Need an estimate of how I did...

[jet2ks]

Date: 12/21/2009 10:03:45 PM
Author: wildcatmccane
I will agree with ya on that different names for the GIA ratings. However, BN for example (ideal) is always GIA excellent cut.
Jamesallen however shows GIA as the report, yet their names Ideal and ideal don't match. if you click on BN cut it tells you that BN uses ideal in place of excellent. On JamesAllen it just talks about the GIA scale. So what I meant by lying I would relabel as completely trying to mislead untrained others.

So this diamond (amoung others) from BN is them lying, then.

http://www.bluenile.com/round-diamond-1-carat-or-less-ideal-cut-d-color-si2-clarity_LD01518279

BN lists it as Ideal. In order for a diamond to receive Ideal from AGS, it must score Ideal in proportions, polish and symmetry, while this diamond only gets Good in Polish & Symmetry both, plus the girdle being very thick--in other words AGS would rate it no higher than Good for cut, as would GIA. I'm not trying to bash anyone, I'm just saying that all vendors do this because of the sheer volume of information that requires entry into their systems.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 12/21/2009 10:11:16 PM
Author: jet2ks

Date: 12/21/2009 10:03:45 PM
Author: wildcatmccane
I will agree with ya on that different names for the GIA ratings. However, BN for example (ideal) is always GIA excellent cut.
Jamesallen however shows GIA as the report, yet their names Ideal and ideal don''t match. if you click on BN cut it tells you that BN uses ideal in place of excellent. On JamesAllen it just talks about the GIA scale. So what I meant by lying I would relabel as completely trying to mislead untrained others.

So this diamond (amoung others) from BN is them lying, then.

http://www.bluenile.com/round-diamond-1-carat-or-less-ideal-cut-d-color-si2-clarity_LD01518279

BN lists it as Ideal. In order for a diamond to receive Ideal from AGS, it must score Ideal in proportions, polish and symmetry, while this diamond only gets Good in Polish & Symmetry both, plus the girdle being very thick--in other words AGS would rate it no higher than Good for cut, so would GIA. I''m not trying to bash anyone, I''m just saying that all vendors do this because of the sheer volume of information that requires entry into their systems.

Exactly.

 

[wildcatmccane]

I guess ideal is relative here. I know I am talking to real professionals here. However, I just need a wowing diamond Ideally the math should be ideal, but its okay to be 95%

So a 2.1 should be rejected. but that 2.1 is not any less good or less then the 2.4. Both aren''t ideal equally right?

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 12/21/2009 10:15:24 PM
Author: wildcatmccane
I guess ideal is relative here. I know I am talking to real professionals here. However, I just need a wowing diamond Ideally the math should be ideal, but its okay to be 95%

So a 2.1 should be rejected. but that 2.1 is not any less good or less then the 2.4. Both aren''t ideal equally right?

Both are equally unlikely to be truly wonderfully cut diamonds

A variety of diamond proportions can create an optically superiour cut. AGS and GIA use different methods to try to identify these elusive beasts that we are searching for -- diamonds with kickin'' optics. AGS actually has tighter parameters than GIA, so their Ideal cut grade (AGS0) is almost always (I have never seen an esxception) kickin according to our standards too. GIA has a broader definition of its top cut grade (Excellent), and so sometimes diamonds make that grade that we don''t think perform as well as they should. The HCA is a tool that uses the diamond''s proportions to help you to narrow the candidates so that you are more likely to be selecting a diamond that has top optics. DIamonds scoring under two are the most likely to be top performers. Diamonds scoring over 2 are less likely to be top performers. Without any other information (like an Idealscope, which trumps the HCA), then pick stones scoring less than 2 and you are the most likely to be selecting a top performing diamond.

Or, Yes.

 

[Dreamer_D]

OK, I totally hear what you are saying about being willing to sacrifice a little in cut. I have looked at diamonds that were tops of the tops compared to almost tops of the tops, and in many situations they look the same. So you can search for an "almost" if you want.

But me personally I would rather drop to a .80ct and get top cut than get a .90ct that was not. The difference in size is 2/10th of a mm. That is 2 sheets of paper. You won''t be able to see it, even if they are side by side. But you may notice that the less than ideal diamond doesn''t look awesome all the time *shrug*... it is your choice in the end.

Did you look at the diamond that I posted from Excel? They are a well reviewed PS vendor and that diamond meets your specs...

 

[wildcatmccane]

Right on Thanks

Hum...so completely not going to happen to find the elusive ideal diamond. But I knew this wouldn''t be the ideal diamond to begin with. I guess I need help finding pretty close to ideal.

 

[jet2ks]

I like the second answer, dreamer

As dreamer mentioned, what rejecting diamonds scoring over 2 does is simply increase your odds. We have seen many diamonds scoring 2-2.5 with great Idealscope images that will be outstanding performers. We have also seen many that leak light and won''t perform very well. The only way to truly know is with images, which BN does not provide, regretably.

 

[hihowareyou]

Date: 12/21/2009 10:03:45 PM
Author: wildcatmccane


So even labeled excellent cut, my first choice (an E ideal) is coming back lower then very good cuts....Very interesting.

The HCA estimates how a diamond performs in light based on its numbers. How GIA comes up with its grading is completely different. GIA Ex. diamonds that do not perform particularly well in the HCA are brought up here quite often and often the IS images confirm it.

