Need advice...problem with BF..

[Mandarine]

ETA: Problem is with Best Friend, not Boyfriend!...oops

After my BF's failed attempt to give me the advice I'm looking for I decided to turn to the place that "knows best"...hehe

No offense to BF, he did try...but this is more a question for girls.

So here is the history. I've known my BF since we were 12. We are best friends and pretty much talk on the phone every single day. In many ways I wonder if we would still be friends if we met today....probably not, but now she's more like a sister. A little sister. Our relationship now is more of a support system for her...and I love to be there for her...I know if I truly needed her she would be there for me too, but it's just always about her. I don't mind since I don't like to talk about my problems every single day....specially work-related problems...I leave those at the office!...she needs to discuss every single detail....it gets annoying, but like I said, we're more like sisters.

We've had a few fights were this has come out...how I think she's selfish at times, etc.

Anyway....so she lives in the same state my sister lives. I went there last year to go skiing and she didn't make an effort at all to come see me (because she was with her BF). I got annoyed...we had a fight, and that was that.

Now I'm planning a trip there (alone)...pretty much to go see my girls (my little sister and her), relax, talk, etc. When my friend came to Florida a while back I pretty much told my BF "see you next weekend, this weekend it's a girls' weekend. My friend didn't need to ask me to do this, but I knew if she was coming to see me that her idea of that was not spending it with me and my BF.

Now that I'm going she has already suggested TWICE that we spend the weekend with her BF. The first time I was much sweeter and explained that although I did want to meet him (not really...I don't care much for him for stuff he has done to her), but I know it's important for her...so I said I would want to meet him, just not spend the entire weekend with him. Then today she calls me and tells me she was thinking we could go to this place that is like 2-hours away from my sister's house and spend the day there...and that her BF could come over and take us. Mind you she has a car and so does my sister...we don' really need a ride if we want to go anywhere. I got annoyed because it puts me in an uncomfortable situation to say again "I don't want to spend the entire day with him"....but I say it....because it's my vacation and because I had said I wanted to be with the girls!. If she doesn't want to or can't separate from him for a day, that's fine...it would hurt me, but if all she wants is to stop by quickly and say hello that is ok. I don't think she should push to spend the weekend with her BF and then act mad and pissed at me when I said I don't want to.

So I sent her an e-mail but know she won't get to it until tonight...so I sent her a text and just said that I thought it was unfair for her to get mad at me and put me in a situation where I have to tell her again, for the second time, the same thing...I told her that's not what I did when we came to visit me (even though I only see my BF on the weekends). So she responds that I don't want to spend with her because otherwise I would at her house and not my sister's house (what?? I don't get that at all)...and then says that if I decided to not see my BF when she came was because I wanted to, not because she asked me. I just replied that I agree is not something you want to ask someone....it's just nice if it comes out naturally and she were just to say "dear BF, I love you...but I'm going to spend time with my friend this weekend". I am 100% sure he wouldn't have a problem with that...and if he did then that's a whole other issue!

Am I being completely crazy?. It's not like we're married and have no option but for the DH's to be there. I'm really not trying to be selfish....but now I'm just so annoyed by her attitude that I really don't even know if I want to see her. I know that just sounds really childish, but I'm just mad. I wanted to spend time with them, go for hikes, talk, maybe go out one night and do a little dancing, stay up talking, relax, cook, etc.....I know that's my idea of MY vacation and she doesn't have to do it, but don't make me feel bad for wanting that...right?. Now I know what will happen is that she will come, be pissed, and then I would feel like forced her to do this...and then I will feel bad because she will act like "happy now?". I want to get some resolution to this before I go there tomorrow. This was supposed to be about relaxing...not all this drama!

It just seems like this friendship is always about her and her problems...

I feel like I'm 12!

M~

 

[zdrastvootya]

Alright. Often lurking, but let me blab.

(This goes back to my theory that the definition for "friend" is different for boys and girls.)

