My Mothers "Emerald" Ring is a Fake?

[TooMuchInformation]

So, here''s the more detailed version of my earlier post about an "Emerald" ring that my mother has. I''m fairly sure that it was purchased by my father somewhere in Equador - he works overseas, and very likely from a less than reputable dealer.

Anyways, I''m having a close look at this ring (because I''m now at the point where I need to look at any peice of jewelry that I see with the loupe), and something strikes me as odd, but I can''t place it. I washed the ring in hot water with a toothbrush, and brought it back to the loupe.

I almost died. What was previously a deep green now shows many areas of VERY dull green to the point of white/transparent; perhaps similar to glass. Intruiged, but a little frightened that I might have damaged the stone, I continued to look at it with the loupe for about 10 minutes. What I saw was VERY interesting - it looked like a doublet/triplet (thanks for the reminder on this term mogok)!

- When viewed from the top/table, it looked like a diamond through a green ideal-scope showing a LOT of leakage (sorry for this crazy analogy), this was after washing the stone, and as it dried, this effect seemed to lessen somewhat, though never appearing to go away completely.
- The only visible inclusions were at the surface level; before the girdle. The bottom of the stone (girdle down) seemed fairly clean, though the view was cramped.
- When viewed from below, the cut was stange; the culet was totally off center, and it appeared VERY white/transparent, as if it was simply made of glass at the bottom.
- The girdle area had a visible line (I''m almost positive that it wasn''t a facet edge) all the way around it, as if there was a "seam" there. It even seemed to be uneven, though the line was perfectly straight.
- I can''t remember what the major area of inclusion looked like; I was too focued on the other tidbits.
- I have no idea what was paid for this item, but typically, my father seems to get items for a fairly inexpensive price in columbia/equador, and they''re appraised at much higher values.

That''s all I can recall at the moment, and although I hate to say it, I have NO experience doing this and might just be way out to lunch, but I feel as though so many signs adding up, there is NO way that I could have made this all up.

Unfortunatly, I have about 8 hours of loupe experience, and I''ve *NEVER* seen an emerald before. I''m describing things the best that I can, though I do at least feel comfortable enough with the loupe to relay some of the important facts of my brief but possibly informative analysis.

The strange part to all of this? My mother had this appraised at a local B&M, who shuffles off their appraisals to a contractor. He''s a certified GG, and has 20 years experience. It need not be said that the gentleman who wrote the appraisal knows a heck of a lot more about this stuff than I do. Though, there were a few things off with his appraisal: the document was for a ring and two other items, but the appraisal value was the TOTAL value for all two or three items. There was NO breakdown. The listing for the ring in question was (verbatum) the following text:

1 X 1.25 ct Rectangular Emerald / Trap Cut Emerald, Colour Bright Green/Good, Clarity Medium. The stone measure approx. 7.22mm X 5.81mm X 4.53mm.

At first, I had thought that "Trap Cut" might have implied this trickery, but as far as I can tell, it simply refers to a "Step Cut", similar to what you see with a typical emerald cut.

Thoughts?

I''m DYING to know more about this issue, and ultimately hope to get the ring appraised again by another GG, but I don''t know if I have the heart to tell this to my parents.

Sorry for another long winded email.

 

[strmrdr]

hmmm is emerald subject to zoning?
I was looking at a unknown to me gemstone the other day that was very light blue from the top but the almost clear from the side except for a small zone of blue color.
I have no idea which gem it was and the owner didnt know either it was a garage sale find.

 

[TooMuchInformation]

A few interesting notes from one of my books:

"The color distribution is often irregular" [1] (though I don't know how to take that)

"Often the emerald is clouded by inclusions. These are not necessarily classified as faults, but are evidence as to the genuineness of the stone as compared with synthetic and other imitations." [1] (Which I recalled reading, and found to be strange given the apparent "clarity" of the lower half of the stone.)

[1] Gemstones of the World Revised & Expanded Edition, Walter Schumann

 

[TooMuchInformation]

Perhaps even more interesting (as this would be my assumption of what I saw, though HORRIBLY uneducated):

"We've also seen true-emerald-doublets made from a peice of overly dark green emerald glued to a peice of pale or colorless beryl to create a larger "emerald"." [1]

[1] Gem Identification Made Easy, Antoinette L. Matlins & A.C. Bonanno

Man I wish one of the appraisers that hung around here lived by my place!

 

[mogok]

Hello Toomuchinformation...
I've post a reply already on your other post before to read this one.

