get all the numbers from the grading reports for us to evaluate to see if it's a good buy (table and depth %, crown and pavilion angles, girdle measurement, cut grade, colour grade and price) and IS images if they are available. I think you've made a wise decision.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 5/25/2008 9:36:21 AM
Author: gwendolyn

Date: 5/25/2008 9:32:39 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 5/25/2008 9:28:11 AM

Author: lanced

Hi all,

Thanks all of you for typing your opinions to help me making such a big decision.

My wife and I are now tipping toward delaying the purchase to find a better diamond. The 54% depth and the IGI report are the key reasons we are backing away. I''m willing to pay a little more at a local store, but I must know exactly what I''m getting. Buying a IGI cert diamond leaves me doubt about the true grading of this stone. If I lower the clarity and color by 1 grade, I can find much cheaper diamond online.


Anyhow, this does not mean I won''t make a stupid mistake later buying else where. Just that I''m delaying a potential mistake here


I don''t think buying diamond is a good idea anyway But it''s my wife''s wish so be it.

If you can, ask to see some AGS0 or GIA Excellent if you prefer to buy from a jeweller. If you would like to buy online, then we will be pleased to help you!

We can also help with a purchase for B&M jewelers if you want us to, but you''d need to make sure you get all the numbers from the grading reports for us to evaluate to see if it''s a good buy (table and depth %, crown and pavilion angles, girdle measurement, cut grade, colour grade and price) and IS images if they are available. I think you''ve made a wise decision.

Yes I forgot to mention that, we can be of assistance in this way too, but will need this info to be able to give you meaningful advice --

depth %
table%
crown angle or percent
pavilion angle or percent
polish and symmetry grades
girdle thickness
fluorescence if applicable
diameter measurement
Type of lab report and cut grade.

 

[Deelight]

Date: 5/25/2008 9:27:43 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 5/25/2008 9:25:45 AM

Author: Deelight

There was a thread a little while ago talking about the MSID diamond you can read it here https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/anyone-know-about-msid-diamonds.83958/

LOL Dee, great minds think alike!

Hehehehe and yes our minds are great

 

[lanced]

I found two stones on WF (details below) one is $14.3K, the other is $15.6K. They don''t grade the cut, but the cheaper one has better depth & table, yet cheaper.

Why WF don''t grade the cut? This is exactly what make buying diamond difficult (

$15,579.00
. Report: GIA
. Shape: Round
. Carat: 1.75
. Depth %: 62.3
. Table %: 58
. Girdle: M-STK
. Measurements: 7.69-7.65X4.78
. Polish: Excellent
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: None


$14,383.00
Item Code: 15723314
. Report: GIA
. Shape: Round
. Carat: 1.75
. Depth %: 61.2
. Table %: 59
. Girdle: TN-M
. Measurements: 7.79-7.74X4.75
. Polish: Very Good
. Symmetry: Good
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: None

 

[Lorelei]

It is possible these are not in house diamonds Lance, these could be virtual stones which WF has access to by calling the diamonds in on request, but don't own as part of their inventory. It can be best to stick to in house diamonds which WF or other vendors can physically see and advise you on. Also with in house diamonds, very often the cut analysis has been done for you, so this can make choosing a bit easier.

Here are some examples of diamonds you could get for your budget from Pricescope vendors.

http://www.niceice.com/certcopies2008/ags0009015501/index.htm

This one below looks to come out to $15020 with the discount for paying with a bank wire.

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-906728.htm

This one is a J colour, but well within budget.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/4014/

 

[Raider2]

Date: 5/25/2008 9:52:24 AM
Author: lanced
I found two stones on WF (details below) one is $14.3K, the other is $15.6K. They don''t grade the cut, but the cheaper one has better depth & table, yet cheaper.


Why WF don''t grade the cut? This is exactly what make buying diamond difficult (


$15,579.00

. Report: GIA

. Shape: Round

. Carat: 1.75

. Depth %: 62.3

. Table %: 58

. Girdle: M-STK

. Measurements: 7.69-7.65X4.78

. Polish: Excellent

. Symmetry: Very Good

. Culet: None

. Fluorescence: None



$14,383.00

Item Code: 15723314

. Report: GIA

. Shape: Round

. Carat: 1.75

. Depth %: 61.2

. Table %: 59

. Girdle: TN-M

. Measurements: 7.79-7.74X4.75

. Polish: Very Good

. Symmetry: Good

. Culet: None

. Fluorescence: None

Lance

I dug around a little and found the corresponding cert numbers. The first has an HCA of 4.1, however the second may be a keeper. There''s a discrepancy between the vendors (all of them, not just WF). The vendors all list a table size of 59, however the GIA report at the GIA site states 56. In either case, the HCA looks great. With a table of 59 the HCA is 1.2, with a table of 56, the HCA is .7 . I''d ask WF to bring this one in to take a look.