My point of view is that you need to get something positive out of a friendship. There should be a net gain. Sometimes we give more than we get, but overall we get something out of it that keeps us going. (I''m not talking material things here. Fun, trust, support, honesty, someone who''s nice to talk to.) The other person should feel this way also. (That''s what makes friendship special. It''s not a zero sum game.) If it feels like work, maybe a friendship should be allowed to fade into a more distant relationship.

jm2c.

Z.

 

[KimberlyH]

Mandarine,

You are not being crazy or unreasonable at all, so stop feeling that way. I think it would be best, if you want to maintain the friendship, to compromise with your friend and have dinner with the boyfriend or something but then draw the line at that point. But it sounds like she''s not the greatest friend in the world so perhaps giving in to her isn''t the best of ideas.

When I first moved from Northern CA to Southern CA to be close to my now husband two of my girlfriends came to visit. I was totally unfamiliar with my new home (San Diego) and so my then boyfriend, now hubby, tagged along on some of our outtings so that we didn''t spend the whole time lost. He went to dinner with us one night and drove my friends back to the airport with me so that I didn''t have to drive home alone as he knew I''d be sad that they were leaving. But the rest of the time it was just girls time. One of my friends was annoyed that he came along at all, which was a bit silly to me as he was and is a huge part of my life and I wanted them to get to know each other and we spent 85% of the time they were here without him.

Point being totally excluding him might not be the best choice but he doesn''t need to spend every minute with you guys either. Different people have different relationships. The friend who was upset and her boyfriend had a schedule of when they saw each other (Mon, Wed, Sat, Sun) and did not speak to one another in the interim unless there was an emergency or something of urgency came up. My hubby and I on the other hand have spoken every day since the day we met and have seen each other every day since I moved to SD. Just keep in mind that not everyone''s relationship works like yours.

I hope you guys work this out amicably. Then again, it sounds like she is a bit of a PITA and drain on you, so is it worth all the struggle and arguing?

 

[Mandarine]

you are so right....and I''ve thought about this and just thinking about it hurts me...it really is like she''s family to me.

But I don''t really get anything positive out of this friendship when I think about it seriously.

I feel terrible...she left me a voicemail that made me mad...so then I called her back and told her to pretty much what I thought.

I know this might just all sound so silly....but she''s been my friend for 17 years!...and I guess that''s what makes me mad. To feel like I''m going there and she can''t, for this one weekend, just be there. To feel like I have to ask her to want to do this...I don''t want to have to ask her. I think it would be clear by now that I''m only going for a few days that I don''t want to spend it revolving around her life (she wanted me to come see the new apartment she rented, meet her ex-roommate, meet her boyfriend, go see where she works at, etc). I know these are all important things for her....and I didn''t try to be rude. I said on Sunday we could drive back to her twon, maybe have dinner with her BF and then I could see her place and go back to my sister''s.

You''re so right that it may be time to reconsider this friendship....

 

[Becky P]

Well, I agree that when you travel somewhere to see someone, it''s annoying if they won''t meet you halfway. When I drive over to Michigan to see my family, I just expect that my friends will drive the 20-30 minutes to meet me for dinner. If they really want to see me, then they will. I''ve already spent 6-7 hours in a car, the least they can do is drive a few minutes down the road. And, I''ve found that the people who are true friends will drive over. Other friends have quietly slipped into the past because they are unwilling to make any effort. A friend who doesn''t make any effort in the relationship is not really a friend, she is a parasite. For me, I just recognize that some people are true friends and some aren''t. The ones who aren''t will quietly drift away.

In your situation, I think you two are fighting because you still genuinely care about each other and want to continue this friendship. If you care enough to fight, then she is truly important. It sounds, though, that you are trying to dictate how the weekend goes, which is fine, since it''s your vacation. But, you said that you knew she spends tons of time with her boyfriend - she didn''t even make an effort to see you the last time that you were there. So, you knew going into this that she would want to be with her boyfriend 100% of the time.

