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manechka

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2002
Messages
30
Hello All,

Need your advice again. I have been offered diamond with EGL certificate and here are the specs:

Decscription: natural diamond
weight: 2.66 ct
shape and cut: round brilliant cut
measurements: 9.00 x 8.93 x 8.54 mm
proportions: very good
depth %: 60.7
table diameter %: 59
crown height: 14%
pavilion depth: 44%
girdle thickness: thin faceted
Finish grade: Good
Purity (clarity grade (10 x loupe magnification): SI1
Color Grade: E
Photoluminescence: none
Comments: None

The price is $17,300 and I need to know if this deal is indeed as sweet as seller presents it to be. Also, this stone has EGL certificate and not GIA and this concerns me. Another thing that concerns me the clarify, it''s SI1. What do you think?
 

69gm

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 28, 2003
Messages
287
hi manechka,

just a couple of quick comments about your stone:

personally i would stay away from EGL certified diamonds. some people will say it's okay while others will say EGL is too lax in the way they do their measurements. there is enough controversy that i don't think it's worth taking a chance.

as far as SI1, usually SI1's tend to be eye-clean. of course different diamonds are different but i've seen lots of fine SI1's out there. you would definitely need a at least a 10x loupe in order to see them.

keep in mind that cut is the most important thing. without the proper proportions of table, depth, crown, and pavilion, clarity doesn't mean squate. after cut, i would try to get a good color. after that worry so much about cut.

i do understand the "feeling" of getting an SI1. my personal comfort level was at VS2. the important thing is to find someone you trust and let them know what you want. then they will find you that "perfect" diamond according to your various comfortable search parameters.

if you do go the route of internet buying, you will definitely find very trustworthy experts here who can definitely help you find what you are looking for.

hope this helps!
 

69gm

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 28, 2003
Messages
287
----------------
On 5/8/2003 9:30:29 PM 69gm wrote:


keep in mind that cut is the most important thing. without the proper proportions of table, depth, crown, and pavilion, clarity doesn't mean squate. after cut, i would try to get a good color. after that worry so much about cut.

----------------
oops! that last sentence should read, "after that worry so much about CLARITY". not cut. boy, brain-farting today...
 

pqcollectibles

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 22, 2003
Messages
3,441
While EGL is not as strict or consistent as AGS or GIA, there are some accurately EGL graded diamonds out there. They take a price hit due to the EGL Cert and the buyer gets a bargain.

Leonid posted equations to calculate angle degrees from %'s and I ran the Cut Advisor on this diamond. HCA rating for this diamond was:

4.2
Good Light Return
Good Fire
Good Scintillation
Very Good Spread
Comments: Good only if price is your main concern.

If you are looking for a real sparkler of a diamond, you might want to consider continuing your search.
 

Mara

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2002
Messages
31,003
You know what they say...if it seems too good to be true...it sometimes is. Or I think they say that anyway.

I would keep looking--unless you are so die-hard set on the 2+ ctw then you may sacrifice cut for the ctw. $18k will get you around a 1.8-1.9 excellently cut stone online, definitely nowhere near the 2.66c that this stone is.

Depends on what your priorities are. Do you want an excellently cut stone that will look bigger than it is and shine from across the room, or a larger stone that may not be as sparkly or brilliant, but has size on it's side?

Personally I'd take the excellently cut 1.9c stone over a 2.66c average cut anyday!!
But that's just me.

Lastly as the others noted..EGL can sometimes be lax on grading. I would be sure to check the SI1 grading on this stone. If it's EGL it may be an SI2 and that may be tricky on a stone as large as this. When you pass the 2c mark you start to see inclusions that would be less visible in a smaller stone. If it's an EGL USA stone it maybe okay....but get it checked out IF you decide to buy it!!

Good luck!!
 

guslik

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Sep 27, 2002
Messages
115
Hi manechka!
I really like you name
where did you get it from?

As far as diamond, I think if you have a chance to see this stone in person, it might help you with your decision. After all, your own eyes are better judge than any numbers.
Good luck!
 

Richard Sherwood

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 25, 2002
Messages
4,924
17 grand is an EXCELLENT price for the stone if it is truly an E/SI1, or even an F/SI1.

If the stone happens to be an SI2, then the price is just "okay". Not a "deal", but not a rip-off.

The cut is not ideal, but probably good to very good.

If you like it, tell him you'll buy it contingent upon the grading checking out. If you really want an ironclad grade, have it sent to the GIA or AGS, and tell him you'll pay the price of the cert if it checks out, otherwise he eats it. You could also use an independent appraiser, but make sure he's good. This is a critical grading decision.

If the stone comes out with an SI2, and you still like it, tell him you're still interested if you can get the percentage discount that Rapaport shows between an SI1 and an SI2.
 

manechka

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2002
Messages
30
Hi There,

That is my nickname, short for my real name. Anyway, I seen the stone yesterday in day light, it is a most beautiful, gorgeious, sparkling piece. Now, the main question is how do I get it independently appraised. Any recommendations in downtown San Francisco?
 

manechka

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2002
Messages
30
Hi there, Thanks for your comments.
Can you recommend any good independent appraisal in San Francisco area who could check out the stone and reconfirm what it says on EGL certificate?
 

manechka

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2002
Messages
30
Thanks for running this report. What does 4.2 represents? Which scale it is measure on or where can I get the post of equations to calculate angle degrees from %'s

Thanks a lot
 

Mara

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2002
Messages
31,003
The 'cut advisor' link at the top of this page will let you plug in your #s to get a return on the HCA. PQ mentioned your stone is around 4. That is on a scale of 10. Under 2 is excellent.

In SF...there was one independent appraiser that my appraiser recommended. I don't know their name. Try emailing [email protected] who is our appraiser (she is in Walnut Creek...and is very good!) and ask her if she has a recommendation for an independent appraiser in SF. I think she told me that there was one she thought was very good. Or if you don't mind taking a little drive, take it to Nancy in Walnut Creek. She is listed on the 'appraisers' tab at the top of this page as well.

Good luck!!
 

manechka

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2002
Messages
30
Thank you all for your suggestions. I didn't get a chance to talk to Nancy so we went to 2 independent appraisal in San Francisco that we could find and both confirmed the stone to be E color and SI1 quality. Both said that stone was very beautiful and if we got it for $17,300 it would be 35% off Rappaport. The final price was $17K which is 38% off Rappaport. The stone is beautiful now we are in search for the setting. Thanks a lot to all of you.

weight: 2.66 ct
shape and cut: round brilliant cut
measurements: 9.00 x 8.93 x 5.45 mm
proportions: very good
depth %: 60.7
table diameter %: 59
crown height: 14%
pavilion depth: 44%
girdle thickness: thin faceted
Finish grade: Good
Purity (clarity grade (10 x loupe magnification): SI1
Color Grade: E
Photoluminescence: none
Comments: None
 

Mara

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2002
Messages
31,003
Congrats! If you decide you want a real workup on the stone, give Nancy a ring or ask the independent appraisers to do a workup.
It's always fun to see the nitty gritty on your stone in black and white.

Post pix when you have the final product!
 
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