 

[Lorelei]

Raider, can you give us the crown and pavilion angles you used for these diamonds please? Also what are the colour and clarities?

 

[lanced]

Hi Lorelei,
The link shows the diamond at $16.6K. Bankwire gives 2% discount. So it''s not $15020. Am I missing something?

"
This one below looks to come out to $15020 with the discount for paying with a bank wire.

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-906728.htm

 

[lanced]

Hi Raider2,
Thanks you. They''re off today. Will call them later.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 5/25/2008 11:12:14 AM
Author: lanced

Hi Lorelei,
The link shows the diamond at $16.6K. Bankwire gives 2% discount. So it's not $15020. Am I missing something?

'
This one below looks to come out to $15020 with the discount for paying with a bank wire.

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/A-Cut-Above-H-A-cut-diamond-906728.htm

As far as I can see, that price above is the pre discount price. I used the search by cut feature to find this diamond, and it noted the $15020 price as the "S" price for Pricescope members if paying with a bank wire transfer to the best of my knowledge. If you are interested in this diamond, WF would be able to clarify this.

https://www.pricescope.com/sift.aspx

There is the search tool I used above, enter the carat weight, colour and clarity, and you should be able to see what I am referring to when the diamond pops up.

 

[Raider2]

Date: 5/25/2008 10:25:11 AM
Author: Lorelei
Raider, can you give us the crown and pavilion angles you used for these diamonds please? Also what are the colour and clarities?

WF $15,579.00

Report Check for GIA Report Number: 16764693
Date of Issue: January 02, 2008
Round Brilliant
Measurements: 7.65 - 7.69 x 4.78 mm
Carat Weight: 1.75
Color Grade: H
Clarity Grade: VS2
Cut Grade: Excellent
Proportions:
Depth: 62.3 %
Table: 58 %
Crown Angle: 35.5°
Crown Height: 15 %
Pavilion Angle: 41°
Pavilion Depth: 43.5 %
Star length: 50 %
Lower Half: 75 %
Girdle: Medium to Slightly Thick, Faceted
Culet: None
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Very Good
Fluorescence: None
Comments: Clouds are not shown. Surface graining is not shown.

WF $14,383.00 Item Code: 15723314
GIA Report Number: 17214839
Date of Issue: May 13, 2008
Laser Inscription Registry: 17214839
Round Brilliant
Measurements: 7.74 - 7.79 x 4.75 mm
Carat Weight: 1.75
Color Grade: H
Clarity Grade: VS2
Cut Grade: Very Good
Proportions:
Depth: 61.2 %
Table: 56 %
Crown Angle: 33.5°
Crown Height: 14.5 %
Pavilion Angle: 40.6°
Pavilion Depth: 43 %
Star length: 55 %
Lower Half: 75 %
Girdle: Thin to Medium, Faceted
Culet: None
Finish:
Polish: Very Good
Symmetry: Good
Fluorescence: None

 

[Lorelei]

Thank you Raider!

Ok, I would definitely pass on the first diamond, it is what we call a steep deep combo with the crown and pavilion angles. This means the diamond could very likely leak light and have reduced performance. The second one is a shallower combo, but it may be an attractive diamond although not cut to superideal standards, WF would be able to advise on this or suggest alternatives.

 

[lanced]

OK. I went back to RB today as we promised them yesterday. We told them our concerns and called the deal off. For what it worth, here is the info on that stone:

8.21 x 8.28 x 4.46
Depth: 55%
Table: 59.5%
Crown: 10% - 26°
Pavilion: 42% - 40.1°
Gridle: Thin, Faceted
Culet: None
Fluorescence: None

Basically, they wanted $14.5K for the stone.

 

[lanced]

Hi Lorelei,
I will call WF. You said "WF would be able to advise on this": What kind of advises would they give?

 

[JulieN]

Date: 5/25/2008 5:08:52 PM
Author: lanced
OK. I went back to RB today as we promised them yesterday. We told them our concerns and called the deal off. For what it worth, here is the info on that stone:

8.21 x 8.28 x 4.46
Depth: 55%
Table: 59.5%
Crown: 10% - 26°
Pavilion: 42% - 40.1°
Gridle: Thin, Faceted
Culet: None
Fluorescence: None

Basically, they wanted $14.5K for the stone.