I think that the easiest way to keep peace is to say this is my plan... do you and bf want to meet for dinner this night? or whatever. Realize that her bf comes with her, they are a package deal - it does not sound like you will be getting to see her alone for any of this trip. And, by expecting to see her alone, you are setting yourself up for problems. Invite her (knowing that her bf will be coming along) to any of the things that you plan on doing where it would be alright with you to have them both along. And, other than that, spend time with your sister and enjoy her company. The bottom line is that you will not be seeing your friend at all without her bf. Although it''s sad that she can''t separate for a little bit, it''s her problem, not yours. Forcing her to leave him behind will only drive a wedge between you two and most surely end this friendship.

"You can only control yourself"

 

[Mandarine]

Becky you''re right that I can only control myself.

I had made my plans clear to her twice before. I guess her and I differ in that I don''t believe in putting your friends on the side just because you''re dating someone. I think a healthy relationship involves spending time with others (I think most of you agree with this). I think she would probably agree to (technically, but not in practice).

I understand that me meeting her BF is important to her....that''s why I had suggested that Sunday night we spent it with him. Did I wnat to do this? No, but she''s my friend and I knew it was important to her...so I suggested that.

Now we left ecah other some not nice voicemails but I told her I was done fighting about this...she could decide what she wanted to do and I wasn''t going to let this ruin my vacation. She sent me a text saying she didn''t wnat to fight, that she wanted to spend time with me, that I didn''t have to meet her BF and she "would talk to him to explain the situation".

So now it just feels like she''s trying to turn this around on what a bad friend I am....to make me feel somehow guilty. I won''t. I had nicely suggested to have dinner with him Sunday (as my idea)...not because I had to meet him. What situation is she explaining to him?

She just drains me. I was just talking to another friend that has also been our friend since we were 12...she says that for the last couple of years she has noticed how my relationship with my BF drains me...because it''s all about her. It''s not about respecting who each other is, but getting her way or being mad if she doesn''t get it.

I don''t know how I''m going to handle this now, but I won''t let this cloud the time with my sister and my time to relax after I''ve had some rough months at work....

M~

 

[~*Alexis*~]

This girl is what people call toxic friends. These are the types of people that take and take and take and never give anything back but grief. She needs to not be self centered and focus on the fact that you are driving their for a ''girls weekend''. Not a lets hang out and make me a third wheel weekend. I would hate to say it, but you need to cut the strings and let the friendship go. It is not worth the hassel or the bleeding ears.

 

[Becky P]

Date: 10/11/2006 1:45:25 PM
Author: Mandarine
I guess her and I differ in that I don''t believe in putting your friends on the side just because you''re dating someone. I think a healthy relationship involves spending time with others (I think most of you agree with this). I think she would probably agree to (technically, but not in practice).

Oooh yes! I totally agree with you 100%! But, we all have those friends who believe in that - until they get a boyfriend that is.

Date: 10/11/2006 1:45:25 PM
Author: Mandarine
I had nicely suggested to have dinner with him Sunday (as my idea)...not because I had to meet him. What situation is she explaining to him?

Maybe reiterate your desire to have dinner with both of them on Sunday. Who knows what she''ll say to him... Women sure can be hard to deal with - our poor boyfriends and all they have to put up with!

If you need to let her go, then let her go... It sounds like you will be better off without a "friend" who stresses you out this much. Have a GREAT vacation!

 

[Mandarine]

Well....we stopped playing phone tag and finally spoke on the phone....

I said to myself I would stop feeling guilty or bad and just tell her how I felt.

She was just saying how this is all about me and how I want to spend my vacation but I haven''t for once asked her what she wants and she was just looking for a way to do something with her BF.....and he was the one that had suggested so nicely that we spent the weekend together. I said I did appreciate that, but this was the third time I had to tell her what my plans were and how I would like to meet him maybe Sunday but I wanted to spend the weekend with my sister and her (if she wanted to tag along).