----------------
On 1/24/2004 1:43:56 AM TooMuchInformation wrote:



I washed the ring in hot water with a toothbrush, and brought it back to the loupe.
I almost died. What was previously a deep green now shows many areas of VERY dull green to the point of white/transparent; perhaps similar to glass. Intruiged, but a little frightened that I might have damaged the stone, I continued to look at it with the loupe for about 10 minutes. What I saw was VERY interesting - it looked like a doublet/triplet (thanks for the reminder on this term mogok)!----------------

What you say here is very interesting! I told you to put your stone in a liquid and look at it... This is what you did and you tell me that the stone nearly vanished... That sound like a triplet stone.
I explain again: Usualy in this kind of stones both the top and the pavillons are cheap cololess or near colorless stones that can be natural or no. Its possible that the top of your stone is a colorless natural beryl with typical natural inclusions... These stones are very tricky if you dont do the immersion test!
Now the cement between the 2 part of the stone holds the color so when you put the ston in the water or if you cover it with transparent oil: The stone looks like to disapear. The reason is that the difference of refractive index between the stone and the air is very high if you cover the stone with oil or water and look at it before it to dry than you can see inside much better as the light will go more easy from air to oil and the from oil to stone than from air to stone...

Well at this pointI would like to advise you to go back to see this G.G. and ask him what he is meaning by "trap-emerald". Then show him the stone again and tell him about your doubts and your observations.
Everybody can make mistakes even a good professionnal. If he is a good professional then he will find a nice repair his possible mistake or he will help your understand your mistake...

Whatever this story will make you learn a lot, and if the stone was cheap so its just great!

All the best,

 

[TooMuchInformation]

Yeah, this is quite a tale! It's been pretty exciting, and the only bad thing about the whole thing is my parents feelings! I'm not sure if I can tell my mother and father that they should get a second opinion or allow me to chat with the GG that did the appraisal - as weird as this might sound, I don't want any feelings to be hurt!

Oh, and just to clarify, I didn't "submerge" the ring in water and look at it (in fact, I didn't even know this was beneficial to look at stones); I simply washed the stone in water and took it out right away. I only saw the "transparency" in the bottom part of the stone after I cleaned some of the "junk" off of the bottom that was bothering me during my initial analysis!

And thanks again for all your help and responses! This is fun stuff - especially when the jewelry isn't yours

 

[valeria101]

The story is interesting (just your piece of evidence about buying jewelry in random places). But if my opinion matters, don't tell them. A good emerald would not be either easy found or inexpensive. Few are as focused on gems as you (or I) so... I would not.

 

[TooMuchInformation]

The appraisal came in at somewhere around $3,500 CDN (though this was the cumulative value for two items). I chatted with my fiance about this issue on the way home from their place, and although she's a little skeptical of my abilities (and rightfully so), we did come to the conclusion that it would be a bad thing to tell them (even though I blurted some of it out while we were there, and then took it back later, blaming it on my inexperience). I'm so interested to know just to validate my own inexperienced opinion.

As another note, however, my dad purchases jewelry from South America on a regular basis, so I had wondered if telling him of the dupe (if indeed it's real) would be a good thing, just to make him a little more careful next time (though there wouldn't be much that he could do). I'll try to find out what he paid for that ring.

My mother, on the other hand, gets her feelings hurt VERY easily, and when I had originally discussed my concerns with the ring, she seemed a little insulted with my claim, and refused to believe that the appraisal that was done on it could be incorrect. Can't say I blame her, because I don't have an idea what I'm doing yet - just going on books I've read and what I saw.

 

[valeria101]

I would be hurt too... and a 1.5 or so emerald with good looks would be more than that whole appraisal value, without overdoing it. No use to insist, I guess. There's plenty of fake jewelry in my family and I learned my lesson to keep quiet about the nature and/or quality of the pieces at any time aside when I see someone geting seriously cheated. If whatever item is priced accordingly it does not seem wrong at all. And pointing out the wrongdoing after, it makes little sense. Few would pay atention anyway.

 

[TooMuchInformation]

Well, *that's* certainly good to know. I have no idea what quality the emerald portion of the stone itself is, but I do find it VERY strange that the appraiser wouldn't make specific note of it being a dublet on his papers.

I've looked at about 10 diamond rings so far, and I've seen some very included stones. I have been really viligant in talking kindly of everyones diamonds, regardless of their quality, and simply looking to see what I can see, though after seeing this "fake", I had concerns for any future purchases that my father might make. However, if they were very happy with the appraisal, and the value given in the appraisal seems as though it could be accurate, than I have no issue whatsoever.