Wow, that stone has a large chipping risk compared to regular rounds.

 

[purrfectpear]

Another happy Whiteflash customer here (2.06). They will look at the stone and give your their HONEST opinion. I trust their eyes completely. In addition they will send you highly magnified photos, sarin, aset, and other reports to help you make your decision.

If it makes you feel any better, WF is not just an internet presence, they also have a real store in Texas (though I purchased completely online).

 

[lanced]

Hi purrfectpear,
Is WF price negotiable?
BTW, I''m in Dallas, just 4 hrs from where WF is.

Any good B&M store in Dallas you all can recommend?

 

[lanced]

Hi Raider2,
How did you get the GIA report number from the WF description? I went to the GIA site and they need the report # as well as the carat.

 

[lanced]

Please advice which one is better for the money. The bottom one obviously has better dimensions and fluorescense = none but it''s $1.1K different.

http://www.whiteflash.com/round/Round-cut-diamond-834191.htm#
AGS link: http://www.whiteflash.com/images/diamond_images/images_details/report_ags.gif
1.8 ct H VS1 Round
$15,584.00
Item Code: 15009095
. Report: AGS
. Shape: Round
. Carat: 1.800
. Depth %: 62.9
. Table %: 56
. Girdle: TN-STK
. Measurements: 7.76-7.70X4.86
. Polish: Excellent
. Symmetry: Ideal
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: Strong Blue


http://www.whiteflash.com/round/Round-cut-diamond-834575.htm#
1.8 ct H VS2 Round
$16,664.00
Item Code: 15083068
. Report: GIA
. Shape: Round
. Carat: 1.80
. Depth %: 59.1
. Table %: 58
. Girdle: TN-STK
. Measurements: 7.97-8.03X4.73
. Polish: Very Good
. Symmetry: Excellent
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: None

 

[Raider2]

Date: 5/25/2008 6:47:01 PM
Author: lanced
Hi Raider2,

How did you get the GIA report number from the WF description? I went to the GIA site and they need the report # as well as the carat.

Virtual diamonds (those not held by a vendor in-house) are listed by more than one vendor in the PS diamond search. By plugging in the table, depth and carat information, I found all the vendors listing the virtual stone, and one of them had the cert # in their description (it wasn't WF). This works about 80% of the time.

 

[purrfectpear]

Here is an AGS0 stone at Good Old Gold for $13,085 that''s very nice 1.726


The pricescope vendors don''t really haggle over price, the margin is pretty small as is.

 

[arjunajane]

Date: 5/25/2008 6:38:25 PM
Author: lanced
Hi purrfectpear,
Is WF price negotiable?
BTW, I''m in Dallas, just 4 hrs from where WF is.

Any good B&M store in Dallas you all can recommend?

...Many ppl would be jealous of you being able to go to WF in person - I understand you are able to call them and set up an appointment - tell them what you''re after and they will have a range of stones for you to choose from. All the work in choosing a great diamond will be done for you by extremely knowledgeable people, all you have to do is pick the one your eyes like the best!
Then, either choose one of the lovely stock settings from their respectable selection, or have WF make something custom to your desire.

bada-bing, bada-boom, done!

 

[honey22]

Date: 5/25/2008 8:33:38 AM
Author: lanced
Hi Lorelei,
My wife told me the depth is 54% indeed. It''s because with the RB MSID cut, they make the diamond look bigger (1.77ct looks as big as a 2 ct). Effectively, that would make a very shallow depth. I heard too shallow is not good either. So what is the ideal depth?

Please don''t buy a stone that is cut to make it look bigger - what you gain in spread, you will surely lose in sparkle. A diamond cut to the correct proportions (ie. depth not too deep or too shallow) will sparkle more and look much brighter and beautiful than a stone that has been cut to look bigger. I would take an smaller ideal cut stone over a shallow poorly cut stone in a heartbeat - frozen spit looks like frozen spit, whether it''s big or small.

I have purchased from WF, and wouldn''t hesitate to recommend them. AGS certified stones are just as reliable (even more so IMHO) as GIA, so don''t worry about that. Find yourself an AGS 000 stone to look at and you will appreciate the importance of getting the best cut possible.

Good luck! I am sure you will end up with a gorgeous stone!