I told her that by her syaing "I was just looking for a way to do someting with my BF"....That''s fine, then she shoudl go ahead and do that. I''m not saying she can''t...I''m just saying I don''t want to. Her only priority is her BF (who has treated her like S#it so many times)....and I have to respect that (not agree with it, but respect it). So if that is what she wanted to do she should go ahead and do it. I told her she knew what my plans were and I would be happy to have her join us, but I wasn''t changing my plans.

She went on to say how then she needs to understand that I just don''t care at all about her life and what is important to her, etc etc. I told her that wasn''t the case and I wasn''t going to start playing this "you said" ,"I said" game. I had suggested to hang out with him on Sunday. She also said not to worry because I didn''t have to meet him and she didn''t want me to meet him now anyway....I know, what are? 15??. I told her this was childish and unfair...

It was just a conversation that wasn''t taking us anywhere because she said she was offended and hurt by my reaction...but that she wanted to come to see me anyway. I honestly don''t want her to come...I can just see "drama" written all over this and that just doesn''t sound like a nice and positive weekend.

In any case. I did say something that I feel and hope she might have listened to. I said a friendship is about two people...and that two people should be getting something positive out of the friendship...otherwise...what is the point?. I told her that the fact that we have been friends for 17 years is not good enough reason to remain friends.

I don''t think she got it...or maybe she did but chose to ignore it. I''m not sure. She''s too busy blaming me, thinking I''m rude, evil and selfish and she''s just playing the victim card now....

I know I need to let this go and not let it bother me now....but it''s hard...specially because now she insists on coming anyway.

M~

 

[phoenixgirl]

Well, it sounds like this friendship isn''t really a two-way street. That doesn''t mean there isn''t anything to hold on to, but I don''t think a person like that can really be anybody''s "best" friend.

I had a friend not make an effort to see me once, and that was the end of our friendship. She was my best friend in high school, and after college she actually drove an hour to my shore house where another friend of ours, Joanna, was staying to go get coffee or something with Joanna (they had become much closer in college, whereas my friend and I were basically just emailing at this point), and she didn''t come up to say hello to me. How rude is that??? I told her I was upset about it, and she gave me some BS about how she thought Joanna wanted to leave right away. Well, she dropped her off too, she could have come up then instead! After that I never made any effort to keep in touch with her.

I''ve also had a friend who went on and on about the minutia of her life. She teaches elementary school in a nice area, and I teach high school in a rough area. I have 100+ students every year, so there are always a few bad apples. But she would go on and on about her one problem student, who never seemed to do much more than be unable to pay attention. Maybe it was because we were brand new teachers, I don''t know. I used to tell my husband about every little thing at work, and now I find that I have fewer grievances to share and less of a need to share the ones I do have. But I just couldn''t put the energy into being a good listener after a hard day''s work. It was so draining that I would lose the desire to tell her anything about myself and just go, "Uh huh . . . uh huh . . . No!!!" for the whole conversation.

It''s ok to have conflict or misunderstandings, but the key is how the person reacts. The first time you told her about her boyfriend should have been enough, even if she didn''t agree. Another friend of mine got married this summer, and her best friend from high school planned the bachelorette party to be two hours away at the beach. This is where the other best friend of this bridesmaid happened to live, so she asked my friend if her other BF could come along . . . but she and my friend aren''t friends. The party was just bridesmaids and me, so I don''t really know why she thought that was a good idea, but at least when my friend told her no she took it in stride. You shouldn''t have to have fight after fight for your friend to honor your wishes during *your* visit.