So, what type of price would one expect for an emerald of 1.25 of varying quality, and where can one get their hands on a *rough* price guide for stones? Hrm. This reminds me of another question that I need to ask on Rocky Talky about Rapport values, but I'll save that for another time!

Thanks again for your feedback!

 

[pqcollectibles]

I love Emeralds. I spent some time learning a thing or 2 about them. Emeralds are relatively fragile and tend to dry out making them even more fragile. I learned you need to oil Emeralds periodically.

Even though you suspect this may not be a true Emerald, you may want to gently rub or brush the stone with some Cedar Oil. Cedar Oil can be bought at Home Depot, craft stores, and the like. It has a nearly identical refractive index as Emeralds do. Don't wipe the oil off. Let the stone soak in the oil for a while.

I usually just put my Emeralds in a ziplock baggie and let them set for several days or a week. Then I clean the jewelry well by soaking in lukewarm water with a drop of Dawn added. I use a soft brush to clean any remaining oil residue off the rest of the jewelry. Then I just buff the emerald lightly to restore the sheen to the stone.

 

[strmrdr]

just an fyi Rapport gets asked about once a week or better do a search and you will find a ton of posts on it....

 

[mike04456]

----------------
On 1/24/2004 1:43:56 AM TooMuchInformation wrote:











Unfortunatly, I have about 8 hours of loupe experience, and I've *NEVER* seen an emerald before.

----------------

TMI, you probably won't like this answer, but my suggestion is that you trust the appraisal. Believe me when I say you have to look at a lot of different stones, under a lot of different conditions, all of it under expert instruction, before you can begin to make conclusions about what you're seeing. I find it very hard to believe that a GG appraiser with 20 years experience would make that kind of mistake. One of the things they teach you in the GG courses is how to spot doublets, and it is not difficult if you know what you're doing. Eight hours with a loupe on your own isn't anything close to sufficient experience. I can remember a number of times during my GG lab classes that I thought I was seeing a doublet--was convinced that I saw the joint, and this under 60x magnification--only to be told by my instructor that it was, indeed, only the facet edge. It's also not unusual for emeralds to have color zoning. If the appraiser says it's an emerald, I would trust that.

 

[mogok]

Hello,
Well LawGem I agree somewhere with you, thats why I advised toomuchinformation to go to see again his appraisal.
Its hard to believe that a GG with 20 years of experience missed a doublet as it was the first thing we were teached to look at during the gem identification class... But a doublet is really the stupid stone that you can miss after 20 years if, for I dont know which reason, you forget to look through the girdle...
Whatever, that the reason it would be nice to show this ring again to a lab or somebody with experience and training and to explain him your doubts about the doublet possibility.
This is the only way I see to close this case.

Anyway, as one of my teacher in university told me: "To advance in knowledge, you dont have to find the good answers, you have to find the good questions..."

 

[AGBF]

----------------
On 1/25/2004 1:40:51 AM pqcollectibles wrote:

I love Emeralds. I spent some time learning a thing or 2 about them. Emeralds are relatively fragile and tend to dry out making them even more fragile. I learned you need to oil Emeralds periodically.

I knew they were easily (and, thus, usually) included, but I didn't know about *DRY*!!! I knew that *OPALS* dried out and sometimes needed rehydration! (I own some emeralds I bought in Colombia, but they are not the rich, deep green color of fine emeralds.)

 

[mogok]

----------------
On 1/25/2004 8:09:22 PM AGBF wrote:

----------------
On 1/25/2004 1:40:51 AM pqcollectibles wrote:

I love Emeralds. I spent some time learning a thing or 2 about them. Emeralds are relatively fragile and tend to dry out making them even more fragile. I learned you need to oil Emeralds periodically.

I knew they were easily (and, thus, usually) included, but I didn't know about *DRY*!!! I knew that *OPALS* dried out and sometimes needed rehydration!


----------------

Hello,
Pqcollectible is right and wrong: Emeralds dont need to be oiled except... if they were oiled before!

In this case he is perfectly right: Some care have to be given from time to time to oiled emerald or to filled emeralds (It means that instead to have put some oil inside to conceal cracks and/or to improve the color somebody have put inside some polymer as the famous "opticon")
These oiled emerald have to be protected from too dry conditions (Strong Air con, desertic climate or dry cold climate is not that good) from heat, from acids, from steam, from detergeants, ultrasonic cleaners, solvants...)
For example: Heat will make the oil expand and possibly leave the stone, when the stone will cool down it will retract and so some areas will not be oiled anymore. As a result the clarity and the color of the oiled emerald may suffer.
Secondly oil and polymer inside the stone are not stable for centuries, they are in the contact with air and will get old and usually dry. If you want them to dry slowly you have to do your best for this stone to stay most of the time in conditions with enough humidity.
You may have also to oil again your stones from time to time. But whatever you stone will possibly slowly change. Thats the big problem with this stone that has hurt so badly the emerald market. Dry oil can turn to dirty blackish thing that is very difficult to impossible to remove... Depending of the nature of the oil used, the conditions in which you emerald will "breath", the care you will give to it... It can take few months to few tens of years for your stone to "get old"...