I guess you need to decide if you are happy to play 100% trust in the GIA Ex. grade even though you now know that not all Ex. diamonds are equal. Do you trust BN on numbers alone as they will not supply you with any additional images?

You will find most people on these board really favour cut. I am the same partly because I believe a good cut is what turns a bit of rock from the earth into something precious and beautiful. I think if I'm going to spend a few thousand on a diamond it might as well have been treated like a king, had the most care taken in crafting the facets so they they would perform in the optimum way, etc. There is however a market for lower quality cut stones that tick other boxes such as size, colour, clarity, price, etc. At the end of the day your preference and the preference of the person who will wear the stone is most important. If your priority if size over cut then you are free to that opinion. Unfortunately though it doesn't look like your budget will cater for the size and colour that you desire together with a premium cut.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 12/21/2009 10:25:34 PM
Author: dreamer_dachsie

Did you look at the diamond that I posted from Excel? They are a well reviewed PS vendor and that diamond meets your specs...

Again, this one meets all your critria and the numbers are great...

 

[wildcatmccane]

300 dollars more than my budget of 3700

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 12/21/2009 10:40:33 PM
Author: wildcatmccane
300 dollars more than my budget of 3700

Ok, I hear you. Then you will need to drop one of your criteria if you will not stretch.

I think if you really are wanting to drop cut more than anything, then just pick a GIA excellent cut and get it. It won''t be the best, but it will still be better than most people''s e-rings.

Still, I wish you would drop to a G color. I know you said you saw them in a store, but if they were not graded by GIA or AGS then you don''t really know that you saw a properly graded F and G to compare.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 12/21/2009 10:40:33 PM
Author: wildcatmccane
300 dollars more than my budget of 3700

And just FYI, it is 3912 if you pay by bank wire, and most Ps vendors have a PS discount of a percent or so. I would call about it, with the discount it could meet your budget.

ETA Or do whatever you want, I'm not trying to push you to do something you aren't interested in, just wanted to point it out in case $$ was the only impediment.

 

[wildcatmccane]

Thanks again for all the replies yesterday. I looked over everything and know I didn''t get a perfect diamond. In fact, it is probably not close by many standards here

I purchased:
http://www.bluenile.com/round-diamond-1-carat-or-less-ideal-cut-e-color-si1-clarity_LD01609144

will be getting it tomorrow and I will let you know my initial response

thanks!

 

[wildcatmccane]

One odd question. Is a 4 prong or 6 prong better than the other in making a diamond look better?

 

[jet2ks]

Congrats on your purchase.

Actually, I think you did well. 35/41 can be a good combination, especially with the 80% lower half--it is likely to be a very nice diamond. When you get the diamond, make sure to look at it in a variety of lighting situations--diffused daylight, fluorescent office lighting, low light, etc. and make sure the diamond doesn''t go dead in any of them. It will have different personalities in the various lighting, but should be sparkly and pretty in all.

The most important thing is whether you like the diamond and are happy and comfortable with your purchase.

Date: 12/22/2009 10:55:58 PM
Author: wildcatmccane
One odd question. Is a 4 prong or 6 prong better than the other in making a diamond look better?

Difference of opinion amoung people here. A 4 prong is generally considered to show off more of the diamond, but can make it appear square. A 6 prong will appear more round and is technically more secure (a well made 4 prong is plenty secure, however. Any ring needs to be checked a couple times a year for security). There is no wrong answer. You should go over to the Show Me The Ring forum and browse some threads to get an idea of what each style looks like. There are a lot of pictures there. I would recommend the Eye Candy thread--they will have the most variety of pics with the least amount of clicking around.

Please post some pics once the ring is done--we love pics

 

[Dreamer_D]

Well we all make compromises somewhere. I am sure your diamond will be gorgeous and much nicer than most diamonds people buy. When is the proposal? (Is this an engagement purchase?)

Some people think 6 prongs make diamonds look bigger, others think that on smaller diamonds 6 prongs are overwhelming. I think since you got an E color it would be nice to see more of the pavilion in more open 4 prong setting so you can really appreciate its colorlessness from the side, where it is most noticable.

 

[wildcatmccane]

I need to get the ring. Thankfully I can get the ring wicked cheap. My dad had a silver business for 15 years, and I opened a business account with his contacts. amazing how the ring (gold platnium) is marked up a minimum of 3 times, yet in my diamond search even the distributors weren''t much less than online, and I couldn''t sit on the phone for hours looking at all of them like i did in my online quest.

I like the 6 prong look myself. She does too. But good point about the color and the the side view.

i will let you know when it comes....hopefully the SI1 proves to pass the eye clean test. We shall see.

Thanks on the tip about different lighting. Appreciate that everyone isn''t passing me by on help. Some of us are truly new to the whole diamond deal.

 

[wildcatmccane]

Came the next day after ordering.

Looks perfect. No visible flaws. Everything visually is as I read on this website (the whole can see your fingers when you are pinching it business...not on this one). Looks exactly like the picture from the first page on what a great diamond looks like.

Without looking previously, I am amazed how the girdle is so unnoticeable. This one is a medium medium faceted, but I believe the normal person wouldn''t even notice it without being told.



Thanks everyone.

 

[Lisa Loves Shiny]

Congrats! Isn''t it great to know that you picked out a diamond that you and your fiance love! As for prong settings, I prefer a six prong setting as it makes the diamond more round to my eye and I think it protects the diamond a little better. To each his or hers own. Please post pics soon.