 

[akw94]

Mandarine,
Sorry you're going through this. I've had a fairly similar experience w/a friend. I know that figuring out if the friendship is worth continuing can be very painful. It definitely was for me. I have had a particular friend since high school. We have gone through periods (mainly college) where we don't talk all that often but still keep in touch. I've always considered her a best friend. For a long time, I have felt our friendship was more about her. She no longer lives in the same state so she came home for a visit once and sent a group email saying she wanted to get together and she doesn't have time to see everyone so maybe we can have one big thing for her. I was very offended. Very! We didn't end up seeing each other that trip b/c I made no effort. I was so hurt and just felt that too often, our friendship is about what she wants, her problems, her stories and no real effort made into me or my life. We are at different places in our lives but I always make an effort w/her. I thought long and hard about just ending our friendship after that. It wasn't only that one thing but a multitude of things. I finally decided that I do want her friendship. The time that we've been friends (17years too) was just too long to throw away. And actually, since that time, I've seen her make more of an effort to ask about me. I just try to remember who she is and have decided to accept that. I know that when she is overwhelmed or in a new experience, she only focuses on her. That passes and she adjusts back to normal life. When I realized that I just couldn't imagine my life w/o her or not having her at my wedding, I knew her friendship was truly too important to me to give up.
So, that is not to say my advice would be to stay friends w/your bf. I would say that you really have to think about what you want and will get from her. I think it's great you tried to talk to her, but unfortunately, it didn't seem that effective. You can't change her. No matter what. You can ask that she think more about you, but you can't make her do that. You have to decide what you are willing to accept in your life and if you want her as part of it.
I hope the trip turns out ok. If you decide to stay friends, I would try to focus on the positive of your friendship. What has held you two together for this long. It's probably more than just the time if you've lasted 17yrs. I know that when I went to see my friend fairly recently, that visit helped me a lot. We got to just hang out and it helped remind me of what I cherish in her.

 

[Mandarine]

Thank you girls

I loved reading all your stories because it makes me feel like I''m not that sillly for letting this get to me. It does hurt...like I said she''s like a "little" sister. She''s very immature and childish, but I truly do care about her.

This is not the first time I''ve told her how I feel....she''s made efforts in the past and then goes back to her ways. She will probably do that this weekend...although I do wish she wouldn''t come because I''m hurt and mad and I know it will come out at some point.

I''m not about to just never talk to her again....but I do think I need to separate myself a little from her. It''s just too much wasted energy to get nothing positive in return and it has been like this for the past two years. We''ve been friends for so long because we have always been there for each other and just make each other laugh out loud...I don''t laugh that hard with anyone else (other than my sisters!). Things have changed and she has changed and I guess I have changed too. I''d like to think that I''ve grown and have learned to appreciate friendships and family more and more everyday. She seems to have gone back to her younger 20s. She never did have a serious boyfriend until recently and I think that explains her actions. She had dreams about doing her masters and working at a huge recognized company....now her biggest dream is to be a secretary (no offense to any secretaries!) but that wasn''t what she dreamt about.

It hurts to see her have so little ambition for her life and career and that her whole world revolves around her BF. Don''t get me wrong, I really have nothing against him (even though he''s been an @ss at times)...but I also know how she can get so I don''t really have any pre-formed perceptions about the kind of guy he is. Maybe she''s living now what I lived when I was 20 or so and maybe that''s why I can''t understand or relate...

That''s why I think it''s better for me to stop putting so much energy into this relationship....I''m not throwing it away because I know if she needed me I would still be there for her....but this day to day nagging and complaining and blaming everyone but herslef about where she is in her life is just getting old. She needs to take responsiblity for her life and the world around her. The only way we could remain good friends as things are right now is if I just become a HUGE ear with little arms and little legs (no mouth because she doesn''t really want an opnion)...and that''s just not going to work for me....hehe I can actually picture the huge ear walking around...haha.

So...I leave in a couple of hours but I wanted to thank you for your advice and your stories!

I can''t wait to see my little sister and spoil her a little bit!...little, well...she''s 22 and I''m 29, but she''ll always be my little sister and I love being able to "spoil" her a bit since she''s in college and broke!. She''s very excited about me coming and has all these hikes planned out! (I love hiking!) and she knows I love to cook so she already told her roommates they''ll be having a nice dinner tonight!

Thanks girls!

M~

 

[Becky P]

Hey, hope you have a great trip! Enjoy yourself and relax! That''s what vacations are for...