Now if your emerald was not oiled, so its Ok your stone you will be able to enjoy it for years without problem and a minimum care as emeralds are "pretty sweet little gems".

Hoping to have clarify this point,
All the best

 

[pqcollectibles]

Thanks for the info, Mogok!

To the best of my knowledge, the Emeralds I own were not oil treated prior to when I purchased. Since I was fascinated with Emeralds, I did a little research and studying. You know what they say about a little knowledge,.....

I read that Emeralds could become dry over time. That oiling with Cedar Oil (due to the refractive index) would combat the drying process. The book I have recommended just applying a thin coat of oil and leaving it. I couldn't stand the thought of a layer of oil on my stones. It would get greasy and gunky and yuck with collected dirt over time. Not to mention, my Emeralds are all mounted in jewelry with diamonds. So I modified the procedure somewhat when I oiled mine. I've only oiled my Emeralds 2, maybe 3 times in 25 years.

 

[AGBF]

----------------
On 1/25/2004 9:50:39 PM pqcollectibles wrote:

Thanks for the info, Mogok!


To the best of my knowledge, the Emeralds I own were not oil treated prior to when I purchased.

PQ,

*I* have read that almost *ALL* emeralds are oiled...right in the mine or immediately afterward! Now I realize that *I* have only a little bit of knowledge, but if that is the only test of whether an emerald needs oil, I suspect all of 'em do!!!

I await mogok's opinion...and Lawgem's, of course!

 

[TooMuchInformation]

LawGem,

Thank you very much for your opinion. To be honest, I do like your response, and perhaps find it the most logical explanation of this situation that I have received thus far. I look forward to finding out more about the stone.

 

[mogok]

Hello all of you,

Well about oil in emeralds, Its not true that all the emeralds are oiled. Most of them are oiled that's for sure as fissures are very common in emeralds.
When an emerald does not present any fissure or just minor ones, there is absolutly no reason to oil it! Oil does not improve anything in emerald except its apparent beauty as its hiding some cracks that can disturb the light passing within the stone.

It happen from time to time that we meet in AIGS gemological laboratory in Bangkok some emerald that were not oiled.

If you are willing to read I will explain the problematic of such treatment:
Oiling emeralds with volatile oils or natural resins is something performed for centuries to enhance the clarity of stones with fissures (In order the make the stone more beautiful of course). It is a generally accepted practice as long as the filler is not colored. The remaining problem with this treatment is that compared to heat treatment in sapphire and ruby: It is not permanent. I explain: When a cracked ruby is heated with fluxes, it will result a "fracture filled" ruby. It mean that a foreign substance that is usually a glass have cealed the fissure. This treatment has the advantage to be both permanent and to improve the durability of the stone because the cracks are now glues by the glass. This treatment is commonly performed on rubies from Mongshu and some other localities in order to make the rough suitable for cutting.

Clarity enhancement in emeralds just hide the fissures and cracks. It does not close them. It is in this aspect that this is a problem: This practice hide the fissure, but the fissure is still present and can still be a thread for the durability of the stone.

Now the second problem is that some modern fillers are now applied to emeralds. These artificial fillers of synthetic origin are known by some trade names as "Opticon" or "Gematrat",... other substances as polyester are also used. They have a close Refractive index with the stone compared to traditional oil and waxes. The first problem they pose is that they are near impossible to remove once applied as they are more durable than volatile oil and the second one is that their behavior whith age is completely uncertain. They can for exemple turn blackish and so ruin the host stone.

This is the reason why the "oiling of emerald" had a very bad impact on the emerald trade.

Emerald can be such a beatiful stone by itself, to try to conceal imperfections can result in the ruins of the stone which is very sad to me. And I dont even speak about the psycholigical impact of the customer who bought his stone for a small fortune and feel finaly very badly disepointed with this potential "time bomb".

I feel very confortable with ruby and sapphire treatment are they imporve both the durability and the beauty of the stone... They are never a "time bomb" that will make a customer stop to buy gem stones for the rest of his life.

Too much information sensible mother possible reaction is the living proof that misleading practices within gem trade have to be fight. As this is the survival of all the industry that these practices are threatening.
...
Well, I get a little passionate on the subject isn't it?

...
Cool down!
...

How to be sure that your emerald is or is not oiled?

You can first of all bring it to a well equiped laboratory or to somebody with a strong experience in this field. This is the secure way.

Now if you want to practice yourself, you have to undertand that in most cases you need to have some professional equipement much more powerful then a simple loupe which is not enough in many cases especially in the hand of a person lacking of experience.

To detect the oil in emerald we are using several technique in AIGS Laboratory, which are standart in other laboratories that have to same kind of equipment:

First normal observation with a microscope, then we can study the fluorescence of the stone as most of the time oil and resin have a different fluorescence that the rest of the stone (whitish or yellowish). More advanced instruments are then determinant to identify sometimes the presence of a filler and in all cases to determinante the exact nature of this filler. These isntruments are FTIR (Fourier Transmission Infrared Spectroscopy) and Raman spectroscope.

There is also a simple test that can be used also on his own stones (But this is not recommended on stone without the complete approval of the owner as it can damage the appearance of the stone near the area tested in the case the test turns postive) is to use a heating needle that is bring near a fissure reaching the surface and observe the result under microscope. If a filler is present then it will leave the fissure as a result of its dillatation.
I have practice this test on the pavillion of a stone when I had to buy emeralds. If course it was with the authorisation of the stone owner.

Hoping that these explanations has help some of you to understand the oiling in emerald and its problematic. Enjoy your stones and if they were oiled please follow pqcollectibles technique and take a good care of them as even if they are oiled they remain beautiful precious stones and may be more precious than any other one as their beauty will possibly not last for ever.

All the best,

 

[valeria101]

“Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please.”

Not my criticism on anyone: just an incentive to open a fun article. An here's another green link , just in case this thread will remain Pricescope's testimony on emeralds for a while

​

 

[mogok]

Hello AnA,

Well I know this article. Its an interesting point of view but well...
Anyway it does not change my opinion on all unstable treatments.
I have a personnal problem with them... Its something like epidermic, a kind of allergy.

A gem is rare, beautiful and durable!

A fine beryllium treated orange sapphire is more gemmy to my eyes than an emerald full of fissures and epoxy resin...
Hot topic (Not my favorite...)

When beauty vanish with time it make the stone may be something more human that can be also source of love... (one good argument given to me by one of my fiends in love also with emeralds) But this is just not what i research in a Gem.

You know that I'm a Spinel, Ruby and Sapphire lover with a weakness for fine Moonstones!
I love "native" stones, just cut and polished...
I Love their inclusions and their cut imperfections because as they can be recut to improve their beauty. They are potential, mystery... Genuine...
... (thinking)...
Its not I dont like emeralds, but Ok: May be I've spend too much time in Burma and with my Burmese gems addicts buddies!

All the best,

 

[valeria101]

All that Burma needed were emeralds. Good Lord, just about everything else is right there under your feet

I can't say I don't agree. There are not too many emeralds left to stand on their own. Cedar oil is just great for polishing furniture, thanks!

Nice to see moonstones set in the right company for once

 

[mogok]

Burma dont really need emeralds (lol...)

The earth was prolific enought to have give them the most beautiful green gemstone we can dream about, the only one that can make an emerald look pale... And this gemstone has a toughness that envy all the other gems especially the brittle emerald!
I means its majesty Jadeite...
As probably 99% of the fine quality imperial jadeite in the market in coming from the Hpakant mines in Kachin state, Burma does not "need" emeralds.
It would be too much for sure!

Burmese was so rich and proud with their famous Mogok rubies that they never traditionally prize Jade that much and let this stone of heaven to their Chinese neigbours. They were also so ruby lovers that they never give to their sapphires, which are possibly the best in the world along with Kashmir stones, the place they desserve: Sapphire are called there "Nilar"... which means : "Will become red". Trditionally (not any more...lol!) they burried back sapphires to wait them to become rubies.

Burma is a crazy place. A geologic and gemologic scandal: The best rubies, the best sapphires, the best Jade, the best red spinels, and possibly also the best peridots, the best moonstones, the best danburite, the best scapolite, the best south sea pearls... and so many other beautiful stones!

I completly agree anyway that there are a lot of "fish tank" stones in Burma and that even there gemmy preties are true rarities. Beauty should not be related to origin, I cannot agree more. But when the beauty comes from Burma... There is something magic, impressive as the gem vehiculate so many gem